Why not close the achievement gap from the top down?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As the parent of two advanced students it’s terrifying to me that people actually think like OP. OP, are you by any chance a Fairfax County school board member?

Every member of the current and incoming FCPS school board believes in closing the achievement gap from the top down.

+1. It’s the prevailing thought around the education world. No one quite comes out and says it like this, but it’s the gist of things. Rather than say it like this, schools do things like putting everyone in honors and not even having Gen Ed classes (which is what our current MS did.) Also the endless retakes and “PBL.” (project based learning which is code for how to give kids an A on a big graded assignment who could never get an A or B on an actual test of the material.) The last class day or two at the end of every quarter is spent allowing kids who didn’t turn in a bunch of their work to do it really quickly and turn it in. The kids who already did all of the their work just sit there for several days at the end of each quarter. I’ve honestly started calling my kids in sick these days. The amount of reminder emails we get from the principal about checking our kids grades, looking for missing assignments and checking in with teachers before it’s “too late.” It’s ridiculous. The only care about the bottom. The middle and top kids are just noise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you study the achievement gap, you’ll know that high school isn’t the issue. Neither is calculus. Neither is TJ (although whether we should have public, selective high schools and what their admission process should be is a separate and valid issue). The problem is in the early grades.

Plus nobody believes advanced calculus is the ticket to great wealth.

Sorry, but if you add in early childhood research the pattern is set before age 2.

By age 2 Hispanic children are the same a white in socialization but behind in vocabulary (in home language).

There are initiatives to teach parents patterns of interaction that raise this (serve and return conversations etc)

It is set very very early and the gap is there well before Kindergarten.

Sorry, not sorry. And not convinced by your weak argument.

For decades, pols pushed for more money to be thrown at expensive “head start” programs.

The money’s been spent, but it has not meaningfully changed things. So your premise is faulty.

Research. I don’t care about your opinion. I’m sure you don’t trust science, but here is the research.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4543291/

Here are the findings since you will not bother to read it:

As has been suggested by others, children with greater vocabulary may be better able to regulate their behavior using self-talk or mental symbolic representations to control their impulses (Barkley, 1997; Vallotton & Ayoub, 2011). It is also possible that children who use more words are better able to express themselves and have a better sense of control in their environment, leading to less frustration accompanied by better growth in inhibitory control skills (Vallotton & Ayoub, 2011). The findings from the present study suggest that interventions aimed at improving school readiness skills for Spanish-speaking Hispanic children should start early and target early verbal abilities in the child’s home language.

I am not talking about money, but how different cultures talk to their infants that in part make the achievement gap.

That you are ignorant of early childhood research doesn’t make my premise faulty.

That said, the biggest predictor of a child’s achievement in school is maternal income.

Guess what Dobbs just did- took more women out of the workforce. SO if you are upset about money, you should know that the R’s just considerably widened the achievement gap and it will take more money to be pro-life.

Glad you only get one vote- yours and mine cancel each other out!!!

Your post flails about, but ultimately makes little sense.

Federal head start programs do not work, and the research proves that fact:

https://www.cato.org/blog/us-government-our-head-start-program-doesnt-work

Hilarious - quoting a Cato Institute blog post as "fact" is like quoting Vladimir Putin on Ukrainian History.
So folks know how bad that Cato drive-by-shooting is, it's two "sources" are a dead link and - crack me up - the New York POST!
I'm laughing so hard I might just pee myself!

It’s a symptom of the rampant astroturfing in NoVA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FCPS’ equity program, SBG program and now restorative justice program are doing exactly what the OP has suggested. Sadly they are doing it to great effect. So now everyone in FCPS suffers. Congratulations Superintendent Reid, mission accomplished!

When did that start?

It is hard to stay on top of all the screwed up things Reid is doing - https://www.fcps.edu/resources/student-safety-wellness/restorative-justice

Vote republicans on to the FCPS school board and maybe they can stop Michelle Reid’s extremist “social justice” initiatives harming our school system.

If you vote for democrats again, things will only get worse. Much worse.

Your idea of extremist is the majority of voters' idea of decency since the GOP anti-education agenda was soundly defeated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FCPS’ equity program, SBG program and now restorative justice program are doing exactly what the OP has suggested. Sadly they are doing it to great effect. So now everyone in FCPS suffers. Congratulations Superintendent Reid, mission accomplished!

When did that start?

It is hard to stay on top of all the screwed up things Reid is doing - https://www.fcps.edu/resources/student-safety-wellness/restorative-justice

Vote republicans on to the FCPS school board and maybe they can stop Michelle Reid’s extremist “social justice” initiatives harming our school system.

If you vote for democrats again, things will only get worse. Much worse.

How can we be certain republicans wont continue the same extremist nonsense being pursued by current democratic board?

Republicans certainly have their share of bad ideas but I think the point is to have a bit of viewpoint diversity so light can be shed on bad leftist ideas. No one I'm on the board is doing that right now because they're either leftists or left enough to not want to say anything.

Illinois schoolchildren did a little better this past school year, but they are still behind where they were before the pandemic hit and put them out of their classrooms for large blocks of time.

It’s interesting timing as Illinois state lawmakers are showing too little interest in keeping the one thing that worked during the pandemic: school choice.

Scores for public schools were just released and showed only 35% of students in grades 3 through 8 could read at grade level in 2023, according to the Illinois Report Card. Only 27% met proficiency in math.

That is 3 percentage points lower in reading and 5 points lower in math than before the pandemic.

High school juniors taking the SAT posted similar proficiency: 32% could read and 27% do math at grade level.

Illinois Superintendent of Education Tony Sanders said the state has a “significant distance to travel” toward recovery after pandemic-era school closures caused record-low proficiency rates statewide.

Really? You mean Illinois shouldn’t be satisfied when roughly 2 of every 3 students are behind?

The state’s education leaders were spinning the scores as “strong progress” because both elementary reading and math increased from the prior year. They also celebrated the high school graduation rate, which sits at 87.6% for the class of 2023 – the highest it has been in 13 years.

But look back a year at when the graduating class of 2023 were tested as juniors. Just 30% met grade-level standards in reading and 29% in math when they took the state-required SAT in spring 2022.

So, our record graduation rates are basically sending 7 of every 10 young adults out into the world ill-prepared for the demands they will face.

How long will it take for college admissions officers and hiring managers to start saying: “Oh. That’s an Illinois high school diploma. Maybe we should take the Massachusetts grad.”

More: https://www.illinoispolicy.org/policy-shop/the-policy-shop-illinois-last-stand-for-school-choice/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FCPS’ equity program, SBG program and now restorative justice program are doing exactly what the OP has suggested. Sadly they are doing it to great effect. So now everyone in FCPS suffers. Congratulations Superintendent Reid, mission accomplished!

When did that start?

It is hard to stay on top of all the screwed up things Reid is doing - https://www.fcps.edu/resources/student-safety-wellness/restorative-justice

Vote republicans on to the FCPS school board and maybe they can stop Michelle Reid’s extremist “social justice” initiatives harming our school system.

If you vote for democrats again, things will only get worse. Much worse.

How can we be certain republicans wont continue the same extremist nonsense being pursued by current democratic board?

Republicans certainly have their share of bad ideas but I think the point is to have a bit of viewpoint diversity so light can be shed on bad leftist ideas. No one I'm on the board is doing that right now because they're either leftists or left enough to not want to say anything.

Illinois schoolchildren did a little better this past school year, but they are still behind where they were before the pandemic hit and put them out of their classrooms for large blocks of time.

It’s interesting timing as Illinois state lawmakers are showing too little interest in keeping the one thing that worked during the pandemic: school choice.

Scores for public schools were just released and showed only 35% of students in grades 3 through 8 could read at grade level in 2023, according to the Illinois Report Card. Only 27% met proficiency in math.

That is 3 percentage points lower in reading and 5 points lower in math than before the pandemic.

High school juniors taking the SAT posted similar proficiency: 32% could read and 27% do math at grade level.

Illinois Superintendent of Education Tony Sanders said the state has a “significant distance to travel” toward recovery after pandemic-era school closures caused record-low proficiency rates statewide.

Really? You mean Illinois shouldn’t be satisfied when roughly 2 of every 3 students are behind?

The state’s education leaders were spinning the scores as “strong progress” because both elementary reading and math increased from the prior year. They also celebrated the high school graduation rate, which sits at 87.6% for the class of 2023 – the highest it has been in 13 years.

But look back a year at when the graduating class of 2023 were tested as juniors. Just 30% met grade-level standards in reading and 29% in math when they took the state-required SAT in spring 2022.

So, our record graduation rates are basically sending 7 of every 10 young adults out into the world ill-prepared for the demands they will face.

How long will it take for college admissions officers and hiring managers to start saying: “Oh. That’s an Illinois high school diploma. Maybe we should take the Massachusetts grad.”

More: https://www.illinoispolicy.org/policy-shop/the-policy-shop-illinois-last-stand-for-school-choice/

School choice helps URM and lower SES students succeed. But the teachers unions hate the idea, and they will funnel the $$$ they collect from members to sleazy lobbyists solely to fight choice.

[Anonymous]

Schools can’t close the achievement gap.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our society is already so lopsided as far as the top 1% owning practically everything.

And I’m sorry but no kid needs advanced calculus in high school.

Why not narrow the achievement gap by finding ways to lower the test results for the top performers?

Are you serious??? For a rich nation, the US is already lagging way behind other countries for academic achievement and you want to dumb down education even more than it already is?

Race to the bottom is OP’s solution instead of helping to bring up the bottom in the elementary and early years

If you are going to change anything, you don't need any AAP elementary, those students can find plenty of enrichment elsewhere until they reach higher levels.
Use the funds for intervention in the early years so more students can take calculus in high school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FCPS’ equity program, SBG program and now restorative justice program are doing exactly what the OP has suggested. Sadly they are doing it to great effect. So now everyone in FCPS suffers. Congratulations Superintendent Reid, mission accomplished!

When did that start?

It is hard to stay on top of all the screwed up things Reid is doing - https://www.fcps.edu/resources/student-safety-wellness/restorative-justice

Vote republicans on to the FCPS school board and maybe they can stop Michelle Reid’s extremist “social justice” initiatives harming our school system.

If you vote for democrats again, things will only get worse. Much worse.

How can we be certain republicans wont continue the same extremist nonsense being pursued by current democratic board?

Republicans certainly have their share of bad ideas but I think the point is to have a bit of viewpoint diversity so light can be shed on bad leftist ideas. No one I'm on the board is doing that right now because they're either leftists or left enough to not want to say anything.

Illinois schoolchildren did a little better this past school year, but they are still behind where they were before the pandemic hit and put them out of their classrooms for large blocks of time.

It’s interesting timing as Illinois state lawmakers are showing too little interest in keeping the one thing that worked during the pandemic: school choice.

Scores for public schools were just released and showed only 35% of students in grades 3 through 8 could read at grade level in 2023, according to the Illinois Report Card. Only 27% met proficiency in math.

That is 3 percentage points lower in reading and 5 points lower in math than before the pandemic.

High school juniors taking the SAT posted similar proficiency: 32% could read and 27% do math at grade level.

Illinois Superintendent of Education Tony Sanders said the state has a “significant distance to travel” toward recovery after pandemic-era school closures caused record-low proficiency rates statewide.

Really? You mean Illinois shouldn’t be satisfied when roughly 2 of every 3 students are behind?

The state’s education leaders were spinning the scores as “strong progress” because both elementary reading and math increased from the prior year. They also celebrated the high school graduation rate, which sits at 87.6% for the class of 2023 – the highest it has been in 13 years.

But look back a year at when the graduating class of 2023 were tested as juniors. Just 30% met grade-level standards in reading and 29% in math when they took the state-required SAT in spring 2022.

So, our record graduation rates are basically sending 7 of every 10 young adults out into the world ill-prepared for the demands they will face.

How long will it take for college admissions officers and hiring managers to start saying: “Oh. That’s an Illinois high school diploma. Maybe we should take the Massachusetts grad.”

More: https://www.illinoispolicy.org/policy-shop/the-policy-shop-illinois-last-stand-for-school-choice/

School choice helps URM and lower SES students succeed. But the teachers unions hate the idea, and they will funnel the $$$ they collect from members to sleazy lobbyists solely to fight choice.

Do you have any support for that assertion? It seems like the biggest beneficiaries of school choice are for profit corporations running schools. People seem to get the idea that a voucher is all that is standing between their kid and the Potomac school when the reality is that the only schools accepting the voucher will look nothing like the private school parents envision

[Anonymous]

Achieving the goal of closing the gap by bringing the top down by implementing SGB.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Achieving the goal of closing the gap by bringing the top down by implementing SGB.

Nope. If kids need “buffer” assignments to boost their grades then they were never really top students to begin with. Eliminating grade inflation doesn’t bring the top down, it thins the herd to the kids who’ve actually mastered the material.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you study the achievement gap, you’ll know that high school isn’t the issue. Neither is calculus. Neither is TJ (although whether we should have public, selective high schools and what their admission process should be is a separate and valid issue). The problem is in the early grades.

Plus nobody believes advanced calculus is the ticket to great wealth.

Sorry, but if you add in early childhood research the pattern is set before age 2.

By age 2 Hispanic children are the same a white in socialization but behind in vocabulary (in home language).

There are initiatives to teach parents patterns of interaction that raise this (serve and return conversations etc)

It is set very very early and the gap is there well before Kindergarten.

Sorry, not sorry. And not convinced by your weak argument.

For decades, pols pushed for more money to be thrown at expensive “head start” programs.

The money’s been spent, but it has not meaningfully changed things. So your premise is faulty.

Research. I don’t care about your opinion. I’m sure you don’t trust science, but here is the research.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4543291/

Here are the findings since you will not bother to read it:

As has been suggested by others, children with greater vocabulary may be better able to regulate their behavior using self-talk or mental symbolic representations to control their impulses (Barkley, 1997; Vallotton & Ayoub, 2011). It is also possible that children who use more words are better able to express themselves and have a better sense of control in their environment, leading to less frustration accompanied by better growth in inhibitory control skills (Vallotton & Ayoub, 2011). The findings from the present study suggest that interventions aimed at improving school readiness skills for Spanish-speaking Hispanic children should start early and target early verbal abilities in the child’s home language.

I am not talking about money, but how different cultures talk to their infants that in part make the achievement gap.

That you are ignorant of early childhood research doesn’t make my premise faulty.

That said, the biggest predictor of a child’s achievement in school is maternal income.

Guess what Dobbs just did- took more women out of the workforce. SO if you are upset about money, you should know that the R’s just considerably widened the achievement gap and it will take more money to be pro-life.

Glad you only get one vote- yours and mine cancel each other out!!!

Your post flails about, but ultimately makes little sense.

Federal head start programs do not work, and the research proves that fact:

https://www.cato.org/blog/us-government-our-head-start-program-doesnt-work

Hilarious - quoting a Cato Institute blog post as "fact" is like quoting Vladimir Putin on Ukrainian History.
So folks know how bad that Cato drive-by-shooting is, it's two "sources" are a dead link and - crack me up - the New York POST!
I'm laughing so hard I might just pee myself!

It’s a symptom of the rampant astroturfing in NoVA.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our society is already so lopsided as far as the top 1% owning practically everything.

And I’m sorry but no kid needs advanced calculus in high school.

Why not narrow the achievement gap by finding ways to lower the test results for the top performers?

There has now been created a world in which the success of others is a grievance, rather than an example.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our society is already so lopsided as far as the top 1% owning practically everything.

And I’m sorry but no kid needs advanced calculus in high school.

Why not narrow the achievement gap by finding ways to lower the test results for the top performers?

There has now been created a world in which the success of others is a grievance, rather than an example.

Well said! I hope we can right the ship before it is too late, but the task keeps getting harder. As Einstein said “the difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has limits.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FCPS’ equity program, SBG program and now restorative justice program are doing exactly what the OP has suggested. Sadly they are doing it to great effect. So now everyone in FCPS suffers. Congratulations Superintendent Reid, mission accomplished!

When did that start?

It is hard to stay on top of all the screwed up things Reid is doing - https://www.fcps.edu/resources/student-safety-wellness/restorative-justice

Vote republicans on to the FCPS school board and maybe they can stop Michelle Reid’s extremist “social justice” initiatives harming our school system.

If you vote for democrats again, things will only get worse. Much worse.

How can we be certain republicans wont continue the same extremist nonsense being pursued by current democratic board?

Republicans certainly have their share of bad ideas but I think the point is to have a bit of viewpoint diversity so light can be shed on bad leftist ideas. No one I'm on the board is doing that right now because they're either leftists or left enough to not want to say anything.

This is an absolutely hilarious understatement.

This is an area filled with intelligent, educated people. We aren’t going to elect Rs no matter how many message board posts you make.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FCPS’ equity program, SBG program and now restorative justice program are doing exactly what the OP has suggested. Sadly they are doing it to great effect. So now everyone in FCPS suffers. Congratulations Superintendent Reid, mission accomplished!

When did that start?

It is hard to stay on top of all the screwed up things Reid is doing - https://www.fcps.edu/resources/student-safety-wellness/restorative-justice

Vote republicans on to the FCPS school board and maybe they can stop Michelle Reid’s extremist “social justice” initiatives harming our school system.

If you vote for democrats again, things will only get worse. Much worse.

How can we be certain republicans wont continue the same extremist nonsense being pursued by current democratic board?

Republicans certainly have their share of bad ideas but I think the point is to have a bit of viewpoint diversity so light can be shed on bad leftist ideas. No one I'm on the board is doing that right now because they're either leftists or left enough to not want to say anything.

Illinois schoolchildren did a little better this past school year, but they are still behind where they were before the pandemic hit and put them out of their classrooms for large blocks of time.

It’s interesting timing as Illinois state lawmakers are showing too little interest in keeping the one thing that worked during the pandemic: school choice.

Scores for public schools were just released and showed only 35% of students in grades 3 through 8 could read at grade level in 2023, according to the Illinois Report Card. Only 27% met proficiency in math.

That is 3 percentage points lower in reading and 5 points lower in math than before the pandemic.

High school juniors taking the SAT posted similar proficiency: 32% could read and 27% do math at grade level.

Illinois Superintendent of Education Tony Sanders said the state has a “significant distance to travel” toward recovery after pandemic-era school closures caused record-low proficiency rates statewide.

Really? You mean Illinois shouldn’t be satisfied when roughly 2 of every 3 students are behind?

The state’s education leaders were spinning the scores as “strong progress” because both elementary reading and math increased from the prior year. They also celebrated the high school graduation rate, which sits at 87.6% for the class of 2023 – the highest it has been in 13 years.

But look back a year at when the graduating class of 2023 were tested as juniors. Just 30% met grade-level standards in reading and 29% in math when they took the state-required SAT in spring 2022.

So, our record graduation rates are basically sending 7 of every 10 young adults out into the world ill-prepared for the demands they will face.

How long will it take for college admissions officers and hiring managers to start saying: “Oh. That’s an Illinois high school diploma. Maybe we should take the Massachusetts grad.”

More: https://www.illinoispolicy.org/policy-shop/the-policy-shop-illinois-last-stand-for-school-choice/

School choice helps URM and lower SES students succeed. But the teachers unions hate the idea, and they will funnel the $$$ they collect from members to sleazy lobbyists solely to fight choice.

“School choice” is code for vouchers. You aren’t getting vouchers.