Wizards and Caps could be moving to Potomac Yard

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:VA resident, Arlington Co. I really, really, really, really wish they'd stay put. This will ruin my quality of life.

Same. I commute down to Alexandria and this is just going to make it even more of a mess.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:This deal is not done, so DC has some hope. Lets pressure the Mayor and DC Council to move aggressively and quickly. Both are important.

Or they can sit back and let the Virginia House of Delegates reject a bad deal, and maybe have a staffer take Teddy’s call when he comes crawling back.

That is not likley if Alexandria is on board.

If I were an Alexandria taxpayer, I would be furious over this.

As an Alexandria taxpayer I like this. City of Alexandria needs to diversify its tax revenue and this will help. Original plans for Potomac Yard envisioned more office buildings in that section, but there’s little demand for new office space and Alexandria is leading the country in office to residential conversions. This whole entertainment district will generate a lot of tax revenue for Alexandria—much more than the empty lots that are currently there.

lol all the tax revenues generated by the project will be used to pay off the hundreds of millions in bond debt that Alexandria will owe to creditors as a result of pitching in to build the facility. Your mayor just sold Alexandria to the bond market for the next 20+ years all while knowing he won’t have to answer to the voters.

Don’t see anything wrong with the revenue from the project being used to pay off bond debt that helped build it.

Right, but Alexandria would be on the hook if the rosy projections of concession and ticket sales do not cover the obligation. Given the difficulty of the location (ie the transportation issues) this is a real risk.

The indoor/outdoor performing arts venue will likely have events almost every day of the year. This will undoubtedly fill Alexandria’s coffers, and pull the renaming musicals and other shows out of downtown DC (namely the National and Warner theaters). Already most prefer to travel to the brand new Capital One Hall in Tysons for shows. Sadly there will just be fewer reasons for a night out on the town in DC with its beautiful architecture and culture. We’ll just drive all the bland new suburban venues. Strathmore, Capital One Hall, the future Potomac Yards performing arts space. Even the Kennedy Center might survive since it’s off of a freeway ramp with a speedy connection to Virginia.

You think that people are going to flock to a suburban venue without parking?

There is the Metroway BRT which runs by lots of empty office and hotel parking garages. The city and Metro can pay for increased frequency. It’ll be like taking the parking shuttle at Disneyland.

DP, but you think, given everything, people will

1) drive from where they are, 30-90 minutes
2) park in some external lot ($20+)
3) wait for a bus
4) ride a bus
5) go to event
6) wait in line for bus
7) ride bus
8)get car
9) drive back to where they came from

Ted is making what had been a 3-4 hour time committment to attend an event into an all day bonanza.

Most people understand that, which is why the teams are being told from their plan holders, that they will not be making this move.

I personally would not but if you consider what it's like taking a trip from Dulles...Good God. I hate flying out of that airport but I do because I want to get to my travel destinations. Never underestimate the power of desire. For fans who want to see their team play, I think they would do this if you market the right way. I would never travel to specific NFL fields because of how inconvenient it is (Soldier Field as I'm from Chicago for example) and yet, people do. I think maybe the Wizards would be hurting because their fans tend to be more urban. But for Caps, I think if they play great, people would do this absolutely. I also think there's a difference n talking about the average person who sees a game out of sheer entertainment and convenience which in DC makes sense. These people would likely not do the above. But there's a lot of people in NOVA/DC and I would even suggest die hard Cap fans in MD who could feasibly do this. Again, I would not do it but not sure how much different it is than going to see a game or doing something that does take a really long time and isn't easy to do but ultimately, you are doing something to see what you want. People have done much crazier stuff!!

Dude. Busy professionals do not have time to turn a simple Caps/Wizards game into a 5-6 hour excursion. Not happening. Even a partial season ticket holder at 10-20 games is not spending the time. For comparison, this busy professional gave up highly desirable Redskins season tickets because did not want to spend all day Sunday at a game, and could not even give away the tickets. I know dozens of former season ticket holders who made the same decision.

And yet the stadium is sold out every weekend.

Narrator: the commanders had their first sellout in many, many years this season when Miami fans packed the stadium.

The Miami Cardinals?

https://commanderswire.usatoday.com/2023/09/01/washington-commanders-2023-nfl-season-sold-out-fedex-field/

You’re right. They did sell that out. So two sellouts this year after not selling out a single game since 2018 (first year I began taking my son to games).

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:This deal is not done, so DC has some hope. Lets pressure the Mayor and DC Council to move aggressively and quickly. Both are important.

Or they can sit back and let the Virginia House of Delegates reject a bad deal, and maybe have a staffer take Teddy’s call when he comes crawling back.

That is not likley if Alexandria is on board.

If I were an Alexandria taxpayer, I would be furious over this.

As an Alexandria taxpayer I like this. City of Alexandria needs to diversify its tax revenue and this will help. Original plans for Potomac Yard envisioned more office buildings in that section, but there’s little demand for new office space and Alexandria is leading the country in office to residential conversions. This whole entertainment district will generate a lot of tax revenue for Alexandria—much more than the empty lots that are currently there.

lol all the tax revenues generated by the project will be used to pay off the hundreds of millions in bond debt that Alexandria will owe to creditors as a result of pitching in to build the facility. Your mayor just sold Alexandria to the bond market for the next 20+ years all while knowing he won’t have to answer to the voters.

Don’t see anything wrong with the revenue from the project being used to pay off bond debt that helped build it.

Right, but Alexandria would be on the hook if the rosy projections of concession and ticket sales do not cover the obligation. Given the difficulty of the location (ie the transportation issues) this is a real risk.

The indoor/outdoor performing arts venue will likely have events almost every day of the year. This will undoubtedly fill Alexandria’s coffers, and pull the renaming musicals and other shows out of downtown DC (namely the National and Warner theaters). Already most prefer to travel to the brand new Capital One Hall in Tysons for shows. Sadly there will just be fewer reasons for a night out on the town in DC with its beautiful architecture and culture. We’ll just drive all the bland new suburban venues. Strathmore, Capital One Hall, the future Potomac Yards performing arts space. Even the Kennedy Center might survive since it’s off of a freeway ramp with a speedy connection to Virginia.

The outdoor music venue under the landing path of National Airport? Ya, that will be real popular.

You can't build an outdoor music venue underwater.

Oh really?

LOL this is comical

The project will likely require a flood wall or some sort of flood remediation system, which will likely balloon the budget for the state and city of Alexandria. Plus, they'd have to get buy-in from the Feds/NPS.

Good luck.

[Anonymous]

The NPS would not sign off on such a project. The impact on wildlife and the river would be contrary to its mission.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The NPS would not sign off on such a project. The impact on wildlife and the river would be contrary to its mission.

Well Potomac Yards was a freight rail yard, one of the largest in the country. But it ran via overhead electrical wires. So the air was clean since the locomotives were electric.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:This deal is not done, so DC has some hope. Lets pressure the Mayor and DC Council to move aggressively and quickly. Both are important.

Or they can sit back and let the Virginia House of Delegates reject a bad deal, and maybe have a staffer take Teddy’s call when he comes crawling back.

That is not likley if Alexandria is on board.

If I were an Alexandria taxpayer, I would be furious over this.

As an Alexandria taxpayer I like this. City of Alexandria needs to diversify its tax revenue and this will help. Original plans for Potomac Yard envisioned more office buildings in that section, but there’s little demand for new office space and Alexandria is leading the country in office to residential conversions. This whole entertainment district will generate a lot of tax revenue for Alexandria—much more than the empty lots that are currently there.

lol all the tax revenues generated by the project will be used to pay off the hundreds of millions in bond debt that Alexandria will owe to creditors as a result of pitching in to build the facility. Your mayor just sold Alexandria to the bond market for the next 20+ years all while knowing he won’t have to answer to the voters.

Don’t see anything wrong with the revenue from the project being used to pay off bond debt that helped build it.

Right, but Alexandria would be on the hook if the rosy projections of concession and ticket sales do not cover the obligation. Given the difficulty of the location (ie the transportation issues) this is a real risk.

The indoor/outdoor performing arts venue will likely have events almost every day of the year. This will undoubtedly fill Alexandria’s coffers, and pull the renaming musicals and other shows out of downtown DC (namely the National and Warner theaters). Already most prefer to travel to the brand new Capital One Hall in Tysons for shows. Sadly there will just be fewer reasons for a night out on the town in DC with its beautiful architecture and culture. We’ll just drive all the bland new suburban venues. Strathmore, Capital One Hall, the future Potomac Yards performing arts space. Even the Kennedy Center might survive since it’s off of a freeway ramp with a speedy connection to Virginia.

The outdoor music venue under the landing path of National Airport? Ya, that will be real popular.

You can't build an outdoor music venue underwater.

Oh really?

LOL this is comical

The project will likely require a flood wall or some sort of flood remediation system, which will likely balloon the budget for the state and city of Alexandria. Plus, they'd have to get buy-in from the Feds/NPS.

Good luck.

Yikes. At this point, arena opponents are throwing the whole pot of spaghetti. Curious to see what sticks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This deal is not done, so DC has some hope. Lets pressure the Mayor and DC Council to move aggressively and quickly. Both are important.

Or they can sit back and let the Virginia House of Delegates reject a bad deal, and maybe have a staffer take Teddy’s call when he comes crawling back.

That is not likley if Alexandria is on board.

If I were an Alexandria taxpayer, I would be furious over this.

As an Alexandria taxpayer I like this. City of Alexandria needs to diversify its tax revenue and this will help. Original plans for Potomac Yard envisioned more office buildings in that section, but there’s little demand for new office space and Alexandria is leading the country in office to residential conversions. This whole entertainment district will generate a lot of tax revenue for Alexandria—much more than the empty lots that are currently there.

lol all the tax revenues generated by the project will be used to pay off the hundreds of millions in bond debt that Alexandria will owe to creditors as a result of pitching in to build the facility. Your mayor just sold Alexandria to the bond market for the next 20+ years all while knowing he won’t have to answer to the voters.

Don’t see anything wrong with the revenue from the project being used to pay off bond debt that helped build it.

Right, but Alexandria would be on the hook if the rosy projections of concession and ticket sales do not cover the obligation. Given the difficulty of the location (ie the transportation issues) this is a real risk.

The indoor/outdoor performing arts venue will likely have events almost every day of the year. This will undoubtedly fill Alexandria’s coffers, and pull the renaming musicals and other shows out of downtown DC (namely the National and Warner theaters). Already most prefer to travel to the brand new Capital One Hall in Tysons for shows. Sadly there will just be fewer reasons for a night out on the town in DC with its beautiful architecture and culture. We’ll just drive all the bland new suburban venues. Strathmore, Capital One Hall, the future Potomac Yards performing arts space. Even the Kennedy Center might survive since it’s off of a freeway ramp with a speedy connection to Virginia.

The outdoor music venue under the landing path of National Airport? Ya, that will be real popular.

You can't build an outdoor music venue underwater.

Oh really?

LOL this is comical

The project will likely require a flood wall or some sort of flood remediation system, which will likely balloon the budget for the state and city of Alexandria. Plus, they'd have to get buy-in from the Feds/NPS.

Good luck.

Yikes. At this point, arena opponents are throwing the whole pot of spaghetti. Curious to see what sticks.

There are two fundamental problems with the proposal:

1) transportation" despite having a metro stop, the site is a challenge for most people to easily get to
2) finances: putting the town of Alexandria on the hook if the sales and concessions revenue doesn't pan out is problematic, particularly given #1 above.

Ted will still get his league and TV revenue. Youngkin gets his "political win" but the people of the city and state get royally screwed.

Unless or until the power players figure out how to sell people on these two issues, it will be a challenge to get through.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The NPS would not sign off on such a project. The impact on wildlife and the river would be contrary to its mission.

Well Potomac Yards was a freight rail yard, one of the largest in the country. But it ran via overhead electrical wires. So the air was clean since the locomotives were electric.

Nevermind that it was a SuperFund site because of all of the industrial toxins.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This deal is not done, so DC has some hope. Lets pressure the Mayor and DC Council to move aggressively and quickly. Both are important.

Or they can sit back and let the Virginia House of Delegates reject a bad deal, and maybe have a staffer take Teddy’s call when he comes crawling back.

That is not likley if Alexandria is on board.

If I were an Alexandria taxpayer, I would be furious over this.

As an Alexandria taxpayer I like this. City of Alexandria needs to diversify its tax revenue and this will help. Original plans for Potomac Yard envisioned more office buildings in that section, but there’s little demand for new office space and Alexandria is leading the country in office to residential conversions. This whole entertainment district will generate a lot of tax revenue for Alexandria—much more than the empty lots that are currently there.

lol all the tax revenues generated by the project will be used to pay off the hundreds of millions in bond debt that Alexandria will owe to creditors as a result of pitching in to build the facility. Your mayor just sold Alexandria to the bond market for the next 20+ years all while knowing he won’t have to answer to the voters.

Don’t see anything wrong with the revenue from the project being used to pay off bond debt that helped build it.

Right, but Alexandria would be on the hook if the rosy projections of concession and ticket sales do not cover the obligation. Given the difficulty of the location (ie the transportation issues) this is a real risk.

The indoor/outdoor performing arts venue will likely have events almost every day of the year. This will undoubtedly fill Alexandria’s coffers, and pull the renaming musicals and other shows out of downtown DC (namely the National and Warner theaters). Already most prefer to travel to the brand new Capital One Hall in Tysons for shows. Sadly there will just be fewer reasons for a night out on the town in DC with its beautiful architecture and culture. We’ll just drive all the bland new suburban venues. Strathmore, Capital One Hall, the future Potomac Yards performing arts space. Even the Kennedy Center might survive since it’s off of a freeway ramp with a speedy connection to Virginia.

The outdoor music venue under the landing path of National Airport? Ya, that will be real popular.

You can't build an outdoor music venue underwater.

Oh really?

LOL this is comical

The project will likely require a flood wall or some sort of flood remediation system, which will likely balloon the budget for the state and city of Alexandria. Plus, they'd have to get buy-in from the Feds/NPS.

Good luck.

Yikes. At this point, arena opponents are throwing the whole pot of spaghetti. Curious to see what sticks.

There are two fundamental problems with the proposal:

1) transportation" despite having a metro stop, the site is a challenge for most people to easily get to
2) finances: putting the town of Alexandria on the hook if the sales and concessions revenue doesn't pan out is problematic, particularly given #1 above.

Ted will still get his league and TV revenue. Youngkin gets his "political win" but the people of the city and state get royally screwed.

Unless or until the power players figure out how to sell people on these two issues, it will be a challenge to get through.

Yes, there are some other possible issues, but these are the big ones.

Youngkin DGAF about the actual consequences. He just wants a "win" on paper.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This deal is not done, so DC has some hope. Lets pressure the Mayor and DC Council to move aggressively and quickly. Both are important.

Or they can sit back and let the Virginia House of Delegates reject a bad deal, and maybe have a staffer take Teddy’s call when he comes crawling back.

That is not likley if Alexandria is on board.

If I were an Alexandria taxpayer, I would be furious over this.

As an Alexandria taxpayer I like this. City of Alexandria needs to diversify its tax revenue and this will help. Original plans for Potomac Yard envisioned more office buildings in that section, but there’s little demand for new office space and Alexandria is leading the country in office to residential conversions. This whole entertainment district will generate a lot of tax revenue for Alexandria—much more than the empty lots that are currently there.

lol all the tax revenues generated by the project will be used to pay off the hundreds of millions in bond debt that Alexandria will owe to creditors as a result of pitching in to build the facility. Your mayor just sold Alexandria to the bond market for the next 20+ years all while knowing he won’t have to answer to the voters.

Don’t see anything wrong with the revenue from the project being used to pay off bond debt that helped build it.

Right, but Alexandria would be on the hook if the rosy projections of concession and ticket sales do not cover the obligation. Given the difficulty of the location (ie the transportation issues) this is a real risk.

The indoor/outdoor performing arts venue will likely have events almost every day of the year. This will undoubtedly fill Alexandria’s coffers, and pull the renaming musicals and other shows out of downtown DC (namely the National and Warner theaters). Already most prefer to travel to the brand new Capital One Hall in Tysons for shows. Sadly there will just be fewer reasons for a night out on the town in DC with its beautiful architecture and culture. We’ll just drive all the bland new suburban venues. Strathmore, Capital One Hall, the future Potomac Yards performing arts space. Even the Kennedy Center might survive since it’s off of a freeway ramp with a speedy connection to Virginia.

The outdoor music venue under the landing path of National Airport? Ya, that will be real popular.

You can't build an outdoor music venue underwater.

Oh really?

LOL this is comical

The project will likely require a flood wall or some sort of flood remediation system, which will likely balloon the budget for the state and city of Alexandria. Plus, they'd have to get buy-in from the Feds/NPS.

Good luck.

How many times did the movie theater that was there flood?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:VA resident, Arlington Co. I really, really, really, really wish they'd stay put. This will ruin my quality of life.

Same. I commute down to Alexandria and this is just going to make it even more of a mess.

Two people will be impacted. We need to shut down this project immediately.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:VA resident, Arlington Co. I really, really, really, really wish they'd stay put. This will ruin my quality of life.

Same. I commute down to Alexandria and this is just going to make it even more of a mess.

Two people will be impacted. We need to shut down this project immediately.

It will negatively impact thousands of the residents and commuters. Not to mention the spectators. It’s only good for Glenn and Ted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The NPS would not sign off on such a project. The impact on wildlife and the river would be contrary to its mission.

Well Potomac Yards was a freight rail yard, one of the largest in the country. But it ran via overhead electrical wires. So the air was clean since the locomotives were electric.

Nevermind that it was a SuperFund site because of all of the industrial toxins.

The freight rail yard was the hub for the tropicana orange juice trains, and not chemical freight. There was no fuel since the trains ran on overhead wires. Any cleanup was minimal and just took a few months at most, maybe less. The Potomac Yards just sat vacant for a time until the Hoyt Cinema and Target opened up.

The section of Potomac Yards in Arlington County became office towers and hotels and no cleanup was needed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The NPS would not sign off on such a project. The impact on wildlife and the river would be contrary to its mission.

Well Potomac Yards was a freight rail yard, one of the largest in the country. But it ran via overhead electrical wires. So the air was clean since the locomotives were electric.

Nevermind that it was a SuperFund site because of all of the industrial toxins.

The freight rail yard was the hub for the tropicana orange juice trains, and not chemical freight. There was no fuel since the trains ran on overhead wires. Any cleanup was minimal and just took a few months at most, maybe less. The Potomac Yards just sat vacant for a time until the Hoyt Cinema and Target opened up.

Which immediately flooded after deafening every customer with airplane noise.

[Anonymous]

Honestly, none of the things people are raising here as very valid reasons this plan should fail — the costs, the flooding, the traffic, etc. — will wind up mattering. Youngkin and Leonsis want it. It'll go through. I wish it wouldn't, as I'd like to see the teams stay in downtown D.C., but I don't really see the point in hoping against reality.