If every kid is doing the same damn EC

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

Discussed by a former Vanderbilt AO here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ApplyingToCollege/comments/v6bdz7/the_type_of_ecs_i_wish_i_saw_more_of_as_a/

"There are ECs that are impressive and there are ECs that are memorable – and they aren’t always the same.

I’ve reviewed countless applications from debate champions, but only one from a girl who plays drums in a Led Zeppelin cover band. I’ve seen a lot of varsity tennis, but only one student who was a Pokémon card game champion.

Heck, when I applied to college, I focused my activities section on volunteering, debate, and school clubs while completely failing to mention fronting a sloppy punk rock band where we wrote songs, released an album, and played a bunch of shows.

I want you to broaden the scope of what you value as extracurricular engagement."

this guy seems extremely immature.

College admissions is a scam. There is no clear cut way that works for Ivy League. Think about who profits from this crazy athletics madness that we all buy into? Travel sports, competitions etc.. and from such a young age too. Kids miss out on their childhood and parents miss out on the time with their kids and family.. all in the name of college admissions..
lets face it, we are all sheep and don’t want to be left behind in this race to nowhere.

Don't buy in. One of my kids refused the athletics madness (sports competitions).
Did great in the app process (many T20 admits). Had a very unique distinctive hobby though that took up a LOT of time.

Ask your kid what they like. Are they curious? Do they spend time watching videos on YouTube? Podcast?
Develop and nature those interests.

Seconding this! Don’t buy in! Five T15 admits unhooked. All the top stats and top scores in the hardest classes, but also had unique ECs and hobbies. Concertmaster was on the list too but not one of the top three activities/ECs based on impact and deep involvement

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are tons of kids who get into top colleges with the formula of:

Top grades in hardest tracks
Tippy top test scores
Enough ECs to pass muster as well rounded

This was me and most of my friends, who were all top 25% (and usually top 10%) at Ivy graduation.

Unless you and most of your friends went to ivies within the last 2 (maybe 3) years, your experience is not relevant to how college admissions is now.

Actually, this year and next year will be different from the last two years as well. College admissions has been in constant flux since the class of 2021 applied; no two years have been quite the same since then: Covid class '20 admissions was normal, then deferrals and WL movements went crazy due to COVID; post covid class '21 started TO, dealing with last years deferrals returning; not enough dorm space, new deferrals, and tons of WL movement; '22 TO continuing with tons of deferred kids taking back spots and shrinking the incoming class; '23 TO continues, but starts to claw back, with class sizes normalizing plus explosion of admissions for "alternate start" options like start abroad, other campuses, etc. (always had some of this but it went crazy after COVID as they struggled to get back to class size averages); '24 new AA Supreme court case, plus TO continues to revert in some schools; '25 legacy disappears in many schools coast to coast, schools still grapple with AA changes, TO continues to revert in even more schools -- essentially the rules for each school are different which changes kids lists and strategies yet again). All of this can change what kids try to highlight in their applications. Who knows what next year will look like?

Things will get more normalized when test scores are required again.
Trying to read the tea leaves without any frikking tea leaves has been difficult for the admissions committees.

I don't think test scores will be required again for outside of top 20 anytime soon.

Probably top 50.
Those are the places we are talking about.

No one really cares whether Tulane prefers the mandolin over the ukelele.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

And this is why schools like Harvard, Stanford, Princeton, Duke, and Northwestern prioritize “individual achievement, notoriety, success, or ranking” in non-academic areas.

These kids with some sort of fame, including an individual random “hobby” that will garner continued national recognition or achievement matter a lot more than a perfect scores and perfect grades.

A university wants successful accomplished and famous alumni.
A larger predictor of that is this exact type of individual drive/creativity and success in HS.
Test scores and grades do not get you there.
This is the entire point or reason behind holistic admissions.

Test scores a better predictor of success after college than almost anything else.
Everything from peer reviewed publications to financial success to scientific accomplishments.
If a 1600 SAT ukelele player is somehow more prone to success than a 1600 violin player, I would bet it has more to do with their risk tolerance and willingness to do new things.

Test scores are a predictor of someone doing well in a middle management job and maxing out at $350k a year.
That is not "success" in a T20 college eyes. Sure, they need some of those poeple....but they are willing to take a bet/leap on the more interesting creative kids who won't play by the rules.

Let me guess which one is your kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

This sounds like a made up story based on what is largely true in admissions…what school?

The 2 kids in a "rock band" at our private got into EVERY T20 they applied to last year. Not top of class.

Did you read what I wrote…it is true they want diversity of all kinds in their class. What is made up is her story about hearing all that at a party.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

Yes...I got the idea. You are being screwed if you are Asian-American by the AO.

So, you can be a OnlyFans ho and call yourself an influencer who has monitized herself. And then you can get in Ivy schools.

I think we get the idea so well that Asian-Americans have started going to in-state flagships with full tuition paid by the university. They have raised the profile of these state universities (looking at you UMD) and now the average non-Asian Joe is not getting admission in the state schools. Who is impacting most? Well, the OnlyFans influencer.

If an Asian-American does not get into any Ivy school, it is because they are no longer applying to Ivies, no longer applying to private schools and mostly applying to in-state flagships in sought after STEM courses. Oh, and the tuition they are saving by getting essentially free college education is being invested so that they can become wealthy.

I love that the powers that be are too dumb to realize how Asians have made lemonade with the lemons handed to them. Putting obstacles in the path of Asians always backfires.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

Yes...I got the idea. You are being screwed if you are Asian-American by the AO.

So, you can be a OnlyFans ho and call yourself an influencer who has monitized herself. And then you can get in Ivy schools.

I think we get the idea so well that Asian-Americans have started going to in-state flagships with full tuition paid by the university. They have raised the profile of these state universities (looking at you UMD) and now the average non-Asian Joe is not getting admission in the state schools. Who is impacting most? Well, the OnlyFans influencer.

If an Asian-American does not get into any Ivy school, it is because they are no longer applying to Ivies, no longer applying to private schools and mostly applying to in-state flagships in sought after STEM courses. Oh, and the tuition they are saving by getting essentially free college education is being invested so that they can become wealthy.

I love that the powers that be are too dumb to realize how Asians have made lemonade with the lemons handed to them. Putting obstacles in the path of Asians always backfires.

There are no shortage of Asians at the top private schools, nor a shortage of applying, nor a shortage gaining acceptance.

Just like generations or other races/ethnicities before them, they now better understand the game and are more than willing to play it well.

I doubt successful OnlyFans participants are all that eager to attend college, much less an Ivy league college. Interesting that is where you go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

And this is why schools like Harvard, Stanford, Princeton, Duke, and Northwestern prioritize “individual achievement, notoriety, success, or ranking” in non-academic areas.

These kids with some sort of fame, including an individual random “hobby” that will garner continued national recognition or achievement matter a lot more than a perfect scores and perfect grades.

A university wants successful accomplished and famous alumni.
A larger predictor of that is this exact type of individual drive/creativity and success in HS.
Test scores and grades do not get you there.
This is the entire point or reason behind holistic admissions.

Test scores a better predictor of success after college than almost anything else.
Everything from peer reviewed publications to financial success to scientific accomplishments.
If a 1600 SAT ukelele player is somehow more prone to success than a 1600 violin player, I would bet it has more to do with their risk tolerance and willingness to do new things.

Test scores are a predictor of someone doing well in a middle management job and maxing out at $350k a year.
That is not "success" in a T20 college eyes. Sure, they need some of those poeple....but they are willing to take a bet/leap on the more interesting creative kids who won't play by the rules.

Let me guess which one is your kid.

In that case, this process is doing it's job of finding and encouraging the next generation of SBFs and Holmeses just fine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

And this is why schools like Harvard, Stanford, Princeton, Duke, and Northwestern prioritize “individual achievement, notoriety, success, or ranking” in non-academic areas.

These kids with some sort of fame, including an individual random “hobby” that will garner continued national recognition or achievement matter a lot more than a perfect scores and perfect grades.

A university wants successful accomplished and famous alumni.
A larger predictor of that is this exact type of individual drive/creativity and success in HS.
Test scores and grades do not get you there.
This is the entire point or reason behind holistic admissions.

Test scores a better predictor of success after college than almost anything else.
Everything from peer reviewed publications to financial success to scientific accomplishments.
If a 1600 SAT ukelele player is somehow more prone to success than a 1600 violin player, I would bet it has more to do with their risk tolerance and willingness to do new things.

at this point violin is riskier than ukulele.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

Liar. Last year, at a work party, an AO told you that essentially they are violating the supreme court ruling. I’ll take things that never happened for $800.

[Anonymous]

Prestige conscious parents will never stop buying into this scam. They will keep subjecting their kids to this nonsense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

And this is why schools like Harvard, Stanford, Princeton, Duke, and Northwestern prioritize “individual achievement, notoriety, success, or ranking” in non-academic areas.

These kids with some sort of fame, including an individual random “hobby” that will garner continued national recognition or achievement matter a lot more than a perfect scores and perfect grades.

A university wants successful accomplished and famous alumni.
A larger predictor of that is this exact type of individual drive/creativity and success in HS.
Test scores and grades do not get you there.
This is the entire point or reason behind holistic admissions.

Test scores a better predictor of success after college than almost anything else.
Everything from peer reviewed publications to financial success to scientific accomplishments.
If a 1600 SAT ukelele player is somehow more prone to success than a 1600 violin player, I would bet it has more to do with their risk tolerance and willingness to do new things.

Test scores are a predictor of someone doing well in a middle management job and maxing out at $350k a year.
That is not "success" in a T20 college eyes. Sure, they need some of those poeple....but they are willing to take a bet/leap on the more interesting creative kids who won't play by the rules.

Let me guess which one is your kid.

Only a small fraction of Ivy League graduates are making 350k/year at any point in their lives.. A vast majority would be ecstatic to get there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

Discussed by a former Vanderbilt AO here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ApplyingToCollege/comments/v6bdz7/the_type_of_ecs_i_wish_i_saw_more_of_as_a/

"There are ECs that are impressive and there are ECs that are memorable – and they aren’t always the same.

I’ve reviewed countless applications from debate champions, but only one from a girl who plays drums in a Led Zeppelin cover band. I’ve seen a lot of varsity tennis, but only one student who was a Pokémon card game champion.

Heck, when I applied to college, I focused my activities section on volunteering, debate, and school clubs while completely failing to mention fronting a sloppy punk rock band where we wrote songs, released an album, and played a bunch of shows.

I want you to broaden the scope of what you value as extracurricular engagement."

this guy seems extremely immature.

College admissions is a scam. There is no clear cut way that works for Ivy League. Think about who profits from this crazy athletics madness that we all buy into? Travel sports, competitions etc.. and from such a young age too. Kids miss out on their childhood and parents miss out on the time with their kids and family.. all in the name of college admissions..
lets face it, we are all sheep and don’t want to be left behind in this race to nowhere.

Don't buy in. One of my kids refused the athletics madness (sports competitions).
Did great in the app process (many T20 admits). Had a very unique distinctive hobby though that took up a LOT of time.

Ask your kid what they like. Are they curious? Do they spend time watching videos on YouTube? Podcast?
Develop and nature those interests.

Seconding this! Don’t buy in! Five T15 admits unhooked. All the top stats and top scores in the hardest classes, but also had unique ECs and hobbies. Concertmaster was on the list too but not one of the top three activities/ECs based on impact and deep involvement

Really? What orchestra?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

Yes...I got the idea. You are being screwed if you are Asian-American by the AO.

So, you can be a OnlyFans ho and call yourself an influencer who has monitized herself. And then you can get in Ivy schools.

I think we get the idea so well that Asian-Americans have started going to in-state flagships with full tuition paid by the university. They have raised the profile of these state universities (looking at you UMD) and now the average non-Asian Joe is not getting admission in the state schools. Who is impacting most? Well, the OnlyFans influencer.

If an Asian-American does not get into any Ivy school, it is because they are no longer applying to Ivies, no longer applying to private schools and mostly applying to in-state flagships in sought after STEM courses. Oh, and the tuition they are saving by getting essentially free college education is being invested so that they can become wealthy.

I love that the powers that be are too dumb to realize how Asians have made lemonade with the lemons handed to them. Putting obstacles in the path of Asians always backfires.

There are no shortage of Asians at the top private schools, nor a shortage of applying, nor a shortage gaining acceptance.

Just like generations or other races/ethnicities before them, they now better understand the game and are more than willing to play it well.

I doubt successful OnlyFans participants are all that eager to attend college, much less an Ivy league college. Interesting that is where you go.

Oh they do. Especially the SoCal crowd.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

And this is why schools like Harvard, Stanford, Princeton, Duke, and Northwestern prioritize “individual achievement, notoriety, success, or ranking” in non-academic areas.

These kids with some sort of fame, including an individual random “hobby” that will garner continued national recognition or achievement matter a lot more than a perfect scores and perfect grades.

A university wants successful accomplished and famous alumni.
A larger predictor of that is this exact type of individual drive/creativity and success in HS.
Test scores and grades do not get you there.
This is the entire point or reason behind holistic admissions.

Test scores a better predictor of success after college than almost anything else.
Everything from peer reviewed publications to financial success to scientific accomplishments.
If a 1600 SAT ukelele player is somehow more prone to success than a 1600 violin player, I would bet it has more to do with their risk tolerance and willingness to do new things.

Test scores are a predictor of someone doing well in a middle management job and maxing out at $350k a year.
That is not "success" in a T20 college eyes. Sure, they need some of those poeple....but they are willing to take a bet/leap on the more interesting creative kids who won't play by the rules.

Let me guess which one is your kid.

Only a small fraction of Ivy League graduates are making 350k/year at any point in their lives.. A vast majority would be ecstatic to get there.

Whatever small fraction do, is still many times that of graduates of other schools on a per capita basis.

So, I don't get the point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of my coworkers' wife, who is an AO at an Ivy, said this to me at the company last year Christmas party:

How to get rejected by Ivies:
- I have 4.0 GPA with 12 AP classes
​AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I am the violin first chair in the orchestra,
AO response: There are 1200 Asian kids with the same achievement

- I score 1570+ on the SAT
AO response: There are 1500 Asian kids with the same score as you

- I am an accomplished pianist
AO response: There are 800 Asian kids that can play piano just as good as you, if not better

- I found a nonprofit to help the homeless:
​AO response: There are 500 Asian kids that also do the same thing like you

How to get accepted by Ivies:

- I can play guitar like Slash of Guns 'n Roses. I can show you how I play "November Rain" or "sweet child o mine"
AO response: Now that's unique. We would love to have you at the university

- I have a TikTok influencer with over 2M followers
AO response: Amazing. You know how to monetize your influence. It means more exposure for the university. Welcome to the university.

You get the idea...

And this is why schools like Harvard, Stanford, Princeton, Duke, and Northwestern prioritize “individual achievement, notoriety, success, or ranking” in non-academic areas.

These kids with some sort of fame, including an individual random “hobby” that will garner continued national recognition or achievement matter a lot more than a perfect scores and perfect grades.

A university wants successful accomplished and famous alumni.
A larger predictor of that is this exact type of individual drive/creativity and success in HS.
Test scores and grades do not get you there.
This is the entire point or reason behind holistic admissions.

Test scores a better predictor of success after college than almost anything else.
Everything from peer reviewed publications to financial success to scientific accomplishments.
If a 1600 SAT ukelele player is somehow more prone to success than a 1600 violin player, I would bet it has more to do with their risk tolerance and willingness to do new things.

Test scores are a predictor of someone doing well in a middle management job and maxing out at $350k a year.
That is not "success" in a T20 college eyes. Sure, they need some of those poeple....but they are willing to take a bet/leap on the more interesting creative kids who won't play by the rules.

Let me guess which one is your kid.

Only a small fraction of Ivy League graduates are making 350k/year at any point in their lives.. A vast majority would be ecstatic to get there.

Whatever small fraction do, is still many times that of graduates of other schools on a per capita basis.

So, I don't get the point.

Who cares whether the school graduates 2 or 3 billionaires. It won't be your kids. It's stupid to base your admission policies on that (which I don't think they do, to be honest).