Where do top students who got rejected early from Ivy/T10 land?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think feeder schools are working well at all this year. My kid goes to one in DC and we know others in NYC and results at the elite universities are way down this year. Tons of deferrals. The pool of schools that the elite colleges are taking kids from is wider each year.

OP, I have a kid in a similar spot and I'm not feeling particularly optimistic. If prestige is important to you I would 100% take the Chicago spot. That is what our college counselor advised as well. my kid is not (she is fine with a school ranked 40).

Disagree with this 100%. OP's kid is clearly a standout (Yale only defers maybe 15% of applicants). If your kid isn't in love with Chicago, don't do it. They WILL have other amazing options. Worst case Cornell, Georgetown, or Duke (hardly a worst case...).

FWIW I have a kid w similar stats who did ED1 Chicago and will go there in the fall. In a best case scenario he would have loved to take a shot at Penn and Yale but he genuinely loved Chicago too. So it made sense to take the bird in the hand, and he's thrilled to be done. But if he hadn't loved Chicago, we wouldn't have done ED for the prestige.

LOL you’re talking like OP’s kid will just get accepted to Duke, Duke is pretty much as selective as Yale these days

Or here. In our school probably 80% of the super high stats kids who get shut out of HYPSM land at Duke, Georgetown, or Cornell. But you're right that 20% don't. So that's a risk you take if you don't do a safer ED2. Personally I think it's worth taking that risk. Real worst case, your kid goes to a state school for a year and transfers to Ivy.

You are on drugs. Or just delusional.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The most important stat is weighted class rank. And even if your school says it doesn’t rank, colleges can figure out. From a public, your unhooked kid needs to be in top 5 percent of class and from a private, top 10 to 15 percent to have a chance at a T20.

When T20s have tens of applications to review, that's doubtful. If a HS doesn't rank, it doesn't rank.

You’d be surprised, counselors might estimate in their letters or schools have awards like cum laude or other academic awards that tip off admissions, especially at schools that regularly send kids to that college. They know.

Assuming multiple kids are applying to a particular t10 school the admissions offer can simply rank the apps. They don't need a GPA, they can calculate that themselves on the basis of the transcript. If there is a legit counselor, he/she will state what tranche of the class the kid is in. It's not rocket science. And if the transcripts are roughly equivalent, which is not uncommon for kids applying to top schools, it's going to be the ECs, letters, awards that differentiate the kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:surprising to see Cornell back then compared to now is still similar amount of students in top 10% in class rank ~86%

Hopkins and Chicago currently at 97%+. Back in 2017, Hopkins and Chicago were both higher than Cornell too.

I think the public parts of Cornell are probably a bit less competitive than the private.

Cornell’s latest classs of 2028 now at 81% of class within top 10% (vs 98% at chicago and 99% at Hopkins) and 55% submitting test scores (similar to hopkins and chicago).

No reason for class rank percent to be that low state side or private. test scores already shown to be lower

How is that class rank stat even possible? Chicago takes over 2% of its class from private high schools that don’t rank.

In our experience, private high schools do rank. They just don't share that with students. Admissions officers write it in their recos though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think feeder schools are working well at all this year. My kid goes to one in DC and we know others in NYC and results at the elite universities are way down this year. Tons of deferrals. The pool of schools that the elite colleges are taking kids from is wider each year.

OP, I have a kid in a similar spot and I'm not feeling particularly optimistic. If prestige is important to you I would 100% take the Chicago spot. That is what our college counselor advised as well. my kid is not (she is fine with a school ranked 40).

Disagree with this 100%. OP's kid is clearly a standout (Yale only defers maybe 15% of applicants). If your kid isn't in love with Chicago, don't do it. They WILL have other amazing options. Worst case Cornell, Georgetown, or Duke (hardly a worst case...).

FWIW I have a kid w similar stats who did ED1 Chicago and will go there in the fall. In a best case scenario he would have loved to take a shot at Penn and Yale but he genuinely loved Chicago too. So it made sense to take the bird in the hand, and he's thrilled to be done. But if he hadn't loved Chicago, we wouldn't have done ED for the prestige.

LOL you’re talking like OP’s kid will just get accepted to Duke, Duke is pretty much as selective as Yale these days

Or here. In our school probably 80% of the super high stats kids who get shut out of HYPSM land at Duke, Georgetown, or Cornell. But you're right that 20% don't. So that's a risk you take if you don't do a safer ED2. Personally I think it's worth taking that risk. Real worst case, your kid goes to a state school for a year and transfers to Ivy.

Transferring to an Ivy is not easy.

Transfer acceptance rates at four-year colleges can range from less than 1% at Ivy League universities to more than 80% at some public institutions.

Transfer rates:
Princeton University 3.1%
Dartmouth College 1.6%
Yale University 1.2%
Harvard University <1%

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am talking about applicants who have the academic stats (1500+, 4.0+, high rigor) but didn't make the cut. Unhooked. What typically happens to them?

Not all kids who have the stats (to enter the lottery) want to attend an Ivy. No sour grapes - they did not like the perceived atmosphere, for right or for wrong

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think feeder schools are working well at all this year. My kid goes to one in DC and we know others in NYC and results at the elite universities are way down this year. Tons of deferrals. The pool of schools that the elite colleges are taking kids from is wider each year.

OP, I have a kid in a similar spot and I'm not feeling particularly optimistic. If prestige is important to you I would 100% take the Chicago spot. That is what our college counselor advised as well. my kid is not (she is fine with a school ranked 40).

Disagree with this 100%. OP's kid is clearly a standout (Yale only defers maybe 15% of applicants). If your kid isn't in love with Chicago, don't do it. They WILL have other amazing options. Worst case Cornell, Georgetown, or Duke (hardly a worst case...).

FWIW I have a kid w similar stats who did ED1 Chicago and will go there in the fall. In a best case scenario he would have loved to take a shot at Penn and Yale but he genuinely loved Chicago too. So it made sense to take the bird in the hand, and he's thrilled to be done. But if he hadn't loved Chicago, we wouldn't have done ED for the prestige.

LOL you’re talking like OP’s kid will just get accepted to Duke, Duke is pretty much as selective as Yale these days

Or here. In our school probably 80% of the super high stats kids who get shut out of HYPSM land at Duke, Georgetown, or Cornell. But you're right that 20% don't. So that's a risk you take if you don't do a safer ED2. Personally I think it's worth taking that risk. Real worst case, your kid goes to a state school for a year and transfers to Ivy.

Transferring to an Ivy is not easy.

Transfer acceptance rates at four-year colleges can range from less than 1% at Ivy League universities to more than 80% at some public institutions.

Transfer rates:
Princeton University 3.1%
Dartmouth College 1.6%
Yale University 1.2%
Harvard University <1%

Penn and Brown ~4%; Cornell 12%

But, with transfer portal rule changes--a lot of these will be athletes. It's still rare. People confuse the ease it is to transfer into public state universities--up to 80%. UVA it's 40%

See the rationale is flawed?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Usually state schools if unhooked. Emory for the strivers.

State schools as in Berkeley/UVA or VT/UMD? And what's wrong with striving for better?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think feeder schools are working well at all this year. My kid goes to one in DC and we know others in NYC and results at the elite universities are way down this year. Tons of deferrals. The pool of schools that the elite colleges are taking kids from is wider each year.

OP, I have a kid in a similar spot and I'm not feeling particularly optimistic. If prestige is important to you I would 100% take the Chicago spot. That is what our college counselor advised as well. my kid is not (she is fine with a school ranked 40).

Disagree with this 100%. OP's kid is clearly a standout (Yale only defers maybe 15% of applicants). If your kid isn't in love with Chicago, don't do it. They WILL have other amazing options. Worst case Cornell, Georgetown, or Duke (hardly a worst case...).

FWIW I have a kid w similar stats who did ED1 Chicago and will go there in the fall. In a best case scenario he would have loved to take a shot at Penn and Yale but he genuinely loved Chicago too. So it made sense to take the bird in the hand, and he's thrilled to be done. But if he hadn't loved Chicago, we wouldn't have done ED for the prestige.

LOL you’re talking like OP’s kid will just get accepted to Duke, Duke is pretty much as selective as Yale these days

Or here. In our school probably 80% of the super high stats kids who get shut out of HYPSM land at Duke, Georgetown, or Cornell. But you're right that 20% don't. So that's a risk you take if you don't do a safer ED2. Personally I think it's worth taking that risk. Real worst case, your kid goes to a state school for a year and transfers to Ivy.

Transferring to an Ivy is not easy.

Transfer acceptance rates at four-year colleges can range from less than 1% at Ivy League universities to more than 80% at some public institutions.

Transfer rates:
Princeton University 3.1%
Dartmouth College 1.6%
Yale University 1.2%
Harvard University <1%

Penn and Brown ~4%; Cornell 12%

But, with transfer portal rule changes--a lot of these will be athletes. It's still rare. People confuse the ease it is to transfer into public state universities--up to 80%. UVA it's 40%

See the rationale is flawed?

UVA is 100% for community college students with a 3.4 cumulative

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think feeder schools are working well at all this year. My kid goes to one in DC and we know others in NYC and results at the elite universities are way down this year. Tons of deferrals. The pool of schools that the elite colleges are taking kids from is wider each year.

OP, I have a kid in a similar spot and I'm not feeling particularly optimistic. If prestige is important to you I would 100% take the Chicago spot. That is what our college counselor advised as well. my kid is not (she is fine with a school ranked 40).

Disagree with this 100%. OP's kid is clearly a standout (Yale only defers maybe 15% of applicants). If your kid isn't in love with Chicago, don't do it. They WILL have other amazing options. Worst case Cornell, Georgetown, or Duke (hardly a worst case...).

FWIW I have a kid w similar stats who did ED1 Chicago and will go there in the fall. In a best case scenario he would have loved to take a shot at Penn and Yale but he genuinely loved Chicago too. So it made sense to take the bird in the hand, and he's thrilled to be done. But if he hadn't loved Chicago, we wouldn't have done ED for the prestige.

LOL you’re talking like OP’s kid will just get accepted to Duke, Duke is pretty much as selective as Yale these days

Or here. In our school probably 80% of the super high stats kids who get shut out of HYPSM land at Duke, Georgetown, or Cornell. But you're right that 20% don't. So that's a risk you take if you don't do a safer ED2. Personally I think it's worth taking that risk. Real worst case, your kid goes to a state school for a year and transfers to Ivy.

Transferring to an Ivy is not easy.

Transfer acceptance rates at four-year colleges can range from less than 1% at Ivy League universities to more than 80% at some public institutions.

Transfer rates:
Princeton University 3.1%
Dartmouth College 1.6%
Yale University 1.2%
Harvard University <1%

Columbia is 52.5%

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think feeder schools are working well at all this year. My kid goes to one in DC and we know others in NYC and results at the elite universities are way down this year. Tons of deferrals. The pool of schools that the elite colleges are taking kids from is wider each year.

OP, I have a kid in a similar spot and I'm not feeling particularly optimistic. If prestige is important to you I would 100% take the Chicago spot. That is what our college counselor advised as well. my kid is not (she is fine with a school ranked 40).

Disagree with this 100%. OP's kid is clearly a standout (Yale only defers maybe 15% of applicants). If your kid isn't in love with Chicago, don't do it. They WILL have other amazing options. Worst case Cornell, Georgetown, or Duke (hardly a worst case...).

FWIW I have a kid w similar stats who did ED1 Chicago and will go there in the fall. In a best case scenario he would have loved to take a shot at Penn and Yale but he genuinely loved Chicago too. So it made sense to take the bird in the hand, and he's thrilled to be done. But if he hadn't loved Chicago, we wouldn't have done ED for the prestige.

This is weird advice, Duke is near impossible from this area.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:surprising to see Cornell back then compared to now is still similar amount of students in top 10% in class rank ~86%

Hopkins and Chicago currently at 97%+. Back in 2017, Hopkins and Chicago were both higher than Cornell too.

I think the public parts of Cornell are probably a bit less competitive than the private.

. Yes , yes they are. It drags down the student body somewhat and makes it more on par with UVA or Michigan

Cornell does seem less selective than Vandy, Emory, WashU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:surprising to see Cornell back then compared to now is still similar amount of students in top 10% in class rank ~86%

Hopkins and Chicago currently at 97%+. Back in 2017, Hopkins and Chicago were both higher than Cornell too.

I think the public parts of Cornell are probably a bit less competitive than the private.

. Yes , yes they are. It drags down the student body somewhat and makes it more on par with UVA or Michigan

Cornell does seem less selective than Vandy, Emory, WashU.

Funny….sure….on par with UVA or Michigan…..they would DREAM to be Cornell….Even Cornell Public Schools are the TOP programs in the US. ILR, Agriculture, etc…..

[Anonymous]

Columbia is 52.5%

Does this include GS? Otherwise it makes no sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am talking about applicants who have the academic stats (1500+, 4.0+, high rigor) but didn't make the cut. Unhooked. What typically happens to them?

Many kids primarily attend ED2 schools through ED2 or RD. Also, many end up at state flagship universities.

This is what I observe with top students these days, which explains why the caliber of students is not so different from that of Ivy League schools and other institutions we often discuss on this board.

The concentration of elites is no longer centralized, and talent is everywhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am talking about applicants who have the academic stats (1500+, 4.0+, high rigor) but didn't make the cut. Unhooked. What typically happens to them?

Many kids primarily attend ED2 schools through ED2 or RD. Also, many end up at state flagship universities.

This is what I observe with top students these days, which explains why the caliber of students is not so different from that of Ivy League schools and other institutions we often discuss on this board.

The concentration of elites is no longer centralized, and talent is everywhere.

Will start to be concentrated again when the demographic cliff hits