Freshman Math Placement

[Anonymous]

Also - when speaking to the math rep from the HS - ask how other students coming from your child's 8th grade MS Algebra I class fared. The HS may have a strong history to use as an example of how well (or not) children from that middle school perform in the HS math sequence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our son was in a similar situation. There are two things to consider here:

Algebra 1 taught by most middle schools is a watered down version of the high school Algebra 1 version.

The curriculum of "Algebra 1 honors" at some schools is more like Algebra 2 and precalc. This is the case at my son's high school.

I'd inquire about what exactly the Algebra 1 honors curriculum is before ruling it out.

Does anyone have a sense of Gonzaga's math program? If anyone can speak to the strengths and weaknesses of their curriculum, that would be super helpful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s OK to reach out to the math chair (or the person who does the placement) and ask about the placement and the rationale behind it, but just be polite and not demanding or entitled. Ultimately, you may disagree with their rationale (or maybe you find that your kid didn’t do as well as he thought on the test), but you’re going to be there for four years so don’t establish yourself as a difficult family, especially if there’s an opportunity to take Geometry in the summer.

I would consider "difficult family" argument in a public school. In a private school, if my kid wants Geometry, they get Geometry. If it ends up being to hard... ...good lesson for the kid on judging their abilities.

I would listen to school's arguments against, but they better be VERY convincing.

[Anonymous]

I would not want to have to have my kid take geometry next summer in order to get a little bit ahead. The summer after freshman year can be spent in a variety of better ways. Maybe the school would be open to your kid doing an extra algebra class with Art of Problem Solving or something this summer, If they are not confident that the algebra class he already took is sufficient.

[Anonymous]

As everyone else has said, reach out to the school to understand why the placed him where they did. I can’t imagine it’s a “resource issue” as you said - schools have tons of geometry classes, and more importantly they WANT every incoming 9th grader on the right math path - it’s just harder for them later if they aren’t. He clearly didn’t do as well on the placement test as he thought.


Two other thoughts:
- our high school does informal evaluations the first two weeks of school to see if anyone is misplaced. If he does start in algebra 1, make sure he gets 100 on every homework, quiz, and test at the beginning of the year, and then a few weeks in see if you can reevaluate his placement.
- if he does end up in algebra 1 next year, you can also inquire about taking algebra 2 and geometry concurrently as a sophomore. It takes away an elective slot obviously, but it’s a very common way to move math tracks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kid is taking Algebra I in 8th, doing well, and claims he aced the placement test at his new HS, but the HS is not willing to let him into Geometry and is putting him in Algebra I Honors. They apparently have a program whereby Geometry can be taken over the summer after Freshman year, but offer no details on how long this will take or how much it will cost (and we are already stretched paying for regular tuition). We love many things about the school, but all bets will be off if our kid gets bored doing what essentially could be a repeat of Algebra his first year there and which in turn puts him a disadvantage with his peers when applying for college. Any advice on how to handle this with the school would be appreciated.

Do you mind sharing the school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kid is taking Algebra I in 8th, doing well, and claims he aced the placement test at his new HS, but the HS is not willing to let him into Geometry and is putting him in Algebra I Honors. They apparently have a program whereby Geometry can be taken over the summer after Freshman year, but offer no details on how long this will take or how much it will cost (and we are already stretched paying for regular tuition). We love many things about the school, but all bets will be off if our kid gets bored doing what essentially could be a repeat of Algebra his first year there and which in turn puts him a disadvantage with his peers when applying for college. Any advice on how to handle this with the school would be appreciated.

Do you mind sharing the school?

Guessing St John's?

[Anonymous]

When DC got an unexpected result after the math placement test last year, the math chair offered DC the chance to come in and look over the test so they could see what they’d missed. The school also offered the option of retaking the placement test toward the end of the summer if DC wanted to try to brush up (either independently, or with a tutor or taking a class). Ultimately DC didn’t want to have to study over the summer and retake and we went with the school’s placement and it turned out to be exactly right. I’d suggest asking if the school could go over the test results with your son (he won’t be able to take it home of course) to see what the gaps are. If it seems like a surmountable difference and up your son is willing to work over the summer, as if a retake would be possible.

Also I don’t understand the school not offering you information about the logistics and cost of taking geometry in the summer. I wouldn’t necessarily recommend that route anyway, but do you mean they just refuse to answer when you’ve asked how much the summer classes cost?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When DC got an unexpected result after the math placement test last year, the math chair offered DC the chance to come in and look over the test so they could see what they’d missed. The school also offered the option of retaking the placement test toward the end of the summer if DC wanted to try to brush up (either independently, or with a tutor or taking a class). Ultimately DC didn’t want to have to study over the summer and retake and we went with the school’s placement and it turned out to be exactly right. I’d suggest asking if the school could go over the test results with your son (he won’t be able to take it home of course) to see what the gaps are. If it seems like a surmountable difference and up your son is willing to work over the summer, as if a retake would be possible.

Also I don’t understand the school not offering you information about the logistics and cost of taking geometry in the summer. I wouldn’t necessarily recommend that route anyway, but do you mean they just refuse to answer when you’ve asked how much the summer classes cost?

What school was this? Knowing the schools are helpful so others can know what to expect. TIA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When DC got an unexpected result after the math placement test last year, the math chair offered DC the chance to come in and look over the test so they could see what they’d missed. The school also offered the option of retaking the placement test toward the end of the summer if DC wanted to try to brush up (either independently, or with a tutor or taking a class). Ultimately DC didn’t want to have to study over the summer and retake and we went with the school’s placement and it turned out to be exactly right. I’d suggest asking if the school could go over the test results with your son (he won’t be able to take it home of course) to see what the gaps are. If it seems like a surmountable difference and up your son is willing to work over the summer, as if a retake would be possible.

Also I don’t understand the school not offering you information about the logistics and cost of taking geometry in the summer. I wouldn’t necessarily recommend that route anyway, but do you mean they just refuse to answer when you’ve asked how much the summer classes cost?

What school was this? Knowing the schools are helpful so others can know what to expect. TIA

SSSAS. But other schools we considered (O’Connell for sure and I think also Flint Hill) mentioned that they offer similar options to study and retake math placement exams if students aren’t happy with their results. So I think it’s generally worth asking about, regardless of what school.

[Anonymous]

Not OP but we encountered this at SJC and they didn't budge on placement. They also did not allow for a retake then or at the end of the summer. If you don't make the Geometry cutoff for the summer you are SOL. You have no options to take it on your own and test out, etc. Its a bad system which leaves capable kids behind. We are currently stuck in it and assessing how much of an overall impact we think it will have. I do believe there is another opportunity to test into a summer program between 11th and 12th but thats pretty darn late.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it’s OK to reach out to the math chair (or the person who does the placement) and ask about the placement and the rationale behind it, but just be polite and not demanding or entitled. Ultimately, you may disagree with their rationale (or maybe you find that your kid didn’t do as well as he thought on the test), but you’re going to be there for four years so don’t establish yourself as a difficult family, especially if there’s an opportunity to take Geometry in the summer.

I would consider "difficult family" argument in a public school. In a private school, if my kid wants Geometry, they get Geometry. If it ends up being to hard... ...good lesson for the kid on judging their abilities.

I would listen to school's arguments against, but they better be VERY convincing.

I can assure you - this approach will certainly label you as a "difficult family". I don't recommend that as a "starting point" at any school.

And, as others have noted - it is best to approach this as trying to understand the Algebra I placement in terms of test result, the HS knowledge (or not) of prior MS Algebra I students. And also to understand that just moving to Geometry isn't the issue - the issue in longer term - and will arise in Algebra II/Pre-calc/Calc when more Algebra I will be required.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not OP but we encountered this at SJC and they didn't budge on placement. They also did not allow for a retake then or at the end of the summer. If you don't make the Geometry cutoff for the summer you are SOL. You have no options to take it on your own and test out, etc. Its a bad system which leaves capable kids behind. We are currently stuck in it and assessing how much of an overall impact we think it will have. I do believe there is another opportunity to test into a summer program between 11th and 12th but thats pretty darn late.

But was it the wrong placement? Did the student actually know the material for the assessment?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP but we encountered this at SJC and they didn't budge on placement. They also did not allow for a retake then or at the end of the summer. If you don't make the Geometry cutoff for the summer you are SOL. You have no options to take it on your own and test out, etc. Its a bad system which leaves capable kids behind. We are currently stuck in it and assessing how much of an overall impact we think it will have. I do believe there is another opportunity to test into a summer program between 11th and 12th but thats pretty darn late.

But was it the wrong placement? Did the student actually know the material for the assessment?

Hard to know. A in 8th grade Algebra 1 and 4 on the DC PARCC but not a good test at SJC. I don't have issue with the retake as much as with the lack of ability to move up a level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not OP but we encountered this at SJC and they didn't budge on placement. They also did not allow for a retake then or at the end of the summer. If you don't make the Geometry cutoff for the summer you are SOL. You have no options to take it on your own and test out, etc. Its a bad system which leaves capable kids behind. We are currently stuck in it and assessing how much of an overall impact we think it will have. I do believe there is another opportunity to test into a summer program between 11th and 12th but thats pretty darn late.

The placement test would show mastery of the material but it did now so they aren't that capable.