Is nanny confusing my baby or am I just looking for someone to blame my frustration on?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I vote confusing. I think consistency is really important when sleep training, and I don't think naps and nights are as separate as you think.

The language barrier is stressful, but I think it's time to take a half hour and start fresh. Walk her through the fact that you're sleep training, you're goals (to have the baby go to sleep independently and take two naps of at least an hour a day), and what steps you'd like her to take during the day. I think particularly with a language barrier, you might try to get your point across verbally, in writing, and in action if possible. So, start with verbally walking her through it. Encourage questions. Do you have book that you're working off of? Could you maybe flag some key pages and give them to her to read? Or write down the details of your routine (with guidelines of what to do when) and give her basically a one-pager? Especially with a language barrier, sometimes having both a spoken and written option can help bridge that gap. And then maybe have her watch you do the routine one day?

This is a hill I would die on, but I'm alllllll about baby sleep.

PP here - I also think it would be best to have this conversation on a Friday, then hit it hard over the weekend, so she's jumping in on day three of intense nap training on Monday, rather than day 1. You do want to minimize the crying she has to deal with. You might even want to even take a couple days off to get a longer stretch of time where you can do it.

Or maybe she can take time off during nap and put baby down and show nanny how she wants to do it. Innoway both to train the nanny and sleep train the baby.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is “lots of tears?” We don’t have a nanny so everything is consistent but I still get as many as 15 minutes of crying at bedtime and often a few minutes of crying at naps (no “routine” except a little cuddle, dark and white noise and sleep sack). I would say she’s fully sleep trained though. She just “powers down” to borrow a phrase from a book. I also notice the bedtime crying is worse on days with a lot of excitement, so I think she’s just processing. It never goes longer than 15 minutes.

I would ask nanny to do whatever it is you want, very specifically. So for example rocking until drowsy, then pit down still awake, then as much as 15 minutes of crying? Whatever it is. Make sure there’s a clock in the room.

But honestly I don’t think it’s this specific or magical. I think some crying is just part of it.

Thanks this is incredibly helpful. Yeah "lots of tears" is like 20-30 minutes w/ check ins some nights this past week. He's certainly got FOMO and will only go down without any fussing if he's just absolutely exhausted. I don't mind a little fussing as he winds down, but 20 minutes of actual on and off crying is hard to listen to, and makes me feel horrible. It's helpful to know some babies just need some time to decompress and they cry at bedtime sometimes - I feel like everyone talks about sleep training like they have 3 rough nights and then it's all rainbows and sunshine, so maybe I need to partially reframe my own expectations for our spirited dude.

Oh for God's sake, your 6 month old does not have FOMO

It's also not especially difficult for a 6 month old to go from playing to native without much transition in between. It sounds like you're not well read on normal infant development.

I'd never sleep train again, based on what I know now. But with the child that I did sleep train it was often like you describe. Things would go well for a few weeks (maybe even a month!) Then baby would enter a developmental leap or hit a new milestone and we'd be back to square one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's hard to tell. However, if you really want a certain routine and the nanny is not doing it, it's time for a talk.

It's okay if she doesn't want to raise the child this way, but then you are not very compatible in styles. Or maybe she just doesn't understand what you want, or she doesn't get how important it is to you. Have the talk.

This. And it may be time to part ways, too. If I were a nanny, I could not let a baby cry it out no matter what the parents said. Though I'd have had a discussion with the employer and offered to resign if that was a requirement. I think that is the type of thing parents and nanny candidates need to discuss ahead of time though.

Thanks, I understand that sentiment too which is why I have not doubled down yet this week on the rocking thing. I am trying to figure out if what I've read is correct (at least anecdotally with others' experiences) - that babies can adapt to different caregivers - OR if we are setting our baby up for failure by not being more firm with her.

And I really wanted to go all in on not sleep training but our baby (and we) were getting such awful fractured sleep, something had to change. The strange thing is that initially she suggested to us to let him cry more when he was much younger and struggling with naps, and we were nowhere near ready to even think about sleep training at that point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is “lots of tears?” We don’t have a nanny so everything is consistent but I still get as many as 15 minutes of crying at bedtime and often a few minutes of crying at naps (no “routine” except a little cuddle, dark and white noise and sleep sack). I would say she’s fully sleep trained though. She just “powers down” to borrow a phrase from a book. I also notice the bedtime crying is worse on days with a lot of excitement, so I think she’s just processing. It never goes longer than 15 minutes.

I would ask nanny to do whatever it is you want, very specifically. So for example rocking until drowsy, then pit down still awake, then as much as 15 minutes of crying? Whatever it is. Make sure there’s a clock in the room.

But honestly I don’t think it’s this specific or magical. I think some crying is just part of it.

Thanks this is incredibly helpful. Yeah "lots of tears" is like 20-30 minutes w/ check ins some nights this past week. He's certainly got FOMO and will only go down without any fussing if he's just absolutely exhausted. I don't mind a little fussing as he winds down, but 20 minutes of actual on and off crying is hard to listen to, and makes me feel horrible. It's helpful to know some babies just need some time to decompress and they cry at bedtime sometimes - I feel like everyone talks about sleep training like they have 3 rough nights and then it's all rainbows and sunshine, so maybe I need to partially reframe my own expectations for our spirited dude.

Oh for God's sake, your 6 month old does not have FOMO

It's also not especially difficult for a 6 month old to go from playing to native without much transition in between. It sounds like you're not well read on normal infant development.

I'd never sleep train again, based on what I know now. But with the child that I did sleep train it was often like you describe. Things would go well for a few weeks (maybe even a month!) Then baby would enter a developmental leap or hit a new milestone and we'd be back to square one.

I've read a ton on normal infant sleep, yes, and weighed a bunch of what I read against what I read about sleep training. As I said in my post and previous follow-ups, I know babies go through many changes and phases and regressions and nothing is linear. It's actually not at all what I'm asking though. I'm wondering if inconsistency between caregivers is leading to more confusion for my baby and making it even harder on him.

And I'm not talking about a 20 minute routine. I'm talking about a diaper change, and a song while he is rocked for a minute or two and put in the crib calmly. I do think transitions are especially tough for some babies and routine helps with that. Mine included, as I see great success on the weekends when I'm responsible for him all day.

[Anonymous]

It could be cultural too—we had a nanny who came from a culture where leaving your baby to cry was considered abusive. She loved our son and was otherwise fantastic, so we gave up the fight in naps. At 6 months, it can also be hard to distinguish between a sleep regression and poor sleep training, so adding that uncertainty (on my part) to the many’s feeling that we were asking her to do something immoral was too much. At the end of the day, I decided that I’d rather take someone who cared about my son and gave up on sleep. But the sleep was really rough, so I understand your dilemma!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I vote confusing. I think consistency is really important when sleep training, and I don't think naps and nights are as separate as you think.

The language barrier is stressful, but I think it's time to take a half hour and start fresh. Walk her through the fact that you're sleep training, you're goals (to have the baby go to sleep independently and take two naps of at least an hour a day), and what steps you'd like her to take during the day. I think particularly with a language barrier, you might try to get your point across verbally, in writing, and in action if possible. So, start with verbally walking her through it. Encourage questions. Do you have book that you're working off of? Could you maybe flag some key pages and give them to her to read? Or write down the details of your routine (with guidelines of what to do when) and give her basically a one-pager? Especially with a language barrier, sometimes having both a spoken and written option can help bridge that gap. And then maybe have her watch you do the routine one day?

This is a hill I would die on, but I'm alllllll about baby sleep.

PP here - I also think it would be best to have this conversation on a Friday, then hit it hard over the weekend, so she's jumping in on day three of intense nap training on Monday, rather than day 1. You do want to minimize the crying she has to deal with. You might even want to even take a couple days off to get a longer stretch of time where you can do it.

Or maybe she can take time off during nap and put baby down and show nanny how she wants to do it. Innoway both to train the nanny and sleep train the baby.

Thanks, these are both great suggestions - I appreciate your thoughtful responses!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It could be cultural too—we had a nanny who came from a culture where leaving your baby to cry was considered abusive. She loved our son and was otherwise fantastic, so we gave up the fight in naps. At 6 months, it can also be hard to distinguish between a sleep regression and poor sleep training, so adding that uncertainty (on my part) to the many’s feeling that we were asking her to do something immoral was too much. At the end of the day, I decided that I’d rather take someone who cared about my son and gave up on sleep. But the sleep was really rough, so I understand your dilemma!

Thanks, exactly the dilemma. She loves our baby so much that it's hard to say "you're actually loving him too much." I wish it was easier and he was an easier sleeper, and secretly hope this is all just a regression and nights will be back on track soon, regardless of what she does. I hate putting a very loving woman in a position that is clearly making her uncomfortable, even though I ultimately think it is best for him to have consistency among us. My husband and I are riding it out this week, seeing what happens this weekend when we do naps too, and then planning to try once more on Monday with a conversation. We may give up after that point and accept that the benefits of her care outweigh this.

[Anonymous]

OP I really don't think this is an issue with the nanny. I think you may be having some stress about having a nanny at all, and among the healthy things to do about this problem is to decompress a little bit and just realize you'll have to roll with some bumps, some crying and some regressions. Having the nanny who loves him and his mommy who loves him is a lot more important than minutes of crying pre-nap or a pre-nap routine. Things don't have to be going perfectly for you to be parenting perfectly, if that makes any sense.

[Anonymous]

Isn't your nanny the one who has the most experience with your child's naps? Why don't you trust her judgment on what your child needs during the day? Since she is presumably handling this 5 days a week and you're only handling it 2 days a week.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Isn't your nanny the one who has the most experience with your child's naps? Why don't you trust her judgment on what your child needs during the day? Since she is presumably handling this 5 days a week and you're only handling it 2 days a week.

Also, it's possible he's started to have problems at night again because he's underslept because you're forcing him to soothe himself to sleep at naps (and it sounds like he's missing out on a lot of daytime sleep because of that). Maybe your nanny can tell he's under-rested and just wants to make sure he takes good naps, vs. sticking to the sleep training schedule.

[Anonymous]

It could be cultural too—we had a nanny who came from a culture where leaving your baby to cry was considered abusive. She loved our son and was otherwise fantastic, so we gave up the fight in naps. At 6 months, it can also be hard to distinguish between a sleep regression and poor sleep training, so adding that uncertainty (on my part) to the many’s feeling that we were asking her to do something immoral was too much. At the end of the day, I decided that I’d rather take someone who cared about my son and gave up on sleep. But the sleep was really rough, so I understand your dilemma!

Thanks, exactly the dilemma. She loves our baby so much that it's hard to say "you're actually loving him too much." I wish it was easier and he was an easier sleeper, and secretly hope this is all just a regression and nights will be back on track soon, regardless of what she does. I hate putting a very loving woman in a position that is clearly making her uncomfortable, even though I ultimately think it is best for him to have consistency among us. My husband and I are riding it out this week, seeing what happens this weekend when we do naps too, and then planning to try once more on Monday with a conversation. We may give up after that point and accept that the benefits of her care outweigh this.

NP, we had a similar situation, and a wonderful nanny with cultural differences who "babied" our kids--who yet became great sleepers. As from a older Mom with multiple kids (why am I on this thread again ?), I would just caution that there are so many factors to a baby's sleep patterns, temperaments, developmental stages, it is hard for me to believe that small discrepancies between caretakers is somehow the decisive factor. I think you are latching upon this because it is something you *can* control, as opposed to the many factors you cannot. So absolutely have a calm, polite conversation with your nanny about your thoughts about sleep/nap training, but is absolutely not worth jeopardizing your relationship!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Isn't your nanny the one who has the most experience with your child's naps? Why don't you trust her judgment on what your child needs during the day? Since she is presumably handling this 5 days a week and you're only handling it 2 days a week.

Also, it's possible he's started to have problems at night again because he's underslept because you're forcing him to soothe himself to sleep at naps (and it sounds like he's missing out on a lot of daytime sleep because of that). Maybe your nanny can tell he's under-rested and just wants to make sure he takes good naps, vs. sticking to the sleep training schedule.

I really respectfully disagree with this sentiment that often comes up on DCUM. Yes she has experience with more babies than I do, but every parent is different and part of her job is also to implement things the parent wants. And every baby is different so what may have worked for a previous kid, may not work for mine - if it's affecting his settling at bedtime, it doesn't work for us. I don't know if it is, which is why I posed the question.

It is possible that nights are being affected by day sleep but he's actually getting great naps (3 hours on average between the two naps), both before and after she started rocking him to sleep again. It's possible that he's still adjusting to having dropped the 3rd nap though, and it has nothing to do with confusion between caregivers style though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP I really don't think this is an issue with the nanny. I think you may be having some stress about having a nanny at all, and among the healthy things to do about this problem is to decompress a little bit and just realize you'll have to roll with some bumps, some crying and some regressions. Having the nanny who loves him and his mommy who loves him is a lot more important than minutes of crying pre-nap or a pre-nap routine. Things don't have to be going perfectly for you to be parenting perfectly, if that makes any sense.

Thank you this is helpful perspective. I think you are absolutely correct that a lot of it is figuring out how to let go and let someone else be his primary caregiver M-F. It's always worth reminding myself of that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

It could be cultural too—we had a nanny who came from a culture where leaving your baby to cry was considered abusive. She loved our son and was otherwise fantastic, so we gave up the fight in naps. At 6 months, it can also be hard to distinguish between a sleep regression and poor sleep training, so adding that uncertainty (on my part) to the many’s feeling that we were asking her to do something immoral was too much. At the end of the day, I decided that I’d rather take someone who cared about my son and gave up on sleep. But the sleep was really rough, so I understand your dilemma!

Thanks, exactly the dilemma. She loves our baby so much that it's hard to say "you're actually loving him too much." I wish it was easier and he was an easier sleeper, and secretly hope this is all just a regression and nights will be back on track soon, regardless of what she does. I hate putting a very loving woman in a position that is clearly making her uncomfortable, even though I ultimately think it is best for him to have consistency among us. My husband and I are riding it out this week, seeing what happens this weekend when we do naps too, and then planning to try once more on Monday with a conversation. We may give up after that point and accept that the benefits of her care outweigh this.

NP, we had a similar situation, and a wonderful nanny with cultural differences who "babied" our kids--who yet became great sleepers. As from a older Mom with multiple kids (why am I on this thread again ?), I would just caution that there are so many factors to a baby's sleep patterns, temperaments, developmental stages, it is hard for me to believe that small discrepancies between caretakers is somehow the decisive factor. I think you are latching upon this because it is something you *can* control, as opposed to the many factors you cannot. So absolutely have a calm, polite conversation with your nanny about your thoughts about sleep/nap training, but is absolutely not worth jeopardizing your relationship!

Thank you very much for this perspective. I definitely KNOW a big part of this is me not being in control which is why I asked "am I just looking for someone to blame my frustration on" initially. Perspective from people who have been there, done that are really appreciated as I navigate my own feelings/coping mechanisms and figure out what is/isn't a hill to die on as we stick with this.

[Anonymous]

Have you considered, just rocking your baby to sleep? I mean if it works and it gets him to sleep why not just do that. He'll outgrow those pretty quick anyways before you know it you'll have a kid in school.