Shocking Penn State hazing incident

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Greek system should be abolished. How many hazing deaths or injuries will it take? The peer pressure and social structure of these organizations prevents young people from doing what's right, because the social consequences would be too high. Any greek organization needs to go back to being 100% community service. No houses, no parties, no booze allowed.

+1

I went to a college (Jesuit) without a Greek system. People self segregated into groups and did this too whether it was the baseball players, lax, etc. Young kids are going to drink into oblivion.

40% do 60% do not

[Anonymous]

I also went to a Jesuit college and was an athlete. I did not see what PP described. Drinking was forbidden in season in my sport.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My takeaway is remind your kids to call 911 themselves when they see someone at risk -- don't plead with others to do so. Pick up the phone yourself.

+1

if you think 911 should be called, call them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Greek system should be abolished. How many hazing deaths or injuries will it take? The peer pressure and social structure of these organizations prevents young people from doing what's right, because the social consequences would be too high. Any greek organization needs to go back to being 100% community service. No houses, no parties, no booze allowed.

+1

I went to a college (Jesuit) without a Greek system. People self segregated into groups and did this too whether it was the baseball players, lax, etc. Young kids are going to drink into oblivion.

I drank heavily in college. But I was so far removed from Greek life, I knew nothing of it. And I don't remember a single instance of being that pressured to drink. I do remember beer bongs and keg stands (which aren't great), of course I remember a lot of "Come on, do it!" But I never once saw anyone forced or "hazed" to the extent of the Fraternities and Sororities. Yes, drinking happens , but not hazing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Same community that thinks it's normal to witness decades of little boy rape in the football program and not intervene or call the police.

Don't kid yourself. This can and probably does happen ANYWHERE. This is the Greek life mentality, which is what should be questioned.

+1

[Anonymous]

This is the school that just voted Joe Paterno's son to their Board of Trustees

you can't make this stuff up yet people still defend the place.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Greek system should be abolished. How many hazing deaths or injuries will it take? The peer pressure and social structure of these organizations prevents young people from doing what's right, because the social consequences would be too high. Any greek organization needs to go back to being 100% community service. No houses, no parties, no booze allowed.

+1

I went to a college (Jesuit) without a Greek system. People self segregated into groups and did this too whether it was the baseball players, lax, etc. Young kids are going to drink into oblivion.

I drank heavily in college. But I was so far removed from Greek life, I knew nothing of it. And I don't remember a single instance of being that pressured to drink. I do remember beer bongs and keg stands (which aren't great), of course I remember a lot of "Come on, do it!" But I never once saw anyone forced or "hazed" to the extent of the Fraternities and Sororities. Yes, drinking happens , but not hazing.

I agree with this. I had a GREAT time in college. But if someone didn't want to drink, that was fine! We probably would have asked them to drive us to the party so we didn't have to take the bus. We might have razzed them a little, but if someone got sick drinking, we all took care of each other and checked on each other often. If any of my friend were unconscious we would have called 911 without a doubt. Why? Because we were actually friends who loved each other, not just friends bc we paid dues and wore the same sweat shirts.

[Anonymous]

Hazing does happen on sports teams as well - usually the club teams though.

[Anonymous]

The problem isn't so much with the drinking. It's the callous way that they treated a human being who was slowly dying right in front of them. All they had to do was pick up a phone and dial 911.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The parents said that the kid just wanted to fit in. That is the riskiest prospect for anyone. This kid didn't deserve any of this, but that need to be 'like and liked' is dangerous.

If there were no Greek system, "fitting in" would not involve Greek rituals including hazing.

The whole system should be abolished.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Same community that thinks it's normal to witness decades of little boy rape in the football program and not intervene or call the police.

Don't kid yourself. This can and probably does happen ANYWHERE. This is the Greek life mentality, which is what should be questioned.

It does happen everywhere there is Greek life.

Every year (EVERY year) there is a hazing death. And that doesn't even count broken bones, concussions, brain damage from drinking and blacking out.

It is horrifying and disgusting and college/university administrations look the other way, which is even more horrifying and disgusting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Greek system should be abolished. How many hazing deaths or injuries will it take? The peer pressure and social structure of these organizations prevents young people from doing what's right, because the social consequences would be too high. Any greek organization needs to go back to being 100% community service. No houses, no parties, no booze allowed.

+1

I went to a college (Jesuit) without a Greek system. People self segregated into groups and did this too whether it was the baseball players, lax, etc. Young kids are going to drink into oblivion.

The Greek system provides a context and a structure for this. There is certainly binge drinking and other dangerous behavior outside of the Greek system. But there are aspects of the Greek system that increase the likelihood that things like this will happen in a fraternity vs. another college living environment. One factor is the hazing itself. Most binge drinking that occurs outside of frats/sororities/sports teams is voluntary rather than organized and induced by a group. When it's organized by a group, that group has more fear of reprisals when something goes wrong. Another factor is the lack of independence - I'm thinking of the guy who said that they should call 911 but was ignored - why didn't he just call 911 himself?

[Anonymous]

Something isn’t right on this campus. I’m sure binge drinking and frat hazing are happening across the nation, yet time and time again when something happens at PSU -- the immediate reaction is circle the wagons/protect ourselves, screw everyone else. The administration did it with Paterno; now these students are doing it. There’s something about the insular “We Are” culture of that place that breeds this kind of attitude.

The presentment was horrendous to read. His injuries were so severe – a shattered spleen where 80% of his blood pooled bc he didn’t receive any care for 12+ hours; 5-6 falls including 2 down full staircases with brain injuries so severe that the signals to breathe weren’t being sent properly through his body. And his poor parents now know that doctors believe these injuries must have been very painful for him for 12 hrs in his semi conscious state.

Bunch of idiots at that school. Seriously these aren’t little boys – these were all young men age 18+, many of whom sat around googling head injuries/concussions – so they knew something was truly wrong. If there is some decision by the older guys in the frat that 911 would not be called – there wasn’t 1 guy in that group willing to say “f— you” and call anyway? Or not say anything, go outside and make a quick call? Or anonymously call this kid’s roommate or RA and say – come get him, he’s in deep trouble but we can’t help but you have to come, it’s life or death!? One pledge brother was the one who insisted that there may be a head injury and the older brothers shoved him in the wall and told him to shut up; that kid is now doing the media circuit – saw him on GMA. He really couldn’t have stepped outside with a phone – his place in the frat was THAT important??

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Something isn’t right on this campus. I’m sure binge drinking and frat hazing are happening across the nation, yet time and time again when something happens at PSU -- the immediate reaction is circle the wagons/protect ourselves, screw everyone else. The administration did it with Paterno; now these students are doing it. There’s something about the insular “We Are” culture of that place that breeds this kind of attitude.

The presentment was horrendous to read. His injuries were so severe – a shattered spleen where 80% of his blood pooled bc he didn’t receive any care for 12+ hours; 5-6 falls including 2 down full staircases with brain injuries so severe that the signals to breathe weren’t being sent properly through his body. And his poor parents now know that doctors believe these injuries must have been very painful for him for 12 hrs in his semi conscious state.

Bunch of idiots at that school. Seriously these aren’t little boys – these were all young men age 18+, many of whom sat around googling head injuries/concussions – so they knew something was truly wrong. If there is some decision by the older guys in the frat that 911 would not be called – there wasn’t 1 guy in that group willing to say “f— you” and call anyway? Or not say anything, go outside and make a quick call? Or anonymously call this kid’s roommate or RA and say – come get him, he’s in deep trouble but we can’t help but you have to come, it’s life or death!? One pledge brother was the one who insisted that there may be a head injury and the older brothers shoved him in the wall and told him to shut up; that kid is now doing the media circuit – saw him on GMA. He really couldn’t have stepped outside with a phone – his place in the frat was THAT important??

His pledge "bros" were no better. One of them came downstairs at 7 am (10 hrs after it had happened) and saw Timothy moving around, groaning, fetal position, head in hands etc. all while super pale -- he sat there and made a snap chat video and then left the house on his merry way. If you are the parents of these other guys, what the heck do you even say to them?? Are you shocked that you raised someone so callous??

[Anonymous]

I would be mortified. Especially, if my son was one of the guys (let's not call them "kids") who tried to prevent a 911 call, or punched him, or stepped over him, etc.