Last minute plan B if schools don’t open?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't have a plan b. I didn't really have one last year, either. It is a real mark of privilege to just be able to pull a backup education and childcare option out of your back pocket at the last minute.

And that's why, if they close schools again (I mean widespread closures, not limited quarantines which I expect at this point), my Plan B is to protest the hell out of it. The only other real alternative for my family would be to move, but obviously that's not an easy proposition for us or we would have done it already. But at this point, I have less to lose by protesting and putting up a big fight than doing anything else. I already know what a year of DL means for my kid and our family, what it means for me, personally. It's not like last year when I thought I could tough it out, or I believed we were doing something important to help others (ha!). Now I know what it is.

So Plan B is showing up at Central Office every day with a megaphone until they do something about this.

I’m be filing a lawsuit. Watch this space!

Watch for the lawsuit I'm be filing if my healthy unvac'ed kid gets covid at mandatory in-person elementary school!

you can keep your kid home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

As a teacher, I’m 100% confident that we will be in person. I just finished DCs leadership academy this week and they have every indication of business as usual 8/30
If I was a parent I’d be real worried that there are no quarantine policies for concurrent teaching. Last year it was easier when we had to shut down bc students were used to virtual learning, and a lot of teachers already had created in person lessons that could be accessible virtually. I’m not sure how that’s all going to work this year. When we ask Dcps we get nothing

Great job, everyone. The political pressure you've applied have scared DCPS away from having any contingency plans. Because so many of you have screamed bloody murder that the schools better not be planning for anything less than 100% attendance, full day, 5 days a way -- no matter what the metrics may actually look during the school year.

More than 16,600 children had been hospitalized with the coronavirus thus far, and schools haven't started back up yet. Kids are on ventilators. For the idiots who think "Delta doesn't make kids more ill," it does make MORE kids ill, and so there will be a lot more kids who will be severely ill.

But your tantrums have resulted in there being no backup plan, so kids will be in school until Delta is already spreading like wildfire because there's nothing to fall back on.

Yes, I want kids to remain in school as long as possible. I have a kid who is high risk, and I haven't requested a virtual waiver because their ADHD makes it impossible for them to access virtual learning. I full expect that we will have to pull our kid our early because the pigheadedness that has resulted in no backup plan.

So thanks a lot for making it impossible for schools to take action before someone's kid -- maybe your own, maybe mine -- has to pay the price.

+1
And as of yesterday's news, apparently, not just more kids ill, but kids more ill, as they've now established that delta causes more severe illness.

Please cite the link for delta causing more severe illness in children.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/07/29/cdc-mask-guidance/
More severe illness. It doesn't specify 'in children', it just implies 'in humans,' which children are.

and yet, UK and Netherlands did not see an epidemic of child covid deaths.

Long-term sequelae are what we are worried about with kid covid.
Think, polio.

But there's no way to get evidence on whether there is a long-term effect of covid for kids without just waiting years and years. Do you plan to keep kids out of school until we know what happened to the ones who have already gotten covid?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

As a teacher, I’m 100% confident that we will be in person. I just finished DCs leadership academy this week and they have every indication of business as usual 8/30
If I was a parent I’d be real worried that there are no quarantine policies for concurrent teaching. Last year it was easier when we had to shut down bc students were used to virtual learning, and a lot of teachers already had created in person lessons that could be accessible virtually. I’m not sure how that’s all going to work this year. When we ask Dcps we get nothing

Great job, everyone. The political pressure you've applied have scared DCPS away from having any contingency plans. Because so many of you have screamed bloody murder that the schools better not be planning for anything less than 100% attendance, full day, 5 days a way -- no matter what the metrics may actually look during the school year.

More than 16,600 children had been hospitalized with the coronavirus thus far, and schools haven't started back up yet. Kids are on ventilators. For the idiots who think "Delta doesn't make kids more ill," it does make MORE kids ill, and so there will be a lot more kids who will be severely ill.

But your tantrums have resulted in there being no backup plan, so kids will be in school until Delta is already spreading like wildfire because there's nothing to fall back on.

Yes, I want kids to remain in school as long as possible. I have a kid who is high risk, and I haven't requested a virtual waiver because their ADHD makes it impossible for them to access virtual learning. I full expect that we will have to pull our kid our early because the pigheadedness that has resulted in no backup plan.

So thanks a lot for making it impossible for schools to take action before someone's kid -- maybe your own, maybe mine -- has to pay the price.

+1
And as of yesterday's news, apparently, not just more kids ill, but kids more ill, as they've now established that delta causes more severe illness.

Please cite the link for delta causing more severe illness in children.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/07/29/cdc-mask-guidance/
More severe illness. It doesn't specify 'in children', it just implies 'in humans,' which children are.

and yet, UK and Netherlands did not see an epidemic of child covid deaths.

Long-term sequelae are what we are worried about with kid covid.
Think, polio.

I’m amazed that more people—particularly public health experts—haven’t made this connection. The death rate from polio among children was .05%; rate of severe effects (paralysis) was 1%. 70% of cases were asymptomatic. Not so different from COVID-19!

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/polio.html

Yeah, why aren’t public health officials drawing parallels to a disease THAT IS ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE MORE SEVERE TO KIDS????? Do you geniuses know how decimal places work? Or do your tiny lizard brains just lump together all numbers less than 1 as the same?

Not orders of magnitude, actually: https://services.aap.org/en/pages/2019-novel-coronavirus-covid-19-infections/children-and-covid-19-state-level-data-report/

Death rate from polio is higher (.05% vs. 0% to .03%, depending state), but not by orders of magnitude. There’s no equivalent data point for long-term effects for COVID-19 (since we’re still pretty early in the game), but the hospitalization rate was as high as 1.9% in some states. And this article suggests that long COVID could be a thing in kids, too: https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01935-7.

but the argument people are trying to make is that there’s some kind of mysterious “long covid” that can stem from mild or asymptomatic cases. that is nothing like polio - pretty sure everyone knew when the kid got paralyzed.

there’s zero indication that covid is similar to polio for kids. stop fearmongering.

Yes, there is so kind of mysterious long covid that can stem from milk or asymptomatic covid case.
The vast majority of polio cases were asymptomatic. A small number caused lifelong disability.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Yes, there is so kind of mysterious long covid that can stem from milk or asymptomatic covid case.
The vast majority of polio cases were asymptomatic. A small number caused lifelong disability.

*some *mild
Will walk away from keyboard now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everybody has to get it at some point, get the vaccine. I’m a single mom I had to move my ex in to help with the kids as I am an essential employee. Staying at home was terrible for my kids and now my ex want to work things out. For the love of god I can’t take another year of this. When I was in college a good friend got chicken pox as an adult bc his parents were antivax. He was hospitalized for months, things like this are so preventable.

How old are you? The chicken pox vaccine was approved in 1995.
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads/varicella.pdf

Just because it was approved in 1995 doesn’t mean people who were adults then got it. I was 21 in 1995, didn’t have chicken pox as a kid, and only learned about and got the vaccine a few years later because I did proactive research after a friend got chicken pox as an adult.

There was no big campaign to get all of the adults who never had chicken pox vaccinated. I suspect a lot of people who were in their 20s or older when the vaccine came out never got it.

This is what I meant. PP's friend would have to be very young for the non-vac'ed status to be due to anti-vac parents.

I don’t get why PP is referring to PPP as a liar. I was born in 1987 and I also had classmates that were not vaccinated as was their parents choice. Does one have to 50+ to post on this forum?

I asked for the age, but didn't call them a liar. I thought that depending on their age it was perfectly possible that the friend just hadn't received the vaccine as a child because it didn't exist and not because of anti-vac parents. But you're right, you'd have to be middle-aged - I did the research but not the math before asking.

Correct. I was referring to the immediate response after yours. The PP that said, “ When you are lying it’s hard to keep the dates straight.”

[Anonymous]

Have the countries that have seen delta already seen large increases in children's "long covid"?

Also, isn't long covid largely just feeling periodically shitty for three months? My understanding is there's no definition, and there's some research that found that kids who had tested positive for covid had the same rates of feeling periodically shitty as the kids who didn't test positive for covid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Yes, there is so kind of mysterious long covid that can stem from milk or asymptomatic covid case.
The vast majority of polio cases were asymptomatic. A small number caused lifelong disability.

*some *mild
Will walk away from keyboard now.

lol

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't have a plan b. I didn't really have one last year, either. It is a real mark of privilege to just be able to pull a backup education and childcare option out of your back pocket at the last minute.

And that's why, if they close schools again (I mean widespread closures, not limited quarantines which I expect at this point), my Plan B is to protest the hell out of it. The only other real alternative for my family would be to move, but obviously that's not an easy proposition for us or we would have done it already. But at this point, I have less to lose by protesting and putting up a big fight than doing anything else. I already know what a year of DL means for my kid and our family, what it means for me, personally. It's not like last year when I thought I could tough it out, or I believed we were doing something important to help others (ha!). Now I know what it is.

So Plan B is showing up at Central Office every day with a megaphone until they do something about this.

I’m be filing a lawsuit. Watch this space!

I will join it. Especially if once again my kid is expected to stay home while public school kids throughout the city are welcomed back to classrooms simply because their schools are larger or better resourced. I mean, equity is their favorite word when they want to deny things to kids and yet somehow nowhere to be found when kids across the city went back to school in Term 4 but almost no children at our Title 1 school were offered IPL or even CARES classroom slots.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

As a teacher, I’m 100% confident that we will be in person. I just finished DCs leadership academy this week and they have every indication of business as usual 8/30
If I was a parent I’d be real worried that there are no quarantine policies for concurrent teaching. Last year it was easier when we had to shut down bc students were used to virtual learning, and a lot of teachers already had created in person lessons that could be accessible virtually. I’m not sure how that’s all going to work this year. When we ask Dcps we get nothing

Great job, everyone. The political pressure you've applied have scared DCPS away from having any contingency plans. Because so many of you have screamed bloody murder that the schools better not be planning for anything less than 100% attendance, full day, 5 days a way -- no matter what the metrics may actually look during the school year.

More than 16,600 children had been hospitalized with the coronavirus thus far, and schools haven't started back up yet. Kids are on ventilators. For the idiots who think "Delta doesn't make kids more ill," it does make MORE kids ill, and so there will be a lot more kids who will be severely ill.

But your tantrums have resulted in there being no backup plan, so kids will be in school until Delta is already spreading like wildfire because there's nothing to fall back on.

Yes, I want kids to remain in school as long as possible. I have a kid who is high risk, and I haven't requested a virtual waiver because their ADHD makes it impossible for them to access virtual learning. I full expect that we will have to pull our kid our early because the pigheadedness that has resulted in no backup plan.

So thanks a lot for making it impossible for schools to take action before someone's kid -- maybe your own, maybe mine -- has to pay the price.

+1
And as of yesterday's news, apparently, not just more kids ill, but kids more ill, as they've now established that delta causes more severe illness.

Please cite the link for delta causing more severe illness in children.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/07/29/cdc-mask-guidance/
More severe illness. It doesn't specify 'in children', it just implies 'in humans,' which children are.

and yet, UK and Netherlands did not see an epidemic of child covid deaths.

Long-term sequelae are what we are worried about with kid covid.
Think, polio.

I’m amazed that more people—particularly public health experts—haven’t made this connection. The death rate from polio among children was .05%; rate of severe effects (paralysis) was 1%. 70% of cases were asymptomatic. Not so different from COVID-19!

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/polio.html

Yeah, why aren’t public health officials drawing parallels to a disease THAT IS ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE MORE SEVERE TO KIDS????? Do you geniuses know how decimal places work? Or do your tiny lizard brains just lump together all numbers less than 1 as the same?

Not orders of magnitude, actually: https://services.aap.org/en/pages/2019-novel-coronavirus-covid-19-infections/children-and-covid-19-state-level-data-report/

Death rate from polio is higher (.05% vs. 0% to .03%, depending state), but not by orders of magnitude. There’s no equivalent data point for long-term effects for COVID-19 (since we’re still pretty early in the game), but the hospitalization rate was as high as 1.9% in some states. And this article suggests that long COVID could be a thing in kids, too: https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01935-7.

but the argument people are trying to make is that there’s some kind of mysterious “long covid” that can stem from mild or asymptomatic cases. that is nothing like polio - pretty sure everyone knew when the kid got paralyzed.

there’s zero indication that covid is similar to polio for kids. stop fearmongering.

Yes, there is so kind of mysterious long covid that can stem from milk or asymptomatic covid case.
The vast majority of polio cases were asymptomatic. A small number caused lifelong disability.

no, there is not evidence of a crippling “long covid” that strikes kids after asymptomatic or mild cases.

and post-polio syndrome stemmed from severe polio, not asymptomatic polio.

you’re trying to make people scared that asymptomatic or mild covid is more dangerous than it is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sooo... there is nothing that says that the increased virulence is magically restricted to adults.

Remember when we were reading that children could magically never be infected? Or be ill? Or when we read that they magically never could transmit?

This poor NYTimes article came out many long long hours before the WaPo game-changing article on CDC's new understanding of the pandemic.

No, no one said that children couldn't be infected or be ill or transmit. Yes, it is still true that children are less likely to get, be ill from, and (probably) transmit alpha covid.

Yes, delta is being shown to be more transmissible, and that is true for children, as reflected in the articles cited above.

No, you haven't seen anything that says that delta is worse than alpha for kids who contract it.

Yes, there are more cases of delta in children than alpha, because it is more transmissible. Yes, that means that the overall number of kids who get sick from covid (delta) will be higher.

Why don't we....idk....wait for data before losing our minds?

Ohh, you're *that* kind of guy.
The kind that denies the prior batch of untrue placating bullshit, feeds a new fresh heaping, and when that doesn't work, suggests we wait before losing our minds.

DP. Nobody except the dumbest Trumpers ever said that kids "magically" could not be infected, get ill, or transmit. Maybe there were some posters of that ilk here on DCUM as well, but why do you think the PP was among them? That's quite an assumption on an anonymous forum. What sane people here and elsewhere have been emphasizing all along is what you can read in the PP's follow up post - that kids are very unlikely to get severely ill (still true with delta), and less likely than adults to get infected and transmit (probably still true with delta, but maybe less so).

You do sound panicked though, so any nuance in arguments may just have gotten scrambled in your mind.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you enroll your kids and the local rates spike,.will they be truant if you keep them out until they subside? I don't care if they have DL in place or what. At some rate of community infection (like DC last fall) I'm not going to be comfy with my unvaccinated kid iN person learning. i personally don't want my kid catching delta. Yes, less harmful yadda yadda. But for some kids it's equally harmful and we do not know the long term effects..I'm personally convinced it's a made , biological weapon best to be avoided including by children (( it's a super weird virus..if it's from the cold family, it's the cold.from war of the worlds IMO.

Oh wow, you believe that Tom Cotton conspiracy theory?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't have a plan b. I didn't really have one last year, either. It is a real mark of privilege to just be able to pull a backup education and childcare option out of your back pocket at the last minute.

And that's why, if they close schools again (I mean widespread closures, not limited quarantines which I expect at this point), my Plan B is to protest the hell out of it. The only other real alternative for my family would be to move, but obviously that's not an easy proposition for us or we would have done it already. But at this point, I have less to lose by protesting and putting up a big fight than doing anything else. I already know what a year of DL means for my kid and our family, what it means for me, personally. It's not like last year when I thought I could tough it out, or I believed we were doing something important to help others (ha!). Now I know what it is.

So Plan B is showing up at Central Office every day with a megaphone until they do something about this.

I’m be filing a lawsuit. Watch this space!

I'm sure it'll be about as successful as all the other lawsuits people on DCUM talked about filing last year when the schools closed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't have a plan b. I didn't really have one last year, either. It is a real mark of privilege to just be able to pull a backup education and childcare option out of your back pocket at the last minute.

And that's why, if they close schools again (I mean widespread closures, not limited quarantines which I expect at this point), my Plan B is to protest the hell out of it. The only other real alternative for my family would be to move, but obviously that's not an easy proposition for us or we would have done it already. But at this point, I have less to lose by protesting and putting up a big fight than doing anything else. I already know what a year of DL means for my kid and our family, what it means for me, personally. It's not like last year when I thought I could tough it out, or I believed we were doing something important to help others (ha!). Now I know what it is.

So Plan B is showing up at Central Office every day with a megaphone until they do something about this.

I’m be filing a lawsuit. Watch this space!

I will join it. Especially if once again my kid is expected to stay home while public school kids throughout the city are welcomed back to classrooms simply because their schools are larger or better resourced. I mean, equity is their favorite word when they want to deny things to kids and yet somehow nowhere to be found when kids across the city went back to school in Term 4 but almost no children at our Title 1 school were offered IPL or even CARES classroom slots.

I’m totally serious - I will be posting a gmail address here if schools close to collect plaintiffs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Yes, there is so kind of mysterious long covid that can stem from milk or asymptomatic covid case.
The vast majority of polio cases were asymptomatic. A small number caused lifelong disability.

*some *mild
Will walk away from keyboard now.

lol

I thought the PP was being sarcastic until they corrected themselves.

And the mild or asymptomatic cases of polio were not the ones that caused lifelong disability. This comparison is absurd and the people who wonder why "public health experts" haven't made this comparison are as unhinged as the people who think they have done enough "research" to know that vaccines cause autism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sooo... there is nothing that says that the increased virulence is magically restricted to adults.

Remember when we were reading that children could magically never be infected? Or be ill? Or when we read that they magically never could transmit?

This poor NYTimes article came out many long long hours before the WaPo game-changing article on CDC's new understanding of the pandemic.

No, no one said that children couldn't be infected or be ill or transmit. Yes, it is still true that children are less likely to get, be ill from, and (probably) transmit alpha covid.

Yes, delta is being shown to be more transmissible, and that is true for children, as reflected in the articles cited above.

No, you haven't seen anything that says that delta is worse than alpha for kids who contract it.

Yes, there are more cases of delta in children than alpha, because it is more transmissible. Yes, that means that the overall number of kids who get sick from covid (delta) will be higher.

Why don't we....idk....wait for data before losing our minds?

Ohh, you're *that* kind of guy.
The kind that denies the prior batch of untrue placating bullshit, feeds a new fresh heaping, and when that doesn't work, suggests we wait before losing our minds.

DP. Nobody except the dumbest Trumpers ever said that kids "magically" could not be infected, get ill, or transmit. Maybe there were some posters of that ilk here on DCUM as well, but why do you think the PP was among them? That's quite an assumption on an anonymous forum. What sane people here and elsewhere have been emphasizing all along is what you can read in the PP's follow up post - that kids are very unlikely to get severely ill (still true with delta), and less likely than adults to get infected and transmit (probably still true with delta, but maybe less so).

You do sound panicked though, so any nuance in arguments may just have gotten scrambled in your mind.

Just like a year from now you might say "Nobody except the dumbest Trumpers ever said that long-covid didn't exist in children." What many are saying on here amounts to the same thing though. They're saying that it's largely hypothetical, and so rare it should be irrelevant to parenting decisions and policy decisions.