Running Advice - Prioritize Volume Over All?

[Anonymous]

Sorry in advance this is long but I'm just getting overwhelmed by instagram feeding me running advice reels. I am a not serious not elite recreational runner. Just to start out here. I'm not breaking any records. My average outdoor pace is like 11:30. So, just to start the conversation where it belongs haha. I'm a 39 year old woman with three small kids who weighed 50 pounds more three years ago and am still overweight. Again, just to establish what kind of person you're giving advice to.

I spent the 1-2 years losing weight on the peloton. Changed my life! I ran a local 10k that year too just to see if I could do it and have run it every year since. The first year I was at 1:08, the second 1:04. This year I was at 1:05 which was disappointing because I had been doing a LOT of speed work and training on tracks to try to beat an hour but the race itself was on a hot and extremely humid day and the whole pack had higher times than previous years so it was what it was.

I have my eyes set on breaking an hour next summer though. Historically I have done more cycling than running during the year and then ramped up running in June/July for the early August race, but with almost no road running because I had a belief that I had bad feet. And I do have flat feet. But I signed up for a half marathon in October to keep me motivated and have been doing a lot more road running the last few weeks to try to get more exposure to the elements and hills/etc and my feet have been alright. I think weight loss and good shoes are doing the heavy lifting here.

Anyway, my primary focus the last few weeks has been adding volume, but I'm slow! Basically I want to use this year to substantially improve my overall running ability, rather than try to rush progress in the weeks before the race next summer. And trying to sign up for things in the interim to help nudge me along. So my goal is to get to 25 miles this week but since I'm slow this takes a lot of TIME. And then I read online I should be aiming for 7-8 hours of running total. This week I did a long run on Sunday (10.5 miles road/trail, 2:20), a hard outdoor run on Tuesday (5miles, 58min). I intended that run to be a mix of easy and moderate but it was hot out so my HR was pretty high the whole time. Yesterday I did an easy climate controlled zone 2 treadmill run (4miles, just under an hour) intentionally trying to make it EASY to keep zone 2. It felt like, embarrassingly slow. But it also felt manageable even though it was another hour of running. So I'm looking at today and tomorrow and just trying to think.

Do I need to prioritize a speed day? Or should I focus on this zone 2 strategy where it feels really manageable to add volume, but is going to take a lot of time.

Additionally, my husband tore his ACL in June which has meant I have to do a not insubstantial amount of yardwork on the weekend including mowing our lawn with a push mower on a challenging large hill. This seems perhaps unrelated but our yard is really challenging to mow and so while I have been trying to have a 'rest' day on Saturday, it frequently involves this lawn mow which is honestly just not a true rest day. I think mowing my lawn is not insignificantly harder than my hour long zone 2 frankly.

Anyway I don't even know what I'm asking. I feel bombarded by running advice videos on social media that I didn't even sign up for its like the internet just sees me logging more miles so is filling my feed with reinforcing concepts which is scary from the big brother perspective but also kind of messing with my head. My current focus was just 'add volume'. I spent the summer working on speed and feel like volume is where I should have started. Does this seem right? Sorry if this is all over the place. And thanks in advance for any thoughts/advice!

[Anonymous]

I would just, like... do what you enjoy.

Or get a trainer.

[Anonymous]

Buy a coros or garmin watch - do the tests on those - find a plan. Do that plan. Then do it again. Maybe pick a 10k plan. Back out from whenever this event is and go from there. Stop trying to make your own haphazard plans.

You are very unlikely to be at your cardio respiratory ceiling. Additional weight loss makes running a lot easy and faster, but that might come naturally anyways.

[Anonymous]

For what its worth one approach is a lot of speed work if you are short on time. the long 4 hr is good - you need that to get used to it. You wanna run faster then train to run faster.

Tim Ferris wrote about it in his book and got criticized for it. He wrote about a woman who did fast 400 meter runs to prep for a marathon. The speed work not only works your muscles but gets you in the right form. This has been a controversial approach voiced heavily on youtube.

[Anonymous]

So I found that I actually cut my 1/2 marathon time by running slower for the majority of my training days. The concept I follow is run slow to run fast. Now that's not to say I don't also have speed days but basically the majority of my runs are slower than my actual pace. I also work in hills to build endurance but generally I'm looking to run a minute or two slower than my actual desired race day pace.

[Anonymous]

If you are just running to stay in shape, it doesn’t really matter.

If you have a goal of cutting time, in addition to “standard” steady runs you need:

1. Speed days with intervals
2. Low and slow days where you go super long and super slow
3. Weightlifting (full body but esp. legs and core

If you did two regular run days plus one each of these for five workouts a week, you will drop time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Buy a coros or garmin watch - do the tests on those - find a plan. Do that plan. Then do it again. Maybe pick a 10k plan. Back out from whenever this event is and go from there. Stop trying to make your own haphazard plans.

You are very unlikely to be at your cardio respiratory ceiling. Additional weight loss makes running a lot easy and faster, but that might come naturally anyways.

Agree with this. The Garmin Forerunner daily suggested workouts are awesome. Also, doing a long run of 10 miles at 11 minute miles is not slow and is barely recreational

[Anonymous]

majority of your runs should be slow. Sprinkle in some speed work as you approach your race

[Anonymous]

There are 10ks every weekend. Sounds like you are down on yourself for your Aug time. Why not just pick one in Nov and run it! I think you will be pleasantly surprised how much better one does in cool vs horribly hot and humid weather.

Good rule of thumb 80% runs zone 2, and about 1 speed work per week. There are many well known websites with plans for half marathons and all race distances. To stop overthinking it, google, print it out, and follow it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Buy a coros or garmin watch - do the tests on those - find a plan. Do that plan. Then do it again. Maybe pick a 10k plan. Back out from whenever this event is and go from there. Stop trying to make your own haphazard plans.

You are very unlikely to be at your cardio respiratory ceiling. Additional weight loss makes running a lot easy and faster, but that might come naturally anyways.

Agree with this. The Garmin Forerunner daily suggested workouts are awesome. Also, doing a long run of 10 miles at 11 minute miles is not slow and is barely recreational

It was at 13:30 minute miles, not 11. Which most of the rest of the running people seem to think is a snail's pace!

I don't think there is any reason for me to back out of this, the race is a month away and I can do a 10 mile jog. I'm not going to be setting land speed records but it hardly seems unsafe or crazy to do a half on October 6 with my current level of fitness and another four weeks of training.

I feel like my OP was not clear about my question with all these results. The last person got it right, I'm down on myself about my August time (and am not in DC so there aren't 10ks everywhere around me) and trying to think about how to overall increase my load over the course of the next year to just get more serious in general. It isn't about finishing this half at a strong pace, or about doing any one goal. But a more overarching goal of how to improve in endurance running and become the kind of person for whom the 10-11 minute mile runs are the norm instead of the push.

And I have been confused by the advice to focus on adding volume versus focusing on speed. Many websites are like, add volume and speed will come but some are like, focus on speed work. But adding volume and doing speed at the same time is difficult I feel like I can do only one at a time without risking injury. Adding a bunch of zone 2 runs has helped me add volume but I'm going slowwwwwwww in those runs (like 14 minute miles) to stay in zone 2. But my legs are tired because of the increase in time/miles and so adding a speed workout in a week cycle feels like too much.

I dunno I'll just keep plugging away!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Buy a coros or garmin watch - do the tests on those - find a plan. Do that plan. Then do it again. Maybe pick a 10k plan. Back out from whenever this event is and go from there. Stop trying to make your own haphazard plans.

You are very unlikely to be at your cardio respiratory ceiling. Additional weight loss makes running a lot easy and faster, but that might come naturally anyways.

Agree with this. The Garmin Forerunner daily suggested workouts are awesome. Also, doing a long run of 10 miles at 11 minute miles is not slow and is barely recreational

It was at 13:30 minute miles, not 11. Which most of the rest of the running people seem to think is a snail's pace!

I don't think there is any reason for me to back out of this, the race is a month away and I can do a 10 mile jog. I'm not going to be setting land speed records but it hardly seems unsafe or crazy to do a half on October 6 with my current level of fitness and another four weeks of training.

I feel like my OP was not clear about my question with all these results. The last person got it right, I'm down on myself about my August time (and am not in DC so there aren't 10ks everywhere around me) and trying to think about how to overall increase my load over the course of the next year to just get more serious in general. It isn't about finishing this half at a strong pace, or about doing any one goal. But a more overarching goal of how to improve in endurance running and become the kind of person for whom the 10-11 minute mile runs are the norm instead of the push.

And I have been confused by the advice to focus on adding volume versus focusing on speed. Many websites are like, add volume and speed will come but some are like, focus on speed work. But adding volume and doing speed at the same time is difficult I feel like I can do only one at a time without risking injury. Adding a bunch of zone 2 runs has helped me add volume but I'm going slowwwwwwww in those runs (like 14 minute miles) to stay in zone 2. But my legs are tired because of the increase in time/miles and so adding a speed workout in a week cycle feels like too much.

I dunno I'll just keep plugging away!

Those people have been running for years! It takes time. How long have you been running? I have been doing the DSW from Garmin for 6 months and I went from 13:30 to 12:15 at the same heart rate. It's worked really well for me. They aren't that expensive and they aren't that time consuming. I run 4x a week and my long run is only 60-75 minutes. Check out Garmin Watches on Reddit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Buy a coros or garmin watch - do the tests on those - find a plan. Do that plan. Then do it again. Maybe pick a 10k plan. Back out from whenever this event is and go from there. Stop trying to make your own haphazard plans.

You are very unlikely to be at your cardio respiratory ceiling. Additional weight loss makes running a lot easy and faster, but that might come naturally anyways.

Agree with this. The Garmin Forerunner daily suggested workouts are awesome. Also, doing a long run of 10 miles at 11 minute miles is not slow and is barely recreational

It was at 13:30 minute miles, not 11. Which most of the rest of the running people seem to think is a snail's pace!

I don't think there is any reason for me to back out of this, the race is a month away and I can do a 10 mile jog. I'm not going to be setting land speed records but it hardly seems unsafe or crazy to do a half on October 6 with my current level of fitness and another four weeks of training.

I feel like my OP was not clear about my question with all these results. The last person got it right, I'm down on myself about my August time (and am not in DC so there aren't 10ks everywhere around me) and trying to think about how to overall increase my load over the course of the next year to just get more serious in general. It isn't about finishing this half at a strong pace, or about doing any one goal. But a more overarching goal of how to improve in endurance running and become the kind of person for whom the 10-11 minute mile runs are the norm instead of the push.

And I have been confused by the advice to focus on adding volume versus focusing on speed. Many websites are like, add volume and speed will come but some are like, focus on speed work. But adding volume and doing speed at the same time is difficult I feel like I can do only one at a time without risking injury. Adding a bunch of zone 2 runs has helped me add volume but I'm going slowwwwwwww in those runs (like 14 minute miles) to stay in zone 2. But my legs are tired because of the increase in time/miles and so adding a speed workout in a week cycle feels like too much.

I dunno I'll just keep plugging away!

Those people have been running for years! It takes time. How long have you been running? I have been doing the DSW from Garmin for 6 months and I went from 13:30 to 12:15 at the same heart rate. It's worked really well for me. They aren't that expensive and they aren't that time consuming. I run 4x a week and my long run is only 60-75 minutes. Check out Garmin Watches on Reddit.

Do you have to wear the watch all the time? I have a bit of a sensory issue with watches that has prevented me from going into watch world. I'm also a little OBSESSIVE and have been worried getting a watch would be a bit unhealthy for me? I currently have an Oura ring and use the map my run app on my phone for split times outside. I didn't realize the watches had programs integrated in them though. I bought a cheapo $40 one off amazon to try to track paces but really use my phone/map my run much more frequently

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Buy a coros or garmin watch - do the tests on those - find a plan. Do that plan. Then do it again. Maybe pick a 10k plan. Back out from whenever this event is and go from there. Stop trying to make your own haphazard plans.

You are very unlikely to be at your cardio respiratory ceiling. Additional weight loss makes running a lot easy and faster, but that might come naturally anyways.

Agree with this. The Garmin Forerunner daily suggested workouts are awesome. Also, doing a long run of 10 miles at 11 minute miles is not slow and is barely recreational

It was at 13:30 minute miles, not 11. Which most of the rest of the running people seem to think is a snail's pace!

I don't think there is any reason for me to back out of this, the race is a month away and I can do a 10 mile jog. I'm not going to be setting land speed records but it hardly seems unsafe or crazy to do a half on October 6 with my current level of fitness and another four weeks of training.

I feel like my OP was not clear about my question with all these results. The last person got it right, I'm down on myself about my August time (and am not in DC so there aren't 10ks everywhere around me) and trying to think about how to overall increase my load over the course of the next year to just get more serious in general. It isn't about finishing this half at a strong pace, or about doing any one goal. But a more overarching goal of how to improve in endurance running and become the kind of person for whom the 10-11 minute mile runs are the norm instead of the push.

And I have been confused by the advice to focus on adding volume versus focusing on speed. Many websites are like, add volume and speed will come but some are like, focus on speed work. But adding volume and doing speed at the same time is difficult I feel like I can do only one at a time without risking injury. Adding a bunch of zone 2 runs has helped me add volume but I'm going slowwwwwwww in those runs (like 14 minute miles) to stay in zone 2. But my legs are tired because of the increase in time/miles and so adding a speed workout in a week cycle feels like too much.

I dunno I'll just keep plugging away!

Those people have been running for years! It takes time. How long have you been running? I have been doing the DSW from Garmin for 6 months and I went from 13:30 to 12:15 at the same heart rate. It's worked really well for me. They aren't that expensive and they aren't that time consuming. I run 4x a week and my long run is only 60-75 minutes. Check out Garmin Watches on Reddit.

Do you have to wear the watch all the time? I have a bit of a sensory issue with watches that has prevented me from going into watch world. I'm also a little OBSESSIVE and have been worried getting a watch would be a bit unhealthy for me? I currently have an Oura ring and use the map my run app on my phone for split times outside. I didn't realize the watches had programs integrated in them though. I bought a cheapo $40 one off amazon to try to track paces but really use my phone/map my run much more frequently

I wear my watch all the time, but you definitely don't have to. That's just if you want the sleep score and HRV status. You could wear it just for runs if you want. I like that I don't have to bring my phone with me on my run.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Buy a coros or garmin watch - do the tests on those - find a plan. Do that plan. Then do it again. Maybe pick a 10k plan. Back out from whenever this event is and go from there. Stop trying to make your own haphazard plans.

You are very unlikely to be at your cardio respiratory ceiling. Additional weight loss makes running a lot easy and faster, but that might come naturally anyways.

Agree with this. The Garmin Forerunner daily suggested workouts are awesome. Also, doing a long run of 10 miles at 11 minute miles is not slow and is barely recreational

It was at 13:30 minute miles, not 11. Which most of the rest of the running people seem to think is a snail's pace!

I don't think there is any reason for me to back out of this, the race is a month away and I can do a 10 mile jog. I'm not going to be setting land speed records but it hardly seems unsafe or crazy to do a half on October 6 with my current level of fitness and another four weeks of training.

I feel like my OP was not clear about my question with all these results. The last person got it right, I'm down on myself about my August time (and am not in DC so there aren't 10ks everywhere around me) and trying to think about how to overall increase my load over the course of the next year to just get more serious in general. It isn't about finishing this half at a strong pace, or about doing any one goal. But a more overarching goal of how to improve in endurance running and become the kind of person for whom the 10-11 minute mile runs are the norm instead of the push.

And I have been confused by the advice to focus on adding volume versus focusing on speed. Many websites are like, add volume and speed will come but some are like, focus on speed work. But adding volume and doing speed at the same time is difficult I feel like I can do only one at a time without risking injury. Adding a bunch of zone 2 runs has helped me add volume but I'm going slowwwwwwww in those runs (like 14 minute miles) to stay in zone 2. But my legs are tired because of the increase in time/miles and so adding a speed workout in a week cycle feels like too much.

I dunno I'll just keep plugging away!

I mean this is the nicest way possible. I posted the solution which took two sentence to explain earlier.

There are somewhere around 10 billion training programs for all distances. It would be easiest if you had a watch to help you - like a Garmin 265 Forerunner - for example. Pick one of those programs aimed at an event or no event, say 16 weeks out. Maybe a half marathon program. Then, just repeat that plan a few times. The polarization of the training will already be thought out for you and it will be entirely based on time and not distance. Just do that and trust the process and be consistent. And, as a newer running, you are much much much better off running in more ideal temperatures early in the morning than trying to get "heat exposure." None of that heat exposure is going to help you develop your cardio engine at this point.

There are two things that you can improve that make the biggest difference in your running when you are new-ish. 1) your cardio base, 2) weight (nobody likes this one). That's pretty much it. Your form is very unimportant unless there is something so jacked up about your form it is leading to injury. If you want to see some really whacky endurance running form, dial up Matt Hanson or Lion Sanders on youtube (both professional triathletes).

Right now you can't really put in junk miles given your experience. But the way you are explaining all this, you seem to be bouncing around and not really effectively doing the work. So, that leads back to the beginning. Find one of 8000 bazilion plans - Garmin watch based, 80/20, runner's world, for example - and do that plan. Then do it again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Buy a coros or garmin watch - do the tests on those - find a plan. Do that plan. Then do it again. Maybe pick a 10k plan. Back out from whenever this event is and go from there. Stop trying to make your own haphazard plans.

You are very unlikely to be at your cardio respiratory ceiling. Additional weight loss makes running a lot easy and faster, but that might come naturally anyways.

Agree with this. The Garmin Forerunner daily suggested workouts are awesome. Also, doing a long run of 10 miles at 11 minute miles is not slow and is barely recreational

It was at 13:30 minute miles, not 11. Which most of the rest of the running people seem to think is a snail's pace!

I don't think there is any reason for me to back out of this, the race is a month away and I can do a 10 mile jog. I'm not going to be setting land speed records but it hardly seems unsafe or crazy to do a half on October 6 with my current level of fitness and another four weeks of training.

I feel like my OP was not clear about my question with all these results. The last person got it right, I'm down on myself about my August time (and am not in DC so there aren't 10ks everywhere around me) and trying to think about how to overall increase my load over the course of the next year to just get more serious in general. It isn't about finishing this half at a strong pace, or about doing any one goal. But a more overarching goal of how to improve in endurance running and become the kind of person for whom the 10-11 minute mile runs are the norm instead of the push.

And I have been confused by the advice to focus on adding volume versus focusing on speed. Many websites are like, add volume and speed will come but some are like, focus on speed work. But adding volume and doing speed at the same time is difficult I feel like I can do only one at a time without risking injury. Adding a bunch of zone 2 runs has helped me add volume but I'm going slowwwwwwww in those runs (like 14 minute miles) to stay in zone 2. But my legs are tired because of the increase in time/miles and so adding a speed workout in a week cycle feels like too much.

I dunno I'll just keep plugging away!

Those people have been running for years! It takes time. How long have you been running? I have been doing the DSW from Garmin for 6 months and I went from 13:30 to 12:15 at the same heart rate. It's worked really well for me. They aren't that expensive and they aren't that time consuming. I run 4x a week and my long run is only 60-75 minutes. Check out Garmin Watches on Reddit.

Do you have to wear the watch all the time? I have a bit of a sensory issue with watches that has prevented me from going into watch world. I'm also a little OBSESSIVE and have been worried getting a watch would be a bit unhealthy for me? I currently have an Oura ring and use the map my run app on my phone for split times outside. I didn't realize the watches had programs integrated in them though. I bought a cheapo $40 one off amazon to try to track paces but really use my phone/map my run much more frequently

I wear my watch all the time, but you definitely don't have to. That's just if you want the sleep score and HRV status. You could wear it just for runs if you want. I like that I don't have to bring my phone with me on my run.

To add, the Garmin line up has music versions that allow DRM enabled music playlists that play over the bluetooth interface along with structured running workout queues. I have spotify playlists I curated on mine. Who knows, if OP gets a forerunner and gets comfortable swimming in open water, she might end up doing triathlon. What a time to be alive!