Is this friendship over?

[Anonymous]

I could have written this same exact post several years ago. Very similar personality of your friend and mine. I can speak from first hand experience, it wasn't easy, but it was best to remove myself (something I sat in prayer A LOT about). Of course your husband and child come first, and honestly feel like any good friend would see that. It's awful what your friend is going through, but it also seems like the relationship is one-sided. You know what's best for you, and if you feel like in your heart of heart that this relationship needs to be over, then that may be the best choice. Just from your post, you are clearly see that you are being empathetic to her situation, and no way being selfish or just ended a friendship out of spike, etc. Prayers as you continue to process this situation.

Also, there are so many articles our there about this exact topic! Here's a link to a few that may be helpful https://bit.ly/2NFOWcW

[Anonymous]

She sounds way too high maintenance and self centered. Ask yourself what you are getting out of this relationship, OP. I would let it die.

[Anonymous]

Call her once every 2 weeks. Talk for 20minutes. See how that goes. If it's pleasant, start seeing each other, say, every 2 weeks for an hour or two. Do not rely on each other for emergencies or deeply emotional sharing --- neither of you can handle that right now --- it's not appropriate for the amount either of you can invest. Life gets in the way. It should. That's what happens in an emotionally healthy life

I'm this poster and I thought I'd add, if you're uncomfortable w/2 week contact, drop it to monthly or less frequent than that, a couple times a year. If the relationship is remains uncomfortable long term, then just a holiday card. It's good to leave the door open. I don't think there is anyone in my past where I can't manage some degree of contact. Put your "schedule" of contact with this person on the calendar, it's a "to do", and in between forget about it.

[Anonymous]

Some people are takers, she is one of them. You had a baby and she was still a taker. Did she send you a card for baby? A present? How much was she there for you? If she did all these, well great, maybe be a bigger person and make amends. If she wasn't, drop the vampire.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Call her once every 2 weeks. Talk for 20minutes. See how that goes. If it's pleasant, start seeing each other, say, every 2 weeks for an hour or two. Do not rely on each other for emergencies or deeply emotional sharing --- neither of you can handle that right now --- it's not appropriate for the amount either of you can invest. Life gets in the way. It should. That's what happens in an emotionally healthy life

I'm this poster and I thought I'd add, if you're uncomfortable w/2 week contact, drop it to monthly or less frequent than that, a couple times a year. If the relationship is remains uncomfortable long term, then just a holiday card. It's good to leave the door open. I don't think there is anyone in my past where I can't manage some degree of contact. Put your "schedule" of contact with this person on the calendar, it's a "to do", and in between forget about it.

New poster and I agree with PP here, especially on leaving the door open.

The "dump her" posts are very common on DCUM whenever questions like yours come up, OP, but those responses have zero consideration for the reality that even people who are chronically ill or demanding or annoying can be a friend. You have long history with her though it sounds like life has gotten in the way, which is normal.

But if her demanding ways toward you are a fairly recent change and she wasn't like this for most of your time as friends, in you shoes I'd be wondering: Is this really her talking -- or is it her illness? Is she actually not getting much emotional support from her husband so she's unreasonably acting out and grasping for support elsewhere, and overreacting when she doesn't feel she gets it?

I am not excusing her behavior, just saying that there may be more going on than she is telling you, particularly if she became so needy/angry only after she started dealing with a chronic condition. Have you considered that?

I would ramp back the texts etc. and do as the PP suggests, contacting once every two weeks but doing so consistently.

Have you offered to see her, just the two of you, maybe doing an activity you know she likes and would find distracting? Your spouse can spend time with your child while you actually see your friend. That's healthy for you, even if things are idyllic at home with your DC and DH. And doing an activity with your friend may be more comfortable than meeting up and expecting some long, deep, heart-to-heart talk at this point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Call her once every 2 weeks. Talk for 20minutes. See how that goes. If it's pleasant, start seeing each other, say, every 2 weeks for an hour or two. Do not rely on each other for emergencies or deeply emotional sharing --- neither of you can handle that right now --- it's not appropriate for the amount either of you can invest. Life gets in the way. It should. That's what happens in an emotionally healthy life

I'm this poster and I thought I'd add, if you're uncomfortable w/2 week contact, drop it to monthly or less frequent than that, a couple times a year. If the relationship is remains uncomfortable long term, then just a holiday card. It's good to leave the door open. I don't think there is anyone in my past where I can't manage some degree of contact. Put your "schedule" of contact with this person on the calendar, it's a "to do", and in between forget about it.

New poster and I agree with PP here, especially on leaving the door open.

The "dump her" posts are very common on DCUM whenever questions like yours come up, OP, but those responses have zero consideration for the reality that even people who are chronically ill or demanding or annoying can be a friend. You have long history with her though it sounds like life has gotten in the way, which is normal.

But if her demanding ways toward you are a fairly recent change and she wasn't like this for most of your time as friends, in you shoes I'd be wondering: Is this really her talking -- or is it her illness? Is she actually not getting much emotional support from her husband so she's unreasonably acting out and grasping for support elsewhere, and overreacting when she doesn't feel she gets it?

I am not excusing her behavior, just saying that there may be more going on than she is telling you, particularly if she became so needy/angry only after she started dealing with a chronic condition. Have you considered that?

I would ramp back the texts etc. and do as the PP suggests, contacting once every two weeks but doing so consistently.

Have you offered to see her, just the two of you, maybe doing an activity you know she likes and would find distracting? Your spouse can spend time with your child while you actually see your friend. That's healthy for you, even if things are idyllic at home with your DC and DH. And doing an activity with your friend may be more comfortable than meeting up and expecting some long, deep, heart-to-heart talk at this point.

OP here - thanks to you - and to PP for the advice re: leaving the door open. This friend can be very giving - she just has rigid rules and expectations for how friends should be, and sometimes she fails to communicate those expectations and when you fail to meet them, she is upset. This is not new/chronic illness related, but has been a pattern. For a long time, it was our other close friend who she didn't feel had met her expectations. Now it's me. She has been a good friend to me at times, she isn't a toxic/taker type personality. At least, I don't think so - my DH might differ. I think part of the issue is that - in high school and college, I was a pushover. When she would get upset I would apologize, even if I didn't feel that the situation was my fault. However, I've changed a lot since then, and we lived apart in different cities for a long time during a period in my life where I grew into myself and became a lot stronger. I think she still expects me to sort of just fall apart when she is mad at me and is surprised and upset when I don't.

The last time we talked she reached out and told me that things weren't going well in our friendship and she felt like I hadn't been there. I think that was the moment when I could have probably fixed things if I had apologized for all and asked for to forgive me for everything. I think though that I felt I should also be honest about my side of things. I communicated to her that I was sorry that I was unable to come visit her when she had her pain relapse when DS was two/three weeks old, but that I really felt that I was unable to leave my infant at that time or bring him to the hospital. I told her that her reaction to that inability - to tell me that she wouldn't speak to me for a while - was hurtful, and added a weight to the ppd and pp anxiety I was experiencing. I think my failure to take on a more repentant - not sure if that's the right word - role surprised her and things never really got better.

The thing is - we have had so many serious conversations, and it feels so hard. No other friendship - not even my marriage - feels like this much work? Most of my friendships are relaxed. I give out, and receive, rain checks, no one is mad, life gets in the way, and family comes first. I don't want to spend so much time analyzing my feelings. I feel like I've finally come out of the fog of ppd/pp anxiety and it feels nice to live in the present/let myself be happy. When I am with her, I feel like I'm failing someone, like I'm not allowed to have good things in life without guilt. The last time I saw her she commented on "anxious" behavior she stated she witnessed between me and my ds when she saw us together 6 months ago and it made me feel like a bad mother. I just want to be happy.

I think writing all this I'm realizing maybe I didn't need to post about whether or not the friendship is over. I just needed to write it all out. I don't need to close the door, because she isn't responding to my efforts, and she isn't reaching out. If she does I can make a decision then, but for now I think I need to let it go. I wish I could help her, but she doesn't really want my help. Maybe if I'd tried differently a while back? I don't know. I think I want permission not to contact her, but I need it from myself, not from a message board.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I could have written this same exact post several years ago. Very similar personality of your friend and mine. I can speak from first hand experience, it wasn't easy, but it was best to remove myself (something I sat in prayer A LOT about). Of course your husband and child come first, and honestly feel like any good friend would see that. It's awful what your friend is going through, but it also seems like the relationship is one-sided. You know what's best for you, and if you feel like in your heart of heart that this relationship needs to be over, then that may be the best choice. Just from your post, you are clearly see that you are being empathetic to her situation, and no way being selfish or just ended a friendship out of spike, etc. Prayers as you continue to process this situation.

Also, there are so many articles our there about this exact topic! Here's a link to a few that may be helpful https://bit.ly/2NFOWcW

OP here - thank you for the prayers .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Call her once every 2 weeks. Talk for 20minutes. See how that goes. If it's pleasant, start seeing each other, say, every 2 weeks for an hour or two. Do not rely on each other for emergencies or deeply emotional sharing --- neither of you can handle that right now --- it's not appropriate for the amount either of you can invest. Life gets in the way. It should. That's what happens in an emotionally healthy life

I'm this poster and I thought I'd add, if you're uncomfortable w/2 week contact, drop it to monthly or less frequent than that, a couple times a year. If the relationship is remains uncomfortable long term, then just a holiday card. It's good to leave the door open. I don't think there is anyone in my past where I can't manage some degree of contact. Put your "schedule" of contact with this person on the calendar, it's a "to do", and in between forget about it.

New poster and I agree with PP here, especially on leaving the door open.

The "dump her" posts are very common on DCUM whenever questions like yours come up, OP, but those responses have zero consideration for the reality that even people who are chronically ill or demanding or annoying can be a friend. You have long history with her though it sounds like life has gotten in the way, which is normal.

But if her demanding ways toward you are a fairly recent change and she wasn't like this for most of your time as friends, in you shoes I'd be wondering: Is this really her talking -- or is it her illness? Is she actually not getting much emotional support from her husband so she's unreasonably acting out and grasping for support elsewhere, and overreacting when she doesn't feel she gets it?

I am not excusing her behavior, just saying that there may be more going on than she is telling you, particularly if she became so needy/angry only after she started dealing with a chronic condition. Have you considered that?

I would ramp back the texts etc. and do as the PP suggests, contacting once every two weeks but doing so consistently.

Have you offered to see her, just the two of you, maybe doing an activity you know she likes and would find distracting? Your spouse can spend time with your child while you actually see your friend. That's healthy for you, even if things are idyllic at home with your DC and DH. And doing an activity with your friend may be more comfortable than meeting up and expecting some long, deep, heart-to-heart talk at this point.

OP here - thanks to you - and to PP for the advice re: leaving the door open. This friend can be very giving - she just has rigid rules and expectations for how friends should be, and sometimes she fails to communicate those expectations and when you fail to meet them, she is upset. This is not new/chronic illness related, but has been a pattern. For a long time, it was our other close friend who she didn't feel had met her expectations. Now it's me. She has been a good friend to me at times, she isn't a toxic/taker type personality. At least, I don't think so - my DH might differ. I think part of the issue is that - in high school and college, I was a pushover. When she would get upset I would apologize, even if I didn't feel that the situation was my fault. However, I've changed a lot since then, and we lived apart in different cities for a long time during a period in my life where I grew into myself and became a lot stronger. I think she still expects me to sort of just fall apart when she is mad at me and is surprised and upset when I don't.

The last time we talked she reached out and told me that things weren't going well in our friendship and she felt like I hadn't been there. I think that was the moment when I could have probably fixed things if I had apologized for all and asked for to forgive me for everything. I think though that I felt I should also be honest about my side of things. I communicated to her that I was sorry that I was unable to come visit her when she had her pain relapse when DS was two/three weeks old, but that I really felt that I was unable to leave my infant at that time or bring him to the hospital. I told her that her reaction to that inability - to tell me that she wouldn't speak to me for a while - was hurtful, and added a weight to the ppd and pp anxiety I was experiencing. I think my failure to take on a more repentant - not sure if that's the right word - role surprised her and things never really got better.

The thing is - we have had so many serious conversations, and it feels so hard. No other friendship - not even my marriage - feels like this much work? Most of my friendships are relaxed. I give out, and receive, rain checks, no one is mad, life gets in the way, and family comes first. I don't want to spend so much time analyzing my feelings. I feel like I've finally come out of the fog of ppd/pp anxiety and it feels nice to live in the present/let myself be happy. When I am with her, I feel like I'm failing someone, like I'm not allowed to have good things in life without guilt. The last time I saw her she commented on "anxious" behavior she stated she witnessed between me and my ds when she saw us together 6 months ago and it made me feel like a bad mother. I just want to be happy.

I think writing all this I'm realizing maybe I didn't need to post about whether or not the friendship is over. I just needed to write it all out. I don't need to close the door, because she isn't responding to my efforts, and she isn't reaching out. If she does I can make a decision then, but for now I think I need to let it go. I wish I could help her, but she doesn't really want my help. Maybe if I'd tried differently a while back? I don't know. I think I want permission not to contact her, but I need it from myself, not from a message board.

You've nailed it OP. And you actually have helped me think through a similar rocky friendship situation I am having and have made me feel better about my decision to let it go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Call her once every 2 weeks. Talk for 20minutes. See how that goes. If it's pleasant, start seeing each other, say, every 2 weeks for an hour or two. Do not rely on each other for emergencies or deeply emotional sharing --- neither of you can handle that right now --- it's not appropriate for the amount either of you can invest. Life gets in the way. It should. That's what happens in an emotionally healthy life

I'm this poster and I thought I'd add, if you're uncomfortable w/2 week contact, drop it to monthly or less frequent than that, a couple times a year. If the relationship is remains uncomfortable long term, then just a holiday card. It's good to leave the door open. I don't think there is anyone in my past where I can't manage some degree of contact. Put your "schedule" of contact with this person on the calendar, it's a "to do", and in between forget about it.

New poster and I agree with PP here, especially on leaving the door open.

The "dump her" posts are very common on DCUM whenever questions like yours come up, OP, but those responses have zero consideration for the reality that even people who are chronically ill or demanding or annoying can be a friend. You have long history with her though it sounds like life has gotten in the way, which is normal.

But if her demanding ways toward you are a fairly recent change and she wasn't like this for most of your time as friends, in you shoes I'd be wondering: Is this really her talking -- or is it her illness? Is she actually not getting much emotional support from her husband so she's unreasonably acting out and grasping for support elsewhere, and overreacting when she doesn't feel she gets it?

I am not excusing her behavior, just saying that there may be more going on than she is telling you, particularly if she became so needy/angry only after she started dealing with a chronic condition. Have you considered that?

I would ramp back the texts etc. and do as the PP suggests, contacting once every two weeks but doing so consistently.

Have you offered to see her, just the two of you, maybe doing an activity you know she likes and would find distracting? Your spouse can spend time with your child while you actually see your friend. That's healthy for you, even if things are idyllic at home with your DC and DH. And doing an activity with your friend may be more comfortable than meeting up and expecting some long, deep, heart-to-heart talk at this point.

OP here - thanks to you - and to PP for the advice re: leaving the door open. This friend can be very giving - she just has rigid rules and expectations for how friends should be, and sometimes she fails to communicate those expectations and when you fail to meet them, she is upset. This is not new/chronic illness related, but has been a pattern. For a long time, it was our other close friend who she didn't feel had met her expectations. Now it's me. She has been a good friend to me at times, she isn't a toxic/taker type personality. At least, I don't think so - my DH might differ. I think part of the issue is that - in high school and college, I was a pushover. When she would get upset I would apologize, even if I didn't feel that the situation was my fault. However, I've changed a lot since then, and we lived apart in different cities for a long time during a period in my life where I grew into myself and became a lot stronger. I think she still expects me to sort of just fall apart when she is mad at me and is surprised and upset when I don't.

The last time we talked she reached out and told me that things weren't going well in our friendship and she felt like I hadn't been there. I think that was the moment when I could have probably fixed things if I had apologized for all and asked for to forgive me for everything. I think though that I felt I should also be honest about my side of things. I communicated to her that I was sorry that I was unable to come visit her when she had her pain relapse when DS was two/three weeks old, but that I really felt that I was unable to leave my infant at that time or bring him to the hospital. I told her that her reaction to that inability - to tell me that she wouldn't speak to me for a while - was hurtful, and added a weight to the ppd and pp anxiety I was experiencing. I think my failure to take on a more repentant - not sure if that's the right word - role surprised her and things never really got better.

The thing is - we have had so many serious conversations, and it feels so hard. No other friendship - not even my marriage - feels like this much work? Most of my friendships are relaxed. I give out, and receive, rain checks, no one is mad, life gets in the way, and family comes first. I don't want to spend so much time analyzing my feelings. I feel like I've finally come out of the fog of ppd/pp anxiety and it feels nice to live in the present/let myself be happy. When I am with her, I feel like I'm failing someone, like I'm not allowed to have good things in life without guilt. The last time I saw her she commented on "anxious" behavior she stated she witnessed between me and my ds when she saw us together 6 months ago and it made me feel like a bad mother. I just want to be happy.

I think writing all this I'm realizing maybe I didn't need to post about whether or not the friendship is over. I just needed to write it all out. I don't need to close the door, because she isn't responding to my efforts, and she isn't reaching out. If she does I can make a decision then, but for now I think I need to let it go. I wish I could help her, but she doesn't really want my help. Maybe if I'd tried differently a while back? I don't know. I think I want permission not to contact her, but I need it from myself, not from a message board.

She is in control of this friendship, not you. It's not mutual or like a marriage. You are a doormat. Her doormat. Hence your doormat feelings. There is no give & receive going on here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I could have written this same exact post several years ago. Very similar personality of your friend and mine. I can speak from first hand experience, it wasn't easy, but it was best to remove myself (something I sat in prayer A LOT about). Of course your husband and child come first, and honestly feel like any good friend would see that. It's awful what your friend is going through, but it also seems like the relationship is one-sided. You know what's best for you, and if you feel like in your heart of heart that this relationship needs to be over, then that may be the best choice. Just from your post, you are clearly see that you are being empathetic to her situation, and no way being selfish or just ended a friendship out of spike, etc. Prayers as you continue to process this situation.

Also, there are so many articles our there about this exact topic! Here's a link to a few that may be helpful https://bit.ly/2NFOWcW

OP here - thank you for the prayers .

You are very welcome

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP here. Call her once every 2 weeks. Talk for 20minutes. See how that goes. If it's pleasant, start seeing each other, say, every 2 weeks for an hour or two. Do not rely on each other for emergencies or deeply emotional sharing --- neither of you can handle that right now --- it's not appropriate for the amount either of you can invest. Life gets in the way. It should. That's what happens in an emotionally healthy life.

NP. The friend sounds like an emotional vampire. You can’t really just give them a little of yourself— they always need more.

[Anonymous]

Friendships are not supposed to be that hard. I would let it go. Realize that from her perspective the friendship did deteriorate--- you stopped placing her needs at the center of the relationship.

Also, until a later post by you, I assumed she was single. I couldn't imagine making those demands on a new parent when I had a partner to help me.

[Anonymous]

Sounds like you want to let go of this friendship and need affirmation. You have my permission to let go of this friendship. I would.

[Anonymous]

FWIW, OP, in terms of the chronic pain/social withdrawal, etc., I could be your friend. In fact, until I got to the part about her asking you to come visit with your newborn -- to a hospital, no less -- I thought maybe you WERE writing about me.

Here's the thing: chronic pain sucks. It destroys friendships -- but at least in my case and other patients I know, I don't expect my friends to put up with the nightmares that the conditions cause (including frequent cancellations, not great company, etc.) and I certainly don't expect my friends to drop everything or even anything for me. If I am in an acute crisis, perhaps I'd reach out, but never to someone in your situation for I would have wanted you to take care of the baby and your DH and you first.

One more thing: as someone who's in constant/chronic pain, I cannot imagine spending the amount of emotional energy your friend has spent worrying herself and you on perceived slights and dynamics. I really cannot. I am so sorry she is feeling so badly that she's put so much emphasis on the friendship (maybe she feels like since she can't control the pain she'll try and control the friendship?). Regardless, it's not healthy for her or for you, and again I am really sorry.

As others said, perhaps call her or drop her a note every month. See if she responds. If she doesn't, I'd let it go. I know it's sad. I know it's hard. But I also know there's nothing you can do to change this, and your own energies really do belong to your family now.

Hang in there.