AP Classes and IEPs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:An IEP is made to support a students ability to access the curriculum. If your kid is in AP classes, they are more than accessing the curriculum. Hence, no support required.

This is not true. Bright kids who have an IEP and are otherwise qualified for an AP or any advanced class or magnet have a right to the same supports and accommodations in the AP or advanced class.

Whatever accommodations are on the IEP must be delivered in all classes - no exceptions. I have had 2 kids in magnets - 1 with an IEP and 1 with a 504. The AP teacher is obligated to comply with the accommodations.

AP classes are considered part of the curriculum - not “more than the curriculum.”

What kind of “support” does your child need in an AP class, OP?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In terms of level of support, if you take an AP class, you are taking a college level class with the reasonable options of accommodations one might request in a college setting. There are specific cases for one-on-one support such as interpreter for a deaf student, note taker for a physically disabled student (unable to write) etc.

This is incorrect. An AP class is a high school class. A high school student should be supported in an AP class per their IEP just as they would for any other class in high school. The accommodations on the AP exam itself are governed by the College Board, so the student does have to apply to the CB separately for those.


- special ed atty

Special ed atty, how is support defined? This seems murky to me. IEP teams have to disclose student goals, accommodations, and service hours but this hardly nails down the delivery methods for specialized instruction.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our school said no, no support in AP classes.

Same here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:An IEP is made to support a students ability to access the curriculum. If your kid is in AP classes, they are more than accessing the curriculum. Hence, no support required.

This is not true. Bright kids who have an IEP and are otherwise qualified for an AP or any advanced class or magnet have a right to the same supports and accommodations in the AP or advanced class.

Whatever accommodations are on the IEP must be delivered in all classes - no exceptions. I have had 2 kids in magnets - 1 with an IEP and 1 with a 504. The AP teacher is obligated to comply with the accommodations.

AP classes are considered part of the curriculum - not “more than the curriculum.”

What kind of “support” does your child need in an AP class, OP?

Some might find this controversial but I think if your kid is on a college pathway it is probably reasonable (from a parenting perspective) to start getting them used to a less supportive environment in some of their more challenging academic classes. 504 accommodations are more similar to what will be available at the college level so I didn’t think it was a terrible thing when our kids AP classes weren’t supported.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In terms of level of support, if you take an AP class, you are taking a college level class with the reasonable options of accommodations one might request in a college setting. There are specific cases for one-on-one support such as interpreter for a deaf student, note taker for a physically disabled student (unable to write) etc.

This is incorrect. An AP class is a high school class. A high school student should be supported in an AP class per their IEP just as they would for any other class in high school. The accommodations on the AP exam itself are governed by the College Board, so the student does have to apply to the CB separately for those.


- special ed atty

Is a co-teacher an accommodation? Not that I’ve ever seen. An AP student would be entitled to their accommodations but I don’t see them needing specially designed instruction for AP Physics C. That’s above grade level. How does one demonstrate underachievement for grade 11 when you are taking a college level course?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In terms of level of support, if you take an AP class, you are taking a college level class with the reasonable options of accommodations one might request in a college setting. There are specific cases for one-on-one support such as interpreter for a deaf student, note taker for a physically disabled student (unable to write) etc.

This is incorrect. An AP class is a high school class. A high school student should be supported in an AP class per their IEP just as they would for any other class in high school. The accommodations on the AP exam itself are governed by the College Board, so the student does have to apply to the CB separately for those.


- special ed atty

Special ed atty, how is support defined? This seems murky to me. IEP teams have to disclose student goals, accommodations, and service hours but this hardly nails down the delivery methods for specialized instruction.

This is a topic for the IEP team to discuss. The support depends on each student's individualized need in order to access the AP class, as determined by their IEP team.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In terms of level of support, if you take an AP class, you are taking a college level class with the reasonable options of accommodations one might request in a college setting. There are specific cases for one-on-one support such as interpreter for a deaf student, note taker for a physically disabled student (unable to write) etc.

This is incorrect. An AP class is a high school class. A high school student should be supported in an AP class per their IEP just as they would for any other class in high school. The accommodations on the AP exam itself are governed by the College Board, so the student does have to apply to the CB separately for those.


- special ed atty

Is a co-teacher an accommodation? Not that I’ve ever seen. An AP student would be entitled to their accommodations but I don’t see them needing specially designed instruction for AP Physics C. That’s above grade level. How does one demonstrate underachievement for grade 11 when you are taking a college level course?

If a student with a disability requires another staff member in the room in order to access the curriculum and make expected progress, then the school would have to provide it. In most instances, this probably wouldn't be needed though and more typical accommodations would be used in the AP class and the specialized instruction would take place during other parts of the day.

I could see it coming up more in AP Lit. If the student is above grade level in comprehension so needs access to AP level material but has challenges with decoding and fluency for which they require specialized instruction. In that case, I could make a very good argument that co-teaching is necessary in that class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:An IEP is made to support a students ability to access the curriculum. If your kid is in AP classes, they are more than accessing the curriculum. Hence, no support required.

This is absolutely false.

No it's not. Why do you think schools can get away witn not having co-taught AP classes?

Under your thinking a blind child should never take an AP unless they could do it without support?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In terms of level of support, if you take an AP class, you are taking a college level class with the reasonable options of accommodations one might request in a college setting. There are specific cases for one-on-one support such as interpreter for a deaf student, note taker for a physically disabled student (unable to write) etc.

This is incorrect. An AP class is a high school class. A high school student should be supported in an AP class per their IEP just as they would for any other class in high school. The accommodations on the AP exam itself are governed by the College Board, so the student does have to apply to the CB separately for those.


- special ed atty

Special ed atty, how is support defined? This seems murky to me. IEP teams have to disclose student goals, accommodations, and service hours but this hardly nails down the delivery methods for specialized instruction.

This is a topic for the IEP team to discuss. The support depends on each student's individualized need in order to access the AP class, as determined by their IEP team.

Is this PP? Thanks for the response. I would love to have discussed this with our IEP teams. I had an ed background and I knew my kid. But the teams at our kid's schools never liked discussing delivery methods. They made us feel like restaurant patrons who were trying to barge into the kitchen to find the chef's recipes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In terms of level of support, if you take an AP class, you are taking a college level class with the reasonable options of accommodations one might request in a college setting. There are specific cases for one-on-one support such as interpreter for a deaf student, note taker for a physically disabled student (unable to write) etc.

This is incorrect. An AP class is a high school class. A high school student should be supported in an AP class per their IEP just as they would for any other class in high school. The accommodations on the AP exam itself are governed by the College Board, so the student does have to apply to the CB separately for those.


- special ed atty

Is a co-teacher an accommodation? Not that I’ve ever seen. An AP student would be entitled to their accommodations but I don’t see them needing specially designed instruction for AP Physics C. That’s above grade level. How does one demonstrate underachievement for grade 11 when you are taking a college level course?

If a student with a disability requires another staff member in the room in order to access the curriculum and make expected progress, then the school would have to provide it. In most instances, this probably wouldn't be needed though and more typical accommodations would be used in the AP class and the specialized instruction would take place during other parts of the day.

I could see it coming up more in AP Lit. If the student is above grade level in comprehension so needs access to AP level material but has challenges with decoding and fluency for which they require specialized instruction. In that case, I could make a very good argument that co-teaching is necessary in that class.

You would make the argument that a student in AP lit needs explicit instruction in decoding with a coteacher? During the AP class? Read aloud would be the appropriate accommodation and small group support in the special education setting for the explicit decoding instruction. I don’t know an AP kid who would want someone teaching them to sound out words at the small group table

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In terms of level of support, if you take an AP class, you are taking a college level class with the reasonable options of accommodations one might request in a college setting. There are specific cases for one-on-one support such as interpreter for a deaf student, note taker for a physically disabled student (unable to write) etc.

This is incorrect. An AP class is a high school class. A high school student should be supported in an AP class per their IEP just as they would for any other class in high school. The accommodations on the AP exam itself are governed by the College Board, so the student does have to apply to the CB separately for those.


- special ed atty

Is a co-teacher an accommodation? Not that I’ve ever seen. An AP student would be entitled to their accommodations but I don’t see them needing specially designed instruction for AP Physics C. That’s above grade level. How does one demonstrate underachievement for grade 11 when you are taking a college level course?

If a student with a disability requires another staff member in the room in order to access the curriculum and make expected progress, then the school would have to provide it. In most instances, this probably wouldn't be needed though and more typical accommodations would be used in the AP class and the specialized instruction would take place during other parts of the day.

I could see it coming up more in AP Lit. If the student is above grade level in comprehension so needs access to AP level material but has challenges with decoding and fluency for which they require specialized instruction. In that case, I could make a very good argument that co-teaching is necessary in that class.

You would make the argument that a student in AP lit needs explicit instruction in decoding with a coteacher? During the AP class? Read aloud would be the appropriate accommodation and small group support in the special education setting for the explicit decoding instruction. I don’t know an AP kid who would want someone teaching them to sound out words at the small group table

Possibly. If a student needs explicit instruction in decoding then a logical time to deliver it is during the ELA class, which in some cases could be AP Lit. Unless the school division has a proposal to deliver it during a different period. So what would you suggest instead of the English class?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In terms of level of support, if you take an AP class, you are taking a college level class with the reasonable options of accommodations one might request in a college setting. There are specific cases for one-on-one support such as interpreter for a deaf student, note taker for a physically disabled student (unable to write) etc.

This is incorrect. An AP class is a high school class. A high school student should be supported in an AP class per their IEP just as they would for any other class in high school. The accommodations on the AP exam itself are governed by the College Board, so the student does have to apply to the CB separately for those.


- special ed atty

Special ed atty, how is support defined? This seems murky to me. IEP teams have to disclose student goals, accommodations, and service hours but this hardly nails down the delivery methods for specialized instruction.

This is a topic for the IEP team to discuss. The support depends on each student's individualized need in order to access the AP class, as determined by their IEP team.

Is this PP? Thanks for the response. I would love to have discussed this with our IEP teams. I had an ed background and I knew my kid. But the teams at our kid's schools never liked discussing delivery methods. They made us feel like restaurant patrons who were trying to barge into the kitchen to find the chef's recipes.

I guess it depends what you're asking. Generally, teaching methodology doesn't have to be specified in the IEP if that's what you mean.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In terms of level of support, if you take an AP class, you are taking a college level class with the reasonable options of accommodations one might request in a college setting. There are specific cases for one-on-one support such as interpreter for a deaf student, note taker for a physically disabled student (unable to write) etc.

This is incorrect. An AP class is a high school class. A high school student should be supported in an AP class per their IEP just as they would for any other class in high school. The accommodations on the AP exam itself are governed by the College Board, so the student does have to apply to the CB separately for those.


- special ed atty

Is a co-teacher an accommodation? Not that I’ve ever seen. An AP student would be entitled to their accommodations but I don’t see them needing specially designed instruction for AP Physics C. That’s above grade level. How does one demonstrate underachievement for grade 11 when you are taking a college level course?

If a student with a disability requires another staff member in the room in order to access the curriculum and make expected progress, then the school would have to provide it. In most instances, this probably wouldn't be needed though and more typical accommodations would be used in the AP class and the specialized instruction would take place during other parts of the day.

I could see it coming up more in AP Lit. If the student is above grade level in comprehension so needs access to AP level material but has challenges with decoding and fluency for which they require specialized instruction. In that case, I could make a very good argument that co-teaching is necessary in that class.

You would make the argument that a student in AP lit needs explicit instruction in decoding with a coteacher? During the AP class? Read aloud would be the appropriate accommodation and small group support in the special education setting for the explicit decoding instruction. I don’t know an AP kid who would want someone teaching them to sound out words at the small group table

Possibly. If a student needs explicit instruction in decoding then a logical time to deliver it is during the ELA class, which in some cases could be AP Lit. Unless the school division has a proposal to deliver it during a different period. So what would you suggest instead of the English

You’re describing a tier 3 intervention with specific fidelity requirements that is so erste than the AP curriculum. That would be pull-out instruction. I wouldn’t want my 11th grader receiving that instruction in the general ed setting.

[Anonymous]

Our MCPS HS refused to support our IEP student in AP classes. We were even discouraged from having him take them. At one point we were threatened with losing the IEP because he was planning on taking AP English and AP social studies and that meant no co-taught classes. So I asked for him to be placed in co-taught math (which he desperately needed) and that was refused because the IEP didn’t list math, even though it is his most impacted subject. I considered hiring an advocate to sort the whole thing out but was so burned out on dealing with MCPS by that point in time. We caved and our student took a non-AP social studies that was cotaught. They are most definitely violating the law.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In terms of level of support, if you take an AP class, you are taking a college level class with the reasonable options of accommodations one might request in a college setting. There are specific cases for one-on-one support such as interpreter for a deaf student, note taker for a physically disabled student (unable to write) etc.

This is incorrect. An AP class is a high school class. A high school student should be supported in an AP class per their IEP just as they would for any other class in high school. The accommodations on the AP exam itself are governed by the College Board, so the student does have to apply to the CB separately for those.


- special ed atty

Is a co-teacher an accommodation? Not that I’ve ever seen. An AP student would be entitled to their accommodations but I don’t see them needing specially designed instruction for AP Physics C. That’s above grade level. How does one demonstrate underachievement for grade 11 when you are taking a college level course?

If a student with a disability requires another staff member in the room in order to access the curriculum and make expected progress, then the school would have to provide it. In most instances, this probably wouldn't be needed though and more typical accommodations would be used in the AP class and the specialized instruction would take place during other parts of the day.

I could see it coming up more in AP Lit. If the student is above grade level in comprehension so needs access to AP level material but has challenges with decoding and fluency for which they require specialized instruction. In that case, I could make a very good argument that co-teaching is necessary in that class.

You would make the argument that a student in AP lit needs explicit instruction in decoding with a coteacher? During the AP class? Read aloud would be the appropriate accommodation and small group support in the special education setting for the explicit decoding instruction. I don’t know an AP kid who would want someone teaching them to sound out words at the small group table

Possibly. If a student needs explicit instruction in decoding then a logical time to deliver it is during the ELA class, which in some cases could be AP Lit. Unless the school division has a proposal to deliver it during a different period. So what would you suggest instead of the English

You’re describing a tier 3 intervention with specific fidelity requirements that is so erste than the AP curriculum. That would be pull-out instruction. I wouldn’t want my 11th grader receiving that instruction in the general ed setting.

No, that type of instruction does not have to be delivered on a pullout basis. The setting is a team decision, and instruction should always be delivered in the LRE. And it's fine that you wouldn't want your child to get this, but the point is it may be appropriate for other students.