What are folks doing for MS EOTP?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From a logic perspective, the more neighborhood families embracing a by-right middle school the better.

Visionary DCPS leaders could provide by-right middle schools with incentives to staff the darn honors classes, even if few (or no) students are in a position to take advantage of them during year one.

If you build it, they will come. And boy will they come if you can see beyond the end of your nose as a 21st-century planner for a rising school system.

With 70% economically disadvantaged students, and 40% at-risk, you are truly not their target audience. They know that your kids -- like all kids with educated parents, good housing and nutrition -- will be fine in the long run, getting into and attending college and entering the workforce.

Achieving even some of those outcomes for the rest of the students is far from guaranteed.

It should not require 'incentives' to get you to embrace your by-right school. Just do it.

How naive. Yes my good will do “fine” anywhere but I actually want her challenges. And around a better cohort of kids. Those kids need a huge amount of help but not at the expense of my kid. I know we are the mobility so we will move or go private. It’s a shame because EoTP is gentrifying but McFarland is going to be as weak as brookland. I can’t believe someone thought that was a success?

Once you start referring to whole groups of kids as "better" or worse based their race or class or test scores, I think you're gross and don't care if DCPS invests one penny in making sure you feel your kid is "challenges [sic]."

[Anonymous]

You might change your tune once your kid is older. High poverty means a lot more behavioral problems.
Middle school is tough enough. Why do you think so many dc parents send their kids to charters unless they feed to deal?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You might change your tune once your kid is older. High poverty means a lot more behavioral problems.
Middle school is tough enough. Why do you think so many dc parents send their kids to charters unless they feed to deal?

Classism, if not outright racism. I get that people are trying to do what they think it's best for their kids, but there's such a lemming culture even among otherwise educated parents. Put down the Tome of DCUM Knowledge and go look for yourselves.

[Anonymous]

I am a white parent who lives in Brookland. I would prefer to send my kid to our neighborhood MS because of proximity. It would be so much easier. One problem is it doesn't offer the language my kid is currently learning at a charter. The other issue is lack of diversity. My black friends (whose kids are in my kid's class) discouraged me from even checking out Brookland Middle and said they wouldn't send their kids there.

I went to a middle school in another state where there were drive-by shootings near the school periodically and gang issues as well as drugs were present. Yet the school offered honors classes and options for kids of all learning abilities. I was in classes with bright kids, kids and in classes with grade-level and below-grade level kids. SES also varied in all of my classes. I survived and did well.

Why can't DC serve kids of all backgrounds and SES better by offering more options/differentiated instruction in middle school? Wouldn't that be a way to help all kids reach their potential? I don't get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: I am a white parent who lives in Brookland. I would prefer to send my kid to our neighborhood MS because of proximity. It would be so much easier. One problem is it doesn't offer the language my kid is currently learning at a charter. The other issue is lack of diversity. My black friends (whose kids are in my kid's class) discouraged me from even checking out Brookland Middle and said they wouldn't send their kids there.

I went to a middle school in another state where there were drive-by shootings near the school periodically and gang issues as well as drugs were present. Yet the school offered honors classes and options for kids of all learning abilities. I was in classes with bright kids, kids and in classes with grade-level and below-grade level kids. SES also varied in all of my classes. I survived and did well.

Why can't DC serve kids of all backgrounds and SES better by offering more options/differentiated instruction in middle school? Wouldn't that be a way to help all kids reach their potential? I don't get it.

Have you talked to the Brookland MS principal about that? Asked what they'd do? If they laugh you it if there, then I get it. But what if they have a good plan?

I've met the MacFarland principal several times over the past few years and would feel comfortable asking him the same types of questions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You might change your tune once your kid is older. High poverty means a lot more behavioral problems.
Middle school is tough enough. Why do you think so many dc parents send their kids to charters unless they feed to deal?

Classism, if not outright racism. I get that people are trying to do what they think it's best for their kids, but there's such a lemming culture even among otherwise educated parents. Put down the Tome of DCUM Knowledge and go look for yourselves.

You say lemming culture. I'd say you are exhibiting ostrich culture.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel that basically if we show up we will win. And I’ll be honest about it, if people with money and degrees put their kids in a school and demand certain courses for their kids they’ll get it. DC has the money. My experience with building projects has consistently been that if empowered people with ability to get things done show up for their own self-interest DC will either cater to them in proportion to their numbers.

I’m not going to put myself here but when I send my older kid to MacFarland in a couple years I know that with my engagement and that of other parents they’ll be an Algebra class for my child to join. And follow-on options. I plan to make it happen. Not play the lottery or stay on the sidelines or move to Silver Spring.

You may not do take the plow yourselves but the furrow will be plowed. And soon.

This is just about the most misguided post I've ever read here. You personally don't have the authority or funding to make it happen and you're ignoring the Principal and other school officials, teachers, DCPS HQ, funding requirements, other parents who might not want what you want, etc. Plus you still have issues regarding peer group and systemic poverty issues. But go ahead and drink the DCPS HQ koolaid that all you have to do is show up and put in an effort and everything will be great for your kid.

Piling on, the fact that the earlier parent says "they'll (sic) be an Algebra class" in middle school is doubly unimpressive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You might change your tune once your kid is older. High poverty means a lot more behavioral problems.
Middle school is tough enough. Why do you think so many dc parents send their kids to charters unless they feed to deal?

Classism, if not outright racism. I get that people are trying to do what they think it's best for their kids, but there's such a lemming culture even among otherwise educated parents. Put down the Tome of DCUM Knowledge and go look for yourselves.

You say lemming culture. I'd say you are exhibiting ostrich culture.

So you think that learning the details of what's actually being offered is sticking one's head in the sand? Ok, sure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You might change your tune once your kid is older. High poverty means a lot more behavioral problems.
Middle school is tough enough. Why do you think so many dc parents send their kids to charters unless they feed to deal?

Classism, if not outright racism. I get that people are trying to do what they think it's best for their kids, but there's such a lemming culture even among otherwise educated parents. Put down the Tome of DCUM Knowledge and go look for yourselves.

You say lemming culture. I'd say you are exhibiting ostrich culture.

So you think that learning the details of what's actually being offered is sticking one's head in the sand? Ok, sure.

You know damn well that's not what my post meant. You seem to think that if only people bothered to learn what goes on at high poverty schools, they would realize that those schools would be great for their kids and that PP's concerns about discipline issues, among other things, were unfounded. That's misguided for two reasons.

First, as PP noted, there are very real discipline and other issues that exist in low performing schools and those can have a very real negative impact on the learning environment for all students. Second, your underlying premise is wrong. You think that most people are just blinding following advice on DCUM rather than "looking for themselves." That's ridiculous. Most parents who would be inbounds for these schools have spent time at the school and also talking to neighbors who have experiences with the school. You have absolutely no basis to conclude that people who live near the neighborhood schools are blindly following prejudices from DCUM posters from UNW or the burbs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You might change your tune once your kid is older. High poverty means a lot more behavioral problems.
Middle school is tough enough. Why do you think so many dc parents send their kids to charters unless they feed to deal?

Classism, if not outright racism. I get that people are trying to do what they think it's best for their kids, but there's such a lemming culture even among otherwise educated parents. Put down the Tome of DCUM Knowledge and go look for yourselves.

You say lemming culture. I'd say you are exhibiting ostrich culture.

So you think that learning the details of what's actually being offered is sticking one's head in the sand? Ok, sure.

You know damn well that's not what my post meant. You seem to think that if only people bothered to learn what goes on at high poverty schools, they would realize that those schools would be great for their kids and that PP's concerns about discipline issues, among other things, were unfounded. That's misguided for two reasons.

First, as PP noted, there are very real discipline and other issues that exist in low performing schools and those can have a very real negative impact on the learning environment for all students. Second, your underlying premise is wrong. You think that most people are just blinding following advice on DCUM rather than "looking for themselves." That's ridiculous. Most parents who would be inbounds for these schools have spent time at the school and also talking to neighbors who have experiences with the school. You have absolutely no basis to conclude that people who live near the neighborhood schools are blindly following prejudices from DCUM posters from UNW or the burbs.

Read PP 20:28 and tell me where you see any of that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I am a white parent who lives in Brookland. I would prefer to send my kid to our neighborhood MS because of proximity. It would be so much easier. One problem is it doesn't offer the language my kid is currently learning at a charter. The other issue is lack of diversity. My black friends (whose kids are in my kid's class) discouraged me from even checking out Brookland Middle and said they wouldn't send their kids there.

I went to a middle school in another state where there were drive-by shootings near the school periodically and gang issues as well as drugs were present. Yet the school offered honors classes and options for kids of all learning abilities. I was in classes with bright kids, kids and in classes with grade-level and below-grade level kids. SES also varied in all of my classes. I survived and did well.

Why can't DC serve kids of all backgrounds and SES better by offering more options/differentiated instruction in middle school? Wouldn't that be a way to help all kids reach their potential? I don't get it.

Have you talked to the Brookland MS principal about that? Asked what they'd do? If they laugh you it if there, then I get it. But what if they have a good plan?

I've met the MacFarland principal several times over the past few years and would feel comfortable asking him the same types of questions.

Brookland is bad it does come down to the principal but I still say why can't honors classes be offered at all schools. That's all most folks are looking for.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You might change your tune once your kid is older. High poverty means a lot more behavioral problems.
Middle school is tough enough. Why do you think so many dc parents send their kids to charters unless they feed to deal?

Classism, if not outright racism. I get that people are trying to do what they think it's best for their kids, but there's such a lemming culture even among otherwise educated parents. Put down the Tome of DCUM Knowledge and go look for yourselves.

You say lemming culture. I'd say you are exhibiting ostrich culture.

So you think that learning the details of what's actually being offered is sticking one's head in the sand? Ok, sure.

You know damn well that's not what my post meant. You seem to think that if only people bothered to learn what goes on at high poverty schools, they would realize that those schools would be great for their kids and that PP's concerns about discipline issues, among other things, were unfounded. That's misguided for two reasons.

First, as PP noted, there are very real discipline and other issues that exist in low performing schools and those can have a very real negative impact on the learning environment for all students. Second, your underlying premise is wrong. You think that most people are just blinding following advice on DCUM rather than "looking for themselves." That's ridiculous. Most parents who would be inbounds for these schools have spent time at the school and also talking to neighbors who have experiences with the school. You have absolutely no basis to conclude that people who live near the neighborhood schools are blindly following prejudices from DCUM posters from UNW or the burbs.

Read PP 20:28 and tell me where you see any of that.

I was responding to 19:50 and 21:46 -- two posts directly in this string. Why would I be responding to a post not included here? How would I have any idea whether that post was from the same person making other posts?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel that basically if we show up we will win. And I’ll be honest about it, if people with money and degrees put their kids in a school and demand certain courses for their kids they’ll get it. DC has the money. My experience with building projects has consistently been that if empowered people with ability to get things done show up for their own self-interest DC will either cater to them in proportion to their numbers.

I’m not going to put myself here but when I send my older kid to MacFarland in a couple years I know that with my engagement and that of other parents they’ll be an Algebra class for my child to join. And follow-on options. I plan to make it happen. Not play the lottery or stay on the sidelines or move to Silver Spring.

You may not do take the plow yourselves but the furrow will be plowed. And soon.

Maybe, but from what I've observed over the years, what really works to effect steady change in a DCPS middle school is a strong principal who, for whatever reasons, happens to care about serving neighborhood kids academically. Not just paying lip service to meeting their needs, but actually meeting them.

We wouldn't have touched Stuart Hobson under the previous head, who left 18 months ago. From where I sit, the new guy has made more positive changes to draw in neighborhood families during his short stint at the school than the previous head made in the ten years prior.

Sorry, but you can't necessary "make it happen" when your principal isn't on the same page as you are, no matter how willing you are to roll up your sleeves and get to work.

THIS. If the senior admin at school in a gentrifying area isn't a tough-minded star with a vision, forget it. DCPS won't push or incentivize him or her to work to attract neighborhood families.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel that basically if we show up we will win. And I’ll be honest about it, if people with money and degrees put their kids in a school and demand certain courses for their kids they’ll get it. DC has the money. My experience with building projects has consistently been that if empowered people with ability to get things done show up for their own self-interest DC will either cater to them in proportion to their numbers.

I’m not going to put myself here but when I send my older kid to MacFarland in a couple years I know that with my engagement and that of other parents they’ll be an Algebra class for my child to join. And follow-on options. I plan to make it happen. Not play the lottery or stay on the sidelines or move to Silver Spring.

You may not do take the plow yourselves but the furrow will be plowed. And soon.

Maybe, but from what I've observed over the years, what really works to effect steady change in a DCPS middle school is a strong principal who, for whatever reasons, happens to care about serving neighborhood kids academically. Not just paying lip service to meeting their needs, but actually meeting them.

We wouldn't have touched Stuart Hobson under the previous head, who left 18 months ago. From where I sit, the new guy has made more positive changes to draw in neighborhood families during his short stint at the school than the previous head made in the ten years prior.

Sorry, but you can't necessary "make it happen" when your principal isn't on the same page as you are, no matter how willing you are to roll up your sleeves and get to work.

THIS. If the senior admin at school in a gentrifying area isn't a tough-minded star with a vision, forget it. DCPS won't push or incentivize him or her to work to attract neighborhood families.

And if they are great principals with great teachers, then you might just have a gem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel that basically if we show up we will win. And I’ll be honest about it, if people with money and degrees put their kids in a school and demand certain courses for their kids they’ll get it. DC has the money. My experience with building projects has consistently been that if empowered people with ability to get things done show up for their own self-interest DC will either cater to them in proportion to their numbers.

I’m not going to put myself here but when I send my older kid to MacFarland in a couple years I know that with my engagement and that of other parents they’ll be an Algebra class for my child to join. And follow-on options. I plan to make it happen. Not play the lottery or stay on the sidelines or move to Silver Spring.

You may not do take the plow yourselves but the furrow will be plowed. And soon.

Maybe, but from what I've observed over the years, what really works to effect steady change in a DCPS middle school is a strong principal who, for whatever reasons, happens to care about serving neighborhood kids academically. Not just paying lip service to meeting their needs, but actually meeting them.

We wouldn't have touched Stuart Hobson under the previous head, who left 18 months ago. From where I sit, the new guy has made more positive changes to draw in neighborhood families during his short stint at the school than the previous head made in the ten years prior.

Sorry, but you can't necessary "make it happen" when your principal isn't on the same page as you are, no matter how willing you are to roll up your sleeves and get to work.

THIS. If the senior admin at school in a gentrifying area isn't a tough-minded star with a vision, forget it. DCPS won't push or incentivize him or her to work to attract neighborhood families.

And if they are great principals with great teachers, then you might just have a gem.

again you have to replicate Stuart Hobson a strong principal who understands the need for honors options. You need both for it to work