3 children dead in private Christian elementary school shooting in TN

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Evelyn Dieckhaus, Hallie Scruggs and William Kinney, who were all 9 years old — and three adults — Cynthia Peak, 61; Katherine Koonce, 60; and Mike Hill, 61— were killed.” https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/live-blog/nashville-school-shooting-covenant-live-updates-rcna76861

I like to put the names of the murdered in the threads whenever these happen, especially when children have been murdered. These people leave behind parents, siblings, friends, coaches, cousins, babysitters and the adults children. So when we tally up the number of victims, we’re not just talking about the dead. We’re talking about all the living left behind too.

I have a younger child close in age to the youngest victims but I don’t even like the ‘especially the child victims’ part. I don’t know.

This vile, senseless tragedy has bothered me so much. Part of it is the pointless focus on the identity of the murderer - I don’t care. Their last act in life was stealing life from others and destroying the psyches of the survivors. I don’t care about controversy regarding transitions and pronouns; the throughline between this and other tragedies was the arsenal this maniac obtained.

Apart from that - I really detest the search for a reason here (not by you, PP). The pointless search for sense in the rubble of self-evident senselessness! Here, because of what I’m terming identity questions and the presumption about the social environment of the school community, there’s been a great deal of victim blaming of the principal, Ms. Koonce - oh, maybe she ruled over a school that permitted terrible bullying or child sexual abuse! Maybe one of the little girls blown to absolute bits, the daughter of the pastor, was targeted by the murderer! But we have no evidence whatsoever of any of those things. And we’ll never have a reason. Ever. None of it will ever make sense.

Just today, released information from the FBI about the mass shooter who slaughtered dozens in Las Vegas indicated that that vile murderer was angered by his interpretation of how casinos treated certain customers. And his solution was not shooting out a casino - it was sniping at joyous audience members of a music festival. His reason had no reason. But hell, he didn’t need one because he had his arsenal, and a big proportion of as-yet undeleted posts here starting around page 4 indicate whaddyagonnado because regulation apparently equals….communism.

I just can’t.

Why release that Vegas info today?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

"Give up those freedoms." So silly.

When does regulation mean giving up? When does regulation mean "being violated"?

The Constitution gives the right to vote. Voting is regulated everywhere.

If you gun fetishists think the 2nd amendment means there can be no regulation of arms sales and ownership, then you have absolutely no argument to make for voter ID laws and all the other ways Republicans try to reduce voting by the poor and minors.

You're missing the point. I'm not arguing about regulation or no regulation. You and others who have responded, don't want to address ANY of the below constitutional concerns.

To get what you want, which is civilian disarmament, then you have to heavily curtail civil rights.

You have to break the 1st amendment such that the government can dictate what information citizens can share with one another to stop 3d printing of firearms.
You have to allow searches without probable cause breaking the 4th amendment.
You have to implement red flag laws to seize property when no crime has been committed, breaking the 5th amendment.
You have to target certain communities which tend to posses arms acquired illegally at a higher rate, which breaks the 14th amendment.

Now you're no longer living in America, but in a police state.

I'm literally just advocating for existing blue state laws at a federal level. Is NY a police state? CT? Obviously their gun laws have some impact given even the criminals in those states turn to red states for gund that kill... Checks notes... Black and brown bodies.

Stop with the exaggeration and lies for what is actually being discussed

What lies?

How do you stop 3d printing of firearms? It's laughably easy to do right now. I guess you haven't heard of ghost guns? Seems like every other crime story on WTOP says they're used.

Stop and frisk works, but blue state NY's NYC implemementation was found illegal and was directed at LatinX and African Americans and racial profiling is illegal.

Red flags haven't made it to the supreme court, but NY's law was found unconstitutional.

Blue state laws don't work when anyone with a $300 3d printer can make them.

Blue state laws don't work when they get tossed out of court for being illegal.

If I had to choose being in a mass shooting with an AR-15 or one with a 3D printed gun with 3D printed bullets, I sure as hell know which one I’d choose.

Take a look at 3d printed glock clones and the "auto gunner" which will make a ar15 receiver for you out of aluminum. That alone with reusing brass and I'd have zero concerns.

Getting a high quality 3D printer, the right materials to print gun and ammo, finding the best plans online (an act that leaves a digital footprint and would be tougher if all that has to go to the dark web), setting up and printing things correctly, vs walking into a gun store and buying 7 weapons and numerous rounds of ammo in a half hour. Hmmm which one will lead to more killing?

There is typically still a lot of additional work involved in 3d printing, even if it isn't a gun. You may actually also need access to a machine shop, milling machines, and other equipment. Or, your "gun" might also easily turn out to be unsafe to fire, or self destruct the first time it's fired and take your hand or face with it. It is definitely not such a simplistic undertaking as "lol oh you can just 3d print guns now"

[Anonymous]

Let's not forget the rights of mass shooters. Who is anyone to say that cannot have access to the assault rifles they want? Because some of us deem their intended use "improper"? Yeah, right.

Protect our precious Second Amendment and the rights of mass shooters. They matter, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Evelyn Dieckhaus, Hallie Scruggs and William Kinney, who were all 9 years old — and three adults — Cynthia Peak, 61; Katherine Koonce, 60; and Mike Hill, 61— were killed.” https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/live-blog/nashville-school-shooting-covenant-live-updates-rcna76861

I like to put the names of the murdered in the threads whenever these happen, especially when children have been murdered. These people leave behind parents, siblings, friends, coaches, cousins, babysitters and the adults children. So when we tally up the number of victims, we’re not just talking about the dead. We’re talking about all the living left behind too.

I have a younger child close in age to the youngest victims but I don’t even like the ‘especially the child victims’ part. I don’t know.

This vile, senseless tragedy has bothered me so much. Part of it is the pointless focus on the identity of the murderer - I don’t care. Their last act in life was stealing life from others and destroying the psyches of the survivors. I don’t care about controversy regarding transitions and pronouns; the throughline between this and other tragedies was the arsenal this maniac obtained.

Apart from that - I really detest the search for a reason here (not by you, PP). The pointless search for sense in the rubble of self-evident senselessness! Here, because of what I’m terming identity questions and the presumption about the social environment of the school community, there’s been a great deal of victim blaming of the principal, Ms. Koonce - oh, maybe she ruled over a school that permitted terrible bullying or child sexual abuse! Maybe one of the little girls blown to absolute bits, the daughter of the pastor, was targeted by the murderer! But we have no evidence whatsoever of any of those things. And we’ll never have a reason. Ever. None of it will ever make sense.

Just today, released information from the FBI about the mass shooter who slaughtered dozens in Las Vegas indicated that that vile murderer was angered by his interpretation of how casinos treated certain customers. And his solution was not shooting out a casino - it was sniping at joyous audience members of a music festival. His reason had no reason. But hell, he didn’t need one because he had his arsenal, and a big proportion of as-yet undeleted posts here starting around page 4 indicate whaddyagonnado because regulation apparently equals….communism.

I just can’t.

+1

+2
I’m the PP who posted the names of the deceased and I think the reason the child murders bother me SO MUCH is because deranged people (with inexplicable access to guns via the GOP’s creepy gun lust) keep targeting children. I think we can all agree that there’s a degree of monstrosity to that, to targeting utter innocents.

The motivation doesn’t matter to me either. The person (I don’t remember what pronouns we decided they were using and I don’t really care to pay that much respect to them) with active mental illness and violent tendencies was able to legally purchase guns and went hunting for babies.

*uck the GOP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Evelyn Dieckhaus, Hallie Scruggs and William Kinney, who were all 9 years old — and three adults — Cynthia Peak, 61; Katherine Koonce, 60; and Mike Hill, 61— were killed.” https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/live-blog/nashville-school-shooting-covenant-live-updates-rcna76861

I like to put the names of the murdered in the threads whenever these happen, especially when children have been murdered. These people leave behind parents, siblings, friends, coaches, cousins, babysitters and the adults children. So when we tally up the number of victims, we’re not just talking about the dead. We’re talking about all the living left behind too.

I have a younger child close in age to the youngest victims but I don’t even like the ‘especially the child victims’ part. I don’t know.

This vile, senseless tragedy has bothered me so much. Part of it is the pointless focus on the identity of the murderer - I don’t care. Their last act in life was stealing life from others and destroying the psyches of the survivors. I don’t care about controversy regarding transitions and pronouns; the throughline between this and other tragedies was the arsenal this maniac obtained.

Apart from that - I really detest the search for a reason here (not by you, PP). The pointless search for sense in the rubble of self-evident senselessness! Here, because of what I’m terming identity questions and the presumption about the social environment of the school community, there’s been a great deal of victim blaming of the principal, Ms. Koonce - oh, maybe she ruled over a school that permitted terrible bullying or child sexual abuse! Maybe one of the little girls blown to absolute bits, the daughter of the pastor, was targeted by the murderer! But we have no evidence whatsoever of any of those things. And we’ll never have a reason. Ever. None of it will ever make sense.

Just today, released information from the FBI about the mass shooter who slaughtered dozens in Las Vegas indicated that that vile murderer was angered by his interpretation of how casinos treated certain customers. And his solution was not shooting out a casino - it was sniping at joyous audience members of a music festival. His reason had no reason. But hell, he didn’t need one because he had his arsenal, and a big proportion of as-yet undeleted posts here starting around page 4 indicate whaddyagonnado because regulation apparently equals….communism.

I just can’t.

+1

+2
I’m the PP who posted the names of the deceased and I think the reason the child murders bother me SO MUCH is because deranged people (with inexplicable access to guns via the GOP’s creepy gun lust) keep targeting children. I think we can all agree that there’s a degree of monstrosity to that, to targeting utter innocents.

The motivation doesn’t matter to me either. The person (I don’t remember what pronouns we decided they were using and I don’t really care to pay that much respect to them) with active mental illness and violent tendencies was able to legally purchase guns and went hunting for babies.

*uck the GOP.

Apparently hunting babies and human juveniles is now an official GOP gun nut sport.

I would have never believed I would be living in a future like this, but here we are.

[Anonymous]

We have a lot more police and a lot more people in prisons than other civilized countries. Being “soft on crime” is not a USA thing. We are a very violent country and have been since our inception. We have a patriarchal culture that encourages clans, gangs, mobs, and outlaws to resolve grievances through violence. It’s who we are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

"Give up those freedoms." So silly.

When does regulation mean giving up? When does regulation mean "being violated"?

The Constitution gives the right to vote. Voting is regulated everywhere.

If you gun fetishists think the 2nd amendment means there can be no regulation of arms sales and ownership, then you have absolutely no argument to make for voter ID laws and all the other ways Republicans try to reduce voting by the poor and minors.

You're missing the point. I'm not arguing about regulation or no regulation. You and others who have responded, don't want to address ANY of the below constitutional concerns.

To get what you want, which is civilian disarmament, then you have to heavily curtail civil rights.

You have to break the 1st amendment such that the government can dictate what information citizens can share with one another to stop 3d printing of firearms.
You have to allow searches without probable cause breaking the 4th amendment.
You have to implement red flag laws to seize property when no crime has been committed, breaking the 5th amendment.
You have to target certain communities which tend to posses arms acquired illegally at a higher rate, which breaks the 14th amendment.

Now you're no longer living in America, but in a police state.

I'm literally just advocating for existing blue state laws at a federal level. Is NY a police state? CT? Obviously their gun laws have some impact given even the criminals in those states turn to red states for gund that kill... Checks notes... Black and brown bodies.

Stop with the exaggeration and lies for what is actually being discussed

What lies?

How do you stop 3d printing of firearms? It's laughably easy to do right now. I guess you haven't heard of ghost guns? Seems like every other crime story on WTOP says they're used.

Stop and frisk works, but blue state NY's NYC implemementation was found illegal and was directed at LatinX and African Americans and racial profiling is illegal.

Red flags haven't made it to the supreme court, but NY's law was found unconstitutional.

Blue state laws don't work when anyone with a $300 3d printer can make them.

Blue state laws don't work when they get tossed out of court for being illegal.

If I had to choose being in a mass shooting with an AR-15 or one with a 3D printed gun with 3D printed bullets, I sure as hell know which one I’d choose.

Take a look at 3d printed glock clones and the "auto gunner" which will make a ar15 receiver for you out of aluminum. That alone with reusing brass and I'd have zero concerns.

Getting a high quality 3D printer, the right materials to print gun and ammo, finding the best plans online (an act that leaves a digital footprint and would be tougher if all that has to go to the dark web), setting up and printing things correctly, vs walking into a gun store and buying 7 weapons and numerous rounds of ammo in a half hour. Hmmm which one will lead to more killing?

There is typically still a lot of additional work involved in 3d printing, even if it isn't a gun. You may actually also need access to a machine shop, milling machines, and other equipment. Or, your "gun" might also easily turn out to be unsafe to fire, or self destruct the first time it's fired and take your hand or face with it. It is definitely not such a simplistic undertaking as "lol oh you can just 3d print guns now"

You try building a p80 yet?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:“Evelyn Dieckhaus, Hallie Scruggs and William Kinney, who were all 9 years old — and three adults — Cynthia Peak, 61; Katherine Koonce, 60; and Mike Hill, 61— were killed.” https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/live-blog/nashville-school-shooting-covenant-live-updates-rcna76861

I like to put the names of the murdered in the threads whenever these happen, especially when children have been murdered. These people leave behind parents, siblings, friends, coaches, cousins, babysitters and the adults children. So when we tally up the number of victims, we’re not just talking about the dead. We’re talking about all the living left behind too.

We are family friends with one of the affected families. They are devastated. There truly are no words. But the same is true when a parent, aunt, cousin, grandparent is senselessly murdered.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Evelyn Dieckhaus, Hallie Scruggs and William Kinney, who were all 9 years old — and three adults — Cynthia Peak, 61; Katherine Koonce, 60; and Mike Hill, 61— were killed.” https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/live-blog/nashville-school-shooting-covenant-live-updates-rcna76861

I like to put the names of the murdered in the threads whenever these happen, especially when children have been murdered. These people leave behind parents, siblings, friends, coaches, cousins, babysitters and the adults children. So when we tally up the number of victims, we’re not just talking about the dead. We’re talking about all the living left behind too.

We are family friends with one of the affected families. They are devastated. There truly are no words. But the same is true when a parent, aunt, cousin, grandparent is senselessly murdered.

I am so, so sorry.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Evelyn Dieckhaus, Hallie Scruggs and William Kinney, who were all 9 years old — and three adults — Cynthia Peak, 61; Katherine Koonce, 60; and Mike Hill, 61— were killed.” https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/live-blog/nashville-school-shooting-covenant-live-updates-rcna76861

I like to put the names of the murdered in the threads whenever these happen, especially when children have been murdered. These people leave behind parents, siblings, friends, coaches, cousins, babysitters and the adults children. So when we tally up the number of victims, we’re not just talking about the dead. We’re talking about all the living left behind too.

We are family friends with one of the affected families. They are devastated. There truly are no words. But the same is true when a parent, aunt, cousin, grandparent is senselessly murdered.

I am so, so sorry.

PP here. We all are.
It is just so utterly wrong that a right to own deadly weapons outweighs the right to live.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Evelyn Dieckhaus, Hallie Scruggs and William Kinney, who were all 9 years old — and three adults — Cynthia Peak, 61; Katherine Koonce, 60; and Mike Hill, 61— were killed.” https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/live-blog/nashville-school-shooting-covenant-live-updates-rcna76861

I like to put the names of the murdered in the threads whenever these happen, especially when children have been murdered. These people leave behind parents, siblings, friends, coaches, cousins, babysitters and the adults children. So when we tally up the number of victims, we’re not just talking about the dead. We’re talking about all the living left behind too.

We are family friends with one of the affected families. They are devastated. There truly are no words. But the same is true when a parent, aunt, cousin, grandparent is senselessly murdered.

I am so sorry. And it is cruel and senseless for anyone to lose a parent or grandparent or aunt or cousin or friend to this. I’m just so sorry.

[Anonymous]

The Nashville community is turning out to shower these families with love and support. We could learn something from them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The Nashville community is turning out to shower these families with love and support. We could learn something from them.

Conversely we could one of the hundred dozen suggestions toward gun control and maybe, just maybe, we won’t have to do this again in a few days for a new set of families. It’s wonderful people are coming out to support them; it still pales in comparison to having their family member here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The Nashville community is turning out to shower these families with love and support. We could learn something from them.

Yes, that human beings are more important than guns.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Nashville community is turning out to shower these families with love and support. We could learn something from them.

Yes, that human beings are more important than guns.

Yup. OR, you’re sick. We don’t need to live in mass murder land, sponsored by maniacs like YOU who soft-pedal the whole reason people like YOU want AR-15s, in order to feel something like a feeling after seeing another 6 people stalked and pulverized to death. Get HELP.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/interactive/2023/ar-15-damage-to-human-body/?utm_campaign=wp_must_reads&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_mustreads&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F39943c0%2F64282b8bf19a510b042fbc29%2F598a0671ade4e26514f92991%2F23%2F62%2F64282b8bf19a510b042fbc29&wp_cu=678aa48f4e1781db2875cc6ecff16b80%7C389c94b2-9ade-11e1-8e4d-12313d1f7406