What is the real reason MCPS uses Lottery for Middle School Magnet Program

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
No one is addressing the point that the county resorted to lottery because of covid (and therefore no Cogats). The point we should be addressing is when they'll get back to using Cogats. I don't think they'll do it in the spring, but they could do it starting the 2022-2023 school year.

IProblem is there is no transparency in the process. Lottery due to COVID is what they said earlier. However, if you read the case text related to the lawsuit someone posted earlier? MCPS states that if there is cohort of 20 or more kids in homeschool, they will not consider those kids in CES program. If there are less than 20, and the homeschool cannot meet their accilerated need, then they will be placed in Regional programs. It is unclear whether MCPS even considers academic performance at par when they place the kids in regional program.

There is no plan at the moment from MCPS to get back to CoGAT even though kids are back in school in person. Also there is a problem with Virtual Academy in the mix. There are no accelerated program in VA and there is no cohort either. CoGAT is also discontinued.
It is not clear whether MCPS will consider VA students for Regional CES programs based on performance. MCPS BOE gets an F for creating all this mess.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
No one is addressing the point that the county resorted to lottery because of covid (and therefore no Cogats). The point we should be addressing is when they'll get back to using Cogats. I don't think they'll do it in the spring, but they could do it starting the 2022-2023 school year.

People aren't addressing it, because clearly the Cogat could have been offered this year. They chose not to offer it.

[Anonymous]

There are a couple of options we are considering so that DD can continue the academic progress at the same rate.

1) Private School
2) Move to Loudon county

Both are expensive proposition and we have to do this by Spring 2022. Are there any other options that are available other than these 2?

[Anonymous]

PP. just want to add that this for middle school. Any ideas, suggestions are greatly appreciated.

[Anonymous]

As someone who previously supported magnet programs, I think it's time that MCPS gets rid of them and instead expand their gifted and talented offerings at each school. Better access to those programs, better for the schools (especially those with high FARMS), and better from a cost perspective.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The programs used to look for kids who were true outliers. Now we seem to think that the top 25% are outliers and need special programs. If we want to have a program for the top 25% in can be in every school. No need for any lottery based magnet. It is compact math + a high reading group + enrichment.

This thread is about Middle School magnets. In every middle school, there should be enough highly abled students to populate an accelerated classroom. The magnet programs are a head fake by MCPS to avoid actually creating advanced classes in each middle school (not the fake "Honors" level). They are a distraction only, and the majority of highly able kids get no differentiated education because political attention is busy squabbling about the admissions criteria to a program that is a joke in size.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The programs used to look for kids who were true outliers. Now we seem to think that the top 25% are outliers and need special programs. If we want to have a program for the top 25% in can be in every school. No need for any lottery based magnet. It is compact math + a high reading group + enrichment.

Yep, these programs as we knew them are no more...

I know right? We cannot game the system anymore.
Oh well, time to move to VA

May be the games just started at MCPS lowering the standards for all

Or maybe the county is tired of the enormous investment of time, money, and resources dedicated to programs that are demanded by and largely for wealthy whites people. Maybe they are interested in simplifying the process to A) root out bias in selection for these programs and B) expand by a tiny bit the group from which students are pulled into the magnet.

You want your kid to be in an “elite” environment where only the top 1% get in - apply to Sidwell or Maret. Stop using the public schools as a means to suck resources out for a tiny percentage of the population who already tend to be privileged children. As a tax payer I’m happy to see the magnet lottery and glad to see some equity brought to the equation of these programs.

The CES and magnet programs were dominated by Asians who took a 40% hit in acceptance rates when they switched to the home school method a few years ago. So much for your tirade against whites.

Some on this thread always look at everything in life through the lens of race unfortunately. They continuously bring up race and feel really good when some of the students are put at a disadvantage to benefit others. They find satisfaction and miss the larger picture ie; futue of the nation and our responsibility as a society to support every kid in what they do best to help them reach their potential.

1) MCPS is the one who continually uses the lens of race.

2) Supporting every kid to reach their potential means matching their current potential AND academic preparation to allow them to learn and succeed as much as possible. It does not mean arbitrarily assigning them to a magnet program without consideration of both of these.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:With more than 160,000 students I imagine MCPS has a WHOLE LOT MORE on its plate than this. Using the oft repeated "99%" standard it sounds like this ENDLESS debate is about MAYBE 1600 of students? Less than half of 1% of the students MCPS works with?

One of these mornings or afternoons go and watch a county school bus load and unload a dozen SEVERELY SEVERELY SEVERELY handicapped children in wheelchairs.
Watch the county feed kids that don't get enoughto eat at home.
Watch them graduate kids whose parents are in jail or dead and manage to get some of them into college

Then drive home and

Hug your child because you can
Feed your child another healthy meal
Kick or throw a ball around with them because they can control their limbs

And hopefully... Hopefully... HOPEFULLY.... experience a moment of peace because you are blessed

Ok. so you will ingnore the needs of 1600 kids just because you have more kids in the school system? If you are tired, perhaps, time for you to step away from the thread. your intention to discourage others from discussing this important topic, which by the way will have significant impact on future generations to come, is very apparent.

DP - " The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few"*

*If this was true, those severely handicapped kids and kids with intense behavioral issues would be shown the door. Instead, many, many resources are provided to kids that are unlikely to create much good for society (many more than for the average student.) We do this as a society because we affirm the individual worth of each person. Then, you can't turn around and say that the kids with the high intellectual abilities should be denied an appropriate education just because they can "do fine."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
No one is addressing the point that the county resorted to lottery because of covid (and therefore no Cogats). The point we should be addressing is when they'll get back to using Cogats. I don't think they'll do it in the spring, but they could do it starting the 2022-2023 school year.

IProblem is there is no transparency in the process. Lottery due to COVID is what they said earlier. However, if you read the case text related to the lawsuit someone posted earlier? MCPS states that if there is cohort of 20 or more kids in homeschool, they will not consider those kids in CES program. If there are less than 20, and the homeschool cannot meet their accilerated need, then they will be placed in Regional programs. It is unclear whether MCPS even considers academic performance at par when they place the kids in regional program.

There is no plan at the moment from MCPS to get back to CoGAT even though kids are back in school in person. Also there is a problem with Virtual Academy in the mix. There are no accelerated program in VA and there is no cohort either. CoGAT is also discontinued.
It is not clear whether MCPS will consider VA students for Regional CES programs based on performance. MCPS BOE gets an F for creating all this mess.

Around this time last year (2020) MCPS defended itself in the Asian discrimination lawsuit motion to dismiss by saying they had switched to a lottery so the specific complaint about MS magnet selection methodology, including cohort, was moot. If you read Jude Xinis's opinion on the motion, you see that no one in MCPS I ready to either commit to the lottery, or commit to the old method. Even to save themselves $100k in attorneys' fees. They don't know sh*t. As with many things we have seen over this pandemic period, there is no actual plan. They are adrift and meandering through the latest edu-speak opinion and reacting t the loudest parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The programs used to look for kids who were true outliers. Now we seem to think that the top 25% are outliers and need special programs. If we want to have a program for the top 25% in can be in every school. No need for any lottery based magnet. It is compact math + a high reading group + enrichment.

Yep, these programs as we knew them are no more...

I know right? We cannot game the system anymore.
Oh well, time to move to VA

May be the games just started at MCPS lowering the standards for all

Or maybe the county is tired of the enormous investment of time, money, and resources dedicated to programs that are demanded by and largely for wealthy whites people. Maybe they are interested in simplifying the process to A) root out bias in selection for these programs and B) expand by a tiny bit the group from which students are pulled into the magnet.

You want your kid to be in an “elite” environment where only the top 1% get in - apply to Sidwell or Maret. Stop using the public schools as a means to suck resources out for a tiny percentage of the population who already tend to be privileged children. As a tax payer I’m happy to see the magnet lottery and glad to see some equity brought to the equation of these programs.

The cost is the same aside from busing so one solution would be to restrict admission to those willing to provide their own transportation. In the case of those already attending these schools that wouldn't even be necessary. This would be a huge cost savings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
No one is addressing the point that the county resorted to lottery because of covid (and therefore no Cogats). The point we should be addressing is when they'll get back to using Cogats. I don't think they'll do it in the spring, but they could do it starting the 2022-2023 school year.

IProblem is there is no transparency in the process. Lottery due to COVID is what they said earlier. However, if you read the case text related to the lawsuit someone posted earlier? MCPS states that if there is cohort of 20 or more kids in homeschool, they will not consider those kids in CES program. If there are less than 20, and the homeschool cannot meet their accilerated need, then they will be placed in Regional programs. It is unclear whether MCPS even considers academic performance at par when they place the kids in regional program.

There is no plan at the moment from MCPS to get back to CoGAT even though kids are back in school in person. Also there is a problem with Virtual Academy in the mix. There are no accelerated program in VA and there is no cohort either. CoGAT is also discontinued.
It is not clear whether MCPS will consider VA students for Regional CES programs based on performance. MCPS BOE gets an F for creating all this mess.

Around this time last year (2020) MCPS defended itself in the Asian discrimination lawsuit motion to dismiss by saying they had switched to a lottery so the specific complaint about MS magnet selection methodology, including cohort, was moot. If you read Jude Xinis's opinion on the motion, you see that no one in MCPS I ready to either commit to the lottery, or commit to the old method. Even to save themselves $100k in attorneys' fees. They don't know sh*t. As with many things we have seen over this pandemic period, there is no actual plan. They are adrift and meandering through the latest edu-speak opinion and reacting t the loudest parents.

If Asians make up 15% of the county but typically account for 60% of the magnet seats I would think that case would get laughed out of court.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
No one is addressing the point that the county resorted to lottery because of covid (and therefore no Cogats). The point we should be addressing is when they'll get back to using Cogats. I don't think they'll do it in the spring, but they could do it starting the 2022-2023 school year.

IProblem is there is no transparency in the process. Lottery due to COVID is what they said earlier. However, if you read the case text related to the lawsuit someone posted earlier? MCPS states that if there is cohort of 20 or more kids in homeschool, they will not consider those kids in CES program. If there are less than 20, and the homeschool cannot meet their accilerated need, then they will be placed in Regional programs. It is unclear whether MCPS even considers academic performance at par when they place the kids in regional program.

There is no plan at the moment from MCPS to get back to CoGAT even though kids are back in school in person. Also there is a problem with Virtual Academy in the mix. There are no accelerated program in VA and there is no cohort either. CoGAT is also discontinued.
It is not clear whether MCPS will consider VA students for Regional CES programs based on performance. MCPS BOE gets an F for creating all this mess.

Around this time last year (2020) MCPS defended itself in the Asian discrimination lawsuit motion to dismiss by saying they had switched to a lottery so the specific complaint about MS magnet selection methodology, including cohort, was moot. If you read Jude Xinis's opinion on the motion, you see that no one in MCPS I ready to either commit to the lottery, or commit to the old method. Even to save themselves $100k in attorneys' fees. They don't know sh*t. As with many things we have seen over this pandemic period, there is no actual plan. They are adrift and meandering through the latest edu-speak opinion and reacting t the loudest parents.

If Asians make up 15% of the county but typically account for 60% of the magnet seats I would think that case would get laughed out of court.

The point of the lawsuit, I believe, is that the County specifically changed the admission criteria to keep Asians out of the magnet programs. If true, that would be discriminatory.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:With more than 160,000 students I imagine MCPS has a WHOLE LOT MORE on its plate than this. Using the oft repeated "99%" standard it sounds like this ENDLESS debate is about MAYBE 1600 of students? Less than half of 1% of the students MCPS works with?

One of these mornings or afternoons go and watch a county school bus load and unload a dozen SEVERELY SEVERELY SEVERELY handicapped children in wheelchairs.
Watch the county feed kids that don't get enoughto eat at home.
Watch them graduate kids whose parents are in jail or dead and manage to get some of them into college

Then drive home and

Hug your child because you can
Feed your child another healthy meal
Kick or throw a ball around with them because they can control their limbs

And hopefully... Hopefully... HOPEFULLY.... experience a moment of peace because you are blessed

Ok. so you will ingnore the needs of 1600 kids just because you have more kids in the school system? If you are tired, perhaps, time for you to step away from the thread. your intention to discourage others from discussing this important topic, which by the way will have significant impact on future generations to come, is very apparent.

DP - " The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few"

ISn't MCPS BOE suppose to make decisions to meet the needs of all students? So are they making decisions based on the number of students? What happened to no child left behind? You seems to don't care.

They are but since they will never be able to please everybody, they are at least making decisions that will meet the needs of the many

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The programs used to look for kids who were true outliers. Now we seem to think that the top 25% are outliers and need special programs. If we want to have a program for the top 25% in can be in every school. No need for any lottery based magnet. It is compact math + a high reading group + enrichment.

Yep, these programs as we knew them are no more...

I know right? We cannot game the system anymore.
Oh well, time to move to VA

May be the games just started at MCPS lowering the standards for all

Or maybe the county is tired of the enormous investment of time, money, and resources dedicated to programs that are demanded by and largely for wealthy whites people. Maybe they are interested in simplifying the process to A) root out bias in selection for these programs and B) expand by a tiny bit the group from which students are pulled into the magnet.

You want your kid to be in an “elite” environment where only the top 1% get in - apply to Sidwell or Maret. Stop using the public schools as a means to suck resources out for a tiny percentage of the population who already tend to be privileged children. As a tax payer I’m happy to see the magnet lottery and glad to see some equity brought to the equation of these programs.

The CES and magnet programs were dominated by Asians who took a 40% hit in acceptance rates when they switched to the home school method a few years ago. So much for your tirade against whites.

Some on this thread always look at everything in life through the lens of race unfortunately. They continuously bring up race and feel really good when some of the students are put at a disadvantage to benefit others. They find satisfaction and miss the larger picture ie; futue of the nation and our responsibility as a society to support every kid in what they do best to help them reach their potential.

1) MCPS is the one who continually uses the lens of race.

2) Supporting every kid to reach their potential means matching their current potential AND academic preparation to allow them to learn and succeed as much as possible. It does not mean arbitrarily assigning them to a magnet program without consideration of both of these.

Yes the lens of race for a race blind selection process LOL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
No one is addressing the point that the county resorted to lottery because of covid (and therefore no Cogats). The point we should be addressing is when they'll get back to using Cogats. I don't think they'll do it in the spring, but they could do it starting the 2022-2023 school year.

IProblem is there is no transparency in the process. Lottery due to COVID is what they said earlier. However, if you read the case text related to the lawsuit someone posted earlier? MCPS states that if there is cohort of 20 or more kids in homeschool, they will not consider those kids in CES program. If there are less than 20, and the homeschool cannot meet their accilerated need, then they will be placed in Regional programs. It is unclear whether MCPS even considers academic performance at par when they place the kids in regional program.

There is no plan at the moment from MCPS to get back to CoGAT even though kids are back in school in person. Also there is a problem with Virtual Academy in the mix. There are no accelerated program in VA and there is no cohort either. CoGAT is also discontinued.
It is not clear whether MCPS will consider VA students for Regional CES programs based on performance. MCPS BOE gets an F for creating all this mess.

Around this time last year (2020) MCPS defended itself in the Asian discrimination lawsuit motion to dismiss by saying they had switched to a lottery so the specific complaint about MS magnet selection methodology, including cohort, was moot. If you read Jude Xinis's opinion on the motion, you see that no one in MCPS I ready to either commit to the lottery, or commit to the old method. Even to save themselves $100k in attorneys' fees. They don't know sh*t. As with many things we have seen over this pandemic period, there is no actual plan. They are adrift and meandering through the latest edu-speak opinion and reacting t the loudest parents.

If Asians make up 15% of the county but typically account for 60% of the magnet seats I would think that case would get laughed out of court.

The point of the lawsuit, I believe, is that the County specifically changed the admission criteria to keep Asians out of the magnet programs. If true, that would be discriminatory.

Really? I thought they changed it to better support all people not just those wealthy families that could afford cram school.