UCs forbidden to use SAT and ACT in admissions by court

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:SAT thresholds have always been uneven by race. Asian-Americans are full 200-300 points above Blacks and 100-150 points above Whites. I am glad that it is being removed. What equity? My Asian-American kids with perfect GPAs, with toughest course loads and with near perfect SATs and with parents who have saved for college all their lives seems like that they have been always ready for pandemic, civil unrest, racism and global warming. When you are given nothing and your hard earned things are snatched away from you - you become the students no one can subjugate.

Think of it this way, it's one less thing your kid has to worry about. High achieving kids will stand out in other ways. I wouldn't worry about the no SAT thing. My kid still has plenty of tests that will need to be taken, like IB/AP, which, IMO, are harder than SATs.

-signed another Asian American mom

I agree. High achieving students will always do well. They carry with them grit, intelligence, commitment, and a solid foundation in their education. Even if they don’t go to their first choice college, they will likely do well in whatever field they go into. You can’t take that away.

I agree. Work-ethic will always help a student.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:AP Scores are even more correlated with wealth IME than SATs. Why not attack the LSAT, MCAT, PARCC, PSAT, DAT, GRE?
I don’t get the test-haters!

bumping this - those who are anti sat/act...have they answered this?

If anything sat/act track weath less than AP/IB!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:50% of American high schoolers ha r straight As.

DCPS is only giving As and Bs this year. They dropped Cs and below from the grading scale entirely.

This is going to make very student even.

If this is true, this is the most idiotic thing I have ever heard. It's no wonder our country is going down the toilet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AP Scores are even more correlated with wealth IME than SATs. Why not attack the LSAT, MCAT, PARCC, PSAT, DAT, GRE?
I don’t get the test-haters!

bumping this - those who are anti sat/act...have they answered this?

If anything sat/act track weath less than AP/IB!

How so? You can prep for both. With AP/IB at least you are studying the material in class. Not so with SATs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AP Scores are even more correlated with wealth IME than SATs. Why not attack the LSAT, MCAT, PARCC, PSAT, DAT, GRE?
I don’t get the test-haters!

bumping this - those who are anti sat/act...have they answered this?

If anything sat/act track weath less than AP/IB!

PSAT is meaningless except for NMSF, so no one will argue those either way.

PARCC testing everyone hates for well established reasons.

Most others are Grad school tests and not comparable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:SAT thresholds have always been uneven by race. Asian-Americans are full 200-300 points above Blacks and 100-150 points above Whites. I am glad that it is being removed. What equity? My Asian-American kids with perfect GPAs, with toughest course loads and with near perfect SATs and with parents who have saved for college all their lives seems like that they have been always ready for pandemic, civil unrest, racism and global warming. When you are given nothing and your hard earned things are snatched away from you - you become the students no one can subjugate.

Unfortunately, it's not just higher SAT scores. Asian applicants still lose out to blacks even with 300 more points and lose out to whites even with 150 more points in college admissions to top schools. Sad but true.

Qualify this please. To certain top schools, but not where Asians are URMs.

most schools where Asians are URM are not as sought after. Look at the schools that are considered "elite". Then look at the demographics of those schools.

Nobody cares about what nonelite schools do because it's already easier to get into those schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:50% of American high schoolers ha r straight As.

DCPS is only giving As and Bs this year. They dropped Cs and below from the grading scale entirely.

This is going to make very student even.

If this is true, this is the most idiotic thing I have ever heard. It's no wonder our country is going down the toilet.

Really? That's the reason? HS grading policies during a pandemic?

For the record, I also disagree with the grading policy if this is true, I just dislike your hyperbole as it is not helpful in any way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:SAT thresholds have always been uneven by race. Asian-Americans are full 200-300 points above Blacks and 100-150 points above Whites. I am glad that it is being removed. What equity? My Asian-American kids with perfect GPAs, with toughest course loads and with near perfect SATs and with parents who have saved for college all their lives seems like that they have been always ready for pandemic, civil unrest, racism and global warming. When you are given nothing and your hard earned things are snatched away from you - you become the students no one can subjugate.

Unfortunately, it's not just higher SAT scores. Asian applicants still lose out to blacks even with 300 more points and lose out to whites even with 150 more points in college admissions to top schools. Sad but true.

Qualify this please. To certain top schools, but not where Asians are URMs.

most schools where Asians are URM are not as sought after. Look at the schools that are considered "elite". Then look at the demographics of those schools.

Nobody cares about what nonelite schools do because it's already easier to get into those schools.

Nobody cares about the NESCACS? Or other elite LACs? Or Colgate or Bucknell or Vanderbilt or Georgetown or Wake Forest or BC or Tluane etc etc etc? Sorry. Wrong. If they don't, they should.

Being Asian is a benefit or neutral at those colleges, and they all practice the same racial balance in admissions as HYP etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are tens of thousands of high school seniors that spent perhaps years studying and taking get classes to do well on the act and sat's. This really changes college admissions for middle class Californians who can't afford private college (donut hole families). I now live in CA and have an 8th grader. I can't afford private college so UC's are his only option. There is a specialized high school program in our city that is competitive and no guarantee of A's or our local high school that isn't as rigorous but I am told easier to get A's since most of the top students go to the specialized high school. Not sure what we will decide.

We are same. Middle class “donut hole” California family. All these changes are really worrying me. Plus on the November ballot there will be a prop to bring back affirmative action. We’re Asian so I really feel penalized.

I used to live in CA. CA has one of the most extensive higher ed systems in the country. UCs are by far not your "only option" even if you are restricted by finances to in state UC tuition.

--First of all, there is the whole Cal State system. Some of the Cal State schools are excellent; for Cal Poly San Luis Obispo is better than some of the UCs for some majors. With 25 cal state campuses in the state, there is a whole range of options at different levels of selectivity for a bachelors degree. And plenty of Cal State grads I have met have done very well in life. Definitely San Diego state and SF state have plenty of opportunities for internships in tech, and there is plenty of hiring from those campuses in silicon valley.
--There are 9 UC schools offering undergraduate degrees of varying degrees of selectivity. UC Riverside and UC Merced are not nearly as selective as the others. Again, I know plenty of UC Riverside grads who have done pretty well for themselves and you can get a fantastic education at either of those campuses.
--You can transfer into a UC after going to community college and are guaranteed a spot at UC with a certain GPA. I know plenty of people who took that route.

This is just public education in CA. Forget merit aid which will likely still exist going forward at privates or out of state universities that could bring the cost to the same or lower than a UC. Also the total cost of attendance at UC Berkeley (given the cost of housing) is effectively the same as out of state at places like the University of Alabama and other lower COL states (both around 40-45K).

It sounds like there are all kinds of options for your kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:50% of American high schoolers ha r straight As.

DCPS is only giving As and Bs this year. They dropped Cs and below from the grading scale entirely.

This is going to make very student even.

If this is true, this is the most idiotic thing I have ever heard. It's no wonder our country is going down the toilet.

Really? That's the reason? HS grading policies during a pandemic?

For the record, I also disagree with the grading policy if this is true, I just dislike your hyperbole as it is not helpful in any way.

Yes, really.

I have a hard time believing that this is actually true, but if it is - 50% of high schoolers have straight As?? There is NO WAY that 50% of this country's children are that smart. Sorry.

And, in that case, my hyperbole is meant to point out that this is symbolic of the culture we have created - everybody's great! everybody wins! everybody deserves what the other person has! - that is sending our country down the toilet.

Sorry if you don't think that is helpful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:SAT thresholds have always been uneven by race. Asian-Americans are full 200-300 points above Blacks and 100-150 points above Whites. I am glad that it is being removed. What equity? My Asian-American kids with perfect GPAs, with toughest course loads and with near perfect SATs and with parents who have saved for college all their lives seems like that they have been always ready for pandemic, civil unrest, racism and global warming. When you are given nothing and your hard earned things are snatched away from you - you become the students no one can subjugate.

Unfortunately, it's not just higher SAT scores. Asian applicants still lose out to blacks even with 300 more points and lose out to whites even with 150 more points in college admissions to top schools. Sad but true.

Qualify this please. To certain top schools, but not where Asians are URMs.

most schools where Asians are URM are not as sought after. Look at the schools that are considered "elite". Then look at the demographics of those schools.

Nobody cares about what nonelite schools do because it's already easier to get into those schools.

Nobody cares about the NESCACS? Or other elite LACs? Or Colgate or Bucknell or Vanderbilt or Georgetown or Wake Forest or BC or Tluane etc etc etc? Sorry. Wrong. If they don't, they should.

Being Asian is a benefit or neutral at those colleges, and they all practice the same racial balance in admissions as HYP etc.

no way are Asians URM at williams, amherest, wes, midd, bowdoin.

Swarthmore family here - they are def not URM at swat.

they used to be at vandy 15 years ago but not anymore.

i can't speak to colgate or bucknell.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AP Scores are even more correlated with wealth IME than SATs. Why not attack the LSAT, MCAT, PARCC, PSAT, DAT, GRE?
I don’t get the test-haters!

bumping this - those who are anti sat/act...have they answered this?

If anything sat/act track weath less than AP/IB!

How so? You can prep for both. With AP/IB at least you are studying the material in class. Not so with SATs.

NP. In California, a number of poor high schools offer few to zero APs. SAT prep is available free at Khan and doesn't take a whole year; a couple of months ought to do it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:50% of American high schoolers ha r straight As.

DCPS is only giving As and Bs this year. They dropped Cs and below from the grading scale entirely.

This is going to make very student even.

If this is true, this is the most idiotic thing I have ever heard. It's no wonder our country is going down the toilet.

Really? That's the reason? HS grading policies during a pandemic?

For the record, I also disagree with the grading policy if this is true, I just dislike your hyperbole as it is not helpful in any way.

Yes, really.

I have a hard time believing that this is actually true, but if it is - 50% of high schoolers have straight As?? There is NO WAY that 50% of this country's children are that smart. Sorry.

And, in that case, my hyperbole is meant to point out that this is symbolic of the culture we have created - everybody's great! everybody wins! everybody deserves what the other person has! - that is sending our country down the toilet.

Sorry if you don't think that is helpful.

It's not helpful. Not sure why you think it is. It's also not really true, IMHO, but that isn't helpful either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:SAT thresholds have always been uneven by race. Asian-Americans are full 200-300 points above Blacks and 100-150 points above Whites. I am glad that it is being removed. What equity? My Asian-American kids with perfect GPAs, with toughest course loads and with near perfect SATs and with parents who have saved for college all their lives seems like that they have been always ready for pandemic, civil unrest, racism and global warming. When you are given nothing and your hard earned things are snatched away from you - you become the students no one can subjugate.

Unfortunately, it's not just higher SAT scores. Asian applicants still lose out to blacks even with 300 more points and lose out to whites even with 150 more points in college admissions to top schools. Sad but true.

Qualify this please. To certain top schools, but not where Asians are URMs.

most schools where Asians are URM are not as sought after. Look at the schools that are considered "elite". Then look at the demographics of those schools.

Nobody cares about what nonelite schools do because it's already easier to get into those schools.

Nobody cares about the NESCACS? Or other elite LACs? Or Colgate or Bucknell or Vanderbilt or Georgetown or Wake Forest or BC or Tluane etc etc etc? Sorry. Wrong. If they don't, they should.

Being Asian is a benefit or neutral at those colleges, and they all practice the same racial balance in admissions as HYP etc.

no way are Asians URM at williams, amherest, wes, midd, bowdoin.

Swarthmore family here - they are def not URM at swat.

they used to be at vandy 15 years ago but not anymore.

i can't speak to colgate or bucknell.

Jut google please. My comment was "benefit or neutral" as bolded above. As to your points:

6.25% Asian at Midd, essentially the same as the 5.6% gen pop, so no handicap there. 6.61% Asian at Bowdoin. Higher at Amherst, Williams and Wes, yes, but that really makes my point more than yours in that it is only those NESCACS.

I'll google Colgate for you: 4.1% Asian. Bucknell 4%.

So you agree with me there are very competitive colleges where being Asian is either a benefit or not an issue. Thanks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AP Scores are even more correlated with wealth IME than SATs. Why not attack the LSAT, MCAT, PARCC, PSAT, DAT, GRE?
I don’t get the test-haters!

bumping this - those who are anti sat/act...have they answered this?

If anything sat/act track weath less than AP/IB!

How so? You can prep for both. With AP/IB at least you are studying the material in class. Not so with SATs.

NP. In California, a number of poor high schools offer few to zero APs. SAT prep is available free at Khan and doesn't take a whole year; a couple of months ought to do it.

Yep. Also at some high schools, AP classes are taught very poorly with a bunch of useless busy work, yet that busy work is counted for a grade. Not that easy to self-study for AP classes where your teacher never even makes you write an essay in class. The SAT is easier than, sat, Calc BC.