I don’t get it!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The answer to all your “if” questions is “yes”.

The answer to “why” is because certain segments of the US population think the optimal way run an education system is to overload a few elite institutions with an embarrassment of riches so that the very select few get access to the very best. While the rest claw over scraps. It may be that in some societies where there are few good colleges, but the US does not suffer from a lack of terrific colleges. There are a couple hundred at least that nearly every employer would consider hiring from given the right candidate. Of course the less elite it is, it may require a bit more initiative and getting better grades than at an elite school.

By writing the bolded part above, you have contradicted yourself. Part of the fallacy that we all perpetuate is that only the so-called top colleges have “the very best.” There are plenty of great professors and great departments at many universities all over the country.

I don’t know if it’s still the case, but I know that at Harvard, if you wanted to take a class with a famous prof, you had to apply to the class. And who says that just because someone is famous that they are a good teacher?

[Anonymous]

You summed it up. It’s about having the trendy brand/prestige. Many people want to drive a Mercedes over a Honda. My sister will tell you the college matters but my kids attend/attended UMD and there are plenty of top students there - smart and hardworking. My son for example graduated HS with a 4.7 GPA and didn’t earn his first non-A junior year. He has nailed internships each year and I have zero doubt he will be highly employable. We couldn’t afford more elite schools and are really pleased with his education and my daughters.

[Anonymous]

The top schools open doors faster and help in building networks. They aren't better otherwise in terms of an education -- in fact professors at places like Harvard aren't that accessible because they are often deeply involved in their own work.

[Anonymous]

For a lot of families, the Mercedes (HYP) is cheaper than the Honda (UMD).

Not saying it's better, but it's cheaper. For other families, it won't be.

[Anonymous]

“Let's be honest.. if you have an applicant from MIT and one from UMD, you would look at the MIT applicant first.”
+1

Also that there are a few schools where if you tell people you went there it automatically communicates “very smart”: Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Stanford, MIT.

In my view the differentiation after that tippy top signaling school group is not that huge but yes there are bands of perceived “smartness” associated with other schools too like UVA signals smarter than GMU or VCU on a resume. Now maybe the kid from the latter two interviews great and is actually smarter and able to do a better job. But in a pile of resumes with kids from all 3 schools thr UVA one is likely to get a closer look.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, that’s about it.

And, unfortunately, it’s starting when kids are at a young age. Exhibit A is the Advanced Academic Program (AAP) forum. It’s a program in Fairfax County Public Schools. There has to be separate forum there because there are so many parents posting scores of their 7-8 year olds and attempting to get into a program. There are perfectly fine classes in their neighborhood schools that are meeting their kid’s needs, but they’re jockeying for this program because they think it gives them a leg up. In the end, it doesn’t really matter. They all end up at the same high school with the same access to honors, IB and AP classes.

The parents are not okay.

[Anonymous]

^
I should add that my kids are NOT going to go to the tippy top schools. Even if they won the lottery and got in we make too much to benefit from their aid and not enough to easily sewing the sticker tag price.

[Anonymous]

Also, we’re not all crazy. The crazy ones are just loud.

We have a current senior, so we have a kid going through the process now. I just told the family of a junior that it is possible to apply without SAT tutoring or college counselors and they were shocked. Buying into all that is a choice, but when everyone seems to be making it, it doesn’t feel that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m a foreigner and newcomer to DC - we moved here for my husband’s work ~ 2 years ago from Western Europe. We have two boys and the oldest just started high school here, so I’ve been trying to learn about US college admissions in case my kids express interest in attending school here.

This is what I have trouble understanding:
- if now desirable employers recruit from a large range of schools rather than only from a few elite schools
- if you can have access to quality peers beyond the T20 schools since there are way more qualified kids than spots at these schools
- if you can get a quality education at pretty much any top 100 school, and
- if life outcomes are truly dependent on the kid rather than the school

Then why oh why are kids (and parents) putting themselves through so much stress and anxiety to get into HYPSM? This is what I don’t get.

Is it purely because Harvard and Yale are more prestigious than Penn State and Miami? So it’s just about prestige and bragging rights?

It depends on what you mean by desirable

Deloitte recruits widely. McKinsey recruits from a select group.

Capital One recruits widely. Morgan Stanley recruits from a select group.

If you want your kid to be solidly employed at a first job after graduation that is fine go anywhere for college. If your kid wants the jobs the top of the pecking order though they need to go to a target school. Aka an elite one.

[Anonymous]

Remember this key fact. The person ensuring your plane is perfect to fly does not have a college degree. The person fixing your car does not have a college degree. The person ensuring your sushi is not rancid does not have a college degree. But the person sitting at a desk doing nothing for your life must go to Harvard or will be a failure. Haha!!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:“Let's be honest.. if you have an applicant from MIT and one from UMD, you would look at the MIT applicant first.”
+1

Also that there are a few schools where if you tell people you went there it automatically communicates “very smart”: Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Stanford, MIT.

In my view the differentiation after that tippy top signaling school group is not that huge but yes there are bands of perceived “smartness” associated with other schools too like UVA signals smarter than GMU or VCU on a resume. Now maybe the kid from the latter two interviews great and is actually smarter and able to do a better job. But in a pile of resumes with kids from all 3 schools thr UVA one is likely to get a closer look.

There’s some truth to this but it’s only one piece of a resume. If the UMD kid has a better GPA and more relevant internships than the MIT kid, I’m not necessarily looking at the MIT first. Ditto for the GMU kid versus the UVA kid. The whole package matters.

One area where the MITs and UVAs excel over the others is with on-campus recruiting. But even then, there are several dozen schools that will get companies to show up to recruit. Goldman recruits at Indiana. MBB at Texas A&M. And so on.

[Anonymous]

People chase after anything perceived as the best or prestige VIP. It’s why we have idiots driving recalled Cybertrucks

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a foreigner and newcomer to DC - we moved here for my husband’s work ~ 2 years ago from Western Europe. We have two boys and the oldest just started high school here, so I’ve been trying to learn about US college admissions in case my kids express interest in attending school here.

This is what I have trouble understanding:
- if now desirable employers recruit from a large range of schools rather than only from a few elite schools
- if you can have access to quality peers beyond the T20 schools since there are way more qualified kids than spots at these schools
- if you can get a quality education at pretty much any top 100 school, and
- if life outcomes are truly dependent on the kid rather than the school

Then why oh why are kids (and parents) putting themselves through so much stress and anxiety to get into HYPSM? This is what I don’t get.

Is it purely because Harvard and Yale are more prestigious than Penn State and Miami? So it’s just about prestige and bragging rights?

It depends on what you mean by desirable

Deloitte recruits widely. McKinsey recruits from a select group.

Capital One recruits widely. Morgan Stanley recruits from a select group.

If you want your kid to be solidly employed at a first job after graduation that is fine go anywhere for college. If your kid wants the jobs the top of the pecking order though they need to go to a target school. Aka an elite one.

A relative interned at Capital One last summer in a finance group…said 70% were Ivy League kids.

Relative was part of the 30% that happened to have a frat brother alum working at Capital One that hooked him up.

Take away was not “I didn’t need an Ivy”, but rather how much easier it was for Ivy kids compared to him and the other 30%.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a foreigner and newcomer to DC - we moved here for my husband’s work ~ 2 years ago from Western Europe. We have two boys and the oldest just started high school here, so I’ve been trying to learn about US college admissions in case my kids express interest in attending school here.

This is what I have trouble understanding:
- if now desirable employers recruit from a large range of schools rather than only from a few elite schools
- if you can have access to quality peers beyond the T20 schools since there are way more qualified kids than spots at these schools
- if you can get a quality education at pretty much any top 100 school, and
- if life outcomes are truly dependent on the kid rather than the school

Then why oh why are kids (and parents) putting themselves through so much stress and anxiety to get into HYPSM? This is what I don’t get.

Is it purely because Harvard and Yale are more prestigious than Penn State and Miami? So it’s just about prestige and bragging rights?

It depends on what you mean by desirable

Deloitte recruits widely. McKinsey recruits from a select group.

Capital One recruits widely. Morgan Stanley recruits from a select group.

If you want your kid to be solidly employed at a first job after graduation that is fine go anywhere for college. If your kid wants the jobs the top of the pecking order though they need to go to a target school. Aka an elite one.

A relative interned at Capital One last summer in a finance group…said 70% were Ivy League kids.

Relative was part of the 30% that happened to have a frat brother alum working at Capital One that hooked him up.

Take away was not “I didn’t need an Ivy”, but rather how much easier it was for Ivy kids compared to him and the other 30%.

I'm the first PP with a kid at UMD, and yes, this is true. It's just easier, opens the door faster. It doesn't mean that a smart kid from UMD won't there; it will just take them longer. Like I said, my kid is super smart. They can easily hold their own academically compared to students from MIT. DC actually got an interview at MIT; that's how high their stats were. Non minority. Unfortunately, DC decided to major in CS, and that's a tough T10 nut to crack.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People chase after anything perceived as the best or prestige VIP. It’s why we have idiots driving recalled Cybertrucks

This.

It’s the insecure/brand-chasing parents. They want to brag and keep up with the Joneses.

Agree that I’d give a closer look to the resume of a state school grad with excellent internships over a top name school kid.

-An HYP grad