Private School - has it been worth the money to you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've seen, it's not where you went to school that counts, but what you major in that will determine how successful you will be after college. I know way too many people with liberal arts degrees from ivies that don't have jobs where they earn as much as the kids in my family- bottom tier schools, but kick ass majors= fat paychecks.

not the goal for my kids. In fact, I really hope to raise my kids how I was raised - to think of money as pretty inconsequential and college as an opportunity to learn. I got an English degree and don't have a fat paycheck and am happy and fulfilled, wanting nothing. My brother actually fell in love with the law, because a big-law lawyer and now makes a fat paycheck, but finds money inconsequential and lives much the way I live. I think our houses cost the same!

"money as pretty inconsequential" = my parents paid for my English degree and I don't have to worry about saving money or making money because my parents are my emergency fund.
Money is not inconsequential. It pays for education and housing and food and safety.

nope. dad was in grad school when I was in elementary school - family fo 5 living on a 5,000 graduate stipend in 1979. We were on food stamps! There was no money given to me for my state school, but it was the 80s and I could live off of pell grants and part-time work and a small tuition scholarship. I do not come from money and was suporting myself at 18 (with summers home though I still worked in the summer - I think my parents paid for a meal ticket in the cafeteria one year). I graduated with 10,000 in loans and a liberal arts degree becuase college is about learning not votech. growing up with no littls money and being happy and having a rich childhood is what taught me that money is inconsequential.

I worry how my own kids, living a very middle class childhood in a place where money matters so much will ever learn what I did and thus will have the choices I had. I do feel like not caring about a fat paycheck gave me many more choices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not directly on point, but i'll play devil's advocate: I went to private from grades two through five. My mom pulled me out of public because our in-bounds school had two tracks: immersion (which now everyone loves, so it's crazy to think in the 80s that people were worried this wasn't a great option) and split classes (i.e. 30 kids from 1st and 2nd in one room with 2 teachers - chaos!). I went to all girls school, which cost around $4500 a year back then. I was highly gifted, and spent much of my time doing independent work. My mother was chummy with the vice-principal, who ultimately suggested to her that I transfer to the local public middle school that had a strong gifted program. Apparently, the VP told my mom that their job was to take bright but not stellar young women and get them into good colleges. From a quick scan of facebook, looks like most of my old classmates met upper middle class men and have lots of babies staying home in the same suburb we grew up in. I don't think the school ever saw its role as educating the next supreme court justice. This was in a suburb with good schools, but the private did come anywhere near matching the competitive, academic and special schools that we seem to have today in DC. So definitely a different era and not an apples to apples comparison.

We used to live in Florida, and I would never ever ever send my kids to private there. Most of the people with money in Florida do so through, well, non academic means. Lawyers don't get particularly rich down there. So you have professional atheletes, real estate developers, modeling and film industry, and a lot of people stashing their money from other shady economies (like Russians, Venezuelans etc who likely made money under the counter and needed to get it out). The private schools are consequently a non-academic sh*t show. Crazy drugs, partying and stuff you don't want to think of 16 year olds doing. There is no way I'd put my kid in private there. Very different than DC where there is such an emphasis on education and career.

You are generalizing about Florida's privates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The best formula I see is private in the younger years then an awesome highschool, in MD,VA and even Wilson/Walls- you can't go wrong. This sets a nurturing foundation and love for learning well including all of the play based creative ways that are so important for brain development. I think many have it wrong pushing the private in hs to get into the good schools and fear of "bad elements" in the public schools. The heavy testing and focus on memorization pushing reading and academic skills in the rote ways they do is disputed by most experts.

Most of the relevant academic research I've seen supports the idea that if you can only afford a limited number of years of private school, your money is much better spent at K-5 than 9-12. So much more formation take place during those years, setting in place habits (good and bad) that are much harder to change by the time kids get to high school.

But it would be so hard to tell a kid at 5th Grade graduation, "Yep, it's a great school where you've thrived and made best friends. Time to move to public school where you don't know anyone and won't get the same level of attention from teachers or enrichment."

Yes, we set out to do 6-8 in private after MCPS, but now are looking at private through high school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've seen, it's not where you went to school that counts, but what you major in that will determine how successful you will be after college. I know way too many people with liberal arts degrees from ivies that don't have jobs where they earn as much as the kids in my family- bottom tier schools, but kick ass majors= fat paychecks.

What a horribly limiting way to think about education and success. How crass and spiritually empty to measure success by the size of someone's paycheck. I never viewed education solely as a direct route to a paycheck. I acquired two liberal arts Ivy degrees which I'm sure you would deem worthless. However, my parents and I saw education as a way to enrich the mind and develop some thinking skills along the way. I did graduate work -- also at top Ivies -- and had many doors open to me. I chose work that I found meaningful and hopefully would make a social contribution. I did not go for the largest paycheck, though hat certainly was an option.

PP, you sound like you come from a privileged background. Think hard about that before you knock someone for choosing a major that will benefit them academically. Where did your family's money come from?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The only ones that seem "worth" it are ones that have a progressive model - because or selse it is eventually all the same. Learn about each schools offerings and how they teach and you begin to see how progressive models have a value most privates and publics cannot offer. The rest is just prestigue, smaller class sizes (which don't prove to be better for learning- unless you have a special circumstance).

Totally disagree. Smaller class sizes and relationships with teachers are hugely important and research backs this up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is kind of a silly question. Most parents choose to not drop 40k a year on private school when there is a good public school option. There are benefits of going to private school, but for most those benefits aren't worth hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Many kids have grandparents paying (I'd say most of the alumni kids and many others) and there are tax reasons for doing this. We have two kids in private and my husband and I earn $150,000 a year (there is absolutely no way we could drop $80,000 on tuition).

correct.

Does having the grandparents pay for the legacy kids suggest the legacy kids aren't well off enough on their own to afford it, or that their parents were simply wealthy then and remain wealthy now?

I think it would vary between families, but I would bet that mine is fairly common. We can afford a very nice life, but private school would be a big stretch ($250k hhi). Not impossible, but not ideal. We save a lot, and we will have enough for a nice retirement, and could likely swing college if necessary. My parents were in a similar position when I was a child, but housing and school costs were lower. They have since continued earning and saving and had some inheritence and now have quite a nest egg that will be passed down at some point. Paying for schools is a tax-advantaged way to pass it down. We do not count on any inheritence, however, and would likely follow a similar trajectory where any inheritence would be an unnecessary windfall. So, yes, they have more money now, but that is more because of stage of life than anything else.

This is the same story for us. On some level we have chosen jobs with lower income/higher quality of life and could both earn more if that were necessary. Fortunately grandparents are in a financial position to pay and it is a good tax savings to do so. The truth is, the gravy train will likely end with is, or at the very least with my kids.

How is it a tax savings for grandparents to pay for private school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is kind of a silly question. Most parents choose to not drop 40k a year on private school when there is a good public school option. There are benefits of going to private school, but for most those benefits aren't worth hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Many kids have grandparents paying (I'd say most of the alumni kids and many others) and there are tax reasons for doing this. We have two kids in private and my husband and I earn $150,000 a year (there is absolutely no way we could drop $80,000 on tuition).

correct.

Does having the grandparents pay for the legacy kids suggest the legacy kids aren't well off enough on their own to afford it, or that their parents were simply wealthy then and remain wealthy now?

I think it would vary between families, but I would bet that mine is fairly common. We can afford a very nice life, but private school would be a big stretch ($250k hhi). Not impossible, but not ideal. We save a lot, and we will have enough for a nice retirement, and could likely swing college if necessary. My parents were in a similar position when I was a child, but housing and school costs were lower. They have since continued earning and saving and had some inheritence and now have quite a nest egg that will be passed down at some point. Paying for schools is a tax-advantaged way to pass it down. We do not count on any inheritence, however, and would likely follow a similar trajectory where any inheritence would be an unnecessary windfall. So, yes, they have more money now, but that is more because of stage of life than anything else.

This is the same story for us. On some level we have chosen jobs with lower income/higher quality of life and could both earn more if that were necessary. Fortunately grandparents are in a financial position to pay and it is a good tax savings to do so. The truth is, the gravy train will likely end with is, or at the very least with my kids.

How is it a tax savings for grandparents to pay for private school?

Each Grandparent can give $10,000 a year to each child or grandchild without incurring any gift tax. It also decreases the size of the estate so if you have a large estate, you are decreasing the chance of having to pay estate taxes or inheritance taxes.

[Anonymous]

http://www.retirementwatch.com/GrandkidsSample4.cfm

Here is a better explanation of the tax savings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've seen, it's not where you went to school that counts, but what you major in that will determine how successful you will be after college. I know way too many people with liberal arts degrees from ivies that don't have jobs where they earn as much as the kids in my family- bottom tier schools, but kick ass majors= fat paychecks.

not the goal for my kids. In fact, I really hope to raise my kids how I was raised - to think of money as pretty inconsequential and college as an opportunity to learn. I got an English degree and don't have a fat paycheck and am happy and fulfilled, wanting nothing. My brother actually fell in love with the law, because a big-law lawyer and now makes a fat paycheck, but finds money inconsequential and lives much the way I live. I think our houses cost the same!

"money as pretty inconsequential" = my parents paid for my English degree and I don't have to worry about saving money or making money because my parents are my emergency fund.
Money is not inconsequential. It pays for education and housing and food and safety.

nope. dad was in grad school when I was in elementary school - family fo 5 living on a 5,000 graduate stipend in 1979. We were on food stamps! There was no money given to me for my state school, but it was the 80s and I could live off of pell grants and part-time work and a small tuition scholarship. I do not come from money and was suporting myself at 18 (with summers home though I still worked in the summer - I think my parents paid for a meal ticket in the cafeteria one year). I graduated with 10,000 in loans and a liberal arts degree becuase college is about learning not votech. growing up with no littls money and being happy and having a rich childhood is what taught me that money is inconsequential.

I worry how my own kids, living a very middle class childhood in a place where money matters so much will ever learn what I did and thus will have the choices I had. I do feel like not caring about a fat paycheck gave me many more choices.

I totally relate to this. Grew up in a regular middle class upbringing and had parents who valued hard work, personal responsibility etc. Went to ok public schools, and most would consider my HS not that great, but it was a bit bifurcated (AP/Gifted track and the rest). So, I got what I needed and got out. Skipped around in good undergrad universities trying to find my place (as I think can be common at this age for some), got a grad degree at a good school. I absolutely value the fact that I grew up in a non-sheltered environment that taught me how to get on and get along with lots of different people - really relating to people with money, those without it and everywhere in between. Both racially and economically diverse. I think I was a better person for it, because this also represents the real world in which we live. Fast forward and I'm doing nothing similar to my degree work but make 250-400k/year. DH was also public, similar to me, similar college and grad experiences. We both had international schooling experiences as well in college (that cost less than our universities). He loves what he does and makes 300-500k/year. We both intend to send our kids to NW DC public schools. Why?

Because, while it is nice not to be poor or scraping for money, money does not = contentment/happiness. I think that the greater question being ignored is why are we always trying to push to go to the best of the best and the Ivies (unless YOUR goal for your child is to be super high up in the financial world or president - two of the last areas where it seems to matter) when a different, more relaxed (and still good) education may just put them in a better head-space? It may also give them more drive. Studies have also shown that people/groups make better decisions (for instance, in investing decisions etc) when the groups making the decisions are more heterogeneous (not as homogeneous as a private school can be in economic terms). The constant drive of uber-competitiveness and jealousies that seem to be prevalent at private school just isn't worth it.

We can give our kids great experiences with the money we're not spending on private. In the end, what I *want* for them is to be happy, well-rounded and good people. And I'm not saying that private schools are the source of all evil. Not by any stretch. But I do question them as the path to ultimate happiness. If a kid is smart (AND if they have the internal drive that pushes them), they'll be smart in most any environment and will be a success, by whatever measure is important to them. Always being in the rat race of $$ might not be the most important thing in life and may actually lead them to more unhappiness in the end.

And yes, I also agree that asking this question only in this forum will mostly give you a very self-selected group of people....those who have chosen to spend the money and stay in private (meaning of course they're happy with their choice, so you have the answer almost before you ask). Ask also in the public forum, and you'll probably get a broader spectrum of answers to supplement these and will give yourself a more rounded sample (see earlier note about sampling more diverse opinions in life).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP with the progressive educational philosophy here. What are the six schools that you think I should know about? As I mentioned, I never got a chance to complete my research. I am basing my knowledge mostly from those schools where friends, family members or colleagues send their kids. I did not grow up here, and I actually have not visited many privates here. There are some that really interested me, such as Lowell and Burgundy Farms, that really interested me. But, we live downtown, and any school that we choose would have to be accessible by public transport and/or very easily accessible from Georgetown. I'm not really into Waldorf, it goes to far for me.

Burgundy offers bus service that goes to some areas in DC

[Anonymous]

In contrast to a prior poster, we left fcps for private after 8th grade because we couldn't stand the uber-competitiveness of the kids/families at our public middle school, and saw that TJ was even worse. We liked that most privates require participation in sports, community service and other areas that lead to a much more well-rounded experience. It all depends on the specific schools you are comparing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:But the wealthy public school slacker? Not likely very many of those.

Ummm
Why not? Wealthy public school kids slack, do drugs, etc, too

[Anonymous]

Op's post makes me sad and guilty that I can't provide that for my child. I attended a private school, international school abroad for three years. Absolutely loved it. The biggest thing was I got to choose interesting topics to research I chose projects, I got more input into my education so I was more engaged. I've always enjoyed learning and I don't know if it was influenced by that school or not. But I do know that moving to another country with "excellent" public schools but uninspired teachers tied to a curriculum that emphasized rote memorization was a shock to my system and I found no joy going to school anymore. Those six years were a waste of my life. The three were inspirational.
But I think it also depends on the quality of the schooling not just it being private. I attended my first three years at a different private, not an international school but a local private school with some British influence, and I don't remember it being that enjoyable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op's post makes me sad and guilty that I can't provide that for my child. I attended a private school, international school abroad for three years. Absolutely loved it. The biggest thing was I got to choose interesting topics to research I chose projects, I got more input into my education so I was more engaged. I've always enjoyed learning and I don't know if it was influenced by that school or not. But I do know that moving to another country with "excellent" public schools but uninspired teachers tied to a curriculum that emphasized rote memorization was a shock to my system and I found no joy going to school anymore. Those six years were a waste of my life. The three were inspirational.
But I think it also depends on the quality of the schooling not just it being private. I attended my first three years at a different private, not an international school but a local private school with some British influence, and I don't remember it being that enjoyable.

3 years of local private-> international school-> public school rated excellent

[Anonymous]

To the poster who said that they thought Waldorf education goes too far: I thought the same thing of Waldorf education. But then I toured the school (it was too close to home not to at least go see it. My intention was to smugly check it off my list and never look back.)

I was wrong. It is more than what people write it off as and an amazing education.

The true gem is the high school where it all comes together. Two graduates in recent years have been awarded Fulbright Scholarships.