Wilson honors for all - how has it worked?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the principal is closing the achievement gap by ensuring the top students hit the ceiling as fast as possible. If thebonlybdiscussion is on bringing up the slow kids what’s the point of honors? At this stage kids can either do the work or not. Demand more parents or stop supporting the achool.

OP here - my question was how has this worked? I think it would be helpful to consider that answer before assuming the worst and “demanding more”.

My oldest is at Deal but I heard the Principal on NPR with other academics that research points to all the kids benefitting from this model. The high achievers needs are met while kids at the lower end learn more with support (initially) and develop much better confidence and self esteem. It is problematic that so few minorities end up in advanced classes.

Maybe Deal can learn from this so can catch up before they go to Wilson?

It is identical to Deal's model. There are no levels except for math. It is all IB and the provide many support opportunities for struggling students to keep up with the strong students.

And yet, the achievement gap persists at Deal, including the growth scores, as measured by PARCC (and it was the same on DC CAS so probably not only about the test being flawed)

27% gap on ELA (4+)
44% gap in math

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the principal is closing the achievement gap by ensuring the top students hit the ceiling as fast as possible. If thebonlybdiscussion is on bringing up the slow kids what’s the point of honors? At this stage kids can either do the work or not. Demand more parents or stop supporting the achool.

OP here - my question was how has this worked? I think it would be helpful to consider that answer before assuming the worst and “demanding more”.

My oldest is at Deal but I heard the Principal on NPR with other academics that research points to all the kids benefitting from this model. The high achievers needs are met while kids at the lower end learn more with support (initially) and develop much better confidence and self esteem. It is problematic that so few minorities end up in advanced classes.

Maybe Deal can learn from this so can catch up before they go to Wilson?

It is identical to Deal's model. There are no levels except for math. It is all IB and the provide many support opportunities for struggling students to keep up with the strong students.

This is not identical to Deal. Having no tracked classes other than math and having GRIT available at recess is not the same as having intentionally small classes and what sounded like direct intervention for some students to bring their reading skills up. I have an 8th grader at Deal now. I would love to hear from Wilson Parents with 9th or 10th graders that can speak to their children’s experiences. All parents I know with kids at Wilson are very happy with it, but I have not asked this specific question about how challenged the high achieving kids are in these particular classes, largely because I have no idea which kids are the high achieving kids outside my own child’s grade and I do not want to be rude.

[Anonymous]

My kid is in 9th at Wilson and while he is enjoying himself it mostly does not strike me as honors level work. In English they read some essays and chapters of books and discuss in class--he likes it, but not a lot of rigorous reading. In history he doesn't even have a book; they read short things in class, the teacher presents material, they do short exercises. He likes both classes and is engaged with the material, but it is not much material and all the writing assignments are extremely short. I don't blame the teachers, who have way too many students, but I'm not sure what it means that it is "honors."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the principal is closing the achievement gap by ensuring the top students hit the ceiling as fast as possible. If thebonlybdiscussion is on bringing up the slow kids what’s the point of honors? At this stage kids can either do the work or not. Demand more parents or stop supporting the achool.

OP here - my question was how has this worked? I think it would be helpful to consider that answer before assuming the worst and “demanding more”.

My oldest is at Deal but I heard the Principal on NPR with other academics that research points to all the kids benefitting from this model. The high achievers needs are met while kids at the lower end learn more with support (initially) and develop much better confidence and self esteem. It is problematic that so few minorities end up in advanced classes.

Maybe Deal can learn from this so can catch up before they go to Wilson?

It is identical to Deal's model. There are no levels except for math. It is all IB and the provide many support opportunities for struggling students to keep up with the strong students.

This is not identical to Deal. Having no tracked classes other than math and having GRIT available at recess is not the same as having intentionally small classes and what sounded like direct intervention for some students to bring their reading skills up. I have an 8th grader at Deal now. I would love to hear from Wilson Parents with 9th or 10th graders that can speak to their children’s experiences. All parents I know with kids at Wilson are very happy with it, but I have not asked this specific question about how challenged the high achieving kids are in these particular classes, largely because I have no idea which kids are the high achieving kids outside my own child’s grade and I do not want to be rude.

GRIT you have time to do your homework and repeat assignment you missed as many times as you need is not differentiated instruction. Deal does not do a good job of supporting low performing students in need of differentiated but rigorous work.

[Anonymous]

I went to a private school in the south that implemented something similar (obviously different than a large urban public school, but still the same principle) where all classes were considered honors and you took an AP test at the end even though they weren’t designated as AP classes. It has the highest prestige college admissions in the state. Every student can do the work - it is harder for some than others or certain subjects may be harder, UT every student is 100% capable. Why should any parent or student settle for mediocrity?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid is in 9th at Wilson and while he is enjoying himself it mostly does not strike me as honors level work. In English they read some essays and chapters of books and discuss in class--he likes it, but not a lot of rigorous reading. In history he doesn't even have a book; they read short things in class, the teacher presents material, they do short exercises. He likes both classes and is engaged with the material, but it is not much material and all the writing assignments are extremely short. I don't blame the teachers, who have way too many students, but I'm not sure what it means that it is "honors."

We’re still at Deal, but what I’ve heard from a number of parents with high-achieving kids in older grades at Wilson is that 9th grade is not particularly challenging but that it picks up in 10th. I haven’t heard anything from them about the “honors for all” designation, pro or con.

[Anonymous]

My kid is in 9th grade now at Wilson.
It is ok but does not seem honors level. Very easy for my kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid is in 9th grade now at Wilson.
It is ok but does not seem honors level. Very easy for my kid.

Tell your kid to enjoy 9th. By 11th they will be encouraged to take 4-6 AP classes, and if they do any interesting electives (e.g. biomed) they will have a lot more work. If their AP class is large and the teacher can't control it (like my kid's science class), they will also be spending lots of time in group chats figuring out what the hell they are supposed to be learning and teaching themselves AP material out of a test prep book. Fun times.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the principal is closing the achievement gap by ensuring the top students hit the ceiling as fast as possible. If thebonlybdiscussion is on bringing up the slow kids what’s the point of honors? At this stage kids can either do the work or not. Demand more parents or stop supporting the achool.

You seem to be asserting that it's not possible to increase academic achievement in high school. What data supports this notion?

The point of honors is to serve kids aready above grade level. You hit the ground running. Why should the teacher take time away from smarter kids to get other kids up to level? Jus tour those kids in regular leve classes. At some
Point we have to stop punishing high achieving kids in DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid is in 9th grade now at Wilson.
It is ok but does not seem honors level. Very easy for my kid.

Tell your kid to enjoy 9th. By 11th they will be encouraged to take 4-6 AP classes, and if they do any interesting electives (e.g. biomed) they will have a lot more work. If their AP class is large and the teacher can't control it (like my kid's science class), they will also be spending lots of time in group chats figuring out what the hell they are supposed to be learning and teaching themselves AP material out of a test prep book. Fun times.

np: This is where I am confused: i often see people mention large, unwieldy classes. But a poster above said one feature of “Honors for All” is small classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid is in 9th grade now at Wilson.
It is ok but does not seem honors level. Very easy for my kid.

Tell your kid to enjoy 9th. By 11th they will be encouraged to take 4-6 AP classes, and if they do any interesting electives (e.g. biomed) they will have a lot more work. If their AP class is large and the teacher can't control it (like my kid's science class), they will also be spending lots of time in group chats figuring out what the hell they are supposed to be learning and teaching themselves AP material out of a test prep book. Fun times.

np: This is where I am confused: i often see people mention large, unwieldy classes. But a poster above said one feature of “Honors for All” is small classes.

They are making a decision to invest the school’s resources in small classes in 9th to create a stronger foundation across the cohort. The other side of this is a reduction in resources for the AP classes for the older kids and consequently larger classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid is in 9th grade now at Wilson.
It is ok but does not seem honors level. Very easy for my kid.

Tell your kid to enjoy 9th. By 11th they will be encouraged to take 4-6 AP classes, and if they do any interesting electives (e.g. biomed) they will have a lot more work. If their AP class is large and the teacher can't control it (like my kid's science class), they will also be spending lots of time in group chats figuring out what the hell they are supposed to be learning and teaching themselves AP material out of a test prep book. Fun times.

np: This is where I am confused: i often see people mention large, unwieldy classes. But a poster above said one feature of “Honors for All” is small classes.

They are making a decision to invest the school’s resources in small classes in 9th to create a stronger foundation across the cohort. The other side of this is a reduction in resources for the AP classes for the older kids and consequently larger classes.

Thanks for the explanation.

I’m like OP — I’d like to understand how well this is working (and actually at Wison, not just in research).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid is in 9th grade now at Wilson.
It is ok but does not seem honors level. Very easy for my kid.

Tell your kid to enjoy 9th. By 11th they will be encouraged to take 4-6 AP classes, and if they do any interesting electives (e.g. biomed) they will have a lot more work. If their AP class is large and the teacher can't control it (like my kid's science class), they will also be spending lots of time in group chats figuring out what the hell they are supposed to be learning and teaching themselves AP material out of a test prep book. Fun times.

np: This is where I am confused: i often see people mention large, unwieldy classes. But a poster above said one feature of “Honors for All” is small classes.

They are making a decision to invest the school’s resources in small classes in 9th to create a stronger foundation across the cohort. The other side of this is a reduction in resources for the AP classes for the older kids and consequently larger classes.

Thanks for the explanation.

I’m like OP — I’d like to understand how well this is working (and actually at Wison, not just in research).

How many years has this been the norm? One or two?

It is unlikely that Wilson will know until the first class of students under this model graduates, because they will want to see if any gains carried through to the rest of their time in high school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the principal is closing the achievement gap by ensuring the top students hit the ceiling as fast as possible. If thebonlybdiscussion is on bringing up the slow kids what’s the point of honors? At this stage kids can either do the work or not. Demand more parents or stop supporting the achool.

OP here - my question was how has this worked? I think it would be helpful to consider that answer before assuming the worst and “demanding more”.

My oldest is at Deal but I heard the Principal on NPR with other academics that research points to all the kids benefitting from this model. The high achievers needs are met while kids at the lower end learn more with support (initially) and develop much better confidence and self esteem. It is problematic that so few minorities end up in advanced classes.

The bolded part sounds like a bunch of nonsense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I went to a private school in the south that implemented something similar (obviously different than a large urban public school, but still the same principle) where all classes were considered honors and you took an AP test at the end even though they weren’t designated as AP classes. It has the highest prestige college admissions in the state. Every student can do the work - it is harder for some than others or certain subjects may be harder, UT every student is 100% capable. Why should any parent or student settle for mediocrity?

You are comparing a private school to a DC public school?