Please help, what is this condition or disorder?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All of you who are saying that OP's child is just a "normal kid" who is behaving badly are doing her a real disservice. First of all, this child has been diagnosed -- TWICE by two different professionals -- as having an ASD. Presumably they had more to go by than just a paragraph on a message board, not to mention professional expertise. I am assuming that you don't have a child on the spectrum yourself because you don't recognize the rigidity and special interests.

And the reason you are doing OP a disservice is that you are feeding her denial. Read her post again. She has a diagnosis -- TWO, by TWO professionals -- and yet she is looking for ways to find something else going on, some other "condition" that would explain her child. And you are serving it up to her, because you think you know more than the professionals who have presumably done a full evaluation.

OP, ignore the posters who don't know what they are talking about and go back to to one of the professionals who diagnosed your child and ask him or her where to go from here.

No one is saying this is "just a normal kid" who is behaving badly. What we are saying is that THIS is bad behavior. Even kids with ADHD behave badly. Don't confuse the symptoms of ADHD with just plain bad behavior. You still need to parent a special needs kid. You still need to discipline a special needs kid. She's treating this kid as if everything he does should be attributed to a disorder. Preposterous.

[Anonymous]

It wasn't clear to me if the kid was actually dxed with ASD, or just two professionals offered their opinion of that thats what kid has. Ive had professionals say my kid has everything from mental retardation, autism, diary allergies and seizures, but actual dx is ADHD and MERLD.

[Anonymous]

Diagnosis or not, the behavior is unacceptable.

Do you not have an agreed about diagnosis? What about services or intervention? Start there.

[Anonymous]

Well, what about a hypothetical kid who has OCD and insists that his peaches be on a separate plate from his pancakes?

Is that "poor behavior"? Does it require "parenting" to change that behavior?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Diagnosis or not, the behavior is unacceptable.

ITA. I have a younger, 4 yr old, who has AS/ASD and no way would I tolerate such obnoxious behavior. Today, he was throwing his stuffed animals at me while I was cleaning and had to be threatened with a time out. He stopped.

OP, you are not doing your DC or yourself any favors by letting him get away with unacceptable behavior whether he has a diagnosis or not.

[Anonymous]

The peaches and pancakes things are pure perseverative or OCD issues. That has nothing to do with parenting.

Though many posters are well-intentioned (I think), it seems that some of the responses are counting leaves instead of viewing the tree in the forest. By focusing on one particular issue that could be up for interpretation it might be easy to say that parenting is to blame, but I don't believe that is the whole story (maybe it is none of the story). My DS has ADHD and severe anxiety w/ OCD tendencies. He also has what appears to be "rudeness" issues at times. When things feel like they are beyond his control he loses all ability to recognize that other people have feelings. He is, of course, remorseful and upset with himself when he regains control.

The question I would ask is whether he seems to lack empathy in all domains, or only under certain conditions.

[Anonymous]

I don't try to analyze whether AS/ASD DS, 4, can empathize or not. He doesn't - Being self-centered is normal at his age. It's much easier to teach him 'acceptable' behavior/good manners and what is 'unacceptable'.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of you who are saying that OP's child is just a "normal kid" who is behaving badly are doing her a real disservice. First of all, this child has been diagnosed -- TWICE by two different professionals -- as having an ASD. Presumably they had more to go by than just a paragraph on a message board, not to mention professional expertise. I am assuming that you don't have a child on the spectrum yourself because you don't recognize the rigidity and special interests.

And the reason you are doing OP a disservice is that you are feeding her denial. Read her post again. She has a diagnosis -- TWO, by TWO professionals -- and yet she is looking for ways to find something else going on, some other "condition" that would explain her child. And you are serving it up to her, because you think you know more than the professionals who have presumably done a full evaluation.

OP, ignore the posters who don't know what they are talking about and go back to to one of the professionals who diagnosed your child and ask him or her where to go from here.

No one is saying this is "just a normal kid" who is behaving badly. What we are saying is that THIS is bad behavior. Even kids with ADHD behave badly. Don't confuse the symptoms of ADHD with just plain bad behavior. You still need to parent a special needs kid. You still need to discipline a special needs kid. She's treating this kid as if everything he does should be attributed to a disorder. Preposterous.

I'm the PP you are responding to and I previously wrote in this thread that OP should seek professional help for behavior modification because the behavior is unacceptable. As I said, its a challenge when you have a child with a developmental disorder but we don't do them any favors by accommodating their behaviors.

But there are posters saying that this is a "normal kid," thats a direct quote. And they are saying his behavior is the result of bad parenting. So it just isn't true that "no one is saying" these things. I think you and I agree. It can be more of a challenge to control these behaviors when you have a child on the spectrum but you have to try. And those of us with children on the spectrum have suffered through the judgment of others who attribute our kids' behavior to bad parenting which is why I reacted so strongly to the posters who were saying that.

And for the parent who says that you need to respond to OCD with discipline -- YIKES. OCD is a psychiatric disorder in which the person engages in ritualized behaviors in response to intrusive thoughts. You have to treat the condition, not try to punish the behaviors. You may be able to control the behavior some through discipline but you will cause real suffering in the process because the intrusive thoughts won't go away without treatment.

[Anonymous]

Oh woops, the person who raised the idea of OCD was agreeing with me (I think).

[Anonymous]

He seems totally on the spectrum. That is typical ASD behavior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, what about a hypothetical kid who has OCD and insists that his peaches be on a separate plate from his pancakes?

Is that "poor behavior"? Does it require "parenting" to change that behavior?

The problem with this example is that there are many, many kids WITHOUT OCD who insist on this as well. It's a parents job to say no.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, what about a hypothetical kid who has OCD and insists that his peaches be on a separate plate from his pancakes?

Is that "poor behavior"? Does it require "parenting" to change that behavior?

The problem with this example is that there are many, many kids WITHOUT OCD who insist on this as well. It's a parents job to say no.

Right. Got it!

But when someone comes onto this forum and says "My child insists that the peaches be on a separate plate from the pancakes -- what is this condition" the response should be "Could be OCD" not "Could be OCD but even so, it is a parenting problem because even kids with OCD should be able to behave. Don't be a wuss and stop tolerating bad behavior."

Right?

[Anonymous]

In a nutshell.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, what about a hypothetical kid who has OCD and insists that his peaches be on a separate plate from his pancakes?

Is that "poor behavior"? Does it require "parenting" to change that behavior?

The problem with this example is that there are many, many kids WITHOUT OCD who insist on this as well. It's a parents job to say no.

This makes no sense. if it is OCD, a parent shouldn't just say no. As I wrote before, that doesn't stop the intrusive thoughts and just causes suffering. If it is OCD, the parent should take the child to a medical professional for treatment.

There are a lot of kids who have no diagnosis at all, and are happy and well-adjusted and have friends and don't fixate on things and have empathy and don't perseverate and also ask to have their peaches on a separate plate from their pancakes. Yes, you are a genius to identify that. But it isn't what this thread about, that isn't OP's child.

Do you have a child with special needs? How do you feel when another parent judges you because of your child's behavior? If you don't have a child with special needs and have never been in that position, perhaps that explains your lack of empathy. And, once again, no one is advocating that OP should tolerate this behavior. But she isn't going to solve it without professional help and all your judging may make you feel superior but it isn't going to help.

[Anonymous]

Wow, some people are being a bit harsh. OP, my son has ADHD and intense anxiety and when he is experiencing a lot of emotional stress he often sounds rude. That is, he responds to the lack of control he feels by trying to control the environment and the people around him. I guess you could say that I "let him get away with it" to the extent that I don't typically punish him in these moments but I do try to correct him each and every time, ask him to rephrase the words and say them in a kinder tone, remind him to thank me for giving him breakfast, and generally talk about respect all day long.

Also, my approach to particular desires is not to cater to them specifically but to allow and even try to encourage my son to be more self-sufficient about his preferences. I don't cut crusts off of sandwiches, nor do I provide multiple plates so that food doesn't touch, nor do I reheat lukewarm food. But neither am I bothered by my kids'--NT or not--preferences. Basically, you can be as particular as you want in my view as long as you can take care of yourself! At first it took a little coaching but my son, for example, spent about a year re-warm up his food at least once (sometimes several times) in the middle of dinner and then he got over it and never did it again. I do think that supporting him while shifting responsibility onto him has helped my son become more self-sufficient, which I do believe makes him feel a little more in control and, in turn, less likely to try to control everything around him.