3 children dead in private Christian elementary school shooting in TN

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

Oh, you're that person. I know you from the other thread. I literally have posted repeated responses to you, and pointed out that blue states already have constitutionally allowed measures in place that work and they aren't communist places. Others pointed out that other non-communist countries have sensible gun legislation. After all of that, I don't have much to say to you, so that's that. If anyone new wants to respond from the right sided POV, by all means, have at it.

You have not said how you would take those guns out of circulaton.

You know exactly what it would take to do that and know that it is not something anyone is willing to do.

I (and others) previously posted to you that this would not be done other than incentivizing (toys for guns, yadda yadda) gun return, but it would be a moving forward legislature. You ignored all of that, so. Shrug. Red flag law could have worked in the Nashville case if there was one.

Then you really aren't serious about ending mass shootings and don't care about black and brown bodies.

400 million guns are on the streets and most mass shootings are not school shootings like this week's. Your proposals will do nothing to stop those shootings.

Giuliani's warrantless stop and frisk targeted black and brown bodies and while it worked, it violated civil rights and put black and brown bodies in fear. It was not legal either.

Red flag laws will likely not get past SCOTUS either, and as were struck down in NY state.

Again to do what you suggest, along with door to door would turn the USA into an authoritarian hell hole.

So, I agree 100% with this DCUM Politics post, a first. Thank you for putting all this so succinctly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

"Give up those freedoms." So silly.

When does regulation mean giving up? When does regulation mean "being violated"?

The Constitution gives the right to vote. Voting is regulated everywhere.

If you gun fetishists think the 2nd amendment means there can be no regulation of arms sales and ownership, then you have absolutely no argument to make for voter ID laws and all the other ways Republicans try to reduce voting by the poor and minors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

"Give up those freedoms." So silly.

When does regulation mean giving up? When does regulation mean "being violated"?

The Constitution gives the right to vote. Voting is regulated everywhere.

If you gun fetishists think the 2nd amendment means there can be no regulation of arms sales and ownership, then you have absolutely no argument to make for voter ID laws and all the other ways Republicans try to reduce voting by the poor and minors.

This current shooting was a hate crime against Christians.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

Oh, you're that person. I know you from the other thread. I literally have posted repeated responses to you, and pointed out that blue states already have constitutionally allowed measures in place that work and they aren't communist places. Others pointed out that other non-communist countries have sensible gun legislation. After all of that, I don't have much to say to you, so that's that. If anyone new wants to respond from the right sided POV, by all means, have at it.

You have not said how you would take those guns out of circulaton.

You know exactly what it would take to do that and know that it is not something anyone is willing to do.

I (and others) previously posted to you that this would not be done other than incentivizing (toys for guns, yadda yadda) gun return, but it would be a moving forward legislature. You ignored all of that, so. Shrug. Red flag law could have worked in the Nashville case if there was one.

Then you really aren't serious about ending mass shootings and don't care about black and brown bodies.

400 million guns are on the streets and most mass shootings are not school shootings like this week's. Your proposals will do nothing to stop those shootings.

Giuliani's warrantless stop and frisk targeted black and brown bodies and while it worked, it violated civil rights and put black and brown bodies in fear. It was not legal either.

Red flag laws will likely not get past SCOTUS either, and as were struck down in NY state.

Again to do what you suggest, along with door to door would turn the USA into an authoritarian hell hole.

So, I agree 100% with this DCUM Politics post, a first. Thank you for putting all this so succinctly.

Yet snother person ignoring that red state laws supply most US criminals with their guns and conservatives failure to reign in straw purchases as a major factor in deaths of black and brown bodies.

Yet another person ignoring that existing laws in blue states WORK statistically to lower shooting events except that criminals are primarily sourcing their guns from incompetent red states

Yet another person who fails to have anything useful to say to anyone personally impacted by gun violence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

"Give up those freedoms." So silly.

When does regulation mean giving up? When does regulation mean "being violated"?

The Constitution gives the right to vote. Voting is regulated everywhere.

If you gun fetishists think the 2nd amendment means there can be no regulation of arms sales and ownership, then you have absolutely no argument to make for voter ID laws and all the other ways Republicans try to reduce voting by the poor and minors.

You're missing the point. I'm not arguing about regulation or no regulation. You and others who have responded, don't want to address ANY of the below constitutional concerns.

To get what you want, which is civilian disarmament, then you have to heavily curtail civil rights.

You have to break the 1st amendment such that the government can dictate what information citizens can share with one another to stop 3d printing of firearms.
You have to allow searches without probable cause breaking the 4th amendment.
You have to implement red flag laws to seize property when no crime has been committed, breaking the 5th amendment.
You have to target certain communities which tend to posses arms acquired illegally at a higher rate, which breaks the 14th amendment.

Now you're no longer living in America, but in a police state.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

Oh, you're that person. I know you from the other thread. I literally have posted repeated responses to you, and pointed out that blue states already have constitutionally allowed measures in place that work and they aren't communist places. Others pointed out that other non-communist countries have sensible gun legislation. After all of that, I don't have much to say to you, so that's that. If anyone new wants to respond from the right sided POV, by all means, have at it.

You have not said how you would take those guns out of circulaton.

You know exactly what it would take to do that and know that it is not something anyone is willing to do.

I (and others) previously posted to you that this would not be done other than incentivizing (toys for guns, yadda yadda) gun return, but it would be a moving forward legislature. You ignored all of that, so. Shrug. Red flag law could have worked in the Nashville case if there was one.

Then you really aren't serious about ending mass shootings and don't care about black and brown bodies.

400 million guns are on the streets and most mass shootings are not school shootings like this week's. Your proposals will do nothing to stop those shootings.

Giuliani's warrantless stop and frisk targeted black and brown bodies and while it worked, it violated civil rights and put black and brown bodies in fear. It was not legal either.

Red flag laws will likely not get past SCOTUS either, and as were struck down in NY state.

Again to do what you suggest, along with door to door would turn the USA into an authoritarian hell hole.

So, I agree 100% with this DCUM Politics post, a first. Thank you for putting all this so succinctly.

Yet snother person ignoring that red state laws supply most US criminals with their guns and conservatives failure to reign in straw purchases as a major factor in deaths of black and brown bodies.

Yet another person ignoring that existing laws in blue states WORK statistically to lower shooting events except that criminals are primarily sourcing their guns from incompetent red states

Yet another person who fails to have anything useful to say to anyone personally impacted by gun violence.

As for the red states thing, someone already called you out on that. ATF data doesn't show that for Chicago as you previously argued.

FBI data shows that firearms violence rates are primarily intra racial group and that it overwhelming occurs among black and brown bodies. Re-implementing racist Jim Crow era laws to prevent that is entirely unacceptable. Support for BLM ensures that will rightly, never occur.



I think everyone would agree to increase straw purchase prosecutions and penalties.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

"Give up those freedoms." So silly.

When does regulation mean giving up? When does regulation mean "being violated"?

The Constitution gives the right to vote. Voting is regulated everywhere.

If you gun fetishists think the 2nd amendment means there can be no regulation of arms sales and ownership, then you have absolutely no argument to make for voter ID laws and all the other ways Republicans try to reduce voting by the poor and minors.

You're missing the point. I'm not arguing about regulation or no regulation. You and others who have responded, don't want to address ANY of the below constitutional concerns.

To get what you want, which is civilian disarmament, then you have to heavily curtail civil rights.

You have to break the 1st amendment such that the government can dictate what information citizens can share with one another to stop 3d printing of firearms.
You have to allow searches without probable cause breaking the 4th amendment.
You have to implement red flag laws to seize property when no crime has been committed, breaking the 5th amendment.
You have to target certain communities which tend to posses arms acquired illegally at a higher rate, which breaks the 14th amendment.

Now you're no longer living in America, but in a police state.

I'm literally just advocating for existing blue state laws at a federal level. Is NY a police state? CT? Obviously their gun laws have some impact given even the criminals in those states turn to red states for gund that kill... Checks notes... Black and brown bodies.

Stop with the exaggeration and lies for what is actually being discussed

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

Oh, you're that person. I know you from the other thread. I literally have posted repeated responses to you, and pointed out that blue states already have constitutionally allowed measures in place that work and they aren't communist places. Others pointed out that other non-communist countries have sensible gun legislation. After all of that, I don't have much to say to you, so that's that. If anyone new wants to respond from the right sided POV, by all means, have at it.

You have not said how you would take those guns out of circulaton.

You know exactly what it would take to do that and know that it is not something anyone is willing to do.

I (and others) previously posted to you that this would not be done other than incentivizing (toys for guns, yadda yadda) gun return, but it would be a moving forward legislature. You ignored all of that, so. Shrug. Red flag law could have worked in the Nashville case if there was one.

Then you really aren't serious about ending mass shootings and don't care about black and brown bodies.

400 million guns are on the streets and most mass shootings are not school shootings like this week's. Your proposals will do nothing to stop those shootings.

Giuliani's warrantless stop and frisk targeted black and brown bodies and while it worked, it violated civil rights and put black and brown bodies in fear. It was not legal either.

Red flag laws will likely not get past SCOTUS either, and as were struck down in NY state.

Again to do what you suggest, along with door to door would turn the USA into an authoritarian hell hole.

So, I agree 100% with this DCUM Politics post, a first. Thank you for putting all this so succinctly.

Yet snother person ignoring that red state laws supply most US criminals with their guns and conservatives failure to reign in straw purchases as a major factor in deaths of black and brown bodies.

Yet another person ignoring that existing laws in blue states WORK statistically to lower shooting events except that criminals are primarily sourcing their guns from incompetent red states

Yet another person who fails to have anything useful to say to anyone personally impacted by gun violence.

As for the red states thing, someone already called you out on that. ATF data doesn't show that for Chicago as you previously argued.

FBI data shows that firearms violence rates are primarily intra racial group and that it overwhelming occurs among black and brown bodies. Re-implementing racist Jim Crow era laws to prevent that is entirely unacceptable. Support for BLM ensures that will rightly, never occur.



I think everyone would agree to increase straw purchase prosecutions and penalties.

geor
50 percent is bad enough and I live in DC where most are coming from Georgia and North Carolina as of late. We can go state by state. I'm not wrong

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

"Give up those freedoms." So silly.

When does regulation mean giving up? When does regulation mean "being violated"?

The Constitution gives the right to vote. Voting is regulated everywhere.

If you gun fetishists think the 2nd amendment means there can be no regulation of arms sales and ownership, then you have absolutely no argument to make for voter ID laws and all the other ways Republicans try to reduce voting by the poor and minors.

You're missing the point. I'm not arguing about regulation or no regulation. You and others who have responded, don't want to address ANY of the below constitutional concerns.

To get what you want, which is civilian disarmament, then you have to heavily curtail civil rights.

You have to break the 1st amendment such that the government can dictate what information citizens can share with one another to stop 3d printing of firearms.
You have to allow searches without probable cause breaking the 4th amendment.
You have to implement red flag laws to seize property when no crime has been committed, breaking the 5th amendment.
You have to target certain communities which tend to posses arms acquired illegally at a higher rate, which breaks the 14th amendment.

Now you're no longer living in America, but in a police state.

Go to law school and get back to us, because you have zero understanding of the Constitution.

Gun sales and ownership can easily be regulated, targeting both the types of weapons allowed, as well as who can own one. All it takes is a Supreme Court which recognizes that gun ownership was never intended to be, nor is, an absolute right.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

Oh, you're that person. I know you from the other thread. I literally have posted repeated responses to you, and pointed out that blue states already have constitutionally allowed measures in place that work and they aren't communist places. Others pointed out that other non-communist countries have sensible gun legislation. After all of that, I don't have much to say to you, so that's that. If anyone new wants to respond from the right sided POV, by all means, have at it.

You have not said how you would take those guns out of circulaton.

You know exactly what it would take to do that and know that it is not something anyone is willing to do.

I (and others) previously posted to you that this would not be done other than incentivizing (toys for guns, yadda yadda) gun return, but it would be a moving forward legislature. You ignored all of that, so. Shrug. Red flag law could have worked in the Nashville case if there was one.

Then you really aren't serious about ending mass shootings and don't care about black and brown bodies.

400 million guns are on the streets and most mass shootings are not school shootings like this week's. Your proposals will do nothing to stop those shootings.

Giuliani's warrantless stop and frisk targeted black and brown bodies and while it worked, it violated civil rights and put black and brown bodies in fear. It was not legal either.

Red flag laws will likely not get past SCOTUS either, and as were struck down in NY state.

Again to do what you suggest, along with door to door would turn the USA into an authoritarian hell hole.

So, I agree 100% with this DCUM Politics post, a first. Thank you for putting all this so succinctly.

Yet snother person ignoring that red state laws supply most US criminals with their guns and conservatives failure to reign in straw purchases as a major factor in deaths of black and brown bodies.

Yet another person ignoring that existing laws in blue states WORK statistically to lower shooting events except that criminals are primarily sourcing their guns from incompetent red states

Yet another person who fails to have anything useful to say to anyone personally impacted by gun violence.

As for the red states thing, someone already called you out on that. ATF data doesn't show that for Chicago as you previously argued.

FBI data shows that firearms violence rates are primarily intra racial group and that it overwhelming occurs among black and brown bodies. Re-implementing racist Jim Crow era laws to prevent that is entirely unacceptable. Support for BLM ensures that will rightly, never occur.



I think everyone would agree to increase straw purchase prosecutions and penalties.

PS I never supported stop and frisk and have not said anything about it. I do support red flag laws they already exist even if not in NYC.

So what do you suggest othet than shooting down ideas and shrugging your shoulders?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.


DP
What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

Oh, you're that person. I know you from the other thread. I literally have posted repeated responses to you, and pointed out that blue states already have constitutionally allowed measures in place that work and they aren't communist places. Others pointed out that other non-communist countries have sensible gun legislation. After all of that, I don't have much to say to you, so that's that. If anyone new wants to respond from the right sided POV, by all means, have at it.

You have not said how you would take those guns out of circulaton.

You know exactly what it would take to do that and know that it is not something anyone is willing to do.

I (and others) previously posted to you that this would not be done other than incentivizing (toys for guns, yadda yadda) gun return, but it would be a moving forward legislature. You ignored all of that, so. Shrug. Red flag law could have worked in the Nashville case if there was one.

Then you really aren't serious about ending mass shootings and don't care about black and brown bodies.

400 million guns are on the streets and most mass shootings are not school shootings like this week's. Your proposals will do nothing to stop those shootings.

Giuliani's warrantless stop and frisk targeted black and brown bodies and while it worked, it violated civil rights and put black and brown bodies in fear. It was not legal either.

Red flag laws will likely not get past SCOTUS either, and as were struck down in NY state.

Again to do what you suggest, along with door to door would turn the USA into an authoritarian hell hole.

So, I agree 100% with this DCUM Politics post, a first. Thank you for putting all this so succinctly.

Yet snother person ignoring that red state laws supply most US criminals with their guns and conservatives failure to reign in straw purchases as a major factor in deaths of black and brown bodies.

Yet another person ignoring that existing laws in blue states WORK statistically to lower shooting events except that criminals are primarily sourcing their guns from incompetent red states

Yet another person who fails to have anything useful to say to anyone personally impacted by gun violence.

As for the red states thing, someone already called you out on that. ATF data doesn't show that for Chicago as you previously argued.

FBI data shows that firearms violence rates are primarily intra racial group and that it overwhelming occurs among black and brown bodies. Re-implementing racist Jim Crow era laws to prevent that is entirely unacceptable. Support for BLM ensures that will rightly, never occur.



I think everyone would agree to increase straw purchase prosecutions and penalties.

geor
50 percent is bad enough and I live in DC where most are coming from Georgia and North Carolina as of late. We can go state by state. I'm not wrong

DP but it's 60.percent in chicago per what I read. Or pick another blue city on a blue state, we can keep playing

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

"Give up those freedoms." So silly.

When does regulation mean giving up? When does regulation mean "being violated"?

The Constitution gives the right to vote. Voting is regulated everywhere.

If you gun fetishists think the 2nd amendment means there can be no regulation of arms sales and ownership, then you have absolutely no argument to make for voter ID laws and all the other ways Republicans try to reduce voting by the poor and minors.

You're missing the point. I'm not arguing about regulation or no regulation. You and others who have responded, don't want to address ANY of the below constitutional concerns.

To get what you want, which is civilian disarmament, then you have to heavily curtail civil rights.

You have to break the 1st amendment such that the government can dictate what information citizens can share with one another to stop 3d printing of firearms.
You have to allow searches without probable cause breaking the 4th amendment.
You have to implement red flag laws to seize property when no crime has been committed, breaking the 5th amendment.
You have to target certain communities which tend to posses arms acquired illegally at a higher rate, which breaks the 14th amendment.

Now you're no longer living in America, but in a police state.

I'm literally just advocating for existing blue state laws at a federal level. Is NY a police state? CT? Obviously their gun laws have some impact given even the criminals in those states turn to red states for gund that kill... Checks notes... Black and brown bodies.

Stop with the exaggeration and lies for what is actually being discussed

What lies?

How do you stop 3d printing of firearms? It's laughably easy to do right now. I guess you haven't heard of ghost guns? Seems like every other crime story on WTOP says they're used.

Stop and frisk works, but blue state NY's NYC implemementation was found illegal and was directed at LatinX and African Americans and racial profiling is illegal.

Red flags haven't made it to the supreme court, but NY's law was found unconstitutional.

Blue state laws don't work when anyone with a $300 3d printer can make them.

Blue state laws don't work when they get tossed out of court for being illegal.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

US provides the guns, Mexican cartels provide the drugs. It’s called international commerce.
Sorry if it wasn’t clear, I was being sarcastic about immigration. It was apparently a failed attempt to point out the hypocrisy is claiming Mexico is a good example of why gun laws don’t work because you know the right would never argue that immigration laws don’t work.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

4) Why do criminals from Mexican cartels turn to US red states for straw purchases to source their guns?

Because it's easier to get guns from the US than to buy them legally in Mexico. Also, the US is the #1 gun exporter in the world.

Wrong.

The Mexican cartels get guns from Central America, left over from the many wars there.

BTW, Mexico already has extremely tough gun control laws.

Gun control doesn’t work, obviously.

Mexico also has extremely tough laws about immigration and yet people cross the border there illegally all the time, so immigration laws must not work. Let’s not bother to control immigration either. Open borders and guns for all!

Sure, let's get rid of laws, right?!?!?! They don't work ever!

I mean, they surely don't work in the blue states because the criminals in blue state cities can buy their guns so easily in those blue states right? They don't have to source them from straw purchases in red states, right?

Sorry if it wasn’t clear, I was being sarcastic about immigration. It was apparently a failed attempt to point out the hypocrisy is claiming Mexico is a good example of why gun laws don’t work because you know the right would never argue that immigration laws don’t work.

Let me help you. Immigration laws don't work if they aren't enforced. That would be the same with gun laws.

Exactly. Which is why it’s silly to point to Mexico as some example in the failure of gun laws. It’s not exactly like they have a functioning government doing anything to curtail gun crimes.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:People complaining about restrictions on rights. Really should go into an airplane and yell bomb or into a government building and yell fire and see what happens when you say it was your Right to freedom of speech....... Your freedoms can't Trump public safety?

I hear you, but we did just live through COVID and saw what one party thought of measure to protect others....

What, masks and shots and this is the same as letting criminals and mass shooters have guns to slaughter children with to the point that they can't be recognized other than bits of clothing and DNA? Sorry, no, get over it, GOP is the party of child killer enablers with gun deaths the #1 cause of pediatric deaths in the USA.

Not giving up the 1st, 4th, 5th and 14th amendments for this.

Please answer directly:

1) Why are mass shootings statistically more likely in (red) states with less restrictive gun laws and trending up in those states? (yes, anecdotally, mass shootings can happen anywhere, but they are statistically less likely in blue states with current gun legislation)
2) Why do criminals from democratic run cities source guns from straw purchases in red states (per gun tracing studies)?
3) If both of the above are true, why will you not conclude that sensible gun legislation already actually works, even without any repeal of 2a?

Check out where those mass shootings occur within red states. They occur in largely blue cities in certain communities. They tend not to occur as much in rural areas.

Data? blue states have cities too. So why are cities in red states worse than cities in blue states for mass shooting types of occurrances?

Also remind me why criminals in chicago need to source their guns from red states? Want to keep deflecting?

I'm taking it you haven't read the gun violence project.

Most mass shootings are concentrated among certain communities and aren't reported beyond the local area.

And why are communities in red states per capita more likely to have mass shooting than blue states?

Someone obviously didn't take stats class.

I took a lot of them actually. I meant communities in red states vs communities in blue states. I assume by "communities" you mean urban cities. So?

PS still waiting for an answer on why chicago criminals source their guns from far away? Same for other blue states? Anyone? Crickets?

They get half in illinois

And half not because they can't and because red states are totally sh*tty at straw purchase control.

At any rate, are you a parent? What is your research based suggestion for curtailing gun crime or you are just cool with babies being slaughtered and red states supplying criminals everywhere with guns?

-Mother of two elementary school children
-Good friend personally knew family/child involved in Sandy Hook
-Family and friend of teachers and law enforcement
-Close family member happened to not be at Buffalo grocery store the day of that shooting
-Live in city where I have heard gunshots from my house on multiple occasions
-Work in healthcare so know all to clearly the difference between handgun wounds and rifle wounds and what they can do to a person's body
-Work in healthcare where I spent a half hour under a desk during an active shooter scare (And we have had people pull guns in our ER and did have an actual shooting that killed a healthcare worker years ago)

I say all of this repeatedly because the only responses I get from people on the right are sarcasm, bluster, stalling, deflecting and pretending it's no big deal. Generic platitudes of "enforce existing laws" and "loss of family values." Blah blah blah.

This is personal, it's real, and my anger isn't generated from reading left wing news so much as personal experience.

What are your solutions? Anything other than generic platitudes and sarcasm?

I'm not cool with the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 14th ammendments being violated as that is what it would take to solve the problem.

I grew up in a Communist country and have no desire to give up those freedoms. A place where due process does not exist.

"Give up those freedoms." So silly.

When does regulation mean giving up? When does regulation mean "being violated"?

The Constitution gives the right to vote. Voting is regulated everywhere.

If you gun fetishists think the 2nd amendment means there can be no regulation of arms sales and ownership, then you have absolutely no argument to make for voter ID laws and all the other ways Republicans try to reduce voting by the poor and minors.

You're missing the point. I'm not arguing about regulation or no regulation. You and others who have responded, don't want to address ANY of the below constitutional concerns.

To get what you want, which is civilian disarmament, then you have to heavily curtail civil rights.

You have to break the 1st amendment such that the government can dictate what information citizens can share with one another to stop 3d printing of firearms.
You have to allow searches without probable cause breaking the 4th amendment.
You have to implement red flag laws to seize property when no crime has been committed, breaking the 5th amendment.
You have to target certain communities which tend to posses arms acquired illegally at a higher rate, which breaks the 14th amendment.

Now you're no longer living in America, but in a police state.

I'm literally just advocating for existing blue state laws at a federal level. Is NY a police state? CT? Obviously their gun laws have some impact given even the criminals in those states turn to red states for gund that kill... Checks notes... Black and brown bodies.

Stop with the exaggeration and lies for what is actually being discussed

What lies?

How do you stop 3d printing of firearms? It's laughably easy to do right now. I guess you haven't heard of ghost guns? Seems like every other crime story on WTOP says they're used.

Stop and frisk works, but blue state NY's NYC implemementation was found illegal and was directed at LatinX and African Americans and racial profiling is illegal.

Red flags haven't made it to the supreme court, but NY's law was found unconstitutional.

Blue state laws don't work when anyone with a $300 3d printer can make them.

Blue state laws don't work when they get tossed out of court for being illegal.

So in conclusion you are completely cool with the status quo, gun deaths are number one killer of children in the USA and you believe there ks nothing that can or should be done? If you could go have a sit down with parents of Sandy Hook kids or black and brown families who lost their loved one to gun violence about solutions, you would say "I'm sorry, nothing can be done"

[Anonymous]

US provides the guns, Mexican cartels provide the drugs. It’s called international commerce.