How would you advise sister in this situation?

[Anonymous]

I know this ship has sailed for your sister but I’m saying this for other women in similar situations who may be reading this. But it is *really* bad idea to have 3 kids with a spouse like that. Having a large family to fill an emotional void for one parent is being so thoughtless of those kids. This situation would be much easier to manage with one kid.

In any case, for your sister, I think continuing to be supportive, listen and asking open-ended questions is the way to go. If you tell her she should leave her DH, then she’ll switch to defending him and defending her decision so far to stay with him.

So examples of open-ended questions to use (and never use “why” questions - those provoke a defensive posture).

This situation continues to sound really difficult for you.

What can I do to help? Do you want to vent to me or do you need me to do something else?

I can’t help but notice that what you are telling me hasn’t changed much in the last few years. What happens if you continue to do nothing? What kind of path can you envision with him not changing and you staying with him? What would happiness for you and the kids look like if he doesn’t change?

I admire you so much for wanting to try to make your marriage work. What does “make it work” mean to you? [she answer something about him changing.]. What if he never changes? If he hasn’t made any changes yet, what gives you hope that he will make those changes now?

Etcx etc. I’m sure you can come up with more and better questions where you get *her* processing the real options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You clearly think you’re superior to everyone involved. That’s annoying.

Plus I don’t understand the need to drag the MIL into all of this. Based on your description of what’s going on, the problem is with the husband and the marriage - not the mother in law.

But considering you don’t see her very much it’s pretty obvious you don’t know the whole story. So stay out of her life. Listen, nod your head, then go back to your own glamorous life where you are just soooo much better than everyone you grew up with.

agree with the bolded

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I know this ship has sailed for your sister but I’m saying this for other women in similar situations who may be reading this. But it is *really* bad idea to have 3 kids with a spouse like that. Having a large family to fill an emotional void for one parent is being so thoughtless of those kids. This situation would be much easier to manage with one kid.

I'm not in the same situation. My situation is a little different, and we have separated, but honestly, as someone whose spouse developed psychosis* years after my youngest was born, being told over and over again that my kids shouldn't exist doesn't make me feel safer or more likely to accept advice or take a chance on leaving.

* In my case it was psychosis, but the same could be said for someone whose spouse developed an addiction, or a major mood disorder, or had a head injury, or a degenerative brain disorder.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You clearly think you’re superior to everyone involved. That’s annoying.

Plus I don’t understand the need to drag the MIL into all of this. Based on your description of what’s going on, the problem is with the husband and the marriage - not the mother in law.

But considering you don’t see her very much it’s pretty obvious you don’t know the whole story. So stay out of her life. Listen, nod your head, then go back to your own glamorous life where you are just soooo much better than everyone you grew up with.

agree with the bolded

Her MIL has already tried to begin winning kids over with snacks, candy, vacations etc. That's why. Setting up alliances and marginalizing the mom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You clearly think you’re superior to everyone involved. That’s annoying.

Plus I don’t understand the need to drag the MIL into all of this. Based on your description of what’s going on, the problem is with the husband and the marriage - not the mother in law.

But considering you don’t see her very much it’s pretty obvious you don’t know the whole story. So stay out of her life. Listen, nod your head, then go back to your own glamorous life where you are just soooo much better than everyone you grew up with.

agree with the bolded

Her MIL has already tried to begin winning kids over with snacks, candy, vacations etc. That's why. Setting up alliances and marginalizing the mom.

Grandma giving her kids snacks, and inviting them on vacations isn't "setting up alliances and marginalizing the mom". It's what Grandmas do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You clearly think you’re superior to everyone involved. That’s annoying.

Plus I don’t understand the need to drag the MIL into all of this. Based on your description of what’s going on, the problem is with the husband and the marriage - not the mother in law.

But considering you don’t see her very much it’s pretty obvious you don’t know the whole story. So stay out of her life. Listen, nod your head, then go back to your own glamorous life where you are just soooo much better than everyone you grew up with.

agree with the bolded

Her MIL has already tried to begin winning kids over with snacks, candy, vacations etc. That's why. Setting up alliances and marginalizing the mom.

Grandma giving her kids snacks, and inviting them on vacations isn't "setting up alliances and marginalizing the mom". It's what Grandmas do.

Cliche-style, her meddlesome mother-in-law lives a block away and is always coming by and fussing over her son.

[Anonymous]

Offer to pay for a consultation with the best divorce lawyer in town.

[Anonymous]

Do either of your parents still live in this small town?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You clearly think you’re superior to everyone involved. That’s annoying.

Plus I don’t understand the need to drag the MIL into all of this. Based on your description of what’s going on, the problem is with the husband and the marriage - not the mother in law.

But considering you don’t see her very much it’s pretty obvious you don’t know the whole story. So stay out of her life. Listen, nod your head, then go back to your own glamorous life where you are just soooo much better than everyone you grew up with.

agree with the bolded

Her MIL has already tried to begin winning kids over with snacks, candy, vacations etc. That's why. Setting up alliances and marginalizing the mom.

Grandma giving her kids snacks, and inviting them on vacations isn't "setting up alliances and marginalizing the mom". It's what Grandmas do.

Cliche-style, her meddlesome mother-in-law lives a block away and is always coming by and fussing over her son.

I have no idea what "cliche-style" is.

You are describing a very concerning situation, and then judging the people supporting this family for being concerned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Offer to pay for a consultation with the best divorce lawyer in town.

I'd do this even if it's not who she would hire so as to take that lawyer off the table for the husband.

[Anonymous]

The MIL question is hard - on the one hand, candy, gifts and vacations is what normal functioning grandparents do.

Frankly I think sister needs to build an alliance with grandma, not fight with grandma. Maybe it wouldn't last past the divorce, but getting grandma at least neutral or non-harmful would be a good thing if divorce happens. Kind of keeping her in the loop so she doesn't think if a divorce happens she'd be cut out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You clearly think you’re superior to everyone involved. That’s annoying.

Plus I don’t understand the need to drag the MIL into all of this. Based on your description of what’s going on, the problem is with the husband and the marriage - not the mother in law.

But considering you don’t see her very much it’s pretty obvious you don’t know the whole story. So stay out of her life. Listen, nod your head, then go back to your own glamorous life where you are just soooo much better than everyone you grew up with.

agree with the bolded

Her MIL has already tried to begin winning kids over with snacks, candy, vacations etc. That's why. Setting up alliances and marginalizing the mom.

Grandma giving her kids snacks, and inviting them on vacations isn't "setting up alliances and marginalizing the mom". It's what Grandmas do.

Cliche-style, her meddlesome mother-in-law lives a block away and is always coming by and fussing over her son.

Perhaps the MIL knows her son is a loser and is overcompensating. Those are her grandkids; of course, she's offering candy, snacks, and vacations. That's what grandparents do. I think it's unfair to vilify the MIL. She's employing her son and is involved and interested in her grandchildren.

[Anonymous]

OP it's great you both are close and you care and are supportive. I don't think you are qualified to give advice nor is anyone here. She needs to consult with a lawyer and if she didn't like the last therapist, try another. There are no easy solutions and this is an extremely complicated situation. I know the feeling of loving someone and wanting to help them "fix" their situation, but you cannot fix this. All you can do is be a buffer/safe place as she manages the stress. You can offer things like having the kids come visit, taking her out for something fun, listening if it isn't too much stress for you, offering to get her a gift card for something she enjoys, etc but you cannot rescue her from this or fix it. She has to figure this out with the help of trained professionals.

[Anonymous]

Well, you can't live her life for her, or make decisions for her, or change her mind. Things you can do:
- listen
- focus on things like money, security, safety -does she have a separate bank account into which she can start accumulating fund. Is there a way she can increase her earning potential? Is there a way to capitalize on the MIL's engagement. (Child coverage - even if paired w/ spoiling - could free your sister up for finishing a degree or getting a certification or working more hours...)

If she wants to stay (or is unable to make a change) then how can she better strengthen her position and protect her kids? Focus on those conversations...

[Anonymous]

Here is what you do:
Make this the best vacation she has ever had. What does her DH hate doing? Do all of it. Make sure she is blissfully enjoying every moment away from him.
All you can do is make her see how great her life is when he isn't there.