Thoughts on Dunbar?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what I'm trying to get at is while people can say

"I am happy in a school that is diverse"

their school choices can also mean

"I am choosing schools to avoid Black and poor people who are my neighbors."

This is frickin hilarious. Some woke white person “of means” makes a statement about how it’s important being in a school that is racially, economically, and academically diverse.

She then gets called out correctly that this is not true, her title 1 school is homogenous. Many HRCS are more diverse.

Then, unable to refute that and admit that she is wrong, she goes on to now accuse everyone of being racist.

Folks, it’s the same play every time. When challenged, instead of providing facts and support for their stance, the only defense these people have left is everyone is racist.

No, I’m not white or racist. I’m avoiding putting my kid in a failing school. Black families with options are doing the EXACT same thing.

You are conflating a few different posters. I am the PP who prefers in-class differentiation in elementary to tracking programs that pull kids out of schools and classes, but I wasn’t involved in the devolution about the relative diversity of charters vs title 1 dcps. I don’t think anyone is racist for disagreeing with me—I do think it’s a shame (but not a surprise) that we cannot discuss the merits of tracking vs grouping without going off the rails. And look, if a school is failing kids, neither approach is going to work. I still don’t think anyone has demonstrated that tracking in elementary school is actually the right move. Even in older grades you see the problem. If tracking was the answer PPs pretend it is, you wouldn’t have people worried about Dunbar (like the forgotten OP) because they would be sure their kid’s needs are being met, either in the test-in school or at Dunbar. But that’s not the case. To be clear, I’m not suggesting dcps get rid of Banneker and other test-in high schools. But why would we start that process with little kids, especially when the research does not support it. Anyway, I’m going to give this thread back to folks talking about Dunbar.
Ps I’m not white either, don’t make those assumptions.
PPs I’m not naming my school bc I like what I see there, and I don’t want it to get flamed by a bunch of people who obviously don’t go there.

Your premise is incorrect. The abysmal achievement that we have at Dunbar where 2% of the kids are on grade level in math is because there is NO tracking from an early age in elementary school. Dunbar is the typical result of not tracking, just like other poorly performing high schools in the city with similar stats.

Of course more than 2% of the thousands of kids in these poorly performing schools could have reached grade level competency. Why didn’t they? Because there is no tracking in elementary with G & T, no tracking of dedicated subjects in middle and high school. So teaching is to the lowest common denominator in these schools which is way below grade level. Then, even if kids don’t grasp concepts, everyone is socially promoted. End results are schools like Dunbar.

Look at cities where you have tracking starting in elementary, magnet or test in middle and high schools. They get low SES kids in these school who do well.

What DCPS does due to the failure of tracking then is defensive recovery in high school with Banneker. These kids come in with huge deficits which Banneker has to try to make up. That’s why all Banneker pushes is academics at the cost of all else. Even with 4 years of this, the best most of these kids can achieve is 3 on AP and low 20’s average on IB exams. These scores are not that great for a test in, heavy emphasis academic high school. But for kids who are so far behind, they do make strides.

Compare that to areas that start tracking early in elementary and beyond These low SES kids have been given higher level academics and challenged since elementary and blow the Banneker kids away. It’s not that both groups don’t have the same potential. It’s just these places tapped it early in the kids from elementary onward to the start of high school. These kids got way ahead and are performing at a much higher academic threshold.

It’s astounding to me that there’s a full grown adult who believes that Dunbar’s results are the result of not having tracking in elementary school. This person seems unaware of the mountains of research about links between academic achievement and poverty, trauma, violence, etc.

How do people this clueless make it through the day safely?

So how do kids who are operating at the 3rd grade level make it to high school? We need to get rid of grade levels and just only let kids move forward once they master material. what is the point of DUnbar if the entire school is remedial? just turn it into vocational training

I think vocational training is a good idea. Reality is if by 8th grade you are performing way below grade level, things are not going to improve too much. It’s too late. Instead of graduating with a worthless diploma and then do what, learn some useful marketable trade skill. Hvac, electrician, plumbers, etc,..can easily make 60k and up to 6 figures. There’s a big need for them too.

Vocational education is now called CTE - career and technical education. Unfortunately DCPS does a crappy job with it.
CTE was decimated by Michelle Rhee who was a big time supporter of the college for all narrative. It is still in shambles. Other states including MD and VA do a much better job of it

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what I'm trying to get at is while people can say

"I am happy in a school that is diverse"

their school choices can also mean

"I am choosing schools to avoid Black and poor people who are my neighbors."

This is frickin hilarious. Some woke white person “of means” makes a statement about how it’s important being in a school that is racially, economically, and academically diverse.

She then gets called out correctly that this is not true, her title 1 school is homogenous. Many HRCS are more diverse.

Then, unable to refute that and admit that she is wrong, she goes on to now accuse everyone of being racist.

Folks, it’s the same play every time. When challenged, instead of providing facts and support for their stance, the only defense these people have left is everyone is racist.

No, I’m not white or racist. I’m avoiding putting my kid in a failing school. Black families with options are doing the EXACT same thing.

You are conflating a few different posters. I am the PP who prefers in-class differentiation in elementary to tracking programs that pull kids out of schools and classes, but I wasn’t involved in the devolution about the relative diversity of charters vs title 1 dcps. I don’t think anyone is racist for disagreeing with me—I do think it’s a shame (but not a surprise) that we cannot discuss the merits of tracking vs grouping without going off the rails. And look, if a school is failing kids, neither approach is going to work. I still don’t think anyone has demonstrated that tracking in elementary school is actually the right move. Even in older grades you see the problem. If tracking was the answer PPs pretend it is, you wouldn’t have people worried about Dunbar (like the forgotten OP) because they would be sure their kid’s needs are being met, either in the test-in school or at Dunbar. But that’s not the case. To be clear, I’m not suggesting dcps get rid of Banneker and other test-in high schools. But why would we start that process with little kids, especially when the research does not support it. Anyway, I’m going to give this thread back to folks talking about Dunbar.
Ps I’m not white either, don’t make those assumptions.
PPs I’m not naming my school bc I like what I see there, and I don’t want it to get flamed by a bunch of people who obviously don’t go there.

Your premise is incorrect. The abysmal achievement that we have at Dunbar where 2% of the kids are on grade level in math is because there is NO tracking from an early age in elementary school. Dunbar is the typical result of not tracking, just like other poorly performing high schools in the city with similar stats.

Of course more than 2% of the thousands of kids in these poorly performing schools could have reached grade level competency. Why didn’t they? Because there is no tracking in elementary with G & T, no tracking of dedicated subjects in middle and high school. So teaching is to the lowest common denominator in these schools which is way below grade level. Then, even if kids don’t grasp concepts, everyone is socially promoted. End results are schools like Dunbar.

Look at cities where you have tracking starting in elementary, magnet or test in middle and high schools. They get low SES kids in these school who do well.

What DCPS does due to the failure of tracking then is defensive recovery in high school with Banneker. These kids come in with huge deficits which Banneker has to try to make up. That’s why all Banneker pushes is academics at the cost of all else. Even with 4 years of this, the best most of these kids can achieve is 3 on AP and low 20’s average on IB exams. These scores are not that great for a test in, heavy emphasis academic high school. But for kids who are so far behind, they do make strides.

Compare that to areas that start tracking early in elementary and beyond These low SES kids have been given higher level academics and challenged since elementary and blow the Banneker kids away. It’s not that both groups don’t have the same potential. It’s just these places tapped it early in the kids from elementary onward to the start of high school. These kids got way ahead and are performing at a much higher academic threshold.

It’s astounding to me that there’s a full grown adult who believes that Dunbar’s results are the result of not having tracking in elementary school. This person seems unaware of the mountains of research about links between academic achievement and poverty, trauma, violence, etc.

How do people this clueless make it through the day safely?

So how do kids who are operating at the 3rd grade level make it to high school? We need to get rid of grade levels and just only let kids move forward once they master material. what is the point of DUnbar if the entire school is remedial? just turn it into vocational training

I think vocational training is a good idea. Reality is if by 8th grade you are performing way below grade level, things are not going to improve too much. It’s too late. Instead of graduating with a worthless diploma and then do what, learn some useful marketable trade skill. Hvac, electrician, plumbers, etc,..can easily make 60k and up to 6 figures. There’s a big need for them too.

Vocational education is now called CTE - career and technical education. Unfortunately DCPS does a crappy job with it.
CTE was decimated by Michelle Rhee who was a big time supporter of the college for all narrative. It is still in shambles. Other states including MD and VA do a much better job of it

My college roommates oldest son is a welder. He did not do too hot in school, was a handful and challenging kid especially in the adolescent and high school years. He discovered welding, did an apprenticeship, and loves it and now has a great job.

College is not for everyone. Some kids may not be book smart but are great in other areas. They just need to be exposed to different things and try different things which I think vocational education is a great avenue for this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what I'm trying to get at is while people can say

"I am happy in a school that is diverse"

their school choices can also mean

"I am choosing schools to avoid Black and poor people who are my neighbors."

This is frickin hilarious. Some woke white person “of means” makes a statement about how it’s important being in a school that is racially, economically, and academically diverse.

She then gets called out correctly that this is not true, her title 1 school is homogenous. Many HRCS are more diverse.

Then, unable to refute that and admit that she is wrong, she goes on to now accuse everyone of being racist.

Folks, it’s the same play every time. When challenged, instead of providing facts and support for their stance, the only defense these people have left is everyone is racist.

No, I’m not white or racist. I’m avoiding putting my kid in a failing school. Black families with options are doing the EXACT same thing.

You are conflating a few different posters. I am the PP who prefers in-class differentiation in elementary to tracking programs that pull kids out of schools and classes, but I wasn’t involved in the devolution about the relative diversity of charters vs title 1 dcps. I don’t think anyone is racist for disagreeing with me—I do think it’s a shame (but not a surprise) that we cannot discuss the merits of tracking vs grouping without going off the rails. And look, if a school is failing kids, neither approach is going to work. I still don’t think anyone has demonstrated that tracking in elementary school is actually the right move. Even in older grades you see the problem. If tracking was the answer PPs pretend it is, you wouldn’t have people worried about Dunbar (like the forgotten OP) because they would be sure their kid’s needs are being met, either in the test-in school or at Dunbar. But that’s not the case. To be clear, I’m not suggesting dcps get rid of Banneker and other test-in high schools. But why would we start that process with little kids, especially when the research does not support it. Anyway, I’m going to give this thread back to folks talking about Dunbar.
Ps I’m not white either, don’t make those assumptions.
PPs I’m not naming my school bc I like what I see there, and I don’t want it to get flamed by a bunch of people who obviously don’t go there.

Your premise is incorrect. The abysmal achievement that we have at Dunbar where 2% of the kids are on grade level in math is because there is NO tracking from an early age in elementary school. Dunbar is the typical result of not tracking, just like other poorly performing high schools in the city with similar stats.

Of course more than 2% of the thousands of kids in these poorly performing schools could have reached grade level competency. Why didn’t they? Because there is no tracking in elementary with G & T, no tracking of dedicated subjects in middle and high school. So teaching is to the lowest common denominator in these schools which is way below grade level. Then, even if kids don’t grasp concepts, everyone is socially promoted. End results are schools like Dunbar.

Look at cities where you have tracking starting in elementary, magnet or test in middle and high schools. They get low SES kids in these school who do well.

What DCPS does due to the failure of tracking then is defensive recovery in high school with Banneker. These kids come in with huge deficits which Banneker has to try to make up. That’s why all Banneker pushes is academics at the cost of all else. Even with 4 years of this, the best most of these kids can achieve is 3 on AP and low 20’s average on IB exams. These scores are not that great for a test in, heavy emphasis academic high school. But for kids who are so far behind, they do make strides.

Compare that to areas that start tracking early in elementary and beyond These low SES kids have been given higher level academics and challenged since elementary and blow the Banneker kids away. It’s not that both groups don’t have the same potential. It’s just these places tapped it early in the kids from elementary onward to the start of high school. These kids got way ahead and are performing at a much higher academic threshold.

It’s astounding to me that there’s a full grown adult who believes that Dunbar’s results are the result of not having tracking in elementary school. This person seems unaware of the mountains of research about links between academic achievement and poverty, trauma, violence, etc.

How do people this clueless make it through the day safely?

So how do kids who are operating at the 3rd grade level make it to high school? We need to get rid of grade levels and just only let kids move forward once they master material. what is the point of DUnbar if the entire school is remedial? just turn it into vocational training

I think vocational training is a good idea. Reality is if by 8th grade you are performing way below grade level, things are not going to improve too much. It’s too late. Instead of graduating with a worthless diploma and then do what, learn some useful marketable trade skill. Hvac, electrician, plumbers, etc,..can easily make 60k and up to 6 figures. There’s a big need for them too.

Vocational education is now called CTE - career and technical education. Unfortunately DCPS does a crappy job with it.
CTE was decimated by Michelle Rhee who was a big time supporter of the college for all narrative. It is still in shambles. Other states including MD and VA do a much better job of it

Kindergartners during Rhee’s last full year are headed off to college this fall. Maybe it’s time to Let It Go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what I'm trying to get at is while people can say

"I am happy in a school that is diverse"

their school choices can also mean

"I am choosing schools to avoid Black and poor people who are my neighbors."

This is frickin hilarious. Some woke white person “of means” makes a statement about how it’s important being in a school that is racially, economically, and academically diverse.

She then gets called out correctly that this is not true, her title 1 school is homogenous. Many HRCS are more diverse.

Then, unable to refute that and admit that she is wrong, she goes on to now accuse everyone of being racist.

Folks, it’s the same play every time. When challenged, instead of providing facts and support for their stance, the only defense these people have left is everyone is racist.

No, I’m not white or racist. I’m avoiding putting my kid in a failing school. Black families with options are doing the EXACT same thing.

You are conflating a few different posters. I am the PP who prefers in-class differentiation in elementary to tracking programs that pull kids out of schools and classes, but I wasn’t involved in the devolution about the relative diversity of charters vs title 1 dcps. I don’t think anyone is racist for disagreeing with me—I do think it’s a shame (but not a surprise) that we cannot discuss the merits of tracking vs grouping without going off the rails. And look, if a school is failing kids, neither approach is going to work. I still don’t think anyone has demonstrated that tracking in elementary school is actually the right move. Even in older grades you see the problem. If tracking was the answer PPs pretend it is, you wouldn’t have people worried about Dunbar (like the forgotten OP) because they would be sure their kid’s needs are being met, either in the test-in school or at Dunbar. But that’s not the case. To be clear, I’m not suggesting dcps get rid of Banneker and other test-in high schools. But why would we start that process with little kids, especially when the research does not support it. Anyway, I’m going to give this thread back to folks talking about Dunbar.
Ps I’m not white either, don’t make those assumptions.
PPs I’m not naming my school bc I like what I see there, and I don’t want it to get flamed by a bunch of people who obviously don’t go there.

Your premise is incorrect. The abysmal achievement that we have at Dunbar where 2% of the kids are on grade level in math is because there is NO tracking from an early age in elementary school. Dunbar is the typical result of not tracking, just like other poorly performing high schools in the city with similar stats.

Of course more than 2% of the thousands of kids in these poorly performing schools could have reached grade level competency. Why didn’t they? Because there is no tracking in elementary with G & T, no tracking of dedicated subjects in middle and high school. So teaching is to the lowest common denominator in these schools which is way below grade level. Then, even if kids don’t grasp concepts, everyone is socially promoted. End results are schools like Dunbar.

Look at cities where you have tracking starting in elementary, magnet or test in middle and high schools. They get low SES kids in these school who do well.

What DCPS does due to the failure of tracking then is defensive recovery in high school with Banneker. These kids come in with huge deficits which Banneker has to try to make up. That’s why all Banneker pushes is academics at the cost of all else. Even with 4 years of this, the best most of these kids can achieve is 3 on AP and low 20’s average on IB exams. These scores are not that great for a test in, heavy emphasis academic high school. But for kids who are so far behind, they do make strides.

Compare that to areas that start tracking early in elementary and beyond These low SES kids have been given higher level academics and challenged since elementary and blow the Banneker kids away. It’s not that both groups don’t have the same potential. It’s just these places tapped it early in the kids from elementary onward to the start of high school. These kids got way ahead and are performing at a much higher academic threshold.

It’s astounding to me that there’s a full grown adult who believes that Dunbar’s results are the result of not having tracking in elementary school. This person seems unaware of the mountains of research about links between academic achievement and poverty, trauma, violence, etc.

How do people this clueless make it through the day safely?

So how do kids who are operating at the 3rd grade level make it to high school? We need to get rid of grade levels and just only let kids move forward once they master material. what is the point of DUnbar if the entire school is remedial? just turn it into vocational training

I think vocational training is a good idea. Reality is if by 8th grade you are performing way below grade level, things are not going to improve too much. It’s too late. Instead of graduating with a worthless diploma and then do what, learn some useful marketable trade skill. Hvac, electrician, plumbers, etc,..can easily make 60k and up to 6 figures. There’s a big need for them too.

Vocational education is now called CTE - career and technical education. Unfortunately DCPS does a crappy job with it.
CTE was decimated by Michelle Rhee who was a big time supporter of the college for all narrative. It is still in shambles. Other states including MD and VA do a much better job of it

Kindergartners during Rhee’s last full year are headed off to college this fall. Maybe it’s time to Let It Go.

There is nothing to let go.
I work for DCPS and this is common knowledge of how it went down.
Rhee was and maybe still is a huge proponent of college for all.
CTE now has a lot of resources but the staffing is a mess. The model of certain programs at specific schools, for ex. Auto tech at Ballou, is inefficient and ineffective. They keep talking about creating a more centralised system like other states have but seem unable to make it happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yup. Imagine adding a differentiation program of some sort to some of the lower performing elementary schools and watch how quickly those schools attract higher SES families who don’t mind having their kids go to school with poorer kids but do mind their kids not receiving a quality education. Rather than fearing segregation, I think forms of strong differentiation will actually promote more integration.

It seems to be an article of faith that attracting new high SES kids to schools like Dunbar is a key outcome that that school should devote a lot of resources to. I don’t see this as an important goal at all. I’d like to see the school focus on better educating the kids who currently attend.

The problem is that probably 75 % of the Dunbar students should not even be in High school given how far they are behind. So is it a high school for kids who on a 6th grade level at best? there is no way the school can make up for that loss and social promotion each year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yup. Imagine adding a differentiation program of some sort to some of the lower performing elementary schools and watch how quickly those schools attract higher SES families who don’t mind having their kids go to school with poorer kids but do mind their kids not receiving a quality education. Rather than fearing segregation, I think forms of strong differentiation will actually promote more integration.

It seems to be an article of faith that attracting new high SES kids to schools like Dunbar is a key outcome that that school should devote a lot of resources to. I don’t see this as an important goal at all. I’d like to see the school focus on better educating the kids who currently attend.

The problem is that probably 75 % of the Dunbar students should not even be in High school given how far they are behind. So is it a high school for kids who on a 6th grade level at best? there is no way the school can make up for that loss and social promotion each year.

I suggest you read the research on “social promotion.” Holding kids back has very much worse outcomes both for the kids held back and for others in their classes.

This is basic stuff to know before opining on education policy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yup. Imagine adding a differentiation program of some sort to some of the lower performing elementary schools and watch how quickly those schools attract higher SES families who don’t mind having their kids go to school with poorer kids but do mind their kids not receiving a quality education. Rather than fearing segregation, I think forms of strong differentiation will actually promote more integration.

It seems to be an article of faith that attracting new high SES kids to schools like Dunbar is a key outcome that that school should devote a lot of resources to. I don’t see this as an important goal at all. I’d like to see the school focus on better educating the kids who currently attend.

The problem is that probably 75 % of the Dunbar students should not even be in High school given how far they are behind. So is it a high school for kids who on a 6th grade level at best? there is no way the school can make up for that loss and social promotion each year.

I suggest you read the research on “social promotion.” Holding kids back has very much worse outcomes both for the kids held back and for others in their classes.

This is basic stuff to know before opining on education policy.

Maybe so, but "acceleration" without an intervention-based cross-team strategy to address achievement deficits leaves kids in classrooms without crucial support and struggling to access the curriculum. But the long-term proficiency research on non-gifted/high-achieving acceleration strategies doesn't exist, or if it does I would love to see it without having to dig around the internet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yup. Imagine adding a differentiation program of some sort to some of the lower performing elementary schools and watch how quickly those schools attract higher SES families who don’t mind having their kids go to school with poorer kids but do mind their kids not receiving a quality education. Rather than fearing segregation, I think forms of strong differentiation will actually promote more integration.

It seems to be an article of faith that attracting new high SES kids to schools like Dunbar is a key outcome that that school should devote a lot of resources to. I don’t see this as an important goal at all. I’d like to see the school focus on better educating the kids who currently attend.

The problem is that probably 75 % of the Dunbar students should not even be in High school given how far they are behind. So is it a high school for kids who on a 6th grade level at best? there is no way the school can make up for that loss and social promotion each year.

I suggest you read the research on “social promotion.” Holding kids back has very much worse outcomes both for the kids held back and for others in their classes.

This is basic stuff to know before opining on education policy.

Fine you send your kids to Dunbar then. Given the research, how could you not?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yup. Imagine adding a differentiation program of some sort to some of the lower performing elementary schools and watch how quickly those schools attract higher SES families who don’t mind having their kids go to school with poorer kids but do mind their kids not receiving a quality education. Rather than fearing segregation, I think forms of strong differentiation will actually promote more integration.

It seems to be an article of faith that attracting new high SES kids to schools like Dunbar is a key outcome that that school should devote a lot of resources to. I don’t see this as an important goal at all. I’d like to see the school focus on better educating the kids who currently attend.

The problem is that probably 75 % of the Dunbar students should not even be in High school given how far they are behind. So is it a high school for kids who on a 6th grade level at best? there is no way the school can make up for that loss and social promotion each year.

I suggest you read the research on “social promotion.” Holding kids back has very much worse outcomes both for the kids held back and for others in their classes.

This is basic stuff to know before opining on education policy.

So what exactly is a high school gradaute going to do in life reading on a elem level, no writing skills or basic math? I know. They end up getting suckered into for profit online colleges or UDC with 100k in school debt and no viable college education or degree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yup. Imagine adding a differentiation program of some sort to some of the lower performing elementary schools and watch how quickly those schools attract higher SES families who don’t mind having their kids go to school with poorer kids but do mind their kids not receiving a quality education. Rather than fearing segregation, I think forms of strong differentiation will actually promote more integration.

It seems to be an article of faith that attracting new high SES kids to schools like Dunbar is a key outcome that that school should devote a lot of resources to. I don’t see this as an important goal at all. I’d like to see the school focus on better educating the kids who currently attend.

The problem is that probably 75 % of the Dunbar students should not even be in High school given how far they are behind. So is it a high school for kids who on a 6th grade level at best? there is no way the school can make up for that loss and social promotion each year.

I suggest you read the research on “social promotion.” Holding kids back has very much worse outcomes both for the kids held back and for others in their classes.

This is basic stuff to know before opining on education policy.

So what exactly is a high school gradaute going to do in life reading on a elem level, no writing skills or basic math? I know. They end up getting suckered into for profit online colleges or UDC with 100k in school debt and no viable college education or degree.

+1 or else they work in fast food, hospitality as hostess, waiter, or cook making pretty much minimum wage. Many of these kids who don’t have much future prospects just end up hanging out, being in the wrong crowd, and getting into trouble with the law.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yup. Imagine adding a differentiation program of some sort to some of the lower performing elementary schools and watch how quickly those schools attract higher SES families who don’t mind having their kids go to school with poorer kids but do mind their kids not receiving a quality education. Rather than fearing segregation, I think forms of strong differentiation will actually promote more integration.

It seems to be an article of faith that attracting new high SES kids to schools like Dunbar is a key outcome that that school should devote a lot of resources to. I don’t see this as an important goal at all. I’d like to see the school focus on better educating the kids who currently attend.

The problem is that probably 75 % of the Dunbar students should not even be in High school given how far they are behind. So is it a high school for kids who on a 6th grade level at best? there is no way the school can make up for that loss and social promotion each year.

I suggest you read the research on “social promotion.” Holding kids back has very much worse outcomes both for the kids held back and for others in their classes.

This is basic stuff to know before opining on education policy.

So what exactly is a high school gradaute going to do in life reading on a elem level, no writing skills or basic math? I know. They end up getting suckered into for profit online colleges or UDC with 100k in school debt and no viable college education or degree.

You should try to broaden your perspective.

Most Americans (62%) don’t graduate from college. My understanding is that for at risk, low income, way below grade level kids, the concern is more about keeping them alive and out of jail past 25 than “for profit colleges.” When these kids are held back, they drop out and end up in jail or dead.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yup. Imagine adding a differentiation program of some sort to some of the lower performing elementary schools and watch how quickly those schools attract higher SES families who don’t mind having their kids go to school with poorer kids but do mind their kids not receiving a quality education. Rather than fearing segregation, I think forms of strong differentiation will actually promote more integration.

It seems to be an article of faith that attracting new high SES kids to schools like Dunbar is a key outcome that that school should devote a lot of resources to. I don’t see this as an important goal at all. I’d like to see the school focus on better educating the kids who currently attend.

The problem is that probably 75 % of the Dunbar students should not even be in High school given how far they are behind. So is it a high school for kids who on a 6th grade level at best? there is no way the school can make up for that loss and social promotion each year.

I suggest you read the research on “social promotion.” Holding kids back has very much worse outcomes both for the kids held back and for others in their classes.

This is basic stuff to know before opining on education policy.

So what exactly is a high school gradaute going to do in life reading on a elem level, no writing skills or basic math? I know. They end up getting suckered into for profit online colleges or UDC with 100k in school debt and no viable college education or degree.

+1 or else they work in fast food, hospitality as hostess, waiter, or cook making pretty much minimum wage. Many of these kids who don’t have much future prospects just end up hanging out, being in the wrong crowd, and getting into trouble with the law.

Again, when they are held back (not “socially promoted”), they drop out of school and enter that life at 13 rather than 18. When that happens, they are very much more likely to be dead or in jail by 25.

Your solution (“end social promotion!”) equals more dead or incarcerated kids.

[Anonymous]

So find the political capital to promote kids to appropriate remedial classes vs. on-grade level classes they can't handle. No brainer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So find the political capital to promote kids to appropriate remedial classes vs. on-grade level classes they can't handle. No brainer.

Exactly. Also more support at the elementary level, after school tutoring, summer intensive programs for these kids and make it mandatory.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So find the political capital to promote kids to appropriate remedial classes vs. on-grade level classes they can't handle. No brainer.

Exactly. Also more support at the elementary level, after school tutoring, summer intensive programs for these kids and make it mandatory.

If DCPS started the above from the beginning at the elementary level from 1st-5th, you would not have the overwhelming majority of kids going into middle school 3-4 grade levels behind. You also would not need as intense supportive services and it would be a significantly smaller number in middle school.

DCPS just fails these kids by passing them. It’s not the answer and why you have the stats you do at Dunbar and other DCPS high schools. You need supports above and need it early for kids so behind.