Gen Z doesn't seem to care about career advancement??

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are these remote jobs paying $90k+ year that are relaxed enough to allow for a second job, and how do I find one?

I'm a PM and could easily do 2 or 3

The BAs and coders on my team could easily do multiple jobs

Most jobs are 20 hours of actual work max.

I do project work so my roadmaps, epics what ever you call them are quarterly or goals or milestones. I literally could not work for two months and as long as I met my KPIs I am set. I easily could do 5 jobs if they all were like this job.

My one coworker goes to her beach house all of July and august and takes off Thanksgiving to New years each year and no one on noticed she catches up at other times. I do less than her. Last year I ghosted 👻 April to November. I worked like 5 hours a week. Tops

If me or her got promoted I get tips a 20-30k boost and have to work 40-45 hours. Easier not to do it and just get a second easy gig

This is a snow job on the people paying you. This is why it irritates me when people think PMs don’t need to understand technical work. If your roadmap is slow rolling, they should know they’re paying you for value that’s not worth what they’re paying you. I have taken over projects in the past and exposed this to the sponsors but, unfortunately, it is really very common.

Also at a large company I literally just ask other folks via slack to help all the time. Or maybe already know how do it and just wait. You are assuming bosses care. My staff member I knew had a second job but did not put him as I had a second job.

Companies only need to track unemployment claims, cobra coverage requests, insurance usage, calendar patterns they don’t care. My “catch up” “ooo” “status update” or “focus time” reoccurring meetings are first clue.

My one staff went to gym three days a week in morning, picked kids up at school five days a week and cut off work at certain time. We were remote. She slipped when she mention her pelatron machine, kids in day care all day and then she does not drive much. I did not care but obvious those were meetings her other job. I would do my meetings at same time. I am sure she knew about me. I think 80 percent of us had two to three jobs.

Key indicator fully remote and so so pay no questions asked take job. Why does someone making 200k take a 160k remote job? Cause they ain’t quitting current job

It is why Janie Dimon is on war path and Capital one on May 1 wants people back in the office. The scan is ending

Massive layoffs in IT last nine months but unemployment stayed the same. Think about that. Those Twitter and Google folks were doing nothing all day

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When the economy changes and they need more money they will change their tune; this post COVID economy where one doesn't really have to work hard to support a lifestyle is deceiving. Also, if they are living at home, on mom and dad's cell phone plan, etc, it is easy to be idealistic

The theme of this thread seems to be that they’re NOT idealistic but cynical to a point where they don’t trust their hard work will be rewarded.

ITA. Many of them were raised by Gen Xers who passed down their cynicism in spades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are these remote jobs paying $90k+ year that are relaxed enough to allow for a second job, and how do I find one?

I'm a PM and could easily do 2 or 3

The BAs and coders on my team could easily do multiple jobs

Most jobs are 20 hours of actual work max.

I do project work so my roadmaps, epics what ever you call them are quarterly or goals or milestones. I literally could not work for two months and as long as I met my KPIs I am set. I easily could do 5 jobs if they all were like this job.

My one coworker goes to her beach house all of July and august and takes off Thanksgiving to New years each year and no one on noticed she catches up at other times. I do less than her. Last year I ghosted 👻 April to November. I worked like 5 hours a week. Tops

If me or her got promoted I get tips a 20-30k boost and have to work 40-45 hours. Easier not to do it and just get a second easy gig

This is a snow job on the people paying you. This is why it irritates me when people think PMs don’t need to understand technical work. If your roadmap is slow rolling, they should know they’re paying you for value that’s not worth what they’re paying you. I have taken over projects in the past and exposed this to the sponsors but, unfortunately, it is really very common.

Also at a large company I literally just ask other folks via slack to help all the time. Or maybe already know how do it and just wait. You are assuming bosses care. My staff member I knew had a second job but did not put him as I had a second job.

Companies only need to track unemployment claims, cobra coverage requests, insurance usage, calendar patterns they don’t care. My “catch up” “ooo” “status update” or “focus time” reoccurring meetings are first clue.

My one staff went to gym three days a week in morning, picked kids up at school five days a week and cut off work at certain time. We were remote. She slipped when she mention her pelatron machine, kids in day care all day and then she does not drive much. I did not care but obvious those were meetings her other job. I would do my meetings at same time. I am sure she knew about me. I think 80 percent of us had two to three jobs.

Key indicator fully remote and so so pay no questions asked take job. Why does someone making 200k take a 160k remote job? Cause they ain’t quitting current job

It is why Janie Dimon is on war path and Capital one on May 1 wants people back in the office. The scan is ending

Massive layoffs in IT last nine months but unemployment stayed the same. Think about that. Those Twitter and Google folks were doing nothing all day

Sorry but there is nothing you could say that would convince me that this is unethical.

It’s not unethical to have multiple jobs and be paid in story points. It is though if you’re deliberately making a roadmap knowing you’re only giving 20 hours worth of work to someone who doesn’t know better. Trust me, if they understood, they’d care. At some point if someone tells them they’ll care.

CS is a big major now. Lots of people are going to get that degree. When the market becomes over saturated this won’t fly so much. As someone who understands development and program management, with degrees and certifications in both, I know what you’re doing and I understand why you’re doing it. It’s just not true that it’s everyone and it’s not true it’s never found out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are these remote jobs paying $90k+ year that are relaxed enough to allow for a second job, and how do I find one?

I'm a PM and could easily do 2 or 3

The BAs and coders on my team could easily do multiple jobs

Most jobs are 20 hours of actual work max.

I do project work so my roadmaps, epics what ever you call them are quarterly or goals or milestones. I literally could not work for two months and as long as I met my KPIs I am set. I easily could do 5 jobs if they all were like this job.

My one coworker goes to her beach house all of July and august and takes off Thanksgiving to New years each year and no one on noticed she catches up at other times. I do less than her. Last year I ghosted 👻 April to November. I worked like 5 hours a week. Tops

If me or her got promoted I get tips a 20-30k boost and have to work 40-45 hours. Easier not to do it and just get a second easy gig

This is a snow job on the people paying you. This is why it irritates me when people think PMs don’t need to understand technical work. If your roadmap is slow rolling, they should know they’re paying you for value that’s not worth what they’re paying you. I have taken over projects in the past and exposed this to the sponsors but, unfortunately, it is really very common.

Also at a large company I literally just ask other folks via slack to help all the time. Or maybe already know how do it and just wait. You are assuming bosses care. My staff member I knew had a second job but did not put him as I had a second job.

Companies only need to track unemployment claims, cobra coverage requests, insurance usage, calendar patterns they don’t care. My “catch up” “ooo” “status update” or “focus time” reoccurring meetings are first clue.

My one staff went to gym three days a week in morning, picked kids up at school five days a week and cut off work at certain time. We were remote. She slipped when she mention her pelatron machine, kids in day care all day and then she does not drive much. I did not care but obvious those were meetings her other job. I would do my meetings at same time. I am sure she knew about me. I think 80 percent of us had two to three jobs.

Key indicator fully remote and so so pay no questions asked take job. Why does someone making 200k take a 160k remote job? Cause they ain’t quitting current job

It is why Janie Dimon is on war path and Capital one on May 1 wants people back in the office. The scan is ending

Massive layoffs in IT last nine months but unemployment stayed the same. Think about that. Those Twitter and Google folks were doing nothing all day

Sorry but there is nothing you could say that would convince me that this is unethical.

It’s not unethical to have multiple jobs and be paid in story points. It is though if you’re deliberately making a roadmap knowing you’re only giving 20 hours worth of work to someone who doesn’t know better. Trust me, if they understood, they’d care. At some point if someone tells them they’ll care.

CS is a big major now. Lots of people are going to get that degree. When the market becomes over saturated this won’t fly so much. As someone who understands development and program management, with degrees and certifications in both, I know what you’re doing and I understand why you’re doing it. It’s just not true that it’s everyone and it’s not true it’s never found out.

*that this is not unethical

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you saying that 80 percent of remote workers have second jobs during the workday? I highly doubt that. If anything, I think those workers are the exception and not the majority.

I know more remote workers with multiple jobs than I do without.

These are all positions where they had their own LLCs for consulting work on the side pre-pandemic. They worked after work and on weekends. However, now that they WFH and there's no one to overhear who they may be speaking with on the phone or notice the fact that they have 2 laptops on their desk, they are free to work their main job & consulting job at the same time.

lol WHY do these people all decide to get a second well-paying job instead of just hanging out with their cat more? that's what i do if i have some downtime. like i make enough money in my first job. why would i want a second, even if i had the time?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you saying that 80 percent of remote workers have second jobs during the workday? I highly doubt that. If anything, I think those workers are the exception and not the majority.

I know more remote workers with multiple jobs than I do without.

These are all positions where they had their own LLCs for consulting work on the side pre-pandemic. They worked after work and on weekends. However, now that they WFH and there's no one to overhear who they may be speaking with on the phone or notice the fact that they have 2 laptops on their desk, they are free to work their main job & consulting job at the same time.

lol WHY do these people all decide to get a second well-paying job instead of just hanging out with their cat more? that's what i do if i have some downtime. like i make enough money in my first job. why would i want a second, even if i had the time?

I had three at one point.
$187,500
$190,000
$210,000

i dropped the $187,500 one recently. And I was online 8-7 everyday from home. And maybe worked 9-10 hours a day. With zero commute that was less than my one in person job. And I still goofed off 2-3 hours a day

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you saying that 80 percent of remote workers have second jobs during the workday? I highly doubt that. If anything, I think those workers are the exception and not the majority.

I know more remote workers with multiple jobs than I do without.

These are all positions where they had their own LLCs for consulting work on the side pre-pandemic. They worked after work and on weekends. However, now that they WFH and there's no one to overhear who they may be speaking with on the phone or notice the fact that they have 2 laptops on their desk, they are free to work their main job & consulting job at the same time.

lol WHY do these people all decide to get a second well-paying job instead of just hanging out with their cat more? that's what i do if i have some downtime. like i make enough money in my first job. why would i want a second, even if i had the time?

My brother is a cloud architect. He has 2 jobs and also does some other development on the side. I think he said he made $165k at job 1 and around $180k at job 2 plus another $20k doing consulting projects. His wife is also a developer and does something with AWS for small businesses in this area on the side. Their goal is to bank as much money as possible and semi-retire in their 40s. They plan on renting out their house and buying an RV to travel. They'll work remotely part-time to keep up their skills, he said. They tested this out last summer when they rented an RV for 3 months. They tested out if they could stand being in that type of space for a long period of time and to make sure it was feasible for working conditions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you saying that 80 percent of remote workers have second jobs during the workday? I highly doubt that. If anything, I think those workers are the exception and not the majority.

I know more remote workers with multiple jobs than I do without.

These are all positions where they had their own LLCs for consulting work on the side pre-pandemic. They worked after work and on weekends. However, now that they WFH and there's no one to overhear who they may be speaking with on the phone or notice the fact that they have 2 laptops on their desk, they are free to work their main job & consulting job at the same time.

lol WHY do these people all decide to get a second well-paying job instead of just hanging out with their cat more? that's what i do if i have some downtime. like i make enough money in my first job. why would i want a second, even if i had the time?

My brother is a cloud architect. He has 2 jobs and also does some other development on the side. I think he said he made $165k at job 1 and around $180k at job 2 plus another $20k doing consulting projects. His wife is also a developer and does something with AWS for small businesses in this area on the side. Their goal is to bank as much money as possible and semi-retire in their 40s. They plan on renting out their house and buying an RV to travel. They'll work remotely part-time to keep up their skills, he said. They tested this out last summer when they rented an RV for 3 months. They tested out if they could stand being in that type of space for a long period of time and to make sure it was feasible for working conditions.

I know people who do this but they don’t end up retiring. Or at least, they have not yet. 40 comes faster than people expect. I do wonder how many people manage it. Spending my whole life planning for retirement doesn’t appeal to me (I plan, but in the typical manner of putting away some money in my retirement account), but it’s a dream for some people and they enjoy the planning and saving.

[Anonymous]

I'm not on here much but for the person looking to be a pm the general route is starting as a ba, business analyst getting your PMP and you can be a pm as early as 26 or so.

[Anonymous]

How many saw their families give everything to a company that then fired them in their 50s and left them with no health insurance for kids?

There used to be stability that came with loyalty. There’s not now.

[Anonymous]

This is good advice. I started as a Computer Scientist, worked my way to IT PM, which is not a common progression since programming pays so much more, but I’m a Federal Employee so you have to move on from Programmer usually to move up.

I think Business Analysts make great PMs, because they spend a lot of time working between development and business teams and a lot of PM in IT involves being the liaison.

[Anonymous]

Gen Zers will live in lower COL rust belt cities, many of which have taken advantage of people wanting an urban, walkable lifestyle. Such places have always been urban, but not in a “good” way in a long time. Think Worcester MA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you saying that 80 percent of remote workers have second jobs during the workday? I highly doubt that. If anything, I think those workers are the exception and not the majority.

I know more remote workers with multiple jobs than I do without.

These are all positions where they had their own LLCs for consulting work on the side pre-pandemic. They worked after work and on weekends. However, now that they WFH and there's no one to overhear who they may be speaking with on the phone or notice the fact that they have 2 laptops on their desk, they are free to work their main job & consulting job at the same time.

lol WHY do these people all decide to get a second well-paying job instead of just hanging out with their cat more? that's what i do if i have some downtime. like i make enough money in my first job. why would i want a second, even if i had the time?

My brother is a cloud architect. He has 2 jobs and also does some other development on the side. I think he said he made $165k at job 1 and around $180k at job 2 plus another $20k doing consulting projects. His wife is also a developer and does something with AWS for small businesses in this area on the side. Their goal is to bank as much money as possible and semi-retire in their 40s. They plan on renting out their house and buying an RV to travel. They'll work remotely part-time to keep up their skills, he said. They tested this out last summer when they rented an RV for 3 months. They tested out if they could stand being in that type of space for a long period of time and to make sure it was feasible for working conditions.

I know people who do this but they don’t end up retiring. Or at least, they have not yet. 40 comes faster than people expect. I do wonder how many people manage it. Spending my whole life planning for retirement doesn’t appeal to me (I plan, but in the typical manner of putting away some money in my retirement account), but it’s a dream for some people and they enjoy the planning and saving.

The money just piles up. I was doing it as an experiment. Retirement is having only one job for overemployed people

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you saying that 80 percent of remote workers have second jobs during the workday? I highly doubt that. If anything, I think those workers are the exception and not the majority.

I know more remote workers with multiple jobs than I do without.

These are all positions where they had their own LLCs for consulting work on the side pre-pandemic. They worked after work and on weekends. However, now that they WFH and there's no one to overhear who they may be speaking with on the phone or notice the fact that they have 2 laptops on their desk, they are free to work their main job & consulting job at the same time.

lol WHY do these people all decide to get a second well-paying job instead of just hanging out with their cat more? that's what i do if i have some downtime. like i make enough money in my first job. why would i want a second, even if i had the time?

My brother is a cloud architect. He has 2 jobs and also does some other development on the side. I think he said he made $165k at job 1 and around $180k at job 2 plus another $20k doing consulting projects. His wife is also a developer and does something with AWS for small businesses in this area on the side. Their goal is to bank as much money as possible and semi-retire in their 40s. They plan on renting out their house and buying an RV to travel. They'll work remotely part-time to keep up their skills, he said. They tested this out last summer when they rented an RV for 3 months. They tested out if they could stand being in that type of space for a long period of time and to make sure it was feasible for working conditions.

I know people who do this but they don’t end up retiring. Or at least, they have not yet. 40 comes faster than people expect. I do wonder how many people manage it. Spending my whole life planning for retirement doesn’t appeal to me (I plan, but in the typical manner of putting away some money in my retirement account), but it’s a dream for some people and they enjoy the planning and saving.

The money just piles up. I was doing it as an experiment. Retirement is having only one job for overemployed people

So my strict 9-5 single job is the same as their retirement? I retired at 25 then!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you saying that 80 percent of remote workers have second jobs during the workday? I highly doubt that. If anything, I think those workers are the exception and not the majority.

I know more remote workers with multiple jobs than I do without.

These are all positions where they had their own LLCs for consulting work on the side pre-pandemic. They worked after work and on weekends. However, now that they WFH and there's no one to overhear who they may be speaking with on the phone or notice the fact that they have 2 laptops on their desk, they are free to work their main job & consulting job at the same time.

lol WHY do these people all decide to get a second well-paying job instead of just hanging out with their cat more? that's what i do if i have some downtime. like i make enough money in my first job. why would i want a second, even if i had the time?

I doubt these people have any pets or any other kids or wife.