Must a child stand for pledge in Virginia

[Anonymous]

As a general matter, no, a school cannot require a student to stand for the pledge or otherwise participate in the pledge, regardless of the basis for their opposition to participating. The school also can't discipline a student if they decide to take a knee during the pledge, turn their back to the flag, or engage in similar forms of expression. That said, that doesn't mean a student can just do whatever they want during the pledge and get away with it. If the school rule is that students must stay with their teachers and cannot be unattended in the hallway, the fact that the class is saying the pledge doesn't mean the student can decide to wander the halls alone as a form of protest. If students are not allowed to stand on desks because of the risk of injury from falling, that the pledge is going on doesn't mean the school has to grant an exception to that rule. As long as the restrictions are reasonably related to appropriate school goals/purposes (such as student safety) and are not applied selectively based on the content of the student's expression, the school can enforce behavioral rules/requirements.

[Anonymous]

Okay so you can't "force" a student to stand, but can you tell them "Larlo, please stand up during the pledge" and if they don't then say "Please be respectful during the pledge" but all without literally forcing them to stand? Anything wrong with that?

And BTW I find that when students don't stand for the pledge in elementary school it is generally because they are distracted or silly or whatever, not making any kind of actual statement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Okay so you can't "force" a student to stand, but can you tell them "Larlo, please stand up during the pledge" and if they don't then say "Please be respectful during the pledge" but all without literally forcing them to stand? Anything wrong with that?

And BTW I find that when students don't stand for the pledge in elementary school it is generally because they are distracted or silly or whatever, not making any kind of actual statement.

No. Just say nothing. If they are being disruptive, discipline them whatever way you discipline other disruptions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so you can't "force" a student to stand, but can you tell them "Larlo, please stand up during the pledge" and if they don't then say "Please be respectful during the pledge" but all without literally forcing them to stand? Anything wrong with that?

And BTW I find that when students don't stand for the pledge in elementary school it is generally because they are distracted or silly or whatever, not making any kind of actual statement.

No. Just say nothing. If they are being disruptive, discipline them whatever way you discipline other disruptions.

Kind of hard to discipline someone when I and the other students are all saying the pledge of allegiance. Discipline them after for being disruptive? I'd just as soon put a stop to it in the moment, five seconds, done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so you can't "force" a student to stand, but can you tell them "Larlo, please stand up during the pledge" and if they don't then say "Please be respectful during the pledge" but all without literally forcing them to stand? Anything wrong with that?

And BTW I find that when students don't stand for the pledge in elementary school it is generally because they are distracted or silly or whatever, not making any kind of actual statement.

No. Just say nothing. If they are being disruptive, discipline them whatever way you discipline other disruptions.

Kind of hard to discipline someone when I and the other students are all saying the pledge of allegiance. Discipline them after for being disruptive? I'd just as soon put a stop to it in the moment, five seconds, done.

Let’s make it a little easier for you:
Disruptive? Discipline.
Not disruptive? STFU.

[Anonymous]

Students cannot be forced to stand for the pledge but they can be required to remain silent during it.

If kids are sitting quietly during the pledge, that is their right & teachers should say & do nothing. If kids are talking/goofing off during the pledge, teachers should respond the same way they would to any similarly disruptive classroom behavior.

[Anonymous]

Your poor little snowflake op. We certainly wouldn’t want trouble him/ her in any way. Imagine being asked to stand in respect for ones country for a whole 30 seconds every day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Okay so you can't "force" a student to stand, but can you tell them "Larlo, please stand up during the pledge" and if they don't then say "Please be respectful during the pledge" but all without literally forcing them to stand? Anything wrong with that?

And BTW I find that when students don't stand for the pledge in elementary school it is generally because they are distracted or silly or whatever, not making any kind of actual statement.

You can ask the class to rise for the pledge but if someone doesn’t stand up, you have to leave it alone and keep going. You cannot single them out and pressure them into standing up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Your poor little snowflake op. We certainly wouldn’t want trouble him/ her in any way. Imagine being asked to stand in respect for ones country for a whole 30 seconds every day.

You cannot do this. Please stop being stupid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so you can't "force" a student to stand, but can you tell them "Larlo, please stand up during the pledge" and if they don't then say "Please be respectful during the pledge" but all without literally forcing them to stand? Anything wrong with that?

And BTW I find that when students don't stand for the pledge in elementary school it is generally because they are distracted or silly or whatever, not making any kind of actual statement.

No. Just say nothing. If they are being disruptive, discipline them whatever way you discipline other disruptions.

Kind of hard to discipline someone when I and the other students are all saying the pledge of allegiance. Discipline them after for being disruptive? I'd just as soon put a stop to it in the moment, five seconds, done.

Then go ahead. But you cannot say anything abou standing or not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your poor little snowflake op. We certainly wouldn’t want trouble him/ her in any way. Imagine being asked to stand in respect for ones country for a whole 30 seconds every day.

You cannot do this. Please stop being stupid.

+1

Why should a non-religious person be forced to stand for a pledge that includes a reference to God? My DC chooses to sit quietly during the pledge and is not disruptive at all - I’m fine with that, as is the teacher.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so you can't "force" a student to stand, but can you tell them "Larlo, please stand up during the pledge" and if they don't then say "Please be respectful during the pledge" but all without literally forcing them to stand? Anything wrong with that?

And BTW I find that when students don't stand for the pledge in elementary school it is generally because they are distracted or silly or whatever, not making any kind of actual statement.

No. Just say nothing. If they are being disruptive, discipline them whatever way you discipline other disruptions.

Kind of hard to discipline someone when I and the other students are all saying the pledge of allegiance. Discipline them after for being disruptive? I'd just as soon put a stop to it in the moment, five seconds, done.

Let’s make it a little easier for you:
Disruptive? Discipline.
Not disruptive? STFU.

I am totally fine with respecting a student's beliefs regarding the pledge and if they choose to not stand for that reason I'm okay with it. However, I consider it a critical part of my job as an educator to teach my students what it means to be respectful, of other's beliefs and of cultural norms. I have to do that because parents like you, who think it's a good idea to tell a stranger on the internet to "STFU", don't teach their children what it means to be respectful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so you can't "force" a student to stand, but can you tell them "Larlo, please stand up during the pledge" and if they don't then say "Please be respectful during the pledge" but all without literally forcing them to stand? Anything wrong with that?

And BTW I find that when students don't stand for the pledge in elementary school it is generally because they are distracted or silly or whatever, not making any kind of actual statement.

No. Just say nothing. If they are being disruptive, discipline them whatever way you discipline other disruptions.

Kind of hard to discipline someone when I and the other students are all saying the pledge of allegiance. Discipline them after for being disruptive? I'd just as soon put a stop to it in the moment, five seconds, done.

Let’s make it a little easier for you:
Disruptive? Discipline.
Not disruptive? STFU.

I am totally fine with respecting a student's beliefs regarding the pledge and if they choose to not stand for that reason I'm okay with it. However, I consider it a critical part of my job as an educator to teach my students what it means to be respectful, of other's beliefs and of cultural norms. I have to do that because parents like you, who think it's a good idea to tell a stranger on the internet to "STFU", don't teach their children what it means to be respectful.

DP. That’s all fine and good, but the Supreme Court has said that you as an educator are not allowed to require or coerce your students to stand for the pledge, nor may you punish them for declining to do so. Period. It doesn’t matter what you think the answer should be, this is how it is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Okay so you can't "force" a student to stand, but can you tell them "Larlo, please stand up during the pledge" and if they don't then say "Please be respectful during the pledge" but all without literally forcing them to stand? Anything wrong with that?

And BTW I find that when students don't stand for the pledge in elementary school it is generally because they are distracted or silly or whatever, not making any kind of actual statement.

No you can’t say please stand. Why not jump to “please be respectful”?

Plus you are a teacher, teach them your expectations. You expect that they will either stand, or sit, or step into the hall. That they will either say all of the pledge, some of the pledge (e.g if they choose to skip “under God”), or nothing at all, but they can’t say anything else during that time, or laugh or do whatever disrespectful thing they were doing.

[Anonymous]

This year I may start staying seated for the Pledge. In the past I’ve been able to overlook the “under God” part, but I don’t know that I am willing to pledge allegiance to a flag that stands for a nation that is no longer “indivisible, with liberty and justice for all”.

ES Teacher