Anybody following the Karen Read trial in Boston?

Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Wow, fascinating. Care to share more about what shapes your opinion? Can you point to specific evidence?

Any good summaries?

Was nobody in and out of the house from the time he was allegedly hit?

What about all the deleted texts, disposed phones?

Scrapped up knuckles on the nephew?

The wounds on Okeefe’s arm?


What shapes my opinion:

Lifelong fascination with an following true crime.

Decades of experience in the criminal justice system, including much of that time in smaller cities and towns and thus extensive familiarity with the bumbling mistakes of small town cops in collection of evidence, etc.

Having handled over a thousand DUI cases - sadly - and hundreds of domestic violence cases as a criminal lawyer, and hundreds more as a DV advocate before that.

More than five decades as a keen observer of the human condition.

More to the specifics you asked:

There were no scraped knuckles on the nephew just days after O’Keefe died - social media pictures show him with undamaged hands in multiple photos. Defense presented a photo from a month later which depicts him with scraped knuckles and he explained how it happened in his testimony. The throwing of that young man under a bus is particularly sickening to me.

Scrapes on John’s arm are consistent with contact with glass, sharp plastic or metal as in from the underside of a vehicle. A broken cocktail glass and broken taillight pieces were found by his body.

I suspect that there was stuff on Brian Albert’s and Brian Higgins’s phones that they didn’t want the world to see - but I don’t believe those things had anything whatsoever to do with the death of John O’Keefe. It will be heartbreaking if their missteps get Karen Read acquitted for killing a decent man who was raising his orphaned niece and nephew.

Yes, people were in and out of the house after the time John O’Keefe was struck and laying on the edge of the lawn. I’m surprised by the people who express shock that nobody would have seen him laying there - anyone who is familiar with suburbs on the south coast, the limited lighting in most such neighborhoods, and the fact that on the night in question it was very dark because of snowy cloud cover - how often are you looking in the darkest corners at the edge of someone’s yard as you pull away on a dark snowy night with poor driving conditions? Never, I’m sure. People are thinking about that aspect as Monday morning quarterbacks.

Listen, I’ve met some really really really dumb cops in my time. Never have I met one dumb enough to dump a body on his own front lawn and cross his fingers and hope that a frantic still drunk girlfriend will show up at the crack of dawn hollering about how she must’ve hit him. It’s really a ludicrous defense theory if you think about it dispassionately.

The thing is, people are not dispassionate about cops - they never have been, but since the George Floyd reckoning, some people are ever more suspicious and inflamed. Massachusetts has had her fair share of cop corruption cases so many are quick to believe it. But the notion that all the people the defense is alleging are in on a conspiracy could actually be and keep it quiet- it really is laughable, or would be if this trial wasn’t putting the O’Keefe family and so many other innocent people through life changing hell.

I’m interested to see what the FBI report says. The FBI is not always right, to begin with. One of the biggest scandals and corruption cases in Massachusetts history involved the Boston FBI and their handling of Whitey Bulger, who they basically allowed to murder multiple people while he was an informant for them.

I’m curious to see their report on John and the allegations he wasn’t hit by a car. John didn’t have the classic impact injuries of being hit full on by a vehicle, but his injuries are consistent with having been knocked down and hitting his head hard on the ground which caused fracturing, black eyes, brain bleed leading to death with complication of hypothermia. His injuries apart from the arm are not dissimilar to how Bob Saget died from hitting his head likely on a table or the marble floor of his hotel bathroom, they lying down and slowly dying.

John’s arm injuries could have been from the broken cocktail glass. They are most definitely NOT in any way related to a dog - I have seen far too many dog attack/mauling photos in my career and those injuries were not remotely akin to dog bites or even scratches. Also there was no canine DNA, although the defense would have you believe that either the lab is in on the coverup or they just didn’t get the right samples.

The defense in this case is very skilled, she is getting her money’s worth. It’s also a slimy immoral defense that reminds me why I quit the criminal law business altogether.


I grew up in Mansfield and Norton and have family in the area who I visited often. In 58 years, I've never heard of "the south coast."


You must not be a very observant person, poster. You can throw a rock and hit the south coast from Mansfield and Norton. The south coast is directly adjacent to the south shore which includes Norfolk county which is trying this case against Karen Read.

Are you a Karen Read supporter also? It would explain a lot.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:There is no "there" there with the CW's case. We are 17 (18?) days in, no manner of death, and Jen McCabe is brainwashing the minor children to commit purjery.

As a Norfolk County taxpayer, I am disgusted with the CW.


I love that people from Norfolk County are on DCUM! I miss it there.
Anonymous
She is either innocent, or there are a lot of total coincidences making other people look guilty.

First, there is no way in hell that three different people that were in that house butt dialed each other 8 times (at least 7 of which did not go to voicemail) with passcode protected iPhones over two hours that night. I’m extremely gullible and always believe people but I don’t believe that. If they are lying about that, why?

It’s a coincidence that the video is missing from the library during the exact time she would have driven by with a broken or not taillight? And the video from the sallyport is also missing at the exact time her car was in police custody? And the Ring video of her coming home is nowhere to be found but she had no access to John’s ring (it was only on his phone, which was with him)?

Total coincidence that the dog was rehomed, the two phones were rehomed, and the basement floor was rehomed?

The “how long to die in the cold” Google search at 2:27am by someone in the house?

The belt that was visible on John at the bar was never found. Did that vaporize in the blizzard?

He has zero injuries on his torso or below his shoulders, other than the scratches on his forearm. That sounds more like a fight than he got hit by a car.

Is there a chance she hit him? Sure. Is it the most likely scenario. Not in my opinion. And I didn’t even touch on the terrible police work!!!!
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Wow, fascinating. Care to share more about what shapes your opinion? Can you point to specific evidence?

Any good summaries?

Was nobody in and out of the house from the time he was allegedly hit?

What about all the deleted texts, disposed phones?

Scrapped up knuckles on the nephew?

The wounds on Okeefe’s arm?


What shapes my opinion:

Lifelong fascination with an following true crime.

Decades of experience in the criminal justice system, including much of that time in smaller cities and towns and thus extensive familiarity with the bumbling mistakes of small town cops in collection of evidence, etc.

Having handled over a thousand DUI cases - sadly - and hundreds of domestic violence cases as a criminal lawyer, and hundreds more as a DV advocate before that.

More than five decades as a keen observer of the human condition.

More to the specifics you asked:

There were no scraped knuckles on the nephew just days after O’Keefe died - social media pictures show him with undamaged hands in multiple photos. Defense presented a photo from a month later which depicts him with scraped knuckles and he explained how it happened in his testimony. The throwing of that young man under a bus is particularly sickening to me.

Scrapes on John’s arm are consistent with contact with glass, sharp plastic or metal as in from the underside of a vehicle. A broken cocktail glass and broken taillight pieces were found by his body.

I suspect that there was stuff on Brian Albert’s and Brian Higgins’s phones that they didn’t want the world to see - but I don’t believe those things had anything whatsoever to do with the death of John O’Keefe. It will be heartbreaking if their missteps get Karen Read acquitted for killing a decent man who was raising his orphaned niece and nephew.

Yes, people were in and out of the house after the time John O’Keefe was struck and laying on the edge of the lawn. I’m surprised by the people who express shock that nobody would have seen him laying there - anyone who is familiar with suburbs on the south coast, the limited lighting in most such neighborhoods, and the fact that on the night in question it was very dark because of snowy cloud cover - how often are you looking in the darkest corners at the edge of someone’s yard as you pull away on a dark snowy night with poor driving conditions? Never, I’m sure. People are thinking about that aspect as Monday morning quarterbacks.

Listen, I’ve met some really really really dumb cops in my time. Never have I met one dumb enough to dump a body on his own front lawn and cross his fingers and hope that a frantic still drunk girlfriend will show up at the crack of dawn hollering about how she must’ve hit him. It’s really a ludicrous defense theory if you think about it dispassionately.

The thing is, people are not dispassionate about cops - they never have been, but since the George Floyd reckoning, some people are ever more suspicious and inflamed. Massachusetts has had her fair share of cop corruption cases so many are quick to believe it. But the notion that all the people the defense is alleging are in on a conspiracy could actually be and keep it quiet- it really is laughable, or would be if this trial wasn’t putting the O’Keefe family and so many other innocent people through life changing hell.

I’m interested to see what the FBI report says. The FBI is not always right, to begin with. One of the biggest scandals and corruption cases in Massachusetts history involved the Boston FBI and their handling of Whitey Bulger, who they basically allowed to murder multiple people while he was an informant for them.

I’m curious to see their report on John and the allegations he wasn’t hit by a car. John didn’t have the classic impact injuries of being hit full on by a vehicle, but his injuries are consistent with having been knocked down and hitting his head hard on the ground which caused fracturing, black eyes, brain bleed leading to death with complication of hypothermia. His injuries apart from the arm are not dissimilar to how Bob Saget died from hitting his head likely on a table or the marble floor of his hotel bathroom, they lying down and slowly dying.

John’s arm injuries could have been from the broken cocktail glass. They are most definitely NOT in any way related to a dog - I have seen far too many dog attack/mauling photos in my career and those injuries were not remotely akin to dog bites or even scratches. Also there was no canine DNA, although the defense would have you believe that either the lab is in on the coverup or they just didn’t get the right samples.

The defense in this case is very skilled, she is getting her money’s worth. It’s also a slimy immoral defense that reminds me why I quit the criminal law business altogether.


I grew up in Mansfield and Norton and have family in the area who I visited often. In 58 years, I've never heard of "the south coast."


You must not be a very observant person, poster. You can throw a rock and hit the south coast from Mansfield and Norton. The south coast is directly adjacent to the south shore which includes Norfolk county which is trying this case against Karen Read.

Are you a Karen Read supporter also? It would explain a lot.


Ah, I get it now:

The "South Coast" label was born as a public relations effort to counteract the perceived stigma of former terms like "Greater Fall River," "Greater New Bedford," or "New Bedford-Fall River," which conjured images, in many Massachusetts residents' minds, of depressed mill towns with run-down buildings and high unemployment. Local boosters, including The Standard-Times newspaper, began using the term in the mid-1990s in an effort to attract business to an area with "the Cape's climate," "better infrastructure" and "relatively low land prices," according to Standard-Times publisher William Kennedy.

Being lumped in with Fall River wouldn't make the Mansfield boosters very happy lol.
Anonymous
Curious how people think things are going this week - such a wild trial. I have been busy so not up to date. What's the mood right now?
Anonymous
it's not over yet?

it's not that complicated... she ran him over and noone involved has an credibility so it's a teensy bit a mystery, but no, she ran him over
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:it's not over yet?

it's not that complicated... she ran him over and noone involved has an credibility so it's a teensy bit a mystery, but no, she ran him over


There is definitely enough reasonable doubt. And Proctor should be fired and lose his pension. What a pos that guy is.
Anonymous
I’ll wait for the movie.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:Curious how people think things are going this week - such a wild trial. I have been busy so not up to date. What's the mood right now?


After yesterday’s testimony there’s no chance she’s found guilty. The testimony was appalling from a professional and moral perspective.

Until we get into the evidence from the medical examiner, I’m not willing to say if she did or didn’t have anything to do with it. But after yesterday I’d say it’s pretty clear the lead investigator gave ZERO efforts into closing out other possibilities and focused solely and completely on one person he has extreme bias against.

Curious what pp who was the prosecutor, defense attorney thinks after yesterday’s testimony.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:I’ll wait for the movie.


I’d only watch it if they can get good Boston accents.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Curious how people think things are going this week - such a wild trial. I have been busy so not up to date. What's the mood right now?


After yesterday’s testimony there’s no chance she’s found guilty. The testimony was appalling from a professional and moral perspective.

Until we get into the evidence from the medical examiner, I’m not willing to say if she did or didn’t have anything to do with it. But after yesterday I’d say it’s pretty clear the lead investigator gave ZERO efforts into closing out other possibilities and focused solely and completely on one person he has extreme bias against.

Curious what pp who was the prosecutor, defense attorney thinks after yesterday’s testimony.


i mean, she did it.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Curious how people think things are going this week - such a wild trial. I have been busy so not up to date. What's the mood right now?


After yesterday’s testimony there’s no chance she’s found guilty. The testimony was appalling from a professional and moral perspective.

Until we get into the evidence from the medical examiner, I’m not willing to say if she did or didn’t have anything to do with it. But after yesterday I’d say it’s pretty clear the lead investigator gave ZERO efforts into closing out other possibilities and focused solely and completely on one person he has extreme bias against.

Curious what pp who was the prosecutor, defense attorney thinks after yesterday’s testimony.


DP. I'd like to know what the PP thinks now too.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Curious how people think things are going this week - such a wild trial. I have been busy so not up to date. What's the mood right now?


After yesterday’s testimony there’s no chance she’s found guilty. The testimony was appalling from a professional and moral perspective.

Until we get into the evidence from the medical examiner, I’m not willing to say if she did or didn’t have anything to do with it. But after yesterday I’d say it’s pretty clear the lead investigator gave ZERO efforts into closing out other possibilities and focused solely and completely on one person he has extreme bias against.

Curious what pp who was the prosecutor, defense attorney thinks after yesterday’s testimony.


i mean, she did it.


Possibly. But I wouldn’t vote to convict her. But I’d sure as heck vote to fire Proctor and strip him of his pension
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Curious how people think things are going this week - such a wild trial. I have been busy so not up to date. What's the mood right now?


After yesterday’s testimony there’s no chance she’s found guilty. The testimony was appalling from a professional and moral perspective.

Until we get into the evidence from the medical examiner, I’m not willing to say if she did or didn’t have anything to do with it. But after yesterday I’d say it’s pretty clear the lead investigator gave ZERO efforts into closing out other possibilities and focused solely and completely on one person he has extreme bias against.

Curious what pp who was the prosecutor, defense attorney thinks after yesterday’s testimony.


i mean, she did it.


Possibly. But I wouldn’t vote to convict her. But I’d sure as heck vote to fire Proctor and strip him of his pension


I mean, I think they should all be shoved off a boat somewhere in the North Atlantic, but she did it.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Curious how people think things are going this week - such a wild trial. I have been busy so not up to date. What's the mood right now?


After yesterday’s testimony there’s no chance she’s found guilty. The testimony was appalling from a professional and moral perspective.

Until we get into the evidence from the medical examiner, I’m not willing to say if she did or didn’t have anything to do with it. But after yesterday I’d say it’s pretty clear the lead investigator gave ZERO efforts into closing out other possibilities and focused solely and completely on one person he has extreme bias against.

Curious what pp who was the prosecutor, defense attorney thinks after yesterday’s testimony.


i mean, she did it.


Possibly. But I wouldn’t vote to convict her. But I’d sure as heck vote to fire Proctor and strip him of his pension


I mean, I think they should all be shoved off a boat somewhere in the North Atlantic, but she did it.


Really, you think she did it? I think there is no way she did it.
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