Why Was My Son Deferred from Duke ED?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not looking for sympathy but any insight would be appreciated. My son was told he would be a good candidate for Ivy League/Duke by his school counselor and applied ED to Duke with a 36 ACT, near-perfect GPA, all 5s and 4s on AP exams, two sport athlete and captain of one sport, student body president, editor in chief of school newspaper, head student liaison for arts nonprofit, a summer internship with a congressman, leadership volunteering position at library with book preservation and restoration experience, good awards, etc. My son had multiple people look over his essays, including the optional ones (academic experience and agreements/disagreements prompts) and he received good feedback. We figured maybe there was something else wrong with his application (maybe a recommendation letter was unexpectedly weak) or that he should’ve gone for another school he liked that would be a bit easier to be accepted like Cornell or Johns Hopkins, but over the past few days he was accepted to UNC Chapel Hill with a full scholarship, USC with scholarship pending, and UMich all out of state. He’s still disappointed about Duke but the UNC scholarship is very enticing and he’s still in the running for Duke, although we’re not sure about the chances of being accepted after a deferral. Inputs are welcome!

Why in the world do you care?

Duke put out Steven Miller.

HS counselors know zip.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Believable but shallow.

No one is heading up a decent paper and also playing a school sport as a captain (with all the captain responsibilities) and being student body president if any of these things (outside of the sport) take more than a few minutes a day. They're just not.

I'm sure Duke admissions reps can see through this from a mile away. If we can see it, they can SEE IT.

I disagree. There are definitely kids like this who balance it all. They go to school, make announcements at lunch as Pres, use their free period to touch base with people writing articles for the paper, go to practice after school, stay for club meeting after practice if that’s the meeting night and roll home around 8:30 pm to begin homework. The next day, same schedule but late to sports because they have a student government meeting after school with the principal, but home right after sports practice for dinner because they don’t have a club meeting. Telephone call with newspaper staff and homework til midnight or later. I have had kids with this schedule. It does happen. BTW, the captain thing really doesn’t require much time beyond the regular team commitment, other than brief check-one with the coach.

+1 it’s doable but the kids have to work really hard to maintain it. Some people are just better at handling the heavy load, and it sounds like OP’s son is one of them. But Duke is going to be filled with kids who’ve been able to maintain an above-and-beyond pace
.

I’m more surprised that one student would be taking up so many leadership opportunities at their high school. My kid went to a big FC public and there are so many incredibly smart, motivated kids. I can’t imagine that all those opportunities wouldn’t be spread around.

At any rate, OP’s kid has lot of great opportunities. Focusing on the one they didn’t get seems really unhealthy, particularly for such an overachiever. I suggest really reframing your thinking and focusing on the successes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not looking for sympathy but any insight would be appreciated. My son was told he would be a good candidate for Ivy League/Duke by his school counselor and applied ED to Duke with a 36 ACT, near-perfect GPA, all 5s and 4s on AP exams, two sport athlete and captain of one sport, student body president, editor in chief of school newspaper, head student liaison for arts nonprofit, a summer internship with a congressman, leadership volunteering position at library with book preservation and restoration experience, good awards, etc. My son had multiple people look over his essays, including the optional ones (academic experience and agreements/disagreements prompts) and he received good feedback. We figured maybe there was something else wrong with his application (maybe a recommendation letter was unexpectedly weak) or that he should’ve gone for another school he liked that would be a bit easier to be accepted like Cornell or Johns Hopkins, but over the past few days he was accepted to UNC Chapel Hill with a full scholarship, USC with scholarship pending, and UMich all out of state. He’s still disappointed about Duke but the UNC scholarship is very enticing and he’s still in the running for Duke, although we’re not sure about the chances of being accepted after a deferral. Inputs are welcome!

Why in the world do you care?

Duke put out Steven Miller.

HS counselors know zip.

Also Richard Spencer, which is where he met Stephen Miller.

[Anonymous]

Perhaps your kid was too decent a human for Dook. Count yourself lucky.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Perhaps your kid was too decent a human for Dook. Count yourself lucky.

True if he gets into Harvard he can become like Jared Kushner instead, or if he gets into Wharton he can walk the same esteemed halls as Trump

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I bet that Duke does a more thorough read of applications then the other schools and questioned the validity (or at least depth) of your son's extracurriculars.
It just doesn't add up that any kid can do that many things at once with any degree of depth.

Listen, the editor of the newspaper at Jackson Reed just got into Harvard and to my knowledge that was his only outlying extracurricular. Why? Because it takes him 20 hours a week.
It's a serious paper and serious time commitment. Your son's resume indicates that he can head the school paper in about 10 minutes a day after he does 7 other things.
It doesn't add up that he's doing anything at more than a superficial level (that or he's never sleeping, eating or socializing).

Applications are read by real people who see through the BS or at least can think logically through resumes. I've seen this before on DCUM--a kid who claimed to have volunteered
for so many hours a year that it worked out to like 30 hours a week. This kid also didn't get into a top school despite having a crazy good resume and wondered why.
Hmm. Maybe someone at the school also did that calculation.

I'm not saying your kid made anything up but rather that Duke saw his impressive extracurriculars as being pretty shallow level stuff since he was able to do them all.

Actually the load seems very reasonable for a high achieving student. He plays two sports likely in different seasons so that’s just one sport at a time. Student body pres and editor in chief as main extracurriculars is impressive but doable. The schoolwork seems to take most of the load rightfully so. Interning for congressman is likely a summer role. Volunteering at library with a leadership position can also be during the summer. I found the profile very impressive overall - believable yet rigorous

The kids I know who interned for congressmen got it through connections. Did the student secure these roles all by himself?

My child got their congressional internship on their own. (I'm not OP.) Same for at least a few of the other interns in the office.

Did yours or any of the others end up at a service academy? Naval? West Point? Air Force?

That was my child's plan, and the chief reason that they pursued this internship, but unfortunately they didn't meet the medical qualifications for the service academies (congenital heart issue.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Believable but shallow.

No one is heading up a decent paper and also playing a school sport as a captain (with all the captain responsibilities) and being student body president if any of these things (outside of the sport) take more than a few minutes a day. They're just not.

I'm sure Duke admissions reps can see through this from a mile away. If we can see it, they can SEE IT.

I disagree. There are definitely kids like this who balance it all. They go to school, make announcements at lunch as Pres, use their free period to touch base with people writing articles for the paper, go to practice after school, stay for club meeting after practice if that’s the meeting night and roll home around 8:30 pm to begin homework. The next day, same schedule but late to sports because they have a student government meeting after school with the principal, but home right after sports practice for dinner because they don’t have a club meeting. Telephone call with newspaper staff and homework til midnight or later. I have had kids with this schedule. It does happen. BTW, the captain thing really doesn’t require much time beyond the regular team commitment, other than brief check-one with the coach.

+1 it’s doable but the kids have to work really hard to maintain it. Some people are just better at handling the heavy load, and it sounds like OP’s son is one of them. But Duke is going to be filled with kids who’ve been able to maintain an above-and-beyond pace
.

I’m more surprised that one student would be taking up so many leadership opportunities at their high school. My kid went to a big FC public and there are so many incredibly smart, motivated kids. I can’t imagine that all those opportunities wouldn’t be spread around.

At any rate, OP’s kid has lot of great opportunities. Focusing on the one they didn’t get seems really unhealthy, particularly for such an overachiever. I suggest really reframing your thinking and focusing on the successes.

Maybe he was home schooled.

[Anonymous]

OP: Your curiosity & concern is reasonable.

Could be an impression made by the essays if they were specifically done for Duke. It is NOT the teacher recs as he was awarded a scholarship at UNC.

I wish that I could read his Duke essays.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not looking for sympathy but any insight would be appreciated. My son was told he would be a good candidate for Ivy League/Duke by his school counselor and applied ED to Duke with a 36 ACT, near-perfect GPA, all 5s and 4s on AP exams, two sport athlete and captain of one sport, student body president, editor in chief of school newspaper, head student liaison for arts nonprofit, a summer internship with a congressman, leadership volunteering position at library with book preservation and restoration experience, good awards, etc. My son had multiple people look over his essays, including the optional ones (academic experience and agreements/disagreements prompts) and he received good feedback. We figured maybe there was something else wrong with his application (maybe a recommendation letter was unexpectedly weak) or that he should’ve gone for another school he liked that would be a bit easier to be accepted like Cornell or Johns Hopkins, but over the past few days he was accepted to UNC Chapel Hill with a full scholarship, USC with scholarship pending, and UMich all out of state. He’s still disappointed about Duke but the UNC scholarship is very enticing and he’s still in the running for Duke, although we’re not sure about the chances of being accepted after a deferral. Inputs are welcome!

The simple truth is because while his accomplishments are impressive, everyone applying has equally or even more impressive credentials.

This is not true. Very few are student body president, captain of a sport team,editor-in-chief, and a 36 ACT score. President of student body & editor-in-chief are complementary positions that make sense.

OP: The rejection is personal. Not sure why, but I suspect that something in one or more essays negatively affected admissions readers.

[Anonymous]

OP, I agree that your DS should do a letter of continued interest, but I hope that you as his parent will start helping him get over the idea of a "dream school." Kids should never, ever get so attached to one school that all the other places they get into (especially strong schools like UNC, Michigan, etc.!) are the also-ran/second choices.

I completely disagree with immediate PP. It's not personal! The fact is that your kid had the stats to buy a lottery ticket -- along with a huge number of other qualified kids from across the country and around the world. Admissions officers aren't looking for well-rounded *kids* like your DS -- they're looking for well-rounded *classes* made up of kids from all 50 states, lots of other countries, males, females, & other, all socioeconomic backgrounds, and racial diversity. You can't let DS take it personally and you shouldn't take it personally either if he didn't get into Duke, especially given the great schools he's already accepted at.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I agree that your DS should do a letter of continued interest, but I hope that you as his parent will start helping him get over the idea of a "dream school." Kids should never, ever get so attached to one school that all the other places they get into (especially strong schools like UNC, Michigan, etc.!) are the also-ran/second choices.

I completely disagree with immediate PP. It's not personal! The fact is that your kid had the stats to buy a lottery ticket -- along with a huge number of other qualified kids from across the country and around the world. Admissions officers aren't looking for well-rounded *kids* like your DS -- they're looking for well-rounded *classes* made up of kids from all 50 states, lots of other countries, males, females, & other, all socioeconomic backgrounds, and racial diversity. You can't let DS take it personally and you shouldn't take it personally either if he didn't get into Duke, especially given the great schools he's already accepted at.

You may not be interpreting "personal" in the same way that I do.

College admissions--and rejections-- at private schools is very personal. If it wasn't, then no essays would be required and there would be no application readers.

[Anonymous]

I disagree with your assumption that the readers took something negative from OP's kid's essays (thereby making it "personal"). A kid can have perfect everything -- including essays -- and still not make the cut because the AOs are in charge of putting together a class, based on many criteria, not just giving a thumbs-up or thumbs-down to an individual based on the perfection or lack thereof of the application.

[Anonymous]

Consider yourself lucky your child isn't going to Dook. Carolina is a great place, and a full-ride is hard to beat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not looking for sympathy but any insight would be appreciated. My son was told he would be a good candidate for Ivy League/Duke by his school counselor and applied ED to Duke with a 36 ACT, near-perfect GPA, all 5s and 4s on AP exams, two sport athlete and captain of one sport, student body president, editor in chief of school newspaper, head student liaison for arts nonprofit, a summer internship with a congressman, leadership volunteering position at library with book preservation and restoration experience, good awards, etc. My son had multiple people look over his essays, including the optional ones (academic experience and agreements/disagreements prompts) and he received good feedback. We figured maybe there was something else wrong with his application (maybe a recommendation letter was unexpectedly weak) or that he should’ve gone for another school he liked that would be a bit easier to be accepted like Cornell or Johns Hopkins, but over the past few days he was accepted to UNC Chapel Hill with a full scholarship, USC with scholarship pending, and UMich all out of state. He’s still disappointed about Duke but the UNC scholarship is very enticing and he’s still in the running for Duke, although we’re not sure about the chances of being accepted after a deferral. Inputs are welcome!

The simple truth is because while his accomplishments are impressive, everyone applying has equally or even more impressive credentials.

This is not true. Very few are student body president, captain of a sport team,editor-in-chief, and a 36 ACT score. President of student body & editor-in-chief are complementary positions that make sense.

OP: The rejection is personal. Not sure why, but I suspect that something in one or more essays negatively affected admissions readers.

There are 10,000+ student body presidents. A lot of them apply to Duke.
There are 100,000+ team captains. A lot of them apply to Duke.
There are 10,000+ editors in chiefs. A lot of them apply to Duke.

There are also an infinite number of superlative EC that your kid didn't do that other kids do. A lot of them apply to Duke.

Seriously, if you don't get it, there are hundreds of thousands of kids who have the scores and EC's to be "qualified" to go to these T20 schools. There are only so many seats. As such, there is going to be some disappointment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not looking for sympathy but any insight would be appreciated. My son was told he would be a good candidate for Ivy League/Duke by his school counselor and applied ED to Duke with a 36 ACT, near-perfect GPA, all 5s and 4s on AP exams, two sport athlete and captain of one sport, student body president, editor in chief of school newspaper, head student liaison for arts nonprofit, a summer internship with a congressman, leadership volunteering position at library with book preservation and restoration experience, good awards, etc. My son had multiple people look over his essays, including the optional ones (academic experience and agreements/disagreements prompts) and he received good feedback. We figured maybe there was something else wrong with his application (maybe a recommendation letter was unexpectedly weak) or that he should’ve gone for another school he liked that would be a bit easier to be accepted like Cornell or Johns Hopkins, but over the past few days he was accepted to UNC Chapel Hill with a full scholarship, USC with scholarship pending, and UMich all out of state. He’s still disappointed about Duke but the UNC scholarship is very enticing and he’s still in the running for Duke, although we’re not sure about the chances of being accepted after a deferral. Inputs are welcome!

The simple truth is because while his accomplishments are impressive, everyone applying has equally or even more impressive credentials.

This is not true. Very few are student body president, captain of a sport team,editor-in-chief, and a 36 ACT score. President of student body & editor-in-chief are complementary positions that make sense.

OP: The rejection is personal. Not sure why, but I suspect that something in one or more essays negatively affected admissions readers.

There are 10,000+ student body presidents. A lot of them apply to Duke.
There are 100,000+ team captains. A lot of them apply to Duke.
There are 10,000+ editors in chiefs. A lot of them apply to Duke.

There are also an infinite number of superlative EC that your kid didn't do that other kids do. A lot of them apply to Duke.

Seriously, if you don't get it, there are hundreds of thousands of kids who have the scores and EC's to be "qualified" to go to these T20 schools. There are only so many seats. As such, there is going to be some disappointment.

I think that you miss the point. OP's child is not just editor-in-chief, student body president, captain of a sports team, and holding a 36 ACT score, OP's child has all four. This is a very well qualified candidate for admission to any elite college or university in the country that offers his preferred course of study.