Virginia Tech gets 1,000 more freshman than last year

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harbinger of things to come?

Middle and upper middle class families finally turning their backs to expensive private colleges?

I bet most of the extra 1k freshmen are because they sat down with their parents and looked at the cost of going to a private college and this was the year that many extra people just couldn't justify it anymore. So the claim that had they known of over-enrollment they wouldn't have signed up probably doesn't cut the cake.

DH went to public college but I went to private. DH thinks everyone should just go to their state college and I am coming around to it for other reasons. I really do think grad school is the new college, and we are not independently wealthy & do work for a living as will our kids - so I think they should do state college for undergrad and save the extra money for grad school now, as opposed to private college (unless they get into my Alma mater which is probably unlikely!). We will see how we all feel about this when they’re older - they’re still young.

Anyway - I did read in the articles linked here that this is the most diverse group of freshman in terms of race and first generation going to college. So to the extent VT wants any “help” here - it might be cool if orgs that promote college diversity and first generation college students help out with ideas. This might be cropping up at other colleges in the future as well and it might be a joint goal for everyone to help colleges handle these increased numbers nicely.

Not everyone has to pay full freight, even donut hole and rich people. My DD had 3 school offers that came in lower than her flagship UMCP, which comes to almost 30K with all the added fees. You really have to pay attention to added costs per major, fees, and if your deposit even goes towards your tuition, etc... And Virginia has some of the most expensive in-state tuition. There are more OOS schools with merit packages that are much cheaper, even before looking at privates. Sure, you can't get merit aid at ivy and tippy top schools, but there are some serious good privates , SLAC's and tech schools that offer stellar merit and/or financial aid packages to make it worth going.

I am not saying there is anything wrong with in-state schools, but don't just settle because you think it is the cheapest. Look around and compare. Also compare housing costs sophomore to senior year. Some big state schools have very expensive off campus housing that charge by the person and are even pricier than campus housing. UMCP being one of them. I mean who is paying $900 a month (for minimum 12 months) plus utilities to share tiny apartments in College Park? Insane.

The other thing to look at is 4 year graduation rates. Many state schools are so overcrowded (VT will be one of them) that kids get bumped out of required courses and it takes 4.5 to 5 years to graduate. And then you are paying another year of all those extra fees and tuition. One less year of earning wages at a FT job too. My DD ended up in a school we are paying about $5K more than in state, but their freshman retention rates is over 95%, 4 graduation rates are over 85%, and many kids are graduating with a masters in 4-4.5 years. She can use her merit scholarship to get her masters and she doesn't have to take the GRE or apply to grad schools. All which cost money and take time. So for us, the extra $5K for 4 years is worth the investment.

And no, not everyone goes to grad schools. Sure, med and law students have to. But if you are smart, you get a great package for a BA/BS and get your employer to pay for your graduate school. My daughter might end up doing that as her major does have a lot of that. And many jobs are just fine with just a BA/BS

A lot of what you say is valid, but let's also be pragmatic. How many kids will qualify for merit at out of state? Or at a more expensive private college? We can't always expect that. But it is absolutely wise to keep your mind open and explore all possibilities. Too many people don't do that.

As someone who went to an expensive elite private college virtually all my classmates went on to get advanced degrees. It is pretty unusual to find someone who went to a top private and who did not also go on to grad school. There are exceptions, of course. And not that many employers pay for graduate school and those who do are usually limited to a few thousand a year, not the full costs (some exceptions, of course). If you have a bright and highly capable kid it's more pragmatic to plan on the kid going to grad school someday than not.

For kids that are getting into schools like UVA, VT, W&M, and UMCP - most of them would qualify for merit scholarships elsewhere. A lot of schools meet more need than state schools do.

I think the point that's often missing from these discussions is that if your child wants to go to a similarly ranked school, merit aid to bring down the cost to equivalent to in-state is just rather unlikely. My kid is going to William and Mary. Yeah, she could've gone to a far less ranked private school with heavy merit aid, but not schools that would be considered academic peers to W&M.

Well we are talking about VT and my child received enough merit and scholarships from Case, WPI, and RPI to make it the same or cheaper. All three of them are ranked much higher than VT and for in-state Marylanders, all three ranked higher than UMCP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harbinger of things to come?

Middle and upper middle class families finally turning their backs to expensive private colleges?

I bet most of the extra 1k freshmen are because they sat down with their parents and looked at the cost of going to a private college and this was the year that many extra people just couldn't justify it anymore. So the claim that had they known of over-enrollment they wouldn't have signed up probably doesn't cut the cake.

DH went to public college but I went to private. DH thinks everyone should just go to their state college and I am coming around to it for other reasons. I really do think grad school is the new college, and we are not independently wealthy & do work for a living as will our kids - so I think they should do state college for undergrad and save the extra money for grad school now, as opposed to private college (unless they get into my Alma mater which is probably unlikely!). We will see how we all feel about this when they’re older - they’re still young.

Anyway - I did read in the articles linked here that this is the most diverse group of freshman in terms of race and first generation going to college. So to the extent VT wants any “help” here - it might be cool if orgs that promote college diversity and first generation college students help out with ideas. This might be cropping up at other colleges in the future as well and it might be a joint goal for everyone to help colleges handle these increased numbers nicely.

Not everyone has to pay full freight, even donut hole and rich people. My DD had 3 school offers that came in lower than her flagship UMCP, which comes to almost 30K with all the added fees. You really have to pay attention to added costs per major, fees, and if your deposit even goes towards your tuition, etc... And Virginia has some of the most expensive in-state tuition. There are more OOS schools with merit packages that are much cheaper, even before looking at privates. Sure, you can't get merit aid at ivy and tippy top schools, but there are some serious good privates , SLAC's and tech schools that offer stellar merit and/or financial aid packages to make it worth going.

I am not saying there is anything wrong with in-state schools, but don't just settle because you think it is the cheapest. Look around and compare. Also compare housing costs sophomore to senior year. Some big state schools have very expensive off campus housing that charge by the person and are even pricier than campus housing. UMCP being one of them. I mean who is paying $900 a month (for minimum 12 months) plus utilities to share tiny apartments in College Park? Insane.

The other thing to look at is 4 year graduation rates. Many state schools are so overcrowded (VT will be one of them) that kids get bumped out of required courses and it takes 4.5 to 5 years to graduate. And then you are paying another year of all those extra fees and tuition. One less year of earning wages at a FT job too. My DD ended up in a school we are paying about $5K more than in state, but their freshman retention rates is over 95%, 4 graduation rates are over 85%, and many kids are graduating with a masters in 4-4.5 years. She can use her merit scholarship to get her masters and she doesn't have to take the GRE or apply to grad schools. All which cost money and take time. So for us, the extra $5K for 4 years is worth the investment.

And no, not everyone goes to grad schools. Sure, med and law students have to. But if you are smart, you get a great package for a BA/BS and get your employer to pay for your graduate school. My daughter might end up doing that as her major does have a lot of that. And many jobs are just fine with just a BA/BS

A lot of what you say is valid, but let's also be pragmatic. How many kids will qualify for merit at out of state? Or at a more expensive private college? We can't always expect that. But it is absolutely wise to keep your mind open and explore all possibilities. Too many people don't do that.

As someone who went to an expensive elite private college virtually all my classmates went on to get advanced degrees. It is pretty unusual to find someone who went to a top private and who did not also go on to grad school. There are exceptions, of course. And not that many employers pay for graduate school and those who do are usually limited to a few thousand a year, not the full costs (some exceptions, of course). If you have a bright and highly capable kid it's more pragmatic to plan on the kid going to grad school someday than not.

For kids that are getting into schools like UVA, VT, W&M, and UMCP - most of them would qualify for merit scholarships elsewhere. A lot of schools meet more need than state schools do.

I think the point that's often missing from these discussions is that if your child wants to go to a similarly ranked school, merit aid to bring down the cost to equivalent to in-state is just rather unlikely. My kid is going to William and Mary. Yeah, she could've gone to a far less ranked private school with heavy merit aid, but not schools that would be considered academic peers to W&M.

Well we are talking about VT and my child received enough merit and scholarships from Case, WPI, and RPI to make it the same or cheaper. All three of them are ranked much higher than VT and for in-state Marylanders, all three ranked higher than UMCP.

OK, then your child is clearly well, well above the average incoming student in terms of stats for VT. For the average student at VT, it does not apply.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If they are so oversubscribed they should make an arrangememt with GMU (or UVA W&M JMU etc) to have the NoVA students have an option to take intro/freshman classes locally at GMU and then go to VT for the next level. They are both state unis so tuition reconciliation for these students should not be too complicated.

Even if 200-300 students took the opportunity it would allow VT at least 1 semester to line up housing for these students.

No room at GMU or UVA. Both are oversubscribed. GMU junior and senior students have been ordered out of the dorms in order to make room for the incoming class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If they are so oversubscribed they should make an arrangememt with GMU (or UVA W&M JMU etc) to have the NoVA students have an option to take intro/freshman classes locally at GMU and then go to VT for the next level. They are both state unis so tuition reconciliation for these students should not be too complicated.

Even if 200-300 students took the opportunity it would allow VT at least 1 semester to line up housing for these students.

No room at GMU or UVA. Both are oversubscribed. GMU junior and senior students have been ordered out of the dorms in order to make room for the incoming class.

There is room at W&M, JMU, Longwood, Radford, and Mary Washington (source is other forums) If Tech had made the right number of offers, 1000+ students could have found a home at one of the other state colleges in the first place. Their actions have a ripple effect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Perhaps Tech/Purdue admissions need to hire some of their own quant/engineering graduates to minimize the deviation??

The article says they hired an outside agency to predict the numbers. Oops.

How do you get 1000 more people into classes? Dining halls? Dorms?

Trailers like FCPS??
-PP

I know to make up for a lack of dorms they get very selective with those requesting singles, they turn some singles into doubles, add a 5th in the quad rooms, and will also lease out hotels. They can also create dorm "rooms" out of common rooms.

The university I went to over-admitted one year and did all of the above. I felt bad for those who were in a 4-person quad room and got a 5th thrown in and those who were given a "room" that was actually a common area. The singles turned into doubles wasn't too bad; my friend had one of these and it was tighter than a normal 2-person dorm but not so much that it was uncomfortable. And those who got a hotel assignment hit the jackpot, IMO, because not only did they get their rooms cleaned each day by housekeeping, but the university also paid for take-away laundry service for them and they got their own private bus to take them to and from campus that even ran until 3 AM Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights.

Handling the influx of student in terms of the dining hall and classes is the easy part. Add in more 100-level TA taught classes that so many of the freshmen are in and as for dining, just make sure there was extra food. Even during the busiest of times in the dining hall, not every table was taken as so many students got their food to go.

[Anonymous]

They will all 3 beds loft beds and turn doubles into triples. They will bunk bed singles. They will get as many in each dorm as is possible up to fire code.

They will also do what Purdue did last year and turn basement areas into dorm room cubicles. And Purdue only had 500 more. Expected 7800 and received 8300 instead.

I am not sure how they will fit the rest TBH though.

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/tanyachen/people-horrified-by-temporary-housing-purdue-university

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Perhaps Tech/Purdue admissions need to hire some of their own quant/engineering graduates to minimize the deviation??

The article says they hired an outside agency to predict the numbers. Oops.

How do you get 1000 more people into classes? Dining halls? Dorms?

Trailers like FCPS??
-PP

I know to make up for a lack of dorms they get very selective with those requesting singles, they turn some singles into doubles, add a 5th in the quad rooms, and will also lease out hotels. They can also create dorm "rooms" out of common rooms.

The university I went to over-admitted one year and did all of the above. I felt bad for those who were in a 4-person quad room and got a 5th thrown in and those who were given a "room" that was actually a common area. The singles turned into doubles wasn't too bad; my friend had one of these and it was tighter than a normal 2-person dorm but not so much that it was uncomfortable. And those who got a hotel assignment hit the jackpot, IMO, because not only did they get their rooms cleaned each day by housekeeping, but the university also paid for take-away laundry service for them and they got their own private bus to take them to and from campus that even ran until 3 AM Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights.

Handling the influx of student in terms of the dining hall and classes is the easy part. Add in more 100-level TA taught classes that so many of the freshmen are in and as for dining, just make sure there was extra food. Even during the busiest of times in the dining hall, not every table was taken as so many students got their food to go.

That sucks. No one wants to be taught by a TA thrown in last minute.

[Anonymous]

Bottom line: VA Tech needs to become more selective. Many students are realizing what a good option it is, in spite of its location. I see it as the next Georgia Tech in terms of selectivity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Bottom line: VA Tech needs to become more selective. Many students are realizing what a good option it is, in spite of its location. I see it as the next Georgia Tech in terms of selectivity.

Then why are they not experiencing application at increases at the rate of other schools and why do they need to admit students off the wait-list every other year ? I think their engineering dept is already becoming more selective, but everything else is not experiencing the same gains.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Bottom line: VA Tech needs to become more selective. Many students are realizing what a good option it is, in spite of its location. I see it as the next Georgia Tech in terms of selectivity.

Um, no. They are one of the only schools who is decreasing in applications submitted AND their scores are also dipping, while everyone else continues to increase. They are not being selective. They just said they are taking in more pell grants, more URM's, more first generation kids. That is not being top tier selective at all. Come on now.

[Anonymous]

This does not surprise me at all. Given the demand and number of distraught near-miss candidates, this could have EASILY been managed from the wait list. I've had kids at UVa, Tech and JMU, and as a parent, I found Tech to be BY FAR the least student-centered of the three. Dorms are overcrowded and mostly lousy under normal circumstances (surprised they have not had the same mold problems as UMCP...I could see/smell it). Food is wonderful and award winning, but is almost all on the residential side of campus and inaccessible when classes are stacked during meal hours. The Math Emporium is a disgrace. The health center is poorly managed and provides very poor service (find your own doctor down there or plan to go to urgent care). As I said, this is just my perspective. Kid mostly loved the place.

[Anonymous]

Any chance they’ll start rescinding like UC Davis did when they over enrolled a couple years ago?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bottom line: VA Tech needs to become more selective. Many students are realizing what a good option it is, in spite of its location. I see it as the next Georgia Tech in terms of selectivity.

Um, no. They are one of the only schools who is decreasing in applications submitted AND their scores are also dipping, while everyone else continues to increase. They are not being selective. They just said they are taking in more pell grants, more URM's, more first generation kids. That is not being top tier selective at all. Come on now.

Where do you see that applications are decreasing? For 2019, they received 32k applications. In 2015, it was 22k. That is a massive increase in 4 years.

The article posted also says that the SAT and GPAs of the entering class are the second-most competitive in VT's history.

Not sure where you are getting your information on either of your points.

[Anonymous]

Re housing, I’ve seen the FEMA tents used in a pinch. See Frye Festival etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bottom line: VA Tech needs to become more selective. Many students are realizing what a good option it is, in spite of its location. I see it as the next Georgia Tech in terms of selectivity.

Um, no. They are one of the only schools who is decreasing in applications submitted AND their scores are also dipping, while everyone else continues to increase. They are not being selective. They just said they are taking in more pell grants, more URM's, more first generation kids. That is not being top tier selective at all. Come on now.

where are you getting your information from? Because that's not what their Common Data Set says at all. Do you have a link or a source? This is what I found from their CDS:
Fall 2014 - 20,744
Fall 2015 - 22,280
Fall 2016 - 25,000
Fall 2017 - 27,423
Fall 2018 - 32,103
Fall 2019 - I can't find an exact number but website says over 32k