Why are people more sympathetic to Lindsay Clancy than Andrea Yates? (Child death mentioned)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lindsay Clancy is no better than Dahmer, or Nikolas Cruz, or any school shooter for that matter, she’s no better than any mom in history who killed their kids. She is in the club now. After she chose to strangle her kids with exercise bands and other horrific acts, she became a murderer. This wasn’t self defense. We have standards and rules in society, she is no longer one of us.

But was she in control of her actions when she did it? Was she in her right mind? Or was she criminally insane?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like two things can be true here: She indeed committed a horrible terrible crime. Unthinkable. Horrific.
She could also have been unaware of what she was doing and psychotic.
Why can't both things exist?

Both things CAN exist. I don't think anyone is arguing that Andrea Yates did not commit an unthinkable crime (I hope not). She committed an unthinkable crime. She was unaware and psychotic. Same for this chick too. I'm not going to parade around saying "#iamlindsey" or whatever, because she committed an unthinkable crime and murdered her children whereas I did not, so, no, I am not the same as her. But I think she probably committed these murders while having a psychotic episode and was not aware of her actions, and this is precisely why we have "Not guilty by reason of insanity".

That argument could be used for so many murderers currently being raped in prison or who are now dead as a result of lethal injection. Lindsay is a woman, yes, who cares though? We are fu$&ed as a society if we support her and fail to even acknowledge or recognize other mentally ill murderers. It’s setting a precedence. She made her bed and made bad choices. So did many other murderers. while I believe she had severe anxiety and possibly a personality disorder,I truly don’t believe she had PPP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lindsay Clancy is no better than Dahmer, or Nikolas Cruz, or any school shooter for that matter, she’s no better than any mom in history who killed their kids. She is in the club now. After she chose to strangle her kids with exercise bands and other horrific acts, she became a murderer. This wasn’t self defense. We have standards and rules in society, she is no longer one of us.

But was she in control of her actions when she did it? Was she in her right mind? Or was she criminally insane?

It may honestly be too late to determine that, it’s done now. She had no diagnosis of PPD or PPP despite being in inpatient psych a month prior, so I doubt she was psychotic. I think she held it together all day, and yes she lost control, but adults need to learn coping skills. She should have left her husband with the kids to pick up the food, or they could have all taken a ride, there were so many options to avoid this. She went berserk, it happens. Most people just have better coping skills. It’s a shame but she knew what she was doing. I do believe the meds were over the top and possibly contributed to her rage, but again we could say that about all murderers who take psych meds.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lindsay Clancy is no better than Dahmer, or Nikolas Cruz, or any school shooter for that matter, she’s no better than any mom in history who killed their kids. She is in the club now. After she chose to strangle her kids with exercise bands and other horrific acts, she became a murderer. This wasn’t self defense. We have standards and rules in society, she is no longer one of us.

But was she in control of her actions when she did it? Was she in her right mind? Or was she criminally insane?

It may honestly be too late to determine that, it’s done now. She had no diagnosis of PPD or PPP despite being in inpatient psych a month prior, so I doubt she was psychotic. I think she held it together all day, and yes she lost control, but adults need to learn coping skills. She should have left her husband with the kids to pick up the food, or they could have all taken a ride, there were so many options to avoid this. She went berserk, it happens. Most people just have better coping skills. It’s a shame but she knew what she was doing. I do believe the meds were over the top and possibly contributed to her rage, but again we could say that about all murderers who take psych meds.

she wasn’t psychotic prior to the murders as documented during her stay at McLean or whatever, and presumably she is not psychotic now. How convenient that she had a moment of psychosis while her husband stepped out.

[Anonymous]

Lindsay was severely anxious she was diagnosed with GAD, which is very common, which can lead to depression many times. One could argue she was less mentally ill or unstable than someone like Nikolas Cruz who suffers from fetal alcohol syndrome. As far as I know there is no diagnosis of PPD/PPP, and Lindsay had extensive inpatient psych treatment. More than most new moms suffering from anxiety ever receive. Either multiple medical professionals dropped the ball here or Lindsay wasn’t entirely honest with anyone, and if so, this leads me to believe she suffers from possibly borderline personality disorder. Still no empathy for her, millions of people suffer from GAD and personality disorders, millions of new moms, but they would rather abandon their kids than kill them. I think the murderers were rather impulsive, she felt rage and lost control.

[Anonymous]

The idea that this woman is somehow overprivileged because she had that much inpatient psychiatric treatment is a sign of the very slippery slope this thread and our society are both on.

Jesus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The idea that this woman is somehow overprivileged because she had that much inpatient psychiatric treatment is a sign of the very slippery slope this thread and our society are both on.

Jesus.

Not necessarily that she was over privileged, but there was ample time for her to receive a diagnosis os PPD/PPP. She displayed no concerning behaviors with her husband, which is why he felt secure leaving her home alone with the children. She has generalized anxiety disorder, I believe she’s lying about hearing a voice. I think PPP is a convenient excuse, if only all murderers could claim psychosis. It’s going to be very difficult, if not impossible to prove she was psychotic during the murders. Comparing this to the Andrea Yates’s case is apples and oranges, the only thing in common is both were mothers who killed their kids. That’s it. PPP is a real thing, but Lindsay Clancy wasn’t suffering from it imo. The med list was quite stunning and certainly led to some unpleasant drug interactions I am sure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like two things can be true here: She indeed committed a horrible terrible crime. Unthinkable. Horrific.
She could also have been unaware of what she was doing and psychotic.
Why can't both things exist?

Because you see, Lindsay isn’t unique. Many, many murderers are indeed mentally ill, and we never support them. Men who murder can also suffer from severe debilitating mental illness to ya know? And guess what, we either kill them by lethal injection or imprison them for life.

Painfully obtuse post.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The idea that this woman is somehow overprivileged because she had that much inpatient psychiatric treatment is a sign of the very slippery slope this thread and our society are both on.

Jesus.

Not necessarily that she was over privileged, but there was ample time for her to receive a diagnosis os PPD/PPP. She displayed no concerning behaviors with her husband, which is why he felt secure leaving her home alone with the children. She has generalized anxiety disorder, I believe she’s lying about hearing a voice. I think PPP is a convenient excuse, if only all murderers could claim psychosis. It’s going to be very difficult, if not impossible to prove she was psychotic during the murders. Comparing this to the Andrea Yates’s case is apples and oranges, the only thing in common is both were mothers who killed their kids. That’s it. PPP is a real thing, but Lindsay Clancy wasn’t suffering from it imo. The med list was quite stunning and certainly led to some unpleasant drug interactions I am sure.

This is just not how mental illness works. It is not a fixed state that persists over time such that any X number of people looking at that person over X interval would all have seen the same thing.

If she only had GAD, what was she doing on all of those medications, in your theory of the case?

[Anonymous]

She was a nurse. An L&D nurse. As soon as she heard voices she should have alerted someone. However it seems that
She never heard voices except for the one time they told her to kill her kids. It’s actually really hard to believe

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The idea that this woman is somehow overprivileged because she had that much inpatient psychiatric treatment is a sign of the very slippery slope this thread and our society are both on.

Jesus.

Not necessarily that she was over privileged, but there was ample time for her to receive a diagnosis os PPD/PPP. She displayed no concerning behaviors with her husband, which is why he felt secure leaving her home alone with the children. She has generalized anxiety disorder, I believe she’s lying about hearing a voice. I think PPP is a convenient excuse, if only all murderers could claim psychosis. It’s going to be very difficult, if not impossible to prove she was psychotic during the murders. Comparing this to the Andrea Yates’s case is apples and oranges, the only thing in common is both were mothers who killed their kids. That’s it. PPP is a real thing, but Lindsay Clancy wasn’t suffering from it imo. The med list was quite stunning and certainly led to some unpleasant drug interactions I am sure.

This is just not how mental illness works. It is not a fixed state that persists over time such that any X number of people looking at that person over X interval would all have seen the same thing.

If she only had GAD, what was she doing on all of those medications, in your theory of the case?

Hmmm, all those meds *could* be prescribed for GAD/depression/insomnia, I think the physicians began throwing anything at her because she kept claiming that nothing was working, which on Lindsay’s part, seems misinformed, uneducated and hasty at best and attention seeking and reeking of a personality disorder at worst. Maybe she was misdiagnosed, maybe she did have PPP but if she lied to physicians or if she hid/masked symptoms, which she must have, because there is no documentation of her having psychosis, that’s on her, the physicians aren’t mind readers. Mental healthcare can only provide as much as you allow it, meaning one must be completely honest and open with their true feelings to receive an accurate diagnosis.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:She was a nurse. An L&D nurse. As soon as she heard voices she should have alerted someone. However it seems that
She never heard voices except for the one time they told her to kill her kids. It’s actually really hard to believe

Thats really not how this works. Especially with higher functioning people experiencing psychosis. What you assert is speculation and not fact.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.necn.com/news/national-international/she-killed-the-kids-prosecutors-outline-chilling-timeline-in-duxbury-tragedy/2924108/

Here is the detailed timeline of the day of the murders. It is bone chilling.

So carefully planned.

Exactly. The call to CVS and the text to her husband about MiraLAX were already building her own defense before she even killed them. Selfish monster.

How would those actions build her defense? If anything, they do the opposite, and prove forethought.

No. The line is that if she were a cold blooded killer with premeditation, she wouldn’t be worrying about medication for the kids she intended to kill that day. But instead, look! I was a good mom taking care of my babies and I just snapped! PPD! Medication! Pity me!

Vomit.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Clancy has my sympathy. She is a Labor & Delivery RN now midwife in 5 days a week outpatient treatment for postpartum depression—she was trying mightily to help herself as was her husband. Sounds like crossover to postpartum psychosis—she will be heartbroken at what she did under SEVERE mental illness. My sympathies to her children deceased, her infant, her husband and yes to her. A nightmare.

I have sympathy and she tried to off herself as well. I think Yates killed her kids and didn’t do anything to herself. But..I believe this post partum psychosis is real. She is going to have to live with this forever. The sad thing is I think a lot of this is tied to lack of sleep and so many people judge if a new mom wants help. I remember I got a lot of judgement for having a night nanny. Luckily I have a great husband who basically told me to put myself first and I did. Without sleep and without an opportunity to exercise or meet with a friend then a severe depression and can develop. It seems like her husband tried and maybe things went sideways with all the meds. Seraqual is a really powerful drug and cannot believe she was on that with others. Maybe the best thing in retrospect would have been inpatient treatment. Anyway new parents should really prioritize sleep and well being. The best thing you can do for a new mom is offer to watch the baby’s so they can nap or offer to take their other kids (if they have them) out so less chaos in the house.

And maybe don’t have three kids in less than five years. Even though posters will jump on here to claim that their mom had 8 kids and didn’t kill any of them! Still, 3 kids under five in this day and age is bananas. And she wasn’t even old or facing a biological clock. What is the rush? The third clearly out her over the edge because she was seemingly ok with the first two.

So, forced abortions like in China?

You are intentionally being obtuse to PP's point, which I admit wasn't artfully made. But no, PP likely wasn't advocating for forced abortions. For a woman like Clancy--who is among the luckiest of us by having access to more knowledge, money, family/friends, and institutional support than the majority of new mothers--I think it isn't unfair to wonder why she would have so many children so closely given the difficulties she had adjusting to motherhood.

She had the kids because she wanted to them show off and brag about her easy pregnancies and brag about how fertile she is, this is an actual thing. It’s sick. She didn’t think it through, like this is a lifelong commitment, it’s quite messy and not at all glamorous. The babies were all for show, many people are doing this now, having prop babies and pets.

Or maybe she's.... Catholic

Isn’t that kind of old school? Like a woman becoming a nun? Who the hell becomes a nun anymore or a priest for that matter. Get w the times, Catholics use birth control now.

No, practicing Catholics do not. But I'm not that sure they were fully practicing. I've read news stories where their parish priest mentions that he didn't know the Clancys, which tells me they probably didn't go to mass regularly or participate in church ministries/activities.

This is simply not true. American Catholics routinely use birth control and are equally represented in the population of women who get abortions, too. American PRACTICING Catholics. This is a well documented researched phenomenon so I recommend you do some research before asserting inaccuracies.

I recommend YOU do some basic research before asserting inaccuracies.

https://www.guttmacher.org/article/2012/02/guttmacher-statistic-catholic-womens-contraceptive-use

They are not following the tenants of the religion and therefore are not PRACTICING.

It’s “tenets” and they are PRACTICING Catholics. I’m sorry you don’t like it.

If one is INTNTIONALLY breaking the rules of their religion every day they are not PRACTICiNG. Just like if someone eat a bacon cheeseburger every single day, they are not a vegan.
I'm sorry you are incapable of comprehension.

I’m sorry you think you’re the gatekeeper of Catholicism. You are wrong and how much it bothers you entertains me.

Now back on topic. Bye.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My friend had a post partum nervous breakdown at six months after weeks of insomnia triggered by baby sleep struggles. She tried to go on fmla but her boss forced her to quit instead with threatening action letters because she said she had ‘already taken too much maternity leave.’ This is the society we live in that tells moms they are too big a burden until some moms say ok i get it, I’m worthless, I will just kill my kids and myself. Which of you who are so disgusted or outraged at her has founght for universal maternity leave? Which of you has lobbied for safe affordable subsidized daycare? Or adequate (first world) maternal medical care? You are the disgusting ones, desperate to see a public lynching while this very minute there is an exhausted mom in the verge of crisis with no one to turn to. You are handmaid’s tale characters. Your righteousness is blasphemy.

Oh, GFY. The rest of us had kids, worked and didn’t murder three babies, including millions of parents with FAR fewer resources than she had. Stick the excuses in your ear.