Why are people more sympathetic to Lindsay Clancy than Andrea Yates? (Child death mentioned)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Based on the arraignment it sounds like she was left alone with the children over significant amounts of time. Her husband was WFH but in an office in the basement. She also seemed to run errands, like take the kids to the doctor or to the park, without him. So him just leaving her alone for 20 min to go to CVS and get take out doesn’t seem like this big open window that she didn’t already have before. When he was working in the basement, it appears they interacted via text vs in person. She seemed to be the primary care giver. She could have done all the things she did while he was in the basement working.

It seems extremely premeditated and not just a snap.

But she didn’t, because she knew it was wrong and she knew the noise of the kids FIGHTING FOR THEIR DAMN LIVES would bring her husband to stop her killing spree.

Good luck to her defense team. They will need it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like members of Lindsay’s Army of love are here and passionately defending a child murderer. Babies and children can be slaughtered but the opportunity to defend a homely, white, professionally unaccomplished, pill popping and attention seeking failure must never be squandered. The projection is real.

Gross, no, and no one is passionately defending her personally in the way that you're suggesting. Repulsive.

Yes, they are, vociferously and repeatedly. They’re repulsive.

+100. I can only wonder what kind of family life people like PP have. It can’t be good. With all these new details, only the lowest of the low and personality disordered individuals could defend or empathize with this woman. I can’t even type her name, I’m so horrified and disgusted by her acts and that’s as it should be. Society needs to stop normalizing and excusing psychopathic behavior.

This stuff revealed in the hearing is very disturbing. But I think people really want to reserve judgment because these murders are just so out of the norm. When Bryan Kohberger was arrested, that made sense - angry jealous stalker type. Once we found out about Chris Watts’ affair, that made sense - enraged husband who wanted a new life. (Though I personally believe he only meant to kill his wife, and only killed the kids because he was temporarily insane and thought they would be better off dead than without a mother).

Here, this just doesn’t make sense. If Lindsay regretted having kids, why not just leave her family? Why risk life in prison by murdering them? And if she did decide that murder was the only way, why do it in this manner? She could’ve at least tried the Susan Smith route. Or a car accident, carbon monoxide poisoning, house fire, etc. Why kill them in a way that directly implicates her? And people on here are saying that she didn’t really intend to kill herself because she jumped out a window. But she’s paralyzed from the waist down, so I think she did actually want to die. She could’ve just taken a bottle of benedryl if she really want to “pretend”. It just doesn’t make sense! Either she’s the dumbest killer ever or she really was out of her mind.

At any rate, some of y’all are way too angry with her. Like the pp who said she’s professionally unaccomplished. Way to crap on an entire group of l&d nurses! Are they all professionally unaccomplished?! And she’s not homely. She’s a solid 7, and an 8 in some of her pictures. Of course Ted Bundy was a total smoke show so that doesn’t mean anything… but why go there? Y’all are weird.

She’s a nurse. She would know just how lethal Benedryl is. You don’t have to take that much to die. Regardless I don’t think that people are going to have a lot of sympathy. Even if you are hearing voices you know it’s wrong to act.

I'm a nurse, including working for many years in an ICU at Hopkins. I would have no idea how much Benadryl (or even morphine) I'd take if I wanted to kill myself. As in, I wouldn't even know what dose I'd start with. It's not exactly something you're taught in nursing school or on the job.

I'm actually scared that you are a nurse.

Ok genius (nurse here).
How many benedryl would it take? Since apparently every nurse would know.
25mg is a pediatric dose. 50mg is an adult.
Would you take 10? 20? 50? How many to stop respiratory function? I'll just look that right up in my handy Nursing Drug Handbook.
And of course, every patient responds differently to Benadryl AND you'd have to weight dose.
So maybe 60?
And you wouldn't want to overdose because then you'd risk throwing up right away and decreasing the sedative effect. Hmm. So maybe 40.

Hi Nurse Here. Do you not have Google? She did, since she had internet access to beg for attention on social media.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My friend had a post partum nervous breakdown at six months after weeks of insomnia triggered by baby sleep struggles. She tried to go on fmla but her boss forced her to quit instead with threatening action letters because she said she had ‘already taken too much maternity leave.’ This is the society we live in that tells moms they are too big a burden until some moms say ok i get it, I’m worthless, I will just kill my kids and myself. Which of you who are so disgusted or outraged at her has founght for universal maternity leave? Which of you has lobbied for safe affordable subsidized daycare? Or adequate (first world) maternal medical care? You are the disgusting ones, desperate to see a public lynching while this very minute there is an exhausted mom in the verge of crisis with no one to turn to. You are handmaid’s tale characters. Your righteousness is blasphemy.

This is dumb. You sleep train. Put the baby to bed at 7 and go back in at 6. That’s all it takes.

That’s why it’s hard for a manager to have empathy for a woman who is voluntarily getting up for a six month old baby.

A child with autism or health issues may not be possible to sleep train.

Let’s stay on topic. Thanks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m very concerned to hear that McClean Hospital discharged her after only five days inpatient. That is far from ideal standard of care of post partum depression requiring inpatient treatment. When I used to be a prosecutor and I would commit patients involuntarily, I was always shocked in following the cases to see how quickly they would street people who were seriously mentally ill, but that was the state hospital. I once put a guy there whose family cut him down from a tree and revived him, he was dead but they restarted his heart with CPR, a miracle really. He was cognitively intact but obviously suicidally depressed and the state hospital discharged him in a week with SSRIs. SSRIs take weeks to reach full efficacy. But that’s our mental health system in this country.

I just don’t think this woman murdered her children with mens rea formed in a sane mind.

Ah, this picture explains everything. Y’all see a white woman hugging her kid and relate to her. That’s the reason for all the mental gymnastics to defend her and “she couldn’t have plotted to murder those kids!” UMC white women everywhere are scared to death that one of them could just be a cold blooded killer and not a victim of mental illness and a failed healthcare system. Perpetual victims..

+1,000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
People here also seem to have a perception of psychosis that is very inaccurate. Many have probably only interacted with severe mental illness with someone on the street with a particular type of psychosis happening. Sometimes delusions are quite quiet and impossible for the person experiencing them to determine what is happening. They are completely unaware. If she had fallen deeper it may explain why she had been raising flags earlier but stopped. Frankly based on my experience it all makes sense. The mental illness got worse and she was now in a state where she couldn’t decipher between which often looks like hiding it - she likely later would have said if this didn’t happen that she doesn’t really remember this time (now she might say that too but folks will be suspicious)

Thank you for this very cogent description. Since I fully believe that you're speaking from experience, I wonder if you would be willing to expand a bit on the bolded?

Pp here. Speaking from professional experience, not personal but for example, in order for something to be a delusion a person basically has to believe in something wildly untrue (not using clinical speak here ha) despite clear evidence to the contrary. But what can often be tricky is someone with delusions (this is just an example, I have no idea if she was having delusions), can be very normal in all other scenarios until something comes up about the delusion. You can be having an incredibly normal conversation and if you avoid the particular topic where the delusion lies, you would truly never know. It’s only if you happen to engage on that particular belief that suddenly things will seem very off. And the person doesn’t realize how off it is because for them it is reality so they wouldn’t say oh hey I’m concerned about myself I need help. There isn’t self awareness at this point.

I am in no way saying this particular situation with delusions being primary is what was happening, but instead trying to share that it is far more common than people here seem to think that someone could be having very scary thoughts or thoughts not aligned with reality and it not be immediately obvious every moment (like you can still call the pharmacy). Also, more likely in her scenario someone can at some points be in a place where when they have auditory hallucinations or intrusive thoughts where they are still aware and feel separate from them and then are more likely to say hey something is going on with me I need help like she did for the initial intrusive thoughts. But in different states, people can be very unaware and it’s like the self awareness is removed so they are in a state where they believe the voices or feel almost disconnected to themselves and very unaware of themselves and what they are doing. So they wouldn’t necessarily say anything to anyone even though they aren’t intentionally hiding it. Anyway there are so many ways it can present and I just think we cannot say what was going on for her based on the fact that she could have some conversations before this happened.

That is really fascinating. It almost sounds as though you are saying that if someone had a deeply delusional belief that was the product of postpartum psychosis that developed from postpartum depression or anxiety, she might have gone through a course of illness in which she seemed outwardly "better"--less floridly depressed--while actually being much more dangerously ill. Y/N?

Yes. It’s kind of like how someone who is deeply depressed can seem better before they complete a suicide attempt. The mind is powerful and it can trick us, trick really good humans into doing things they would never do when not in that state. I have no idea of knowing what happened that day or the weeks before but I do know that mental illness and the way it presents is complex.

And folks are asserting that I don’t want to think a suburban mom could kill in cold blood, I personally think that those jumping to cold blood arguments despite the evidence of postpartum depression that makes way more sense don’t want to think that they too could lose control of their mind. That we are all less in control than we’d like to think, that psychosis or deep depression can happen to any of us and take away much of our rational thinking. It’s a scary scary thought. And it’s easier in a way to think it’s just an evil person because then you can say it won’t/couldn’t happen to you or someone you love and you can take the easy route of saying she’s a monster.

It’s the other way around. You’re jumping to “PPD/ PPP made her homicidal!” despite her having no diagnosis of PPP/PPD by medical professionals who treated and knew her better than you, because it’s a scary scary thought that the nice white lady could plan and execute such a horrific crime. All you Lindsay fans and army of love’ers are basically just racists writing paragraphs of conjecture and word salad because you’re terrified an umc white lady could be blamed and locked away for a crime she did commit.

You have several people here saying that it is entirely possible, and more statistically likely, that she was misdiagnosed or on a path to psychosis that was not detected than that she is a stone cold psychopath. You are presenting no argument against that—just ad hominem. Weak tea.

+1 it is apparently triggering for folks that some of us think Lindsay’s documented mental illness may have escalated and played a role here. I truly don’t understand why. Yet those folks are not showing any evidence that I see that shows the contrary (evidence of prior abuse? Domestic violence in the home? Neglect?) just that she googlemapped a takeout order?? I literally did that last week for a new place I wanted my husband to pick up at. Our diagnostic system is limited. It is helpful and necessary, and has limitations. We do not have good diagnostic criteria for postpartum issues. It was obviously more than GAD or they wouldn’t have hospitalized her. That’s just not something someone ends up in patient for. She had suicidal thoughts and thoughts of harming her children. Thoughts that everyone who knew her is saying unequivocally were not aligned with how she typically is.

You feel like I’m tying myself up in knots to defend her but I feel like you are tying yourself in knots trying to convince yourself this was in cold blood with very little evidence. The prosecution was making their case that she was not safe to leave and that she committed this crime. Everyone agrees with that.

There may be projection happening for me sure, but there is for anyone who is also adamantly saying they know it was in cold blood despite a recent inpatient hospitalization for SI/HI. The jump is huge.

She self-presented at McLean stating she was afraid of hurting herself. At one point (once!) prior to Janaury, she had told her husband that she had thoughts of harming the children she resented so much. The McLean doctors did not come up with a psychosis diagnosis - in fact, the word was not uttered by Lindsay until +10 days after everything occurred... during the same conversation she told her husband she still loves him. She sounds like a master manipulator.

It feels awfully convenient where she was treated by the best doctors at multiple health systems, psychosis never came up, but now it's all, "oh, well, she could've been PPP but not yet diagnosed". It feels like a literal get out of jail free excuse to me. I will grant you, you have to be not in your right mind to do what she did, but can't you say that for anyone who commits a horrible crime? We still punish those people. Plenty of school shooters have severe mental health issues (welllllll beyond GAD), report heaving voices (Parkland shooter, for one), with horrible home lives/extenuating circumstances, but they don't walk free. Why is it different w/ Lindsay?

Why would a master manipulator say either of those things months before committing these acts? It just doesn't make sense.

And agree with PP: I'm not saying she deserves to walk free.

I have no idea why she did what she did.

One of her first things she asks when waking up in the hospital is, do I need a lawyer...so, she's too zonked to worry about the kids, but she can worry about herself? She calls PC to tell him she loves him and expresses love, but doesn't express remorse for what she's done? None of it really makes sense.

Again, the prosecutions job was to paint a picture for you that would leave you upset and horrified. That is their job. Pick the pieces that will tell the most convincing story to convince you this woman is dangerous because as a prosecutor it is my job to make sure she remains under custody right now. Which that is so correct and necessary. But the fact the everyone doesn’t seem to understand that this is their job - to paint a picture and to only take the details that serve them is interesting. They did a good job, but it doesn’t mean it’s telling the full picture.

And they’re doing so using FACTS like the one above. Something is very wrong with you that you continue to try to excuse it away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
People here also seem to have a perception of psychosis that is very inaccurate. Many have probably only interacted with severe mental illness with someone on the street with a particular type of psychosis happening. Sometimes delusions are quite quiet and impossible for the person experiencing them to determine what is happening. They are completely unaware. If she had fallen deeper it may explain why she had been raising flags earlier but stopped. Frankly based on my experience it all makes sense. The mental illness got worse and she was now in a state where she couldn’t decipher between which often looks like hiding it - she likely later would have said if this didn’t happen that she doesn’t really remember this time (now she might say that too but folks will be suspicious)

Thank you for this very cogent description. Since I fully believe that you're speaking from experience, I wonder if you would be willing to expand a bit on the bolded?

Pp here. Speaking from professional experience, not personal but for example, in order for something to be a delusion a person basically has to believe in something wildly untrue (not using clinical speak here ha) despite clear evidence to the contrary. But what can often be tricky is someone with delusions (this is just an example, I have no idea if she was having delusions), can be very normal in all other scenarios until something comes up about the delusion. You can be having an incredibly normal conversation and if you avoid the particular topic where the delusion lies, you would truly never know. It’s only if you happen to engage on that particular belief that suddenly things will seem very off. And the person doesn’t realize how off it is because for them it is reality so they wouldn’t say oh hey I’m concerned about myself I need help. There isn’t self awareness at this point.

I am in no way saying this particular situation with delusions being primary is what was happening, but instead trying to share that it is far more common than people here seem to think that someone could be having very scary thoughts or thoughts not aligned with reality and it not be immediately obvious every moment (like you can still call the pharmacy). Also, more likely in her scenario someone can at some points be in a place where when they have auditory hallucinations or intrusive thoughts where they are still aware and feel separate from them and then are more likely to say hey something is going on with me I need help like she did for the initial intrusive thoughts. But in different states, people can be very unaware and it’s like the self awareness is removed so they are in a state where they believe the voices or feel almost disconnected to themselves and very unaware of themselves and what they are doing. So they wouldn’t necessarily say anything to anyone even though they aren’t intentionally hiding it. Anyway there are so many ways it can present and I just think we cannot say what was going on for her based on the fact that she could have some conversations before this happened.

That is really fascinating. It almost sounds as though you are saying that if someone had a deeply delusional belief that was the product of postpartum psychosis that developed from postpartum depression or anxiety, she might have gone through a course of illness in which she seemed outwardly "better"--less floridly depressed--while actually being much more dangerously ill. Y/N?

Yes. It’s kind of like how someone who is deeply depressed can seem better before they complete a suicide attempt. The mind is powerful and it can trick us, trick really good humans into doing things they would never do when not in that state. I have no idea of knowing what happened that day or the weeks before but I do know that mental illness and the way it presents is complex.

And folks are asserting that I don’t want to think a suburban mom could kill in cold blood, I personally think that those jumping to cold blood arguments despite the evidence of postpartum depression that makes way more sense don’t want to think that they too could lose control of their mind. That we are all less in control than we’d like to think, that psychosis or deep depression can happen to any of us and take away much of our rational thinking. It’s a scary scary thought. And it’s easier in a way to think it’s just an evil person because then you can say it won’t/couldn’t happen to you or someone you love and you can take the easy route of saying she’s a monster.

It’s the other way around. You’re jumping to “PPD/ PPP made her homicidal!” despite her having no diagnosis of PPP/PPD by medical professionals who treated and knew her better than you, because it’s a scary scary thought that the nice white lady could plan and execute such a horrific crime. All you Lindsay fans and army of love’ers are basically just racists writing paragraphs of conjecture and word salad because you’re terrified an umc white lady could be blamed and locked away for a crime she did commit.

You have several people here saying that it is entirely possible, and more statistically likely, that she was misdiagnosed or on a path to psychosis that was not detected than that she is a stone cold psychopath. You are presenting no argument against that—just ad hominem. Weak tea.

+1 it is apparently triggering for folks that some of us think Lindsay’s documented mental illness may have escalated and played a role here. I truly don’t understand why. Yet those folks are not showing any evidence that I see that shows the contrary (evidence of prior abuse? Domestic violence in the home? Neglect?) just that she googlemapped a takeout order?? I literally did that last week for a new place I wanted my husband to pick up at. Our diagnostic system is limited. It is helpful and necessary, and has limitations. We do not have good diagnostic criteria for postpartum issues. It was obviously more than GAD or they wouldn’t have hospitalized her. That’s just not something someone ends up in patient for. She had suicidal thoughts and thoughts of harming her children. Thoughts that everyone who knew her is saying unequivocally were not aligned with how she typically is.

You feel like I’m tying myself up in knots to defend her but I feel like you are tying yourself in knots trying to convince yourself this was in cold blood with very little evidence. The prosecution was making their case that she was not safe to leave and that she committed this crime. Everyone agrees with that.

There may be projection happening for me sure, but there is for anyone who is also adamantly saying they know it was in cold blood despite a recent inpatient hospitalization for SI/HI. The jump is huge.

She self-presented at McLean stating she was afraid of hurting herself. At one point (once!) prior to Janaury, she had told her husband that she had thoughts of harming the children she resented so much. The McLean doctors did not come up with a psychosis diagnosis - in fact, the word was not uttered by Lindsay until +10 days after everything occurred... during the same conversation she told her husband she still loves him. She sounds like a master manipulator.

It feels awfully convenient where she was treated by the best doctors at multiple health systems, psychosis never came up, but now it's all, "oh, well, she could've been PPP but not yet diagnosed". It feels like a literal get out of jail free excuse to me. I will grant you, you have to be not in your right mind to do what she did, but can't you say that for anyone who commits a horrible crime? We still punish those people. Plenty of school shooters have severe mental health issues (welllllll beyond GAD), report heaving voices (Parkland shooter, for one), with horrible home lives/extenuating circumstances, but they don't walk free. Why is it different w/ Lindsay?

Why would a master manipulator say either of those things months before committing these acts? It just doesn't make sense.

And agree with PP: I'm not saying she deserves to walk free.

Also folks are acting like she needed those 30-45 min alone and that’s why she planned this whole take out excursion intentionally. Again this makes no sense to me, she was the primary caregiver if you look at the timeline she had plenty of time alone with the children. And if she was a master manipulator why wouldn’t she have planned better??? This left 0 chance she wouldn’t be very clearly the killer. The whole argument makes nooo sense. If she was such a master and wanted a different life why wouldn’t she have planned even a tiny bit better?

Also folks are acting like they know the extent of what Lindsay has said over these last days because they’ve heard a few small sound bites. We know very little.

She really wasn't "alone" with the kids. Her husband worked from home. Do you think she could have strangled her five year old in the doctor's office?

Her husband worked in the basement. She could easily have killed her kids on the top floor without him hearing. A child being asphyxiated by an exercise band cannot scream or cry, so if she killed them one by one in separate rooms they wouldn’t even be able to alert each other of the danger.

This was a psychotic break. As Rusty Yates said, if she’d had a cardiac arrest or seizure while driving and all three kids perished but she didn’t, it wouldn’t even be a consideration to prosecute her. Since she is a woman of childbearing age she should be hospitalized and supervised until she no longer is a woman of childbearing age. That’s appropriate justice, I think.

You’re writing fanfiction.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How sad to have a life, a pretty nice life it seems, and for it to vanish in a blink. I feel so terrible for the grandparents and extended family and friends too. How tragic the whole thing. So many lives destroyed.

I feel bad for her, too.

I feel bad for Cora, Dawson, and Callan.

We truly lack understanding of severe mental illness.

Weird response.
We hold others accountable when they do bad things and are mentally ill. Why would she be the exception?

I have been saying this from the beginning, was Jeffrey Dahmer mentally stable? Ted Bundy? What about most of the school shooters, were they all stable mentally? No, as a matter of fact many of them were also on psych meds, like Lindsay, but we crucified these young mentally ill kids. How about all the other potentially mentally ill mothers who killed their kids who are now serving life sentences in general pop prisons? What about them? We gotta stop with the #iamlindsay crap, no, no you are not. Like school shootings, we’re going to end up with copycat crimes thanks to the media coverage and the misplaced empathy. If we as a society have never related to, or empathized with murderers, even mentally ill ones, we aren’t going to start now. Hell no.

Jeffrey Dahmer was a serial killer who embalmed and disemboweled people and hid them in his freezer. He had a long history of asocial and frightening behavior. This woman was a highly esteemed labor nurse with no criminal record. Postpartum psychosis is real.

She murdered a baby. The fact that you’re holding her up as “but she’s not as bad as Dahmer!” would be laughable if it weren’t so disgusting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I feel like two things can be true here: She indeed committed a horrible terrible crime. Unthinkable. Horrific.
She could also have been unaware of what she was doing and psychotic.
Why can't both things exist?

Would you have the same opinion if it were, say, your nanny and your kids? After all, anyone can become psychotic and unaware of what they’re doing right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She was a nurse. An L&D nurse. As soon as she heard voices she should have alerted someone. However it seems that
She never heard voices except for the one time they told her to kill her kids. It’s actually really hard to believe

Thats really not how this works. Especially with higher functioning people experiencing psychosis. What you assert is speculation and not fact.

Most everything on this board is speculation and not fact, including the theory that she had psychosis. It will be impossible to actually prove.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Clancy has my sympathy. She is a Labor & Delivery RN now midwife in 5 days a week outpatient treatment for postpartum depression—she was trying mightily to help herself as was her husband. Sounds like crossover to postpartum psychosis—she will be heartbroken at what she did under SEVERE mental illness. My sympathies to her children deceased, her infant, her husband and yes to her. A nightmare.

I have sympathy and she tried to off herself as well. I think Yates killed her kids and didn’t do anything to herself. But..I believe this post partum psychosis is real. She is going to have to live with this forever. The sad thing is I think a lot of this is tied to lack of sleep and so many people judge if a new mom wants help. I remember I got a lot of judgement for having a night nanny. Luckily I have a great husband who basically told me to put myself first and I did. Without sleep and without an opportunity to exercise or meet with a friend then a severe depression and can develop. It seems like her husband tried and maybe things went sideways with all the meds. Seraqual is a really powerful drug and cannot believe she was on that with others. Maybe the best thing in retrospect would have been inpatient treatment. Anyway new parents should really prioritize sleep and well being. The best thing you can do for a new mom is offer to watch the baby’s so they can nap or offer to take their other kids (if they have them) out so less chaos in the house.

And maybe don’t have three kids in less than five years. Even though posters will jump on here to claim that their mom had 8 kids and didn’t kill any of them! Still, 3 kids under five in this day and age is bananas. And she wasn’t even old or facing a biological clock. What is the rush? The third clearly out her over the edge because she was seemingly ok with the first two.

So, forced abortions like in China?

You are intentionally being obtuse to PP's point, which I admit wasn't artfully made. But no, PP likely wasn't advocating for forced abortions. For a woman like Clancy--who is among the luckiest of us by having access to more knowledge, money, family/friends, and institutional support than the majority of new mothers--I think it isn't unfair to wonder why she would have so many children so closely given the difficulties she had adjusting to motherhood.

She had the kids because she wanted to them show off and brag about her easy pregnancies and brag about how fertile she is, this is an actual thing. It’s sick. She didn’t think it through, like this is a lifelong commitment, it’s quite messy and not at all glamorous. The babies were all for show, many people are doing this now, having prop babies and pets.

Or maybe she's.... Catholic

Isn’t that kind of old school? Like a woman becoming a nun? Who the hell becomes a nun anymore or a priest for that matter. Get w the times, Catholics use birth control now.

No, practicing Catholics do not. But I'm not that sure they were fully practicing. I've read news stories where their parish priest mentions that he didn't know the Clancys, which tells me they probably didn't go to mass regularly or participate in church ministries/activities.

This is simply not true. American Catholics routinely use birth control and are equally represented in the population of women who get abortions, too. American PRACTICING Catholics. This is a well documented researched phenomenon so I recommend you do some research before asserting inaccuracies.

I recommend YOU do some basic research before asserting inaccuracies.

https://www.guttmacher.org/article/2012/02/guttmacher-statistic-catholic-womens-contraceptive-use

They are not following the tenants of the religion and therefore are not PRACTICING.

It’s “tenets” and they are PRACTICING Catholics. I’m sorry you don’t like it.

If one is INTNTIONALLY breaking the rules of their religion every day they are not PRACTICiNG. Just like if someone eat a bacon cheeseburger every single day, they are not a vegan.
I'm sorry you are incapable of comprehension.

I’m sorry you think you’re the gatekeeper of Catholicism. You are wrong and how much it bothers you entertains me.

Now back on topic. Bye.

I'm horrified that you think it's ok to spew blatant lies about a religion. You are wrong and how much you insist you are correct is pure foolishness.
Now back on topic. Bye.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like two things can be true here: She indeed committed a horrible terrible crime. Unthinkable. Horrific.
She could also have been unaware of what she was doing and psychotic.
Why can't both things exist?

Would you have the same opinion if it were, say, your nanny and your kids? After all, anyone can become psychotic and unaware of what they’re doing right?

Yes, this is exactly how we must view this. Lindsay was 8 months postpartum, she could’ve been working as an RN, what if it were your kids that she murdered? Would you be saying “oh but she had a moment of psychosis, I understand, I can totally relate to her” no, if it were your children, you wouldn’t be saying this. You’d want her dead or put behind bars to suffer for the rest of her life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like two things can be true here: She indeed committed a horrible terrible crime. Unthinkable. Horrific.
She could also have been unaware of what she was doing and psychotic.
Why can't both things exist?

Would you have the same opinion if it were, say, your nanny and your kids? After all, anyone can become psychotic and unaware of what they’re doing right?

Yes, this is exactly how we must view this. Lindsay was 8 months postpartum, she could’ve been working as an RN, what if it were your kids that she murdered? Would you be saying “oh but she had a moment of psychosis, I understand, I can totally relate to her” no, if it were your children, you wouldn’t be saying this. You’d want her dead or put behind bars to suffer for the rest of her life.

Except the person whose kids actually were murdered (Patrick Clancy) has forgiven her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like two things can be true here: She indeed committed a horrible terrible crime. Unthinkable. Horrific.
She could also have been unaware of what she was doing and psychotic.
Why can't both things exist?

Would you have the same opinion if it were, say, your nanny and your kids? After all, anyone can become psychotic and unaware of what they’re doing right?

Yes, this is exactly how we must view this. Lindsay was 8 months postpartum, she could’ve been working as an RN, what if it were your kids that she murdered? Would you be saying “oh but she had a moment of psychosis, I understand, I can totally relate to her” no, if it were your children, you wouldn’t be saying this. You’d want her dead or put behind bars to suffer for the rest of her life.

Except the person whose kids actually were murdered (Patrick Clancy) has forgiven her.

Or so he claims. Of the woman he says was the “love of his life.” I’m sure he has lots of conflicting feelings right now and unfortunately a lifetime to figure them all out. I’m not putting much stock in his totally bizarre GFM post.

[Anonymous]

https://www.boston.com/news/crime/2023/02/10/lindsay-clancy-duxbury-mom-criminal-case-trial-legal-experts/?p1=hp_secondary

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kevin Reddington is one of the most elite trial attorneys in the country with a great record defending his clients. As a former prosecutor and criminal defense attorney myself, I can attest that what people on this board think about his performance is irrelevant in the face of his record of success. He connects with juries and persuades them with the better story. I remain convinced this woman won’t be convicted as charged.

https://www.patriotledger.com/story/news/2023/02/08/duxbury-lindsay-clancys-attorney-kevin-reddington-history-high-profile-clients/69880508007/

Many of the clients listed in that article either plead guilty or were found guilty. None of the listed clients seem like upstanding citizens with bad luck.

This defense attorney won an acquittal for a woman who killed her partner while he slept, successfully arguing a battered woman defense - this is an outstanding outcome.

Your comment merely reveals how little you know about the workings of the criminal system. Winning acquittals in cases with the most egregious facts is not really the expected objective- it’s great if it happens, but the defense attorney’s goal is often to hang a jury or convince them to settle for lesser included charges which preserve their client’s opportunity for release and returning to a life outside incarceration at some point. That’s true even when you may believe wholeheartedly that your client is actually innocent - the worst cases because it’s soul crushing to see our system wrongfully convict innocent people and leave victims without actual justice.

Defense attorneys know that the vast majority of their clients will be guilty and culpable to some degree with mitigating factors considered. Their oath is to defend the Constitution with zealous advocacy on behalf of individuals at the mercy of the state. They hold the sacred role of keeping the state to account for acting within the law and protecting the rights of all citizens, including the accused.

Anyone who knows the criminal justice system knows that the greatest defense attorneys are not measured by the number of acquittals they’ve won, but by how they’ve leveraged their skill and integrity to get the most justice for their clients within a system everyone knows is deeply flawed and in some places broken.