Let’s Talk APS High Schools: 4th one or no?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How big is the VHC site? Could they put fields at Kenmore but the classrooms there?

Or is this Career Center or nothing? I know that nice big plot at Kenmore is untouchable for a high school building but something has to be built there.

Bingo. It is the Career Center site or nothing. Seriously.
Well, not nothing; your kids will go to a 3000-3500 student high school, possibly in shifts between 7am and 11pm, and have some classes online.
Murphy and staff have already floated this insane idea.
APS is not going to build us another high school on a different parcel, on top of the one at the CC, in the next 30+ years, that would be fiscally completely irresponsible.

So we should make this one, the 4th, the best it can be! It’s also the best chance for Arlington Tech to evolve into something desirable.
If they mess up the CC site, and nobody wants to go there, Arlington Tech will fail. Then we will have no seats, money spent and wasted, and taxpayers will leave the county.

So here's what's going to happen: they aren't going to build the amenities. They will turn it into a neighborhood school and then they won't pull in anyone N of 50, but will pull in all of 22204. A lesser school for a lesser zip code. It was the best they could do. If you expect anything else, you are a fool. I'll be attending the private school fair next week in preparation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I think its really misguided to assume that just declaring the new Career Center space a second HB, or any other choice program will somehow make people want to go there. Arlington Tech is already under-enrolled. There is an entire thread on this board about why people aren't signing up for Arlington Tech and the most common response is the lack of sports/arts/amenities. Why would an extra 2000 students volunteer to go there when they can't get 300 students to want to go there? Even with a different curriculum option?

And the thing that always gets ignored about HB is that they have facilities and amenities! If you look at HB they have a really strong performing arts focus and have facilities to match that. That new HB school will have field space, an indoor gym, art studio, big theatre, separate black box studio, drama room, orchestra room and a kiln room. The program has 5 dedicated stories for 700 students an enormously expensive brand new building. No wonder the wait list is a million years long. The current CIP plan for the Career Center is throw a new story on a dilapidated building and build 1 room that is both a gym and theater for over twice the number students. No fields, no anything else. No one is going to run to sign up for that no matter how many times they call it a second HB. Cause it won't be a 2nd HB. And just calling it STEM isn't going to trick families into sending their kids there either. Not without state of the art science or tech facilities (robotics rooms, science labs, ect.)

I've even heard talk of making it a performing arts choice school. With no auditorium. Or rehearsal space. Again who is going to sign up for that?

The school board/county are trying to build the cheapest lowest quality school they can get away with and pretending that people will choose to attend it is ridiculous. If they aren't forced to build a quality school, then overcrowding and lack of opportunities will impact every high school student when the neighborhood schools are overloaded and the Career Center is still empty.


But they don't have the money to do anything else, without cutting other needed construction. At least if it's choice, nobody is going to be forced to go to a ill-conceived "program." There are plenty of kids who are not college-bound, or who are maybe not liking to get into a traditional or elite four-year college. This is their program.

There are not 2000+ students in Arlington who are going to willingly go to a non-college prep program. And that is the size the County needs the Career Center to be for the overcrowding to be alleviated. They are having a hard time getting 400 students to go to that program. Where are the other 1600 students going to come from? When no one signs up what will they do? Eventually Arlington is going to have to spend some amount of money to attract enough students (equally from all 3 other high schools) to make thier system work. Or make it a neighborhood school which also means spending money.

The county has pursued population growth policies through its development, zoning and affordable housing powers. Now they (and we) are going to have to pay up for the consequences of those policies.

They are having a hard time because they are barking up the wrong tree. They've been trying to sell Arl Tech to UMC families. It isn't happening. And yes, I think there will be 2,000 students in Arlington who are not going to wind up at a four-year college. They should be at the Career Center. It won't pull equally from all 3 HS, but boundaries can be redrawn.

So you are suggesting that we round up all the non-college bound kids (let me guess; you think the largest contingent from Wakefield?!) and bus them to the Career Center.
Then you say, because this will not be proportional from all 3 schools, boundaries will have to be redrawn - to fill a disproportionately empty Wakefield?
Sending Ashton Heights, Lyon Park and other current W-L students to Wakefield- Yeah - let that sink in, W-L. Parents!

Your fight against allowing a decent neighborhood 4th high school at the CC site - would ultimately send YOUR neighborhood straight to Wakefield!

This is a Glen Carlyn deja-vu!!!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How big is the VHC site? Could they put fields at Kenmore but the classrooms there?

Or is this Career Center or nothing? I know that nice big plot at Kenmore is untouchable for a high school building but something has to be built there.

Bingo. It is the Career Center site or nothing. Seriously.
Well, not nothing; your kids will go to a 3000-3500 student high school, possibly in shifts between 7am and 11pm, and have some classes online.
Murphy and staff have already floated this insane idea.
APS is not going to build us another high school on a different parcel, on top of the one at the CC, in the next 30+ years, that would be fiscally completely irresponsible.

So we should make this one, the 4th, the best it can be! It’s also the best chance for Arlington Tech to evolve into something desirable.
If they mess up the CC site, and nobody wants to go there, Arlington Tech will fail. Then we will have no seats, money spent and wasted, and taxpayers will leave the county.

So here's what's going to happen: they aren't going to build the amenities. They will turn it into a neighborhood school and then they won't pull in anyone N of 50, but will pull in all of 22204. A lesser school for a lesser zip code. It was the best they could do. If you expect anything else, you are a fool. I'll be attending the private school fair next week in preparation.

Oh, please let them try that stunt. Can’t wait. You are a fool, if you think their careers could survive that.

[Anonymous]

^^ that’s ridiculous conspiracy theory talk.
A) it’s a very expensive 4th comprehensive hs with Urban design and costs half a billion dollars ( nbd - take money from the acqautic center that we don’t need)
B) it’s a bunch of choice programs with lacking amenities that weren’t well considered that nobody wants. Cheaper in the immediate but ultimately more expensive than option A after it fails and has to be revamped


I believe Reed school should be our clue to how all this shakes down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^ that’s ridiculous conspiracy theory talk.
A) it’s a very expensive 4th comprehensive hs with Urban design and costs half a billion dollars ( nbd - take money from the acqautic center that we don’t need)
B) it’s a bunch of choice programs with lacking amenities that weren’t well considered that nobody wants. Cheaper in the immediate but ultimately more expensive than option A after it fails and has to be revamped


I believe Reed school should be our clue to how all this shakes down.

You mean take money from the unimpressive, yet so expensive pool planned for Crystal City, in that park, that is surrounded by highways, hence unwalkable, and will be, due to proximity, likely mainly a pool for DC residents?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How big is the VHC site? Could they put fields at Kenmore but the classrooms there?

Or is this Career Center or nothing? I know that nice big plot at Kenmore is untouchable for a high school building but something has to be built there.

There is a middle school and elementary school already at that site.

The elementary school sits on four acres of its own. The middle school sits on well over 30 acres. The Career center site is 12 acres. Yorktown sits on 11+ acres (plus the adjacent Greenbrier Park facilities). TJMS/Community Center and the new elementary school sit on 12 acres (plus the 15 acres of adjacent parkland/facilities for a total of 27 acres).

That's 2000 students on Yorktown's 11 acres; 1750 elementary and middle school students on 12 acres at TJ; up to 4,000 students being considered for the Career Center's 12 acres; and a mere 1000-ish students on 32 plus acres at Kenmore (not counting Carlin Springs students and their four acres).

So, you are suggesting that we can't put a high school or anything else on 36+ acres of land because there is already a middle school and an elementary school (which are separated by about 30 acres)?!?!?

Yes. That is what the SB and CB are saying. Welcome to the conversation. Now move on.

No, that's what you and the rest of your selfish neighbors are saying. Time for YOU to move on.

No sweetie, the whole conversation has moved past Kenmore. WHOOSH... you’re a year late. How is volunteering your neighborhood to house a 4th comprehensive high school — WHEN NO ONE ELSE WNATS IT! Selfish?
You really don’t have a handle on this.

The previous comments referred to the question whether it is CC or nothing and noting that there is a big plot of land on the Kenmore site. Glencarlyn is the selfish neighborhood insisting nothing else can go on 32 acres of empty space - not Arlington Heights. SB and CB say it can't be done at Kenmore because of Glencarlyn's pushback, not because it can't be done. THAT's what my comments were referring to....not Arlington Heights.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think this whole discussion of not having amenities at a CC 4th high school is a waste of time. You all are just getting in a tizzy over nothing.

Of course the SB will get the money to build what is needed and move out Montessori. The boundaries for the school will draw primarily from the wealthiest south arlington neighborhoods and very wealthy north arlington. The SB will do what ever it takes, just like it doles out the money for north arlington elementary schools and HB. The lobbying is already fierce! Some affordable housing will get within the boundary, but most will be too close to Wakefield. All of the wealthy communities east of 395 will get into the new school. Arlington Mill and Glen Carlyn will be rezoned to Wakefield. the new HS will be a rich school so it will be fabulous, guaranteed.

A huge portion of the UMC families will get zoned out of Wakefield, leaving that school with a very high FR/L school. Parents will do everything they can to avoid that school.

Congrats.

bingo.

[Anonymous]

If we don’t do this all three high schools better get ready for 3000 kids and trailers. All the N Arlington elementary boosters are complaining they the need seats... well guess what those elementary kids will be in HS at WL AND Yorktown in ten plus years!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think this whole discussion of not having amenities at a CC 4th high school is a waste of time. You all are just getting in a tizzy over nothing.

Of course the SB will get the money to build what is needed and move out Montessori. The boundaries for the school will draw primarily from the wealthiest south arlington neighborhoods and very wealthy north arlington. The SB will do what ever it takes, just like it doles out the money for north arlington elementary schools and HB. The lobbying is already fierce! Some affordable housing will get within the boundary, but most will be too close to Wakefield. All of the wealthy communities east of 395 will get into the new school. Arlington Mill and Glen Carlyn will be rezoned to Wakefield. the new HS will be a rich school so it will be fabulous, guaranteed.

A huge portion of the UMC families will get zoned out of Wakefield, leaving that school with a very high FR/L school. Parents will do everything they can to avoid that school.

Congrats.

bingo.

In there minds only Glen Carlyn and Buckingham go to Wakefield. They get to stay.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If we don’t do this all three high schools better get ready for 3000 kids and trailers. All the N Arlington elementary boosters are complaining they the need seats... well guess what those elementary kids will be in HS at WL AND Yorktown in ten plus years!

Not all of them will be 3000 and trailers, Yorktown can’t take any trailers. So it’ll be roughly 2000 at Yorktown and 3,500 at W-L and Wakefield with a couple dozen trailers each. At least W-L can put its trailers where they’re accessible to the main building, Wakefield will basically have to create an upper school and an lower school, with one of them in a trailer village across the campus past all the fields.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How big is the VHC site? Could they put fields at Kenmore but the classrooms there?

Or is this Career Center or nothing? I know that nice big plot at Kenmore is untouchable for a high school building but something has to be built there.

Bingo. It is the Career Center site or nothing. Seriously.
Well, not nothing; your kids will go to a 3000-3500 student high school, possibly in shifts between 7am and 11pm, and have some classes online.
Murphy and staff have already floated this insane idea.
APS is not going to build us another high school on a different parcel, on top of the one at the CC, in the next 30+ years, that would be fiscally completely irresponsible.

So we should make this one, the 4th, the best it can be! It’s also the best chance for Arlington Tech to evolve into something desirable.
If they mess up the CC site, and nobody wants to go there, Arlington Tech will fail. Then we will have no seats, money spent and wasted, and taxpayers will leave the county.

So here's what's going to happen: they aren't going to build the amenities. They will turn it into a neighborhood school and then they won't pull in anyone N of 50, but will pull in all of 22204. A lesser school for a lesser zip code. It was the best they could do. If you expect anything else, you are a fool. I'll be attending the private school fair next week in preparation.

Oh, please let them try that stunt. Can’t wait. You are a fool, if you think their careers could survive that.

DP, but whose careers are you talking about? Ultimate decision makers are SB, staff just follow their marching orders so they’re insulated. The current SB will set this course in motion but then will move on before we reach the ugly decision point. By then we’ll have a new SB who will be able to shrug and say they didn’t create this mess, they inherited it and now have to make the best of it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If we don’t do this all three high schools better get ready for 3000 kids and trailers. All the N Arlington elementary boosters are complaining they the need seats... well guess what those elementary kids will be in HS at WL AND Yorktown in ten plus years!

Not all of them will be 3000 and trailers, Yorktown can’t take any trailers. So it’ll be roughly 2000 at Yorktown and 3,500 at W-L and Wakefield with a couple dozen trailers each. At least W-L can put its trailers where they’re accessible to the main building, Wakefield will basically have to create an upper school and an lower school, with one of them in a trailer village across the campus past all the fields.

Yorktown can’t cap enrollment. That’s not how it works.
Sorry, but they have to take the students in their boundaries. Which will rise as the other schools become too crowded. No one gets off the hook.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If we don’t do this all three high schools better get ready for 3000 kids and trailers. All the N Arlington elementary boosters are complaining they the need seats... well guess what those elementary kids will be in HS at WL AND Yorktown in ten plus years!

Not all of them will be 3000 and trailers, Yorktown can’t take any trailers. So it’ll be roughly 2000 at Yorktown and 3,500 at W-L and Wakefield with a couple dozen trailers each. At least W-L can put its trailers where they’re accessible to the main building, Wakefield will basically have to create an upper school and an lower school, with one of them in a trailer village across the campus past all the fields.

Yorktown can’t cap enrollment. That’s not how it works.
Sorry, but they have to take the students in their boundaries. Which will rise as the other schools become too crowded. No one gets off the hook.

Lol. That's cute. Is that what happened in the ES and MS boundaries?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If we don’t do this all three high schools better get ready for 3000 kids and trailers. All the N Arlington elementary boosters are complaining they the need seats... well guess what those elementary kids will be in HS at WL AND Yorktown in ten plus years!

Not all of them will be 3000 and trailers, Yorktown can’t take any trailers. So it’ll be roughly 2000 at Yorktown and 3,500 at W-L and Wakefield with a couple dozen trailers each. At least W-L can put its trailers where they’re accessible to the main building, Wakefield will basically have to create an upper school and an lower school, with one of them in a trailer village across the campus past all the fields.

Yorktown can’t cap enrollment. That’s not how it works.
Sorry, but they have to take the students in their boundaries. Which will rise as the other schools become too crowded. No one gets off the hook.

Lol. That's cute. Is that what happened in the ES and MS boundaries?

I realize you are just trolling these threads, but boundaries aren’t redrawn every 4 years. People will move in bounds. They always do.

[Anonymous]

Why can't Yorktown take any trailers? APS's one form of creative problem-solving is squeezing in trailers where you wouldn't think they'd fit