Ivies aren't the best

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find the study mildly interesting, but quite amusing as both Stacy Dale and Alan Krueger hold degrees from Ivy League schools including Princeton, Harvard, and Cornell.

+1 that grads from very elite institutions with very elite jobs at very elite institutions are pretending it doesn't matter. ROFL for anyone to take that BS seriously.

Fortunately peer-reviewed research doesn't care about your our cynicism and ignorance.

I don't think the research can capture the qualitative difference in opportunities, rather than bands of salaries etc. I'm it saying the kids are better or more qualified. Just that they get very different opportunities starting out.

Most social science research of this type is very subjective in terms of how it's framed and set up.

You don't sound like you've read it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many get jobs due to connections, not due to academics or college name. I know many who couldn't get into a local state school and did community college to become eligible for transfer and then got hired by top companies where their dad or uncle worked.

For most that attend Ivy's, they would have had the same connections if they went anywhere---their connections are often from their rich parents/family members. Only the lower income students who attend Ivy's really get any "connection benefit" from attending a top school. The rich kids already have those connections

A lower income kid (including upper middle class DMV kids from donut hole families) is not going to network with rich kids. The rich kids know each other and stick to each other. A lower income kid would have to be extremely pushy to break into that crowd. Even then, it’s probably a mistake. Lower income kid will be shut out of a lot of things that the rich kids do because the lower income kid simply can’t afford them.

I went to Harvard as a kid of immigrant parents, generic UMC but not rich. Totally disagree that all the rich kids just stick together or whatever. Everyone lives in the dorms, everyone is on the unlimited meal plan etc. Freshman roommate assignments are given by the school. There's a range of people and friends/activities felt really mixed.

As showed above the affect of networking with rich seems minimal.

Boston College: $93K
Harvard: $85K
Northeastern: $80K

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It doesn't have to be an ivy, most top 50 schools provide similar opportunities. Ivy just has a better name brand as a cluster.

Yup again below is overall for major colleges in Boston area,

1 MIT: $111K
2 Boston College: $93K
3 Harvard: $85K
4 Northeastern: $80K
5 Boston University: $76K
6 Brandeis: $70K
7 Tufts: $67K



and also major matters more,

Harvard CS: $160,000 > GMU CS: $83,185 > Harvard English: $43,845 > GMU English: $28,000

And again, it's useless information b/c it's based on averages. You need to compare students with the same numbers and level of ambition in order to have anything of value.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It doesn't have to be an ivy, most top 50 schools provide similar opportunities. Ivy just has a better name brand as a cluster.

Yup again below is overall for major colleges in Boston area,

1 MIT: $111K
2 Boston College: $93K
3 Harvard: $85K
4 Northeastern: $80K
5 Boston University: $76K
6 Brandeis: $70K
7 Tufts: $67K



and also major matters more,

Harvard CS: $160,000 > GMU CS: $83,185 > Harvard English: $43,845 > GMU English: $28,000

And again, it's useless information b/c it's based on averages. You need to compare students with the same numbers and level of ambition in order to have anything of value.

Do you even understand yourself what you are trying to say??????

[Anonymous]

That’s not true at all -Harvard and Yale (law) grad

This is encouraging. People go to Yale law and still end up spending their free time on DCUM like the rest of us.

Ok this might literally be the best DCUM comment ever. Maybe second only to fish maw. Well done!

+1000 I love this

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many get jobs due to connections, not due to academics or college name. I know many who couldn't get into a local state school and did community college to become eligible for transfer and then got hired by top companies where their dad or uncle worked.

For most that attend Ivy's, they would have had the same connections if they went anywhere---their connections are often from their rich parents/family members. Only the lower income students who attend Ivy's really get any "connection benefit" from attending a top school. The rich kids already have those connections

A lower income kid (including upper middle class DMV kids from donut hole families) is not going to network with rich kids. The rich kids know each other and stick to each other. A lower income kid would have to be extremely pushy to break into that crowd. Even then, it’s probably a mistake. Lower income kid will be shut out of a lot of things that the rich kids do because the lower income kid simply can’t afford them.

I went to Harvard as a kid of immigrant parents, generic UMC but not rich. Totally disagree that all the rich kids just stick together or whatever. Everyone lives in the dorms, everyone is on the unlimited meal plan etc. Freshman roommate assignments are given by the school. There's a range of people and friends/activities felt really mixed.

Lots of rich kids stick together but not all. But what comes after....not everyone is running off to work at daddy's hedge fund

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:By definition, Harvard and Yale are no longer top universities.

Both opted to withdraw from the USNWR ratings.

No they don't have balls to do that.
That was only for law schools as I know

Meh.

So their law schools are no longer Top 50. Or even Top 100.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:By definition, Harvard and Yale are no longer top universities.

Both opted to withdraw from the USNWR ratings.

No they don't have balls to do that.
That was only for law schools as I know

Meh.

So their law schools are no longer Top 50. Or even Top 100.

Has USNWR decided whether they will consider these schools since they didn’t submit? People are going to question the value do the list without them and I have not seen what USNWR said.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:By definition, Harvard and Yale are no longer top universities.

Both opted to withdraw from the USNWR ratings.

No they don't have balls to do that.
That was only for law schools as I know

Meh.

So their law schools are no longer Top 50. Or even Top 100.

Has USNWR decided whether they will consider these schools since they didn’t submit? People are going to question the value do the list without them and I have not seen what USNWR said.

It does not matter if the rank these schools or not. Yale law school is what it is regardless of this publication. It was excellent before the list existed and it will be excellent when the list is gone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It doesn't have to be an ivy, most top 50 schools provide similar opportunities. Ivy just has a better name brand as a cluster.

Yup again below is overall for major colleges in Boston area,

1 MIT: $111K
2 Boston College: $93K
3 Harvard: $85K
4 Northeastern: $80K
5 Boston University: $76K
6 Brandeis: $70K
7 Tufts: $67K



and also major matters more,

Harvard CS: $160,000 > GMU CS: $83,185 > Harvard English: $43,845 > GMU English: $28,000

And again, it's useless information b/c it's based on averages. You need to compare students with the same numbers and level of ambition in order to have anything of value.

Do you even understand yourself what you are trying to say??????

Yes. Trying to compare one college's ability to educate to another's ability to educate based on the average salary of their graduates is pointless. Showing an average salary compares all students at one college to all at another, but everyone knows the average student at GMU is not as intellectually capable as the average student at Harvard and shouldn't be expected to earn as much. The only way to compare one school to another is to compare what they're capable of doing with the same level of ability and ambition, and the only people who have done this with anything approaching the scientific method (Kruger and Dale) have found that it's the individual that matters, not the university.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It doesn't have to be an ivy, most top 50 schools provide similar opportunities. Ivy just has a better name brand as a cluster.

Yup again below is overall for major colleges in Boston area,

1 MIT: $111K
2 Boston College: $93K
3 Harvard: $85K
4 Northeastern: $80K
5 Boston University: $76K
6 Brandeis: $70K
7 Tufts: $67K



and also major matters more,

Harvard CS: $160,000 > GMU CS: $83,185 > Harvard English: $43,845 > GMU English: $28,000

And again, it's useless information b/c it's based on averages. You need to compare students with the same numbers and level of ambition in order to have anything of value.

Do you even understand yourself what you are trying to say??????

Yes. Trying to compare one college's ability to educate to another's ability to educate based on the average salary of their graduates is pointless. Showing an average salary compares all students at one college to all at another, but everyone knows the average student at GMU is not as intellectually capable as the average student at Harvard and shouldn't be expected to earn as much. The only way to compare one school to another is to compare what they're capable of doing with the same level of ability and ambition, and the only people who have done this with anything approaching the scientific method (Kruger and Dale) have found that it's the individual that matters, not the university.

No, the data and market says GMU CS >> Harvard English
The market decides who's capable of what and willing to pay that much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It doesn't have to be an ivy, most top 50 schools provide similar opportunities. Ivy just has a better name brand as a cluster.

Yup again below is overall for major colleges in Boston area,

1 MIT: $111K
2 Boston College: $93K
3 Harvard: $85K
4 Northeastern: $80K
5 Boston University: $76K
6 Brandeis: $70K
7 Tufts: $67K



and also major matters more,

Harvard CS: $160,000 > GMU CS: $83,185 > Harvard English: $43,845 > GMU English: $28,000

And again, it's useless information b/c it's based on averages. You need to compare students with the same numbers and level of ambition in order to have anything of value.

Do you even understand yourself what you are trying to say??????

Yes. Trying to compare one college's ability to educate to another's ability to educate based on the average salary of their graduates is pointless. Showing an average salary compares all students at one college to all at another, but everyone knows the average student at GMU is not as intellectually capable as the average student at Harvard and shouldn't be expected to earn as much. The only way to compare one school to another is to compare what they're capable of doing with the same level of ability and ambition, and the only people who have done this with anything approaching the scientific method (Kruger and Dale) have found that it's the individual that matters, not the university.

No, the data and market says GMU CS >> Harvard English
The market decides who's capable of what and willing to pay that much.

+1

Humanities are for rich people. Full stop.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Attending and graduating from an Ivy League school generates opportunities. Whether or not one takes advantage of those opportunities is an individual matter, not a criticism of Ivy League schools.

Attending any college generates opportunities. Every college has alumni networks.

So all colleges are the same with respect to job & career opportunities ?

Major matters much more

https://collegescorecard.ed.gov/school/?166027-Harvard-University&fos_code=2301&fos_credential=3

Harvard English: $43845

https://collegescorecard.ed.gov/school/?232186-George-Mason-University&fos_code=1107&fos_credential=3

GMU CS: $83185

Majors matter and school matters
Harvard CS: $163896

School doesn't matter as much as major

Major schools in Boston area

1 MIT: $111K
2 Boston College: $93K
3 Harvard: $85K
4 Northeastern: $80K
5 Boston University: $76K
6 Brandeis: $70K
7 Tufts: $67K

Its below BC and not significantly higher than NEU

If choices are between BC Finance/NEU CS vs Harvard English, History, Anthropology
I would go definitely go with BC Finance/NEU CS

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It doesn't have to be an ivy, most top 50 schools provide similar opportunities. Ivy just has a better name brand as a cluster.

Yup again below is overall for major colleges in Boston area,

1 MIT: $111K
2 Boston College: $93K
3 Harvard: $85K
4 Northeastern: $80K
5 Boston University: $76K
6 Brandeis: $70K
7 Tufts: $67K



and also major matters more,

Harvard CS: $160,000 > GMU CS: $83,185 > Harvard English: $43,845 > GMU English: $28,000

And again, it's useless information b/c it's based on averages. You need to compare students with the same numbers and level of ambition in order to have anything of value.

Do you even understand yourself what you are trying to say??????

Yes. Trying to compare one college's ability to educate to another's ability to educate based on the average salary of their graduates is pointless. Showing an average salary compares all students at one college to all at another, but everyone knows the average student at GMU is not as intellectually capable as the average student at Harvard and shouldn't be expected to earn as much. The only way to compare one school to another is to compare what they're capable of doing with the same level of ability and ambition, and the only people who have done this with anything approaching the scientific method (Kruger and Dale) have found that it's the individual that matters, not the university.

No, the data and market says GMU CS >> Harvard English
The market decides who's capable of what and willing to pay that much.

+1

Humanities are for rich people. Full stop.

Nah

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It doesn't have to be an ivy, most top 50 schools provide similar opportunities. Ivy just has a better name brand as a cluster.

Yup again below is overall for major colleges in Boston area,

1 MIT: $111K
2 Boston College: $93K
3 Harvard: $85K
4 Northeastern: $80K
5 Boston University: $76K
6 Brandeis: $70K
7 Tufts: $67K



and also major matters more,

Harvard CS: $160,000 > GMU CS: $83,185 > Harvard English: $43,845 > GMU English: $28,000

And again, it's useless information b/c it's based on averages. You need to compare students with the same numbers and level of ambition in order to have anything of value.

Do you even understand yourself what you are trying to say??????

Yes. Trying to compare one college's ability to educate to another's ability to educate based on the average salary of their graduates is pointless. Showing an average salary compares all students at one college to all at another, but everyone knows the average student at GMU is not as intellectually capable as the average student at Harvard and shouldn't be expected to earn as much. The only way to compare one school to another is to compare what they're capable of doing with the same level of ability and ambition, and the only people who have done this with anything approaching the scientific method (Kruger and Dale) have found that it's the individual that matters, not the university.

No, the data and market says GMU CS >> Harvard English
The market decides who's capable of what and willing to pay that much.

If showing that CS majors at a state u make more than Harvard English majors was really the original point that was trying to be demonstrated, then I agree. But trying to prove Harvard is better at educating CS majors than GMU is not possible in any way that anyone has tried so far.