Planned Parenthood Already "Rapes" VA women having abortions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one is forcing anyone to have a transvaginal ultra sound. A woman who choses to have an abortion consents to the ultrasound in order to get the abortion. No one is holding anyone down for the ultrasound. If you don't want the ultrasound you don't have to have an abortion. How is this rape?

How about the next time you need medical care you need to get a stick shoved up your ass first, but hey it's up to you to decide if you want the medical care or not?

Hey smarty pants... actually, if they are doing a prostate biopsy, they will put an ultrasound up "your ass" (your words). Its called a transrectal ultrasound and medically necessary in order to ensure adequate and proper specimens are retrieved--- just like before certain gestational ages, a transvaginal ultrasound is necessary to verify both pregnancy and its location.

Get over yourself and your ignorant comments. Yes, it is up to you to get medical care--- appropriate and safe medical care. How fast you would cry foul if a doctor tried to evacuate a pregnancy from a uterus only to find out a couple weeks later that the tiny sac of tissue was in the fallopian tubes and it ruptured the tube and killed the woman.

Do you really not understand the difference between an invasive procedure that a patient consents to undergo because a doctor advises it is medically advisable, and an invasive procedure that the state legislature of Virginia requires patients to undergo for political/religious reasons? I don't think I am the ignorant one.

[Anonymous]

Didn't some state rep. in Va try to amend the bill to require a prostate exam for any man seeking a viagra prescription?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://www.commentarymagazine.com/2012/02/21/ultrasounds-va-planned-parenthood-abortion-procedure/

Fucking right-wing media and their fucking strawmen arguments.

Well-reasoned.

You can't reason with crazy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No one is forcing anyone to have a transvaginal ultra sound. A woman who choses to have an abortion consents to the ultrasound in order to get the abortion. No one is holding anyone down for the ultrasound. If you don't want the ultrasound you don't have to have an abortion. How is this rape?

If you replace the word "abortion" with "food", would it be rape then? Of course. It isn't so offensive to you because you aren't concerned about the right to abortion. But you would be really concerned if it was about something you wanted or needed very much.

[Anonymous]

Hey, remember when Republicans got giant killer bees in their bonnets when the Affordable Care Act merely suggested that a conversation with a doctor about end-of-life care was a good idea? Didn't they call that mandated "death panels?"

And you're the ones who don't understand how the state interfering in the doctor-patient relationship is horrendous? Yeah, sure.

[Anonymous]

Sounds like this might be too extreme even for McDonnell....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The difference is that Republicans are trying to make this a "government mandate" that applies to a woman's control over her own body, her understanding that it is a private health clinic's standard policy. I thought Republicans prided themselves on the fewer government mandates, the better. ?

This.

But, in truth, I've had 4 D&C's for miscarriage. That's the same procedure as an "abortion." I've long wondered whether anyone writing these anti-abortion laws had made this connection or figured this out yet, that women who are trying to have a live baby use this procedure too. Do they really intend to force women who've had miscarriages to look at their dead babies? BTW - I've had 3 different OB tell me there's absolutely no way to know FOR SURE whether the pregnancy is really over, so even when you think you're dealing with a miscarriage you are always dealing with a small element of guessing. The only way to be consistent with an anti-abortion law then, is to refuse D&Cs for all women in all scenarios. You'd just be too open to liability if you didn't. Wonder what it's going to look like when those chickens come home to roost.

We have had those too but guess what, before you do them you use an ultrasound to detect whether there is a heart beat or not. So there you go, it's already been done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

takoma wrote:First, it an't rape if it's consensual -- who is forced to go to PP?

Second, I may have missed something, but is there anything in the article that says the PP ultrasound is the transvaginal kind? It is sort of implied, but the wording studiously avoids saying so. As one of the comments says, that's a pivotal distinction.

First, the point is that it's apparently already a standard procedure. If I were about to have an abortion, I'd certainly want the doctor to determine the gestational age of the fetus so that he/she could perform the appropriate procedure and determine if there are any special circumstances, such as an ectopic pregnancy. Who wouldn't consent to that? The ultrasound, which PP itself admittedly performs before every abortion, is for the mother's safety, so the cries of "rape" are ridiculous.

Second, the VA bill doesn't say anything about transvaginal ultrasounds, either. The type of ultrasound used would depend on how far along the pregnancy is, as I understand it, and that would be true with our without the law.

Bottom line is that nobody is "raping" anybody. What people are really objecting to, I think, is that women have to be given the OPTION of seeing the results of the ultrasound under the bill, which is designed to ensure "informed" consent. Since when is information a bad thing? If hearing that little heartbeat or seeing that little head on the sonogram changes some minds, why is that a bad thing?

As I have posted elsewhere, I wrote to VA delegate Bob Marshall to complain about the vaginal wanding and he did not deny it. The relevant part of his reply is here:

"Secondly, HB 462, is not my legislation though I did vote in favor of it. It is sponsored by Delegate Kathy Byron.

The issue is one of women's safety. HB 462 will add ultrasound to the informed consent requirements in Virginia. Planned Parenthood requires ultrasound to date pregnancy because it is the standard of care to ensure the correct procedure is done. For example if a woman has an ectopic pregnancy or is further along in her pregnancy that she first thought she cannot be given RU-486 because it would be life threatening. Below is a quote from a Planned Parenthood hotline with regard to their requirements for an abortion procedure. All abortions require an ultrasound and a pill abortion requires two trans vaginal ultrasounds, one before the pill is given and one later. Consent for the ultrasound is required to obtain an abortion. As a result, this legislation would not require anything more invasive that what is already done but would only require that all other clinics meet this same standard of care and that the woman be offered the opportunity to view the ultrasound."

[Anonymous]

Only a moron could try to conflate a voluntary, CONSENSUAL procedure with state-mandated Big Brother legalized rape in an effort to bully women.

Amazing how fucking stupid so many people are but as George Carlin said, "Think how stupid the average person is ... and half the people are dumber than that."

[Anonymous]

Sounds like this might be too extreme even for McDonnell....

Nothing is too extreme for this nut job.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/29/AR2009082902434.html?hpid=topnews

At age 34, two years before his first election and two decades before he would run for governor of Virginia, Robert F. McDonnell submitted a master's thesis to the evangelical school he was attending in Virginia Beach in which he described working women and feminists as "detrimental" to the family. He said government policy should favor married couples over "cohabitators, homosexuals or fornicators." He described as "illogical" a 1972 Supreme Court decision legalizing the use of contraception by unmarried couples
The 93-page document, which is publicly available at the Regent University library, culminates with a 15-point action plan that McDonnell said the Republican Party should follow to protect American families -- a vision that he started to put into action soon after he was elected to the Virginia House of Delegates. During his 14 years in the General Assembly, McDonnell pursued at least 10 of the policy goals he laid out in that research paper, including abortion restrictions, covenant marriage, school vouchers and tax policies to favor his view of the traditional family. In 2001, he voted against a resolution in support of ending wage discrimination between men and women.

[Anonymous]

What if they removed the mandatory vaginal ultrasound, will that stop your bitching? It would be funny since that is the entire slogan of what you aborters are pitching

[Anonymous]

^^ um, yes?

Am I missing something?

There's still the personhood law to bitch about though, so until that one goes away, I'll be here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^ um, yes?

Am I missing something?

There's still the personhood law to bitch about though, so until that one goes away, I'll be here.

The other part of the bill requires the health care provider to offer to show the patient a picture of the ultrasound.

In any event, it's really bad public policy to legislate the medical decisions of a health care provider. Even without getting into constitutionality issues, medical practices change over time, and legislation generally isn't proactive or quick enough to keep up. Especially with a part-time legislature.

A better law, if safety is truly the legislator's concern, is to mandate that health care providers use current best practices that ensure patient safety, regardless of the procedure being performed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What if they removed the mandatory vaginal ultrasound, will that stop your bitching? It would be funny since that is the entire slogan of what you aborters are pitching

I've never had an abortion. And I object in the most extreme terms possible to this ultrasound measure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Only a moron could try to conflate a voluntary, CONSENSUAL procedure with state-mandated Big Brother legalized rape in an effort to bully women.

Amazing how fucking stupid so many people are but as George Carlin said, "Think how stupid the average person is ... and half the people are dumber than that."

How is a government mandated procedure that is not medically necessary but only serves to enforce ones political and spiritual beliefs not a violation of my rights? I have never had an abortion and I hope to never need one, but as a women I feel very uncomfortable with the idea of the government (not a medical entity) enforcing that I be physically probed- not for any medical reason but a political one. If it was the doctor saying I needed to have it done for my health I wouldn't have a problem, but that is not the case here.

I would also like to point out that someone on the other side made the correlation between Obama's contraception plan being forced rape of religious institutions- I am gonna guess that it didn't seem as moronic to you then but now in this case where women are ACTUALLY being probed to support your own agenda it is apparently ridiculous to use the term.