Lack of independent play is creating mental health crisis among kids today -- and overprotective parenting is to blame

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Most everyone who is replying here realizes that this would be beneficial for their child yet is coming up with excuses as to why they can't or won't do it. Kinda sad, really.

The first step to making this happen here is to drastically reduce screen time. That isn't easy but it then forces their hand. For our children, they will play some inside but there is only so much of that they will do until they go outside to play. Access to screens just short-circuits this dynamic. Also, we make regular visits to some of the bigger playground parks - there are always kids and they love these trips. Our kids are all under 12 and we've been doing this their whole lives so YMMV.

Do you work?

Yes, I do. Spouse works as well and we also own a small business.

What do you do that you don't have any time to take your kids to a playground or let them play outside?

When do you you have time to take kids to the park if you work? Are you part time?

I work full-time. Spouse works 3 10 hour days and the business is some weekends, mostly. The kids play outside after school and we go to a playground a couple or few times a week, some of those being on weekends. We are no screens Sunday evening until Friday evening("movie night") but we've done this since day one. If you are trying to start this from scratch w/ a 7-12 yo, it's going to be harder.

At the end of the day, you have time for that which you give priority to make time for. In addition to sports/EC's we've made this a priority so the time is there.

Right this afternoon, at this very moment, they decided they wanted to rake leaves in the front yard so they'd have a pile to jump in so that's today's spontaneous unstructured play. If there was a screen as an option, that would never happen.

So at that moment - 4:30pm - you were at home not working?

Yes, I was off work and picked up the kids. Like I said, we have prioritized this.

If you're not currently able to do this, it's because other things are a priority for you and this is not.

NP here. I’m not home by 4:30 because paying my rent is a priority for me. I wish I could be home that early!

Yes, of course - different priorities. My priorities also include paying for food and shelter(that goes w/o saying, I think).

Instead of "wishing" - you should envision a future where you can do both and then plan and execute the necessary steps to get there.

Sorry I don’t want to train for a new career in my 40’s.

Right, I get it - it's not a priority for what you want for your kids, it is what it is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As though aftercare isn't a Lord of the Flies free for all...

Yeah, I'm trying to understand why folks think aftercare or summer day camp is part of this particular problem. Both after care and traditional day camps (not talking about academic or specialty camps) are A LOT of unstructured play and a lot of it is outside and active. At my DD's camp last year she had a big free swim every afternoon (no different than going to the pool with friends) and overall I'd say a good 60% of the day was unstructured hanging out with peers -- jumping on trampolines, swinging in hammocks, making friendship bracelets and chatting, stuff like that... Certainly no screens! My kindergarten niece looooooves after care because it's truly just a big playdate. These things are not the problem.

I think a child does suffer for being truly over-scheduled with STRUCTURED activities, so they don't have time for playing with friends (whether its running around with neighborhood kids, playdates, aftercare, at day camp, etc.). You kid doesn't have to free roam though to have unstructured play with peers. And a balance with some structured activities is ok too.

+1 My son is in 6th grade and chose after care over riding the bus home this year. He likes it so much that he wants to stay longer than he even needs to every day. I'm friends with the director and I know it's 98% free play time. He's made some good friends there. They make up games on the playground or in the gym, or just hang out and talk and goof around.

It's different than running around an entire neighborhood unsupervised. But I do appreciate the unstructured atmosphere.

As an aside, we went to a friend's neighborhood to trick or treat, and I let ds join a small group of other 6th graders to run off unsupervised for an hour. I was so anxious and unsure about it. I kept having to remind myself that I was OF COURSE trick or treating unsupervised at that age. And walking to school and riding my bike alone to the store and running around with friends through neighborhoods. In the end I was glad he had the opportunity. I

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with this - but I think the problem is both overbearing parents AND parents constantly turning to screen time

Parents are turning to screen time because it’s impossible to do the adult life stuff and be your kids playmate. But you can’t just send them out, even though that’s what’s best for them.

It’s all interrelated

We had no cable tv, and my parents did "adult stuff" while we played by ourselves. My parents never played with us. That's a more recent thing, and I think part of the problem. Parents feel like they *have* to play with their kids. Kids won't find other kids to play with if mommy and daddy play with them all the time, or they have structured activities everyday. It becomes a vicious circle.

Just back off and let your kids figure it out. I'm not saying never play with your kids, but other kids should be their main source of playmates, not the parents or activities.

This is a situation where talking about "parents" as a monolith just doesn't work. And also why a tendency to view the past nostalgically, and the present critically, can lead you astray.

It's true that parents today are more likely to feel like they "have" to play with their kids. But why is that? In my case, it's because I was raised by people who actively disliked their children, and that had a negative impact on me both as a kid and as an adult. So I do feel I have an obligation to spend time with my kids, get to know them, take an interest in what they are interested in. But it's not driven by some vague cultural notion or just being a martyr. Is based on my own experience and a recognition that ignoring your kids and telling them, always, to please leave mommy and daddy alone, might have a negative impact on their psyche. I don't want my kids to have to spend two decades in therapy, as I have, building the scaffolding of a sense of self worth, because I am too busy or disinterested to play with them. So yes, I sometimes force myself to play with my kids even when I'm not really in the mood.

Now, I know that not all parents had my experience as a child. But I also no that I am nowhere near alone in it. My parents were the way they were for a few reasons, and they are common: (1) they were raised by Greatest Generation parents who were also alcoholics with untreated mental illness, including PTSD from the war/depression, and (2) they had kids young and out of obligation, and did not really view not having kids as an option. This is an extremely common combination of factors for people who had kids in the 1970s and 80s, and it often resulted in the kind of parental neglect I experienced, which means that a lot of people parenting today are working to correct that pattern with their own kids.

Yes people are sometimes overzealous, and I think parents could stand to be told, more often, "It's okay to take breaks from your kids, and it's okay to let your kids figure stuff out." But parents aren't playing with their kids or focusing on their kids because they are control freaks or because they are subscribing to some crackpot parenting technique they learned on Tik Tok. Most of the time parents are spending time with their kids in an effort to undo generational trauma. That's actually good! Why don't we talk more about how that's actually good?

All well said.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is obvious to me as a parent.

However, every time I try to let my older elementary school kids play independently another parent or older adult in our neighborhood says something negative about it.

Stop the threat of CPS if a parent takes their eyes off their perfectly old enough children and then their mental health will improve.

Examples? I'm having a hard time picturing this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Most everyone who is replying here realizes that this would be beneficial for their child yet is coming up with excuses as to why they can't or won't do it. Kinda sad, really.

The first step to making this happen here is to drastically reduce screen time. That isn't easy but it then forces their hand. For our children, they will play some inside but there is only so much of that they will do until they go outside to play. Access to screens just short-circuits this dynamic. Also, we make regular visits to some of the bigger playground parks - there are always kids and they love these trips. Our kids are all under 12 and we've been doing this their whole lives so YMMV.

Do you work?

Yes, I do. Spouse works as well and we also own a small business.

What do you do that you don't have any time to take your kids to a playground or let them play outside?

When do you you have time to take kids to the park if you work? Are you part time?

I work full-time. Spouse works 3 10 hour days and the business is some weekends, mostly. The kids play outside after school and we go to a playground a couple or few times a week, some of those being on weekends. We are no screens Sunday evening until Friday evening("movie night") but we've done this since day one. If you are trying to start this from scratch w/ a 7-12 yo, it's going to be harder.

At the end of the day, you have time for that which you give priority to make time for. In addition to sports/EC's we've made this a priority so the time is there.

Right this afternoon, at this very moment, they decided they wanted to rake leaves in the front yard so they'd have a pile to jump in so that's today's spontaneous unstructured play. If there was a screen as an option, that would never happen.

So at that moment - 4:30pm - you were at home not working?

Yes, I was off work and picked up the kids. Like I said, we have prioritized this.

If you're not currently able to do this, it's because other things are a priority for you and this is not.

NP here. I’m not home by 4:30 because paying my rent is a priority for me. I wish I could be home that early!

Yes, of course - different priorities. My priorities also include paying for food and shelter(that goes w/o saying, I think).

Instead of "wishing" - you should envision a future where you can do both and then plan and execute the necessary steps to get there.

Sorry I don’t want to train for a new career in my 40’s.

Right, I get it - it's not a priority for what you want for your kids, it is what it is.

DP. Maybe you should prioritize modeling appropriate behavior for your kids. Or do you somehow manage to NOT act like a self-important donkey in real life to other parents you encounter?

[Anonymous]

Our school aftercare does include screens, which I don’t like. Are we unusual? Here’s the afternoon:

2:30-2:45 pm - kids shuffle into aftercare, use the restroom, put up backpacks, etc. Kids can be on screens if they want.
2:45-3:45 - homework (kids grouped by grade). If kid gets done early, he can be on screens until 3:45.
3:45-4 - snack. Not sure if the kids can be on screens.
4-5 - outside play on the playground
5-5:30 - kids wait for parents to pick them up, kids can be on screens.

The “screens” are either iPads that the school provides (has games like Minecraft) or kids can bring iPhones/iPads from home and watch whatever they want.

Are other aftercares not like this?!? How are they scheduled?
3:45-4 -

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Most everyone who is replying here realizes that this would be beneficial for their child yet is coming up with excuses as to why they can't or won't do it. Kinda sad, really.

The first step to making this happen here is to drastically reduce screen time. That isn't easy but it then forces their hand. For our children, they will play some inside but there is only so much of that they will do until they go outside to play. Access to screens just short-circuits this dynamic. Also, we make regular visits to some of the bigger playground parks - there are always kids and they love these trips. Our kids are all under 12 and we've been doing this their whole lives so YMMV.

Do you work?

Yes, I do. Spouse works as well and we also own a small business.

What do you do that you don't have any time to take your kids to a playground or let them play outside?

When do you you have time to take kids to the park if you work? Are you part time?

I work full-time. Spouse works 3 10 hour days and the business is some weekends, mostly. The kids play outside after school and we go to a playground a couple or few times a week, some of those being on weekends. We are no screens Sunday evening until Friday evening("movie night") but we've done this since day one. If you are trying to start this from scratch w/ a 7-12 yo, it's going to be harder.

At the end of the day, you have time for that which you give priority to make time for. In addition to sports/EC's we've made this a priority so the time is there.

Right this afternoon, at this very moment, they decided they wanted to rake leaves in the front yard so they'd have a pile to jump in so that's today's spontaneous unstructured play. If there was a screen as an option, that would never happen.

So at that moment - 4:30pm - you were at home not working?

Yes, I was off work and picked up the kids. Like I said, we have prioritized this.

If you're not currently able to do this, it's because other things are a priority for you and this is not.

NP here. I’m not home by 4:30 because paying my rent is a priority for me. I wish I could be home that early!

Yes, of course - different priorities. My priorities also include paying for food and shelter(that goes w/o saying, I think).

Instead of "wishing" - you should envision a future where you can do both and then plan and execute the necessary steps to get there.

Sorry I don’t want to train for a new career in my 40’s.

Right, I get it - it's not a priority for what you want for your kids, it is what it is.

DP. Maybe you should prioritize modeling appropriate behavior for your kids. Or do you somehow manage to NOT act like a self-important donkey in real life to other parents you encounter?

LOL. Dp. I was about to comment with the same sentiment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Most everyone who is replying here realizes that this would be beneficial for their child yet is coming up with excuses as to why they can't or won't do it. Kinda sad, really.

The first step to making this happen here is to drastically reduce screen time. That isn't easy but it then forces their hand. For our children, they will play some inside but there is only so much of that they will do until they go outside to play. Access to screens just short-circuits this dynamic. Also, we make regular visits to some of the bigger playground parks - there are always kids and they love these trips. Our kids are all under 12 and we've been doing this their whole lives so YMMV.

Do you work?

Yes, I do. Spouse works as well and we also own a small business.

What do you do that you don't have any time to take your kids to a playground or let them play outside?

When do you you have time to take kids to the park if you work? Are you part time?

I work full-time. Spouse works 3 10 hour days and the business is some weekends, mostly. The kids play outside after school and we go to a playground a couple or few times a week, some of those being on weekends. We are no screens Sunday evening until Friday evening("movie night") but we've done this since day one. If you are trying to start this from scratch w/ a 7-12 yo, it's going to be harder.

At the end of the day, you have time for that which you give priority to make time for. In addition to sports/EC's we've made this a priority so the time is there.

Right this afternoon, at this very moment, they decided they wanted to rake leaves in the front yard so they'd have a pile to jump in so that's today's spontaneous unstructured play. If there was a screen as an option, that would never happen.

So at that moment - 4:30pm - you were at home not working?

Yes, I was off work and picked up the kids. Like I said, we have prioritized this.

If you're not currently able to do this, it's because other things are a priority for you and this is not.

NP here. I’m not home by 4:30 because paying my rent is a priority for me. I wish I could be home that early!

Yes, of course - different priorities. My priorities also include paying for food and shelter(that goes w/o saying, I think).

Instead of "wishing" - you should envision a future where you can do both and then plan and execute the necessary steps to get there.

Sorry I don’t want to train for a new career in my 40’s.

Right, I get it - it's not a priority for what you want for your kids, it is what it is.

DP. Maybe you should prioritize modeling appropriate behavior for your kids. Or do you somehow manage to NOT act like a self-important donkey in real life to other parents you encounter?

LOL. Dp. I was about to comment with the same sentiment.

Leave her alone. She’s the only one doing it right. She’s a National Parenting Treasure. What ever would we do without her?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Most everyone who is replying here realizes that this would be beneficial for their child yet is coming up with excuses as to why they can't or won't do it. Kinda sad, really.

The first step to making this happen here is to drastically reduce screen time. That isn't easy but it then forces their hand. For our children, they will play some inside but there is only so much of that they will do until they go outside to play. Access to screens just short-circuits this dynamic. Also, we make regular visits to some of the bigger playground parks - there are always kids and they love these trips. Our kids are all under 12 and we've been doing this their whole lives so YMMV.

Do you work?

Yes, I do. Spouse works as well and we also own a small business.

What do you do that you don't have any time to take your kids to a playground or let them play outside?

When do you you have time to take kids to the park if you work? Are you part time?

I work full-time. Spouse works 3 10 hour days and the business is some weekends, mostly. The kids play outside after school and we go to a playground a couple or few times a week, some of those being on weekends. We are no screens Sunday evening until Friday evening("movie night") but we've done this since day one. If you are trying to start this from scratch w/ a 7-12 yo, it's going to be harder.

At the end of the day, you have time for that which you give priority to make time for. In addition to sports/EC's we've made this a priority so the time is there.

Right this afternoon, at this very moment, they decided they wanted to rake leaves in the front yard so they'd have a pile to jump in so that's today's spontaneous unstructured play. If there was a screen as an option, that would never happen.

So at that moment - 4:30pm - you were at home not working?

Yes, I was off work and picked up the kids. Like I said, we have prioritized this.

If you're not currently able to do this, it's because other things are a priority for you and this is not.

NP here. I’m not home by 4:30 because paying my rent is a priority for me. I wish I could be home that early!

Yes, of course - different priorities. My priorities also include paying for food and shelter(that goes w/o saying, I think).

Instead of "wishing" - you should envision a future where you can do both and then plan and execute the necessary steps to get there.

Sorry I don’t want to train for a new career in my 40’s.

Right, I get it - it's not a priority for what you want for your kids, it is what it is.

DP. Maybe you should prioritize modeling appropriate behavior for your kids. Or do you somehow manage to NOT act like a self-important donkey in real life to other parents you encounter?

Can't tell if you're intentionally being ironic or not...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with this - but I think the problem is both overbearing parents AND parents constantly turning to screen time

Parents are turning to screen time because it’s impossible to do the adult life stuff and be your kids playmate. But you can’t just send them out, even though that’s what’s best for them.

It’s all interrelated

We had no cable tv, and my parents did "adult stuff" while we played by ourselves. My parents never played with us. That's a more recent thing, and I think part of the problem. Parents feel like they *have* to play with their kids. Kids won't find other kids to play with if mommy and daddy play with them all the time, or they have structured activities everyday. It becomes a vicious circle.

Just back off and let your kids figure it out. I'm not saying never play with your kids, but other kids should be their main source of playmates, not the parents or activities.

This is a situation where talking about "parents" as a monolith just doesn't work. And also why a tendency to view the past nostalgically, and the present critically, can lead you astray.

It's true that parents today are more likely to feel like they "have" to play with their kids. But why is that? In my case, it's because I was raised by people who actively disliked their children, and that had a negative impact on me both as a kid and as an adult. So I do feel I have an obligation to spend time with my kids, get to know them, take an interest in what they are interested in. But it's not driven by some vague cultural notion or just being a martyr. Is based on my own experience and a recognition that ignoring your kids and telling them, always, to please leave mommy and daddy alone, might have a negative impact on their psyche. I don't want my kids to have to spend two decades in therapy, as I have, building the scaffolding of a sense of self worth, because I am too busy or disinterested to play with them. So yes, I sometimes force myself to play with my kids even when I'm not really in the mood.

Now, I know that not all parents had my experience as a child. But I also no that I am nowhere near alone in it. My parents were the way they were for a few reasons, and they are common: (1) they were raised by Greatest Generation parents who were also alcoholics with untreated mental illness, including PTSD from the war/depression, and (2) they had kids young and out of obligation, and did not really view not having kids as an option. This is an extremely common combination of factors for people who had kids in the 1970s and 80s, and it often resulted in the kind of parental neglect I experienced, which means that a lot of people parenting today are working to correct that pattern with their own kids.

Yes people are sometimes overzealous, and I think parents could stand to be told, more often, "It's okay to take breaks from your kids, and it's okay to let your kids figure stuff out." But parents aren't playing with their kids or focusing on their kids because they are control freaks or because they are subscribing to some crackpot parenting technique they learned on Tik Tok. Most of the time parents are spending time with their kids in an effort to undo generational trauma. That's actually good! Why don't we talk more about how that's actually good?

whoaw.. you have issues that have nothing to do with your kids. You should've taken care of that before you had kids.

If I tell my kids to go play rather than expect me to play with them all the time that doesn't mean I don't love my kids. I'm sorry about your childhood, but you are projecting.

You are an idiot who clearly cannot read or comprehend things. NP

[Anonymous]

Recent opinion piece in nyt (gift link)

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/02/opinion/overprotected-childhood-parenting-free-range.html?unlocked_article_code=1.7kw.DF3W.jaoxxqH3WjNC&smid=url-share

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our school aftercare does include screens, which I don’t like. Are we unusual? Here’s the afternoon:

2:30-2:45 pm - kids shuffle into aftercare, use the restroom, put up backpacks, etc. Kids can be on screens if they want.
2:45-3:45 - homework (kids grouped by grade). If kid gets done early, he can be on screens until 3:45.
3:45-4 - snack. Not sure if the kids can be on screens.
4-5 - outside play on the playground
5-5:30 - kids wait for parents to pick them up, kids can be on screens.

The “screens” are either iPads that the school provides (has games like Minecraft) or kids can bring iPhones/iPads from home and watch whatever they want.

Are other aftercares not like this?!? How are they scheduled?
3:45-4 -

There is terrible and I would never allow this. Is the Loudoun I’m guessing based on dismissal time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our school aftercare does include screens, which I don’t like. Are we unusual? Here’s the afternoon:

2:30-2:45 pm - kids shuffle into aftercare, use the restroom, put up backpacks, etc. Kids can be on screens if they want.
2:45-3:45 - homework (kids grouped by grade). If kid gets done early, he can be on screens until 3:45.
3:45-4 - snack. Not sure if the kids can be on screens.
4-5 - outside play on the playground
5-5:30 - kids wait for parents to pick them up, kids can be on screens.

The “screens” are either iPads that the school provides (has games like Minecraft) or kids can bring iPhones/iPads from home and watch whatever they want.

Are other aftercares not like this?!? How are they scheduled?
3:45-4 -

There is terrible and I would never allow this. Is the Loudoun I’m guessing based on dismissal time.

2:30-5:30 is three hours of aftercare. Assuming they can’t be on screens during snack time, there is potentially up to 1h 45 min of screen time. More than 50% of the three hours. Why screens? Why can’t they read books or play board games or cards?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our school aftercare does include screens, which I don’t like. Are we unusual? Here’s the afternoon:

2:30-2:45 pm - kids shuffle into aftercare, use the restroom, put up backpacks, etc. Kids can be on screens if they want.
2:45-3:45 - homework (kids grouped by grade). If kid gets done early, he can be on screens until 3:45.
3:45-4 - snack. Not sure if the kids can be on screens.
4-5 - outside play on the playground
5-5:30 - kids wait for parents to pick them up, kids can be on screens.

The “screens” are either iPads that the school provides (has games like Minecraft) or kids can bring iPhones/iPads from home and watch whatever they want.

Are other aftercares not like this?!? How are they scheduled?
3:45-4 -

Ours has screens for group games (Mario Kart, Just Dance, that trivia one...Kazoot?) on days with no school but not on regular days. We get out at 3:50, so there's a lot less time in aftercare for a 5:00-5:30 pickup, but I don't think there are screens for beforecare. My kid always just says she reads.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with this - but I think the problem is both overbearing parents AND parents constantly turning to screen time

Parents are turning to screen time because it’s impossible to do the adult life stuff and be your kids playmate. But you can’t just send them out, even though that’s what’s best for them.

It’s all interrelated

We had no cable tv, and my parents did "adult stuff" while we played by ourselves. My parents never played with us. That's a more recent thing, and I think part of the problem. Parents feel like they *have* to play with their kids. Kids won't find other kids to play with if mommy and daddy play with them all the time, or they have structured activities everyday. It becomes a vicious circle.

Just back off and let your kids figure it out. I'm not saying never play with your kids, but other kids should be their main source of playmates, not the parents or activities.

This is a situation where talking about "parents" as a monolith just doesn't work. And also why a tendency to view the past nostalgically, and the present critically, can lead you astray.

It's true that parents today are more likely to feel like they "have" to play with their kids. But why is that? In my case, it's because I was raised by people who actively disliked their children, and that had a negative impact on me both as a kid and as an adult. So I do feel I have an obligation to spend time with my kids, get to know them, take an interest in what they are interested in. But it's not driven by some vague cultural notion or just being a martyr. Is based on my own experience and a recognition that ignoring your kids and telling them, always, to please leave mommy and daddy alone, might have a negative impact on their psyche. I don't want my kids to have to spend two decades in therapy, as I have, building the scaffolding of a sense of self worth, because I am too busy or disinterested to play with them. So yes, I sometimes force myself to play with my kids even when I'm not really in the mood.

Now, I know that not all parents had my experience as a child. But I also no that I am nowhere near alone in it. My parents were the way they were for a few reasons, and they are common: (1) they were raised by Greatest Generation parents who were also alcoholics with untreated mental illness, including PTSD from the war/depression, and (2) they had kids young and out of obligation, and did not really view not having kids as an option. This is an extremely common combination of factors for people who had kids in the 1970s and 80s, and it often resulted in the kind of parental neglect I experienced, which means that a lot of people parenting today are working to correct that pattern with their own kids.

Yes people are sometimes overzealous, and I think parents could stand to be told, more often, "It's okay to take breaks from your kids, and it's okay to let your kids figure stuff out." But parents aren't playing with their kids or focusing on their kids because they are control freaks or because they are subscribing to some crackpot parenting technique they learned on Tik Tok. Most of the time parents are spending time with their kids in an effort to undo generational trauma. That's actually good! Why don't we talk more about how that's actually good?

whoaw.. you have issues that have nothing to do with your kids. You should've taken care of that before you had kids.

If I tell my kids to go play rather than expect me to play with them all the time that doesn't mean I don't love my kids. I'm sorry about your childhood, but you are projecting.

You are an idiot who clearly cannot read or comprehend things. NP

I comprehend. The ^PP clearly has issues from her childhood, and that's impacting how she parents. She even stated that she spends time with her kids to "undo generational trauma".. those are her words. Her kids don't have trauma. She's the one with ptsd.