Summer swim absurd age rules

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It isn’t fair but that’s the rule. I’m sure those who think it’s fair also think it’s fair when newly 19 year old division 1 swimmers finish a full year of college training, and then return home to swim against kids who were 14 years old a few weeks ago.

Clearly, that’s fair, too.

It is 7-8 weeks of summer swimming, just relax. I’m so surprised people are thinking about fairness with such a short, only for fun, activity. The pools don’t even have blocks and the distances are a joke, and there is a mixed age relay; just have your kid enjoy it and focus on improving their times. Who even examines other kids’ ages that closely? And yeah, in the VERY unusual circumstance where a D1 swimmer with a summer birthday came back and did summer swimming the kids on our team would be psyched to see them, nbd. I can’t imagine someone getting seriously upset about this.

People are upset because a 10U boy is 11 years and 5 weeks and are claiming some huge advantage. What about the Olympians and nationally ranked swimmers who come back to swim for their summer pool?

How is that fair? My kid doesn’t even club swim but these kids have access to the best coaching in the world /s

“Katie Ledecky returns to her summer swim league to sign autographs — and set records” - WaPo

I’m kidding of course - I love this aspect of summer swim, but it puts into perspective how silly the moving the cutoff argument is.

I think I having a cutoff is appropriate for summer swim because the season is so short, but don’t pretend that using August 1 instead of June 1 is ridiculous. It creates the same issue for small groups of swimmers regardless of the cutoff date you use. An 11 year 5 week old competing in the 9-10 group is the same as the 10 year 11 month old competing in the 11-12 group, it just disadvantages different small groups of swimmers.

It’s not the same when you are talking about the next age groups up. It creates a mich bigger discrepancy in the 13-14 and 15-18 groups. Hormones. Just let it go man!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It isn’t fair but that’s the rule. I’m sure those who think it’s fair also think it’s fair when newly 19 year old division 1 swimmers finish a full year of college training, and then return home to swim against kids who were 14 years old a few weeks ago.

Clearly, that’s fair, too.

It is 7-8 weeks of summer swimming, just relax. I’m so surprised people are thinking about fairness with such a short, only for fun, activity. The pools don’t even have blocks and the distances are a joke, and there is a mixed age relay; just have your kid enjoy it and focus on improving their times. Who even examines other kids’ ages that closely? And yeah, in the VERY unusual circumstance where a D1 swimmer with a summer birthday came back and did summer swimming the kids on our team would be psyched to see them, nbd. I can’t imagine someone getting seriously upset about this.

People are upset because a 10U boy is 11 years and 5 weeks and are claiming some huge advantage. What about the Olympians and nationally ranked swimmers who come back to swim for their summer pool?

How is that fair? My kid doesn’t even club swim but these kids have access to the best coaching in the world /s

“Katie Ledecky returns to her summer swim league to sign autographs — and set records” - WaPo

I’m kidding of course - I love this aspect of summer swim, but it puts into perspective how silly the moving the cutoff argument is.

I think I having a cutoff is appropriate for summer swim because the season is so short, but don’t pretend that using August 1 instead of June 1 is ridiculous. It creates the same issue for small groups of swimmers regardless of the cutoff date you use. An 11 year 5 week old competing in the 9-10 group is the same as the 10 year 11 month old competing in the 11-12 group, it just disadvantages different small groups of swimmers.

It’s not the same when you are talking about the next age groups up. It creates a mich bigger discrepancy in the 13-14 and 15-18 groups. Hormones. Just let it go man!

I'm not sure that's true for the girls. We had our swim banquet last night and the 10yo girls were all a full head taller than the 9 yo.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It isn’t fair but that’s the rule. I’m sure those who think it’s fair also think it’s fair when newly 19 year old division 1 swimmers finish a full year of college training, and then return home to swim against kids who were 14 years old a few weeks ago.

Clearly, that’s fair, too.

It is 7-8 weeks of summer swimming, just relax. I’m so surprised people are thinking about fairness with such a short, only for fun, activity. The pools don’t even have blocks and the distances are a joke, and there is a mixed age relay; just have your kid enjoy it and focus on improving their times. Who even examines other kids’ ages that closely? And yeah, in the VERY unusual circumstance where a D1 swimmer with a summer birthday came back and did summer swimming the kids on our team would be psyched to see them, nbd. I can’t imagine someone getting seriously upset about this.

People are upset because a 10U boy is 11 years and 5 weeks and are claiming some huge advantage. What about the Olympians and nationally ranked swimmers who come back to swim for their summer pool?

How is that fair? My kid doesn’t even club swim but these kids have access to the best coaching in the world /s

“Katie Ledecky returns to her summer swim league to sign autographs — and set records” - WaPo

I’m kidding of course - I love this aspect of summer swim, but it puts into perspective how silly the moving the cutoff argument is.

I think I having a cutoff is appropriate for summer swim because the season is so short, but don’t pretend that using August 1 instead of June 1 is ridiculous. It creates the same issue for small groups of swimmers regardless of the cutoff date you use. An 11 year 5 week old competing in the 9-10 group is the same as the 10 year 11 month old competing in the 11-12 group, it just disadvantages different small groups of swimmers.

It’s not the same when you are talking about the next age groups up. It creates a mich bigger discrepancy in the 13-14 and 15-18 groups. Hormones. Just let it go man!

i
No, with an August cutoff you would be talking about kids swimming up for a few weeks into an age group that they are only weeks from being anyway. It’s the same thing as the June cutoff allowing kids who are just past their birthday to swim down for a few weeks. Your hormones argument works both ways because you are talking about very small periods of time, a kid who is 12 years 11 months old is not appreciably different from the kid who is 13 years and 1 week old, and vice versa. If you think a kid who is 12 years 11 months old is being horribly disadvantaged by swimming in the 13-14 year old category, it’s the same disadvantage for the 11-12 year olds to have a kid that is 13 years and 1 month swimming in their group.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are in the lower divisions but have had d3 college swimmers come back in order to coach, and for many of them that has included swimming as a 15-18. Assuming no red shirting kids born in June, July, August and September (so 1/4 of all kids) are still 18 the summer after their freshman year. Even if you switched it to August 1 cut off, all the August and Sept kids still would fall into that.

It shows the absurdity of the summer birthday rule. Go look at the height differences in the 13-14 (15!) year olds. A lot of that will go away if the rule is changed.

[Anonymous]

Please don’t say- we have a kid in the lower age of a bracket who always dominates. Cherry picking a single example doesn’t change the fact that in the majority of cases, it’s an unfair rule. The only people who support it are non club swimmers and/or summer bday kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Please don’t say- we have a kid in the lower age of a bracket who always dominates. Cherry picking a single example doesn’t change the fact that in the majority of cases, it’s an unfair rule. The only people who support it are non club swimmers and/or summer bday kids.

Calling it an unfair rule is like claiming all youth sports are unfair since they all have some age cutoff. Year round swim is one of the only exceptions, and it is an exception because it is after all year round. It would be asinine to apply the same rules to a 6 week sport. The only people against it are a handful of obsessive cranks who refuse to accept that pretty much all summer swim leagues have a similar cutoff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It isn’t fair but that’s the rule. I’m sure those who think it’s fair also think it’s fair when newly 19 year old division 1 swimmers finish a full year of college training, and then return home to swim against kids who were 14 years old a few weeks ago.

Clearly, that’s fair, too.

It is 7-8 weeks of summer swimming, just relax. I’m so surprised people are thinking about fairness with such a short, only for fun, activity. The pools don’t even have blocks and the distances are a joke, and there is a mixed age relay; just have your kid enjoy it and focus on improving their times. Who even examines other kids’ ages that closely? And yeah, in the VERY unusual circumstance where a D1 swimmer with a summer birthday came back and did summer swimming the kids on our team would be psyched to see them, nbd. I can’t imagine someone getting seriously upset about this.

People are upset because a 10U boy is 11 years and 5 weeks and are claiming some huge advantage. What about the Olympians and nationally ranked swimmers who come back to swim for their summer pool?

How is that fair? My kid doesn’t even club swim but these kids have access to the best coaching in the world /s

“Katie Ledecky returns to her summer swim league to sign autographs — and set records” - WaPo

I’m kidding of course - I love this aspect of summer swim, but it puts into perspective how silly the moving the cutoff argument is.

I think I having a cutoff is appropriate for summer swim because the season is so short, but don’t pretend that using August 1 instead of June 1 is ridiculous. It creates the same issue for small groups of swimmers regardless of the cutoff date you use. An 11 year 5 week old competing in the 9-10 group is the same as the 10 year 11 month old competing in the 11-12 group, it just disadvantages different small groups of swimmers.

It’s not the same when you are talking about the next age groups up. It creates a mich bigger discrepancy in the 13-14 and 15-18 groups. Hormones. Just let it go man!

i
No, with an August cutoff you would be talking about kids swimming up for a few weeks into an age group that they are only weeks from being anyway. It’s the same thing as the June cutoff allowing kids who are just past their birthday to swim down for a few weeks. Your hormones argument works both ways because you are talking about very small periods of time, a kid who is 12 years 11 months old is not appreciably different from the kid who is 13 years and 1 week old, and vice versa. If you think a kid who is 12 years 11 months old is being horribly disadvantaged by swimming in the 13-14 year old category, it’s the same disadvantage for the 11-12 year olds to have a kid that is 13 years and 1 month swimming in their group.

You have spent way too much time thinking about this. I suggest a breath of fresh air.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please don’t say- we have a kid in the lower age of a bracket who always dominates. Cherry picking a single example doesn’t change the fact that in the majority of cases, it’s an unfair rule. The only people who support it are non club swimmers and/or summer bday kids.

Calling it an unfair rule is like claiming all youth sports are unfair since they all have some age cutoff. Year round swim is one of the only exceptions, and it is an exception because it is after all year round. It would be asinine to apply the same rules to a 6 week sport. The only people against it are a handful of obsessive cranks who refuse to accept that pretty much all summer swim leagues have a similar cutoff.

This. It reflects the inability of some swim parents to accept that summer swim is more casual and doesn’t really mean anything.

I also think the people who complain about it fail to see the benefits for kids of dealing with a mildly unfair rule shift for the season. Like all they can see is that they think their 14yr old would dominate summer swim were it not for a couple kids turning 15 over the summer (a dubious proposition because their kid could also lose to an older 14 yr old, or a more talented younger swimmer).

But also: it’s good for kids to learn that sometimes the rules benefit you and sometimes they don’t. Sometimes you have to compete against someone bigger and stronger, and just do your best. Sometimes you’ll lose and it will turn out it doesn’t matter that much. This is all actually healthy for kids.

[Anonymous]

My kid may swim after her freshman year of college. I doubt she’ll be a college swimmer because she’s not that good. But her birthday is in June so she will be able to swim in the 15-18 age group if she wants to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid may swim after her freshman year of college. I doubt she’ll be a college swimmer because she’s not that good. But her birthday is in June so she will be able to swim in the 15-18 age group if she wants to.

Good for her. As the parent of younger child i appreciate seeing the older kids who come back to spend one more summer doing something they enjoyed since they were little and hanging out with their friends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Please don’t say- we have a kid in the lower age of a bracket who always dominates. Cherry picking a single example doesn’t change the fact that in the majority of cases, it’s an unfair rule. The only people who support it are non club swimmers and/or summer bday kids.

Those uptight club swimmers can go back to the club and keep their drama away from people trying to enjoy a fun athletic summer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It isn’t fair but that’s the rule. I’m sure those who think it’s fair also think it’s fair when newly 19 year old division 1 swimmers finish a full year of college training, and then return home to swim against kids who were 14 years old a few weeks ago.

Clearly, that’s fair, too.

It is 7-8 weeks of summer swimming, just relax. I’m so surprised people are thinking about fairness with such a short, only for fun, activity. The pools don’t even have blocks and the distances are a joke, and there is a mixed age relay; just have your kid enjoy it and focus on improving their times. Who even examines other kids’ ages that closely? And yeah, in the VERY unusual circumstance where a D1 swimmer with a summer birthday came back and did summer swimming the kids on our team would be psyched to see them, nbd. I can’t imagine someone getting seriously upset about this.

People are upset because a 10U boy is 11 years and 5 weeks and are claiming some huge advantage. What about the Olympians and nationally ranked swimmers who come back to swim for their summer pool?

How is that fair? My kid doesn’t even club swim but these kids have access to the best coaching in the world /s

“Katie Ledecky returns to her summer swim league to sign autographs — and set records” - WaPo

I’m kidding of course - I love this aspect of summer swim, but it puts into perspective how silly the moving the cutoff argument is.

I think I having a cutoff is appropriate for summer swim because the season is so short, but don’t pretend that using August 1 instead of June 1 is ridiculous. It creates the same issue for small groups of swimmers regardless of the cutoff date you use. An 11 year 5 week old competing in the 9-10 group is the same as the 10 year 11 month old competing in the 11-12 group, it just disadvantages different small groups of swimmers.

It’s not the same when you are talking about the next age groups up. It creates a mich bigger discrepancy in the 13-14 and 15-18 groups. Hormones. Just let it go man!

i
No, with an August cutoff you would be talking about kids swimming up for a few weeks into an age group that they are only weeks from being anyway. It’s the same thing as the June cutoff allowing kids who are just past their birthday to swim down for a few weeks. Your hormones argument works both ways because you are talking about very small periods of time, a kid who is 12 years 11 months old is not appreciably different from the kid who is 13 years and 1 week old, and vice versa. If you think a kid who is 12 years 11 months old is being horribly disadvantaged by swimming in the 13-14 year old category, it’s the same disadvantage for the 11-12 year olds to have a kid that is 13 years and 1 month swimming in their group.

You have spent way too much time thinking about this. I suggest a breath of fresh air.

This is the level of deflection my kids use. I’m sorry that basic logic is beyond your capabilities though, because the logic behind this doesn’t require a lot of thought.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are in the lower divisions but have had d3 college swimmers come back in order to coach, and for many of them that has included swimming as a 15-18. Assuming no red shirting kids born in June, July, August and September (so 1/4 of all kids) are still 18 the summer after their freshman year. Even if you switched it to August 1 cut off, all the August and Sept kids still would fall into that.

It shows the absurdity of the summer birthday rule. Go look at the height differences in the 13-14 (15!) year olds. A lot of that will go away if the rule is changed.

Why would the height difference between kids who are 13 year 2 months to 15 year 2 months, be significantly different from the height difference between kids who are 13 year 0 months and to 15 year 0 months, or between kids who are 12 year 10 months to 14 year 10 months? It's going to be a 24 month spread whichever way you go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please don’t say- we have a kid in the lower age of a bracket who always dominates. Cherry picking a single example doesn’t change the fact that in the majority of cases, it’s an unfair rule. The only people who support it are non club swimmers and/or summer bday kids.

Those uptight club swimmers can go back to the club and keep their drama away from people trying to enjoy a fun athletic summer.

When are your kids’ bdays?

[Anonymous]

As an outsider looking in, I have to say it’s no wonder you have parents obsessing over this- the swim league creates this monster with three timers a lane and the hype around divisional and all stars. You can’t say it’s a relaxed summer rec sport on one hand and then omg we need three timers a lane and this, that, or the other.