RTO and No Childcare.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The issue for me is the 8-6 in office requirement. Right now, I work 8-5, pick up my kids, and then work a few more hours at home in the evening. Daycare closes at 6 and I have a 45 minute commute, so I'm not sure what I will go if the 8-6 requirement goes into effect.

A mandate that people now have to be in the office for 10 hours a day is not happening.

DOGE is recommending it for federal workers.

I didn't think DOGE had any enforcing power. That they can just recommend.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those of you bragging about how you don’t do stuff with your kids after school and how you spent plenty of childcare money/hours in traffic and bent over backwards to be in an office because your boss said so with one parent getting home late … this isn’t the flex you think it is.

To quote Varsity Blues: “I don’t want your life.”

Look, I don’t want FT RTO either. But the fact is you do need to plan your life, and it’s not a foregone conclusion that all parents need to dedicate all this time to after school activities. It’s not even clearly good for kids. Women placing these expectations on themselves (and it’s generally women) are going to drive themselves crazy. Your kid does not need to do travel soccer. They can do the school sports team and get themselves to and from there.

But if your vision IS that you spend from 4-7 shuttling your kid around, then yes, you need a better plan than perpetual FT WFH especially if you are a fed. Set your life up so you can prioritize what’s important to you. That may mean you and your DH flex in opposite directions, choosing a more modest home with a shorter commute, one parent going PT, or investing in childcare.

So prioritize what's important to you ... but not a job with WFH that makes the rest of your schedule possible and more pleasant. Choose jobs with flexible schedules or go part time ... but don't be full time 9-5 with WFH, that's entitled.

Do you hear yourselves?

I think what peeves me the most about the holier-than-thou lecturing is the assumption you thought of something I didn't. My middle schooler is in an alternative school without a bus or aftercare or these mythical school sports you speak of. We have two more years till she can walk to HS, something we planned for when we chose our house. Both DH and I worked from home before covid, something we negotiated - with accompanying pay cuts and limited promotion opportunities - to make this school work. Nobody in my house does travel sports, we just want to be able to get our kid to school in the morning, pick her up after, help with homework, and have dinner together at 6:00. But sure, tell me more about how I'm unreasonable and spoiled for not "prioritizing what's important to me" when I make career and childcare decisions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another reason why 1950s America was better.

For white mothers.
Black mothers didn’t have that privilege

So now everything sucks for all mothers. Progress!

Women asked for it. Let’s not forget.

Define 'it"

Did you know that during World War II when the country needed women to work because there weren't men that the government had very good daycare? But when the men came back they convinced women it home was their place? https://www.wwiimemorialfriends.org/blog/the-lanham-act-and-universal-childcare-during-world-war-ii

So it can be done but, we choose not to and it doesn't look like the orange man will help with that either

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The issue for me is the 8-6 in office requirement. Right now, I work 8-5, pick up my kids, and then work a few more hours at home in the evening. Daycare closes at 6 and I have a 45 minute commute, so I'm not sure what I will go if the 8-6 requirement goes into effect.

A mandate that people now have to be in the office for 10 hours a day is not happening.

DOGE is recommending it for federal workers.

I didn't think DOGE had any enforcing power. That they can just recommend.

I recommend they pay me overtime if they make me work more than 40 hours a week.

[Anonymous]

The funny thing is I looked at the DOGE Twitter (X, whatever it is stupidly called now) account and so much of it is complaining about how the government spent money.

But most of these complaints have to do with politician pet projects. Your rank and file fed us not deciding where the federal budget goes. Why don’t they target Congress instead?

Also why is the conclusion that because office space is vacant that employees should go work there instead of selling off/ending leases for these buildings to sell taxpayers money? It’s so obviously clear that they don’t give a crap about efficiency and are just trying to stir up outrage amongst MAGA as a distraction from their true agenda.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those of you bragging about how you don’t do stuff with your kids after school and how you spent plenty of childcare money/hours in traffic and bent over backwards to be in an office because your boss said so with one parent getting home late … this isn’t the flex you think it is.

To quote Varsity Blues: “I don’t want your life.”

Look, I don’t want FT RTO either. But the fact is you do need to plan your life, and it’s not a foregone conclusion that all parents need to dedicate all this time to after school activities. It’s not even clearly good for kids. Women placing these expectations on themselves (and it’s generally women) are going to drive themselves crazy. Your kid does not need to do travel soccer. They can do the school sports team and get themselves to and from there.

But if your vision IS that you spend from 4-7 shuttling your kid around, then yes, you need a better plan than perpetual FT WFH especially if you are a fed. Set your life up so you can prioritize what’s important to you. That may mean you and your DH flex in opposite directions, choosing a more modest home with a shorter commute, one parent going PT, or investing in childcare.

Well my kids’ elementary school doesn’t have sports teams. Rec level practices tend to be … after school with 1-2 practices/week. Times 2 kids that can be several days per week you need a parent around. And we let ours take at home music lessons 2x/month. I hardly consider a sport and an instrument overscheduled.

And I did build my life around this by taking a fed job that has allowed telework since before Obama. I guess before having kids I should have foreseen a reality show entertainer would take over our country and pimp it out to a couple deranged billionaires who want to destroy and de-regulate our government to pad their own investment accounts. But since I didn’t I guess I’ll have to look for more flexible/higher paying work in the private sector.

I don’t know why so many people are acting like WAH has been some recent COVID perk when it’s been around for a very long time. Getting “back to reality” by RTO 5 days per week is more draconian than many jobs were (including mine) 15 years ago.

Elementary school kids don’t need after school sports … they can do it on the weekend (just like when we were kids).

I think telework should be preserved but not on the grounds that kids have to be shuttled intensively to activities from the age of 5.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those of you bragging about how you don’t do stuff with your kids after school and how you spent plenty of childcare money/hours in traffic and bent over backwards to be in an office because your boss said so with one parent getting home late … this isn’t the flex you think it is.

To quote Varsity Blues: “I don’t want your life.”

Look, I don’t want FT RTO either. But the fact is you do need to plan your life, and it’s not a foregone conclusion that all parents need to dedicate all this time to after school activities. It’s not even clearly good for kids. Women placing these expectations on themselves (and it’s generally women) are going to drive themselves crazy. Your kid does not need to do travel soccer. They can do the school sports team and get themselves to and from there.

But if your vision IS that you spend from 4-7 shuttling your kid around, then yes, you need a better plan than perpetual FT WFH especially if you are a fed. Set your life up so you can prioritize what’s important to you. That may mean you and your DH flex in opposite directions, choosing a more modest home with a shorter commute, one parent going PT, or investing in childcare.

So prioritize what's important to you ... but not a job with WFH that makes the rest of your schedule possible and more pleasant. Choose jobs with flexible schedules or go part time ... but don't be full time 9-5 with WFH, that's entitled.

Do you hear yourselves?

I think what peeves me the most about the holier-than-thou lecturing is the assumption you thought of something I didn't. My middle schooler is in an alternative school without a bus or aftercare or these mythical school sports you speak of. We have two more years till she can walk to HS, something we planned for when we chose our house. Both DH and I worked from home before covid, something we negotiated - with accompanying pay cuts and limited promotion opportunities - to make this school work. Nobody in my house does travel sports, we just want to be able to get our kid to school in the morning, pick her up after, help with homework, and have dinner together at 6:00. But sure, tell me more about how I'm unreasonable and spoiled for not "prioritizing what's important to me" when I make career and childcare decisions.

Right?

So many of us *did* plan our lives as the PP suggested by taking lower paying flexible/telework friendly jobs (which have existed well before COVID). But that planning was apparently not the right type of planning?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those of you bragging about how you don’t do stuff with your kids after school and how you spent plenty of childcare money/hours in traffic and bent over backwards to be in an office because your boss said so with one parent getting home late … this isn’t the flex you think it is.

To quote Varsity Blues: “I don’t want your life.”

Look, I don’t want FT RTO either. But the fact is you do need to plan your life, and it’s not a foregone conclusion that all parents need to dedicate all this time to after school activities. It’s not even clearly good for kids. Women placing these expectations on themselves (and it’s generally women) are going to drive themselves crazy. Your kid does not need to do travel soccer. They can do the school sports team and get themselves to and from there.

But if your vision IS that you spend from 4-7 shuttling your kid around, then yes, you need a better plan than perpetual FT WFH especially if you are a fed. Set your life up so you can prioritize what’s important to you. That may mean you and your DH flex in opposite directions, choosing a more modest home with a shorter commute, one parent going PT, or investing in childcare.

So prioritize what's important to you ... but not a job with WFH that makes the rest of your schedule possible and more pleasant. Choose jobs with flexible schedules or go part time ... but don't be full time 9-5 with WFH, that's entitled.

Do you hear yourselves?

I think what peeves me the most about the holier-than-thou lecturing is the assumption you thought of something I didn't. My middle schooler is in an alternative school without a bus or aftercare or these mythical school sports you speak of. We have two more years till she can walk to HS, something we planned for when we chose our house. Both DH and I worked from home before covid, something we negotiated - with accompanying pay cuts and limited promotion opportunities - to make this school work. Nobody in my house does travel sports, we just want to be able to get our kid to school in the morning, pick her up after, help with homework, and have dinner together at 6:00. But sure, tell me more about how I'm unreasonable and spoiled for not "prioritizing what's important to me" when I make career and childcare decisions.

I mean yes - planning to have to FT working parents but never have after school child care is entitled. Sorry!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those of you bragging about how you don’t do stuff with your kids after school and how you spent plenty of childcare money/hours in traffic and bent over backwards to be in an office because your boss said so with one parent getting home late … this isn’t the flex you think it is.

To quote Varsity Blues: “I don’t want your life.”

Look, I don’t want FT RTO either. But the fact is you do need to plan your life, and it’s not a foregone conclusion that all parents need to dedicate all this time to after school activities. It’s not even clearly good for kids. Women placing these expectations on themselves (and it’s generally women) are going to drive themselves crazy. Your kid does not need to do travel soccer. They can do the school sports team and get themselves to and from there.

But if your vision IS that you spend from 4-7 shuttling your kid around, then yes, you need a better plan than perpetual FT WFH especially if you are a fed. Set your life up so you can prioritize what’s important to you. That may mean you and your DH flex in opposite directions, choosing a more modest home with a shorter commute, one parent going PT, or investing in childcare.

Well my kids’ elementary school doesn’t have sports teams. Rec level practices tend to be … after school with 1-2 practices/week. Times 2 kids that can be several days per week you need a parent around. And we let ours take at home music lessons 2x/month. I hardly consider a sport and an instrument overscheduled.

And I did build my life around this by taking a fed job that has allowed telework since before Obama. I guess before having kids I should have foreseen a reality show entertainer would take over our country and pimp it out to a couple deranged billionaires who want to destroy and de-regulate our government to pad their own investment accounts. But since I didn’t I guess I’ll have to look for more flexible/higher paying work in the private sector.

I don’t know why so many people are acting like WAH has been some recent COVID perk when it’s been around for a very long time. Getting “back to reality” by RTO 5 days per week is more draconian than many jobs were (including mine) 15 years ago.

Elementary school kids don’t need after school sports … they can do it on the weekend (just like when we were kids).

I think telework should be preserved but not on the grounds that kids have to be shuttled intensively to activities from the age of 5.

Well my DH and I were athletes growing up. Sports are important to us as our family prioritizes physical fitness. I don’t think playing a sport on the weekend is enough movement for kids.

Sure they can get that from running around with friends after school, which also … requires a parent nearby until they are older. There are also school projects to work on. And family dinner to prep. Or are these not important either?

I get some disgruntled people on this site love to hate on sports, but the reality is kids have to do *something* from school ending until bedtime and many are of an age that requires adult supervision.

I’m sorry that you think employees spending hours in traffic (bad for their health and their environment, but I digress) to sit in an office building typing on a computer and having Teams meetings with people in other offices so they can then spend their pay check to have someone else watch their kids after school just isn’t the ideal setup for our country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those of you bragging about how you don’t do stuff with your kids after school and how you spent plenty of childcare money/hours in traffic and bent over backwards to be in an office because your boss said so with one parent getting home late … this isn’t the flex you think it is.

To quote Varsity Blues: “I don’t want your life.”

Look, I don’t want FT RTO either. But the fact is you do need to plan your life, and it’s not a foregone conclusion that all parents need to dedicate all this time to after school activities. It’s not even clearly good for kids. Women placing these expectations on themselves (and it’s generally women) are going to drive themselves crazy. Your kid does not need to do travel soccer. They can do the school sports team and get themselves to and from there.

But if your vision IS that you spend from 4-7 shuttling your kid around, then yes, you need a better plan than perpetual FT WFH especially if you are a fed. Set your life up so you can prioritize what’s important to you. That may mean you and your DH flex in opposite directions, choosing a more modest home with a shorter commute, one parent going PT, or investing in childcare.

Well my kids’ elementary school doesn’t have sports teams. Rec level practices tend to be … after school with 1-2 practices/week. Times 2 kids that can be several days per week you need a parent around. And we let ours take at home music lessons 2x/month. I hardly consider a sport and an instrument overscheduled.

And I did build my life around this by taking a fed job that has allowed telework since before Obama. I guess before having kids I should have foreseen a reality show entertainer would take over our country and pimp it out to a couple deranged billionaires who want to destroy and de-regulate our government to pad their own investment accounts. But since I didn’t I guess I’ll have to look for more flexible/higher paying work in the private sector.

I don’t know why so many people are acting like WAH has been some recent COVID perk when it’s been around for a very long time. Getting “back to reality” by RTO 5 days per week is more draconian than many jobs were (including mine) 15 years ago.

Elementary school kids don’t need after school sports … they can do it on the weekend (just like when we were kids).

I think telework should be preserved but not on the grounds that kids have to be shuttled intensively to activities from the age of 5.

Well my DH and I were athletes growing up. Sports are important to us as our family prioritizes physical fitness. I don’t think playing a sport on the weekend is enough movement for kids.

Sure they can get that from running around with friends after school, which also … requires a parent nearby until they are older. There are also school projects to work on. And family dinner to prep. Or are these not important either?

I get some disgruntled people on this site love to hate on sports, but the reality is kids have to do *something* from school ending until bedtime and many are of an age that requires adult supervision.

I’m sorry that you think employees spending hours in traffic (bad for their health and their environment, but I digress) to sit in an office building typing on a computer and having Teams meetings with people in other offices so they can then spend their pay check to have someone else watch their kids after school just isn’t the ideal setup for our country.

if you prioritize all that - then you need to prioritize things like shortening your commute, choosing a smaller house/different schools, or flexing your hours. (I was also told that flexing hours was unacceptable.) I do absolutely run out of sympathy for people who are depending on Covid-era telework to forgo childcare.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The issue for me is the 8-6 in office requirement. Right now, I work 8-5, pick up my kids, and then work a few more hours at home in the evening. Daycare closes at 6 and I have a 45 minute commute, so I'm not sure what I will go if the 8-6 requirement goes into effect.

A mandate that people now have to be in the office for 10 hours a day is not happening.

DOGE is recommending it for federal workers.

I didn't think DOGE had any enforcing power. That they can just recommend.

I recommend they pay me overtime if they make me work more than 40 hours a week.

They will have to (hi FLSA!) if they are actually going to extend the workweek to more than 40 hours. People, calm down, they are not going to make the workweek 45 hours.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those of you bragging about how you don’t do stuff with your kids after school and how you spent plenty of childcare money/hours in traffic and bent over backwards to be in an office because your boss said so with one parent getting home late … this isn’t the flex you think it is.

To quote Varsity Blues: “I don’t want your life.”

Look, I don’t want FT RTO either. But the fact is you do need to plan your life, and it’s not a foregone conclusion that all parents need to dedicate all this time to after school activities. It’s not even clearly good for kids. Women placing these expectations on themselves (and it’s generally women) are going to drive themselves crazy. Your kid does not need to do travel soccer. They can do the school sports team and get themselves to and from there.

But if your vision IS that you spend from 4-7 shuttling your kid around, then yes, you need a better plan than perpetual FT WFH especially if you are a fed. Set your life up so you can prioritize what’s important to you. That may mean you and your DH flex in opposite directions, choosing a more modest home with a shorter commute, one parent going PT, or investing in childcare.

So prioritize what's important to you ... but not a job with WFH that makes the rest of your schedule possible and more pleasant. Choose jobs with flexible schedules or go part time ... but don't be full time 9-5 with WFH, that's entitled.

Do you hear yourselves?

I think what peeves me the most about the holier-than-thou lecturing is the assumption you thought of something I didn't. My middle schooler is in an alternative school without a bus or aftercare or these mythical school sports you speak of. We have two more years till she can walk to HS, something we planned for when we chose our house. Both DH and I worked from home before covid, something we negotiated - with accompanying pay cuts and limited promotion opportunities - to make this school work. Nobody in my house does travel sports, we just want to be able to get our kid to school in the morning, pick her up after, help with homework, and have dinner together at 6:00. But sure, tell me more about how I'm unreasonable and spoiled for not "prioritizing what's important to me" when I make career and childcare decisions.

I mean yes - planning to have to FT working parents but never have after school child care is entitled. Sorry!

DP but why? Why is wanting to spend afternoon with your kids and being home in time to cook dinner for your family more “entitled” than things like expecting to have good health insurance options, deciding you need a certain level of pay for the job to be worth your time, negotiating for things like transit benefits, expecting paid PTO, etc.?

The only difference is that telework has allowed many women (who were historically home with kids) to join the full time workforce. It’s internalized misogyny telling you that *this* is the thing that employees are entitled for wanting.

[Anonymous]

Maybe public schools should go back to assigning homework. Kids have none and so parents sign them up for activities for hours every night.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those of you bragging about how you don’t do stuff with your kids after school and how you spent plenty of childcare money/hours in traffic and bent over backwards to be in an office because your boss said so with one parent getting home late … this isn’t the flex you think it is.

To quote Varsity Blues: “I don’t want your life.”

Look, I don’t want FT RTO either. But the fact is you do need to plan your life, and it’s not a foregone conclusion that all parents need to dedicate all this time to after school activities. It’s not even clearly good for kids. Women placing these expectations on themselves (and it’s generally women) are going to drive themselves crazy. Your kid does not need to do travel soccer. They can do the school sports team and get themselves to and from there.

But if your vision IS that you spend from 4-7 shuttling your kid around, then yes, you need a better plan than perpetual FT WFH especially if you are a fed. Set your life up so you can prioritize what’s important to you. That may mean you and your DH flex in opposite directions, choosing a more modest home with a shorter commute, one parent going PT, or investing in childcare.

So prioritize what's important to you ... but not a job with WFH that makes the rest of your schedule possible and more pleasant. Choose jobs with flexible schedules or go part time ... but don't be full time 9-5 with WFH, that's entitled.

Do you hear yourselves?

I think what peeves me the most about the holier-than-thou lecturing is the assumption you thought of something I didn't. My middle schooler is in an alternative school without a bus or aftercare or these mythical school sports you speak of. We have two more years till she can walk to HS, something we planned for when we chose our house. Both DH and I worked from home before covid, something we negotiated - with accompanying pay cuts and limited promotion opportunities - to make this school work. Nobody in my house does travel sports, we just want to be able to get our kid to school in the morning, pick her up after, help with homework, and have dinner together at 6:00. But sure, tell me more about how I'm unreasonable and spoiled for not "prioritizing what's important to me" when I make career and childcare decisions.

I mean yes - planning to have to FT working parents but never have after school child care is entitled. Sorry!

Do you think most people with school aged kids have after care? Upper ES and middle schoolers? No, they don't, and there are not businesses that cater to those kids.

[Anonymous]

I'd just like to know what sports teams have only weekend events. Even rec basketball in elementary school has weekday practices where we live and definitely Little League has multiple practices and games during the week. I imagine it would very difficult to find a sports team that has no weekday events.