What happened to this California family?

[Anonymous]

I have a 21 lb baby and I also have a 50 lb very furry northern breed dog.

Because I've been following this thread and story, out of curiosity, I put the baby in his pack and on my back and picked up the dog just to test out the hurt dog theory. That is a LOT of weight and distributed very very oddly. On a 109 degree day, the combination is deadly, not to mention the sheer effort involved in just keeping yourself balanced, especially if you're going up and down hills. Even with two people passing them back and forth or taking turns carrying one, it would have been deadly.

[Anonymous]

PP here. Even if dog was clipped to me, the effort/balance required to scale steep inclines with the baby in the pack and the clipped dog would be exhausting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I live in the SW, in an area that is seeing highs in the range of 103-108 (like the day they went hiking). I think the piece of this i STILL cannot understand, is why they were on this hike or what they were doing.

Yes, I know people die all the time of heat stroke. But they KNEW this area, it’s not like many of the cases listed here where it was tourists. I know they’d only lived there a year but that’s plenty of time to be familiar enough with the heat.

Also, living in this desert climate….it’s not like DC. It’s not like the weather is a surprise to anyone. They would have known the forecast for the day. There’s simply no way they didn’t know how hot it was and what was coming. It’s really really hot, every day, for months.

Even assuming that they got a later start than they planned or just somehow didn’t fully realize the heat, there’s no way they wouldn’t have realized soon into their hike that it is REALLY hot out and only getting hotter and there’s no shade. I don’t see why they wouldn’t have anticipated that things were going south. Not in an OMG we are gonna die kind of way. But just in a “this isn’t goood for the baby and really sucks” kind of way. You don’t need to be an expert hiker to discern those things. Why didn’t they turn back sooner into the hike?

Also….1 year olds don’t like to be in hiking carriers for hours. They just don’t. The baby had turned 1 in august.

The whole trip was weirdly conceived.

Now keep a few things in mind….

1. They went somewhere that they likely knew would have no foot traffic
2. They told no one where they were going
3. according to some reports, they did not bring very much water
4. They knew the conditions of the area and where they were going in advance (not clueless tourists)

I go back and forth between FA and heat stroke, but the hike was so ill conceived, and they stuck to it. It strikes me as just not adding up to an accidental hike gone wrong.

+1 (and I also live in the SW) NO ONE in their right mind would go on a hike like this with a baby. OR with a dog you care about at all. Just NO. The only people that do this sort of thing are (1) dumb tourists and (2) reckless young people in their teens and 20s. I just can’t emphasize this enough. If they were alone, it would be more plausible but it would take a special kind of stupid to go out like this with a baby or a dog.

They are either complete idiots who were overconfident and got in completely over their heads, or it’s a murder-suicide. I think the latter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the branches, biker, rock slides, cougar poster. Get with the program. No visible signs of trauma.

Get with the program yourself. I've known from before page 1 there were no signs of trauma. The environment contributes to stress, exertion, and exhaustion. Tripping over rocks, twisting ankles, stepping over fallen trees, fear of mountain lions, all can take a toll and not be visible.

I feel like everyone is discounting the potential for mountain lion involvement.

We should ask Bobcat Girl.

And this is the quality DCUM content that you won’t find on WebSleuths.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the baby died. The father sat down in shock. The mother ran off in panic then heat exhaustion + heat stroke took her out.

The timing just doesn't make sense to me, that they'd all die within a minute or two of each other.

People need to stop being hung up on the exact timing. They might not have died within minutes. It was extremely hot. The baby could have died first (or not), dad sat down, died within an hour or so. Mom tried to go off and didn’t make it. Nothing about the body placement means they died “within minutes” or makes it weird.

[Anonymous]

Dad was overburdened, carrying kid with dog strapped to him. They don't realize how bad they're in trouble. Dad collapses, can't get up. At that point wife probably realizes baby is dead, can't move the husband. She is likely hallucinating bc her brain and organs are cooking. She tries to go for help, doesn't make it far before she cooks to death too.

[Anonymous]

I haven't checked the websleuths thread because when I used to read that forum (years ago) every post on every topic was like that DCUM thread about Chris and Shannan Watts with the one poster who remembered the kids' middle names and birthdays, the placement of the apostrophe in Shannan's name, and all the performative handwringing "oh poor beautiful babies, RIP sweet angels." Every poster was like that. Is that no longer the case?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I haven't checked the websleuths thread because when I used to read that forum (years ago) every post on every topic was like that DCUM thread about Chris and Shannan Watts with the one poster who remembered the kids' middle names and birthdays, the placement of the apostrophe in Shannan's name, and all the performative handwringing "oh poor beautiful babies, RIP sweet angels." Every poster was like that. Is that no longer the case?

It’s still like that for some threads. Lots of prayer hands and RIP posts. I still find the quality of the posts there for this topic much higher than the snarky or useless (Boulder, bobcat) posts on DCUM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Dad was overburdened, carrying kid with dog strapped to him. They don't realize how bad they're in trouble. Dad collapses, can't get up. At that point wife probably realizes baby is dead, can't move the husband. She is likely hallucinating bc her brain and organs are cooking. She tries to go for help, doesn't make it far before she cooks to death too.

This honestly sounds worse than FA. I cannot think of a more miserable way to go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven't checked the websleuths thread because when I used to read that forum (years ago) every post on every topic was like that DCUM thread about Chris and Shannan Watts with the one poster who remembered the kids' middle names and birthdays, the placement of the apostrophe in Shannan's name, and all the performative handwringing "oh poor beautiful babies, RIP sweet angels." Every poster was like that. Is that no longer the case?

It’s still like that for some threads. Lots of prayer hands and RIP posts. I still find the quality of the posts there for this topic much higher than the snarky or useless (Boulder, bobcat) posts on DCUM.

Thanks, I will check it out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a 21 lb baby and I also have a 50 lb very furry northern breed dog.

Because I've been following this thread and story, out of curiosity, I put the baby in his pack and on my back and picked up the dog just to test out the hurt dog theory. That is a LOT of weight and distributed very very oddly. On a 109 degree day, the combination is deadly, not to mention the sheer effort involved in just keeping yourself balanced, especially if you're going up and down hills. Even with two people passing them back and forth or taking turns carrying one, it would have been deadly.

Interesting experiment. You should post your results on WebSleuths.

I also think the immobile dog is what did them in. The mom had that dog for about 8 years and she owned it before she started dating her husband. No way was she going to let them leave the dog behind to rescue at a later time. I honestly think that this is what killed them - trying to transport both the dog and the kid in a day that was rapidly heating to above-normal temps.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting that the linked Update article says a witness saw them that day on the trail.

I wonder about the accuracy of the reporting. The article also said that they told friends and family that they were going on this hike. If that were true, why didn't any of them report the missing sooner?

People don't always check in with family and friends every single day. It was about 1 day later that they were reported missing.

They were reported missing by the nanny as soon as she came into work on Monday and she contacted family members throughout the day when they didn't return.

These two lived in the middle of nowhere, if they were going to disappear that's what happens.

When did nanny report for work? I think the reports say the family was reported missing at 11pm Monday. Or maybe the police search began at 11pm?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^or just sit and wait to die.

Maybe they were sitting to rest and recover. Or father and baby and dog were resting and mom tried to go ahead but didn’t make it far. Just because they were found close together doesn’t mean they were all sitting waiting to die. Also possible dad and baby and dog were resting and waiting for help and don’t know mom had collapsed soon after leaving them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m also convinced that if it’s not murder that they took the wrong trail. Were confused very soon and just kept walking. It makes sense to walk an easy road trail for an hour with the baby and dog but not what they did.

Took the wrong trail… how? Isn’t there just one trail that goes in a loop? Or do you mean they walked out intending to burn back around but got confused and walked forward instead of back the way they came?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the baby died. The father sat down in shock. The mother ran off in panic then heat exhaustion + heat stroke took her out.

The timing just doesn't make sense to me, that they'd all die within a minute or two of each other.

We don't know that they did. They might have all collapsed within minutes of each other (baby dying first - maybe she was too quiet and when they finally checked her they realized she wasn't breathing) and then the adults died were they fell. Could have taken hours. But since they weren't discovered until Tuesday (48 hours later) - it would be possible they were still alive but exhausted and dehydrated on Sunday/Monday.

You can survive without water for three days but you can't survive without water that long in such extreme temperatures. And their cell phones had no reception to call for aid.

That makes more sense, thanks. So sad.