Question for EOTP Wilson feeders

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:That is the problem with areas like CH and SP, even if they are nice and getting better they are surrounded by really bad areas that aren't changing fast enough. As long as the kids mix in middle and high school there will be problems.

I personally don't see Wilson staying east of the park, once it turns white what would be the point anyway. Why igo to all the trouble to continue to ntegrate Wilson but this time with slightly less wealthy white kids? If you can't afford Proper NW move to the best part of Arlington or MoCo you can.

Hopefully you didn't mean this post in the way that it sounds, but it sounds quite racist. You should be aware that there are charter school examples of kids mixing in middle and high school without problems. Also, who says things like "as long as kids mix"? To which kind of mixing are you referring?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you don't want to live there anyway, seems like a gamble not worth taking.

Yes, I love Shepherd Park because I love the neighborhood, access to Rock Creek trails, metro, and the families. Shepherd is a great elementary and I'm pretty sure if they ever got zoned out of Deal, it will be for a decent option.

This.

Whatever the speculation about MacFarland/Roosevelt, Shepherd Park won't be zoned for ithem unless and until they're competitive with Deal/Wilson. It's not about the demographics, it's about the money. That's a huge swath of Ward 4 (along with Crestwood) and whether the residents are black or white doesn't matter when it comes to the taxes they pay and the support they can throw behind a candidate.

It does sound a bit like you wouldn't really like Shepherd Park/16th Street Heights for the reasons residents here do. The demographics aren't going to change as much or as fast as you like - most families keep their homes in the family. What you should really keep an eye on is whether or not the number of white families keeps growing in neighborhoods to the south, and whether or not they choose and stay with DCPS. People say it takes 10 years to make a school good. That timer started ticking down 2-3 years ago in Ward 4, so you may not want to trek across the park by the time your kid/s reach middle school.

[Anonymous]

Did the people in SP not just watch Eaton get zoned out of Deal?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I are looking for a home IB for deal/Wilson and really can only afford around 16th st and shepherds park. Knowing the history of extending the boundaries of Wilson to pick them up to integrate that system. Seeing my kids are young and the school is slated for rezoning before they make it to HS, what are the chance they move the border back to west of the park?

I only ask as with much of the city as it improves it is getting much whiter and as that area loses its blackness does it then lose the justification to keep it Wilson? That far north isn't horribly convenient to our jobs and if we pay a premium to be inbound for Wilson and then lose that, it would be troubling not to mention crushing to our resale value. Has any public official ever hinted at which way the winds are blowing?

OP, we recently bought in Shepherd Park. It was a top choice for us, and we know other neighbors for whom it was also a top choice over some WOTP neighborhoods. The folks we've met so far are friendly and civic-minded and in diverse professions (doctors, lawyers, teachers, professors, journalists, nonprofits, etc.). The setting close to Rock Creek Park is great for the outdoorsy types, and the relatively quick access to both downtown and MoCo is great. Also, as an AA family, we appreciate that a significant minority of our neighbors are also AA, highly educated families, so that our children can grow up with like peers, in addition to other kids of all backgrounds--black, white, Jewish, Christian, a few Asian and Latino, international families, two moms/dads, etc.--it's a pretty inclusive neighborhood. We felt the neighborhood school was strong enough in the early grades to give it a go, and we've been happy so far as our child starts her second year at Shepherd. For us, getting rezoned to Wilson was the icing on the cake, but it wasn't the sole reason we chose the neighborhood (and re: high school, that's about a decade away for us and we may go private anyway if we're still in the area, although we will certainly look at Wilson when the time comes).

However, from the tone of your post, it sounds like the neighborhood would not be a top choice for you and you would feel like you are "settling" for the least expensive Deal/Wilson feeder. In a way, this is one of the disadvantages of being rezoned for Wilson--that the types of people who would rather be in say, Tenleytown, etc. will begin moving here. If the unique characteristics of Shepherd Park don't appeal to you, then as other PPs said, perhaps it would be best to look in MoCo or Arlington. However, if being in a neighborhood that in some ways more closely resembles Takoma Park than AU Park appeals to you, then SP is worth a look.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I are looking for a home IB for deal/Wilson and really can only afford around 16th st and shepherds park. Knowing the history of extending the boundaries of Wilson to pick them up to integrate that system. Seeing my kids are young and the school is slated for rezoning before they make it to HS, what are the chance they move the border back to west of the park?

I only ask as with much of the city as it improves it is getting much whiter and as that area loses its blackness does it then lose the justification to keep it Wilson? That far north isn't horribly convenient to our jobs and if we pay a premium to be inbound for Wilson and then lose that, it would be troubling not to mention crushing to our resale value. Has any public official ever hinted at which way the winds are blowing?

OP, we recently bought in Shepherd Park. It was a top choice for us, and we know other neighbors for whom it was also a top choice over some WOTP neighborhoods. The folks we've met so far are friendly and civic-minded and in diverse professions (doctors, lawyers, teachers, professors, journalists, nonprofits, etc.). The setting close to Rock Creek Park is great for the outdoorsy types, and the relatively quick access to both downtown and MoCo is great. Also, as an AA family, we appreciate that a significant minority of our neighbors are also AA, highly educated families, so that our children can grow up with like peers, in addition to other kids of all backgrounds--black, white, Jewish, Christian, a few Asian and Latino, international families, two moms/dads, etc.--it's a pretty inclusive neighborhood. We felt the neighborhood school was strong enough in the early grades to give it a go, and we've been happy so far as our child starts her second year at Shepherd. For us, getting rezoned to Wilson was the icing on the cake, but it wasn't the sole reason we chose the neighborhood (and re: high school, that's about a decade away for us and we may go private anyway if we're still in the area, although we will certainly look at Wilson when the time comes).

However, from the tone of your post, it sounds like the neighborhood would not be a top choice for you and you would feel like you are "settling" for the least expensive Deal/Wilson feeder. In a way, this is one of the disadvantages of being rezoned for Wilson--that the types of people who would rather be in say, Tenleytown, etc. will begin moving here. If the unique characteristics of Shepherd Park don't appeal to you, then as other PPs said, perhaps it would be best to look in MoCo or Arlington. However, if being in a neighborhood that in some ways more closely resembles Takoma Park than AU Park appeals to you, then SP is worth a look.

P.S. I realize I didn't answer your question. I have no idea whether SP will get zoned out of Wilson. I certainly hope not, although I too have wondered whether the historical justification for EOTP Wilson feeders will be less convincing in 10-15 years. One thing to keep in mind, though, is that the neighborhood will not "flip" as quickly as say, Capitol Hill has done. Many AA families in this neighborhood pass their homes on to children and grandchildren, so any change that's happening in the neighborhood seems to be moving at a slower pace than other EOTP areas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wouldn't say that it's so much the high voter turnout as that the area is like a swing state in national politics -- it sits astride a lot of the fault lines in DC politics, as goes Shepherd Park so goes the city.

But the writing is on the wall. If you look at the demographic projections from the Office of Planning there's no way DCPS can keep ignoring the crowding. The only way that EOTP stays in Wilson is if a new high school opens in the southern part of WOTP -- which probably means either Ellington moves and their building is made back into Western HS, or the old Hardy School on Foxhall Road is made into a high school. Either of those ideas faces considerable political opposition. Pick your poison.

Peggy Cooper Cafritz and the Ellington lobby would cut the balls off any DC politician who threatened to move Ellington out of the old Western HS site. But, I agree, it would be the most logical site for a new WOTP high school.

[Anonymous]

MacFarland and Roosevelt has nothing to do with the Shepherd Park neighborhood.

Not sure of the points being made about it when it's not in the feeder zone/pattern for SP.

The real question is will their be a stand alone MS for the Brightwood, Riggs Park, Takoma DC and the likes in the future.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Did the people in SP not just watch Eaton get zoned out of Deal?

That was different. Eaton basically has few political friends. Next to Hearst (which is located even in closer proximity to Deal), Eaton has the smallest IB percentage of any Ward 3 elementary school. (It's no surprise that Eaton keeps slipping and slipping on DCPS' renovation schedule, as Eaton is a far lesser priority for Mary Cheh than other Ward 3 schools with more parent voters.) Obviously, moving a school like Janney or Murch out of Deal didn't make much locational sense and politically it was a nonstarter. Because Eaton's students live scattered across the city, and fewer than 40% in Ward 3, DCPS calculated that there would be less numerous and concentrated parent opposition at Eaton than if they moved any other school WOTP. The other reality is that a number of Eaton OOB students actually live in EOTP neighborhoods that will still feed to Deal, so that reduced the number of upset Eaton families mostly to those who live IB for Eaton. For some of the other Eaton OOB families, Hardy is still a better middle school alternative than what they would otherwise get. The Janney neighborhood also had its own representative (an unsuccessful council candidate) as a Ward 3 member on the redistricting committee, who protected Janney's interests. He was happy to throw Eaton under the bus, referring to Eaton being kicked out of Deal as necessary "collateral damage." The reality is that no students EOTP were going to be removed from the Deal feeder unless there was some bloodletting WOTP. Eaton was the sacrificial lamb.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:MacFarland and Roosevelt has nothing to do with the Shepherd Park neighborhood.

Not sure of the points being made about it when it's not in the feeder zone/pattern for SP.

The real question is will their be a stand alone MS for the Brightwood, Riggs Park, Takoma DC and the likes in the future.

That question will be answered by the results at MacFarland, hence the connection between SP and Roosevelt/MacFarland.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:MacFarland and Roosevelt has nothing to do with the Shepherd Park neighborhood.

Not sure of the points being made about it when it's not in the feeder zone/pattern for SP.

The real question is will their be a stand alone MS for the Brightwood, Riggs Park, Takoma DC and the likes in the future.

MacFarland and Roosevelt have everything to do with easing overcrowding at schools WOTP. If there's a viable standalone middle school in Ward 4, fewer parents will care about whether or not they can get into Deal.

The OP is concerned about school options and property values in 16th Street Heights and SP. Both of those concerns are alleviated by a decent MacFarland and Roosevelt.

[Anonymous]

It's something like 35 students coming from Shepherd Park going to Deal. I don't remember the exact numbers but it's certainly not a big enough to make a dent in the overpopulation problem WOTP. Janney needs to be split as well. Crest wood sacrifice was meaningless but made sense in the elementary-middle-high school feeder path (Crestwood/16th St) folk would have had to have Powell and West feed to Deal to keep their access. Anyway, a whole lot more needs to happen than remove Bancroft and Shepherd to alleviate Deal and Wilson, including dealing with Adams.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I are looking for a home IB for deal/Wilson and really can only afford around 16th st and shepherds park. Knowing the history of extending the boundaries of Wilson to pick them up to integrate that system. Seeing my kids are young and the school is slated for rezoning before they make it to HS, what are the chance they move the border back to west of the park?

I only ask as with much of the city as it improves it is getting much whiter and as that area loses its blackness does it then lose the justification to keep it Wilson? That far north isn't horribly convenient to our jobs and if we pay a premium to be inbound for Wilson and then lose that, it would be troubling not to mention crushing to our resale value. Has any public official ever hinted at which way the winds are blowing?

OP, we recently bought in Shepherd Park. It was a top choice for us, and we know other neighbors for whom it was also a top choice over some WOTP neighborhoods. The folks we've met so far are friendly and civic-minded and in diverse professions (doctors, lawyers, teachers, professors, journalists, nonprofits, etc.). The setting close to Rock Creek Park is great for the outdoorsy types, and the relatively quick access to both downtown and MoCo is great. Also, as an AA family, we appreciate that a significant minority of our neighbors are also AA, highly educated families, so that our children can grow up with like peers, in addition to other kids of all backgrounds--black, white, Jewish, Christian, a few Asian and Latino, international families, two moms/dads, etc.--it's a pretty inclusive neighborhood. We felt the neighborhood school was strong enough in the early grades to give it a go, and we've been happy so far as our child starts her second year at Shepherd. For us, getting rezoned to Wilson was the icing on the cake, but it wasn't the sole reason we chose the neighborhood (and re: high school, that's about a decade away for us and we may go private anyway if we're still in the area, although we will certainly look at Wilson when the time comes).

However, from the tone of your post, it sounds like the neighborhood would not be a top choice for you and you would feel like you are "settling" for the least expensive Deal/Wilson feeder. In a way, this is one of the disadvantages of being rezoned for Wilson--that the types of people who would rather be in say, Tenleytown, etc. will begin moving here. If the unique characteristics of Shepherd Park don't appeal to you, then as other PPs said, perhaps it would be best to look in MoCo or Arlington. However, if being in a neighborhood that in some ways more closely resembles Takoma Park than AU Park appeals to you, then SP is worth a look.

I could have written this post verbatim except we moved in 3 years ago.

[Anonymous]

We moved to SP because as clueless transplants, we listened to everyone that said Deal and Wilson were important and that Shepherd was a good school. (It is, but it is far from perfect.)

I think we would have been happier in Brightwood or Takoma.

SP is a wonderful neighborhood, but it is very hide bound and very, very political. It will never be out zoned for deal and Wilson because there are people with clout here who want them. It is not a subtle thing. When the cadidates knocked on our doors campaigning (and they all did--personally) --they all assured me they'd do everything to keep this community as it was. I think it's a great place--don't get me wrong--but it is how it is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We moved to SP because as clueless transplants, we listened to everyone that said Deal and Wilson were important and that Shepherd was a good school. (It is, but it is far from perfect.)

I think we would have been happier in Brightwood or Takoma.

SP is a wonderful neighborhood, but it is very hide bound and very, very political. It will never be out zoned for deal and Wilson because there are people with clout here who want them. It is not a subtle thing. When the cadidates knocked on our doors campaigning (and they all did--personally) --they all assured me they'd do everything to keep this community as it was. I think it's a great place--don't get me wrong--but it is how it is.

Why don't you sell and but in Takoma or Brightwood? You could make a decent profit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MacFarland and Roosevelt has nothing to do with the Shepherd Park neighborhood.

Not sure of the points being made about it when it's not in the feeder zone/pattern for SP.

The real question is will their be a stand alone MS for the Brightwood, Riggs Park, Takoma DC and the likes in the future.

MacFarland and Roosevelt have everything to do with easing overcrowding at schools WOTP. If there's a viable standalone middle school in Ward 4, fewer parents will care about whether or not they can get into Deal.

The OP is concerned about school options and property values in 16th Street Heights and SP. Both of those concerns are alleviated by a decent MacFarland and Roosevelt.

WOTP will always have OOB slots (until there aren't any) where parents will choose a feeder elementary into Deal. Deal doesn't have OOB slots, therefore your left in the same boat with getting into the elementary schools.

MacFarland may turn into a gem, but what middle class family stays for any of its feeders besides West and maybe Powell at the moment.