HS Party with Alcohol... Death

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
It matters tons! Thinking like this is actually dangerous. People must take responsibility and be held accountable for their own actions. No one forced those kids to drink and no one forced them to hitch a ride with a drunk driver. Come on. Own it.

Not so easy to hold him accountable now, eh?

What are you talking about? His actions absolutely still matter. His contributory negligence can reduce or eliminate the finding of negligence of other parties in criminal cases depending on the laws of the state. Oh, were you trying to be cute because you don't like to talk about the actual law or potential legal outcomes?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Respect the dead kids please.

Which dead kids?

This crash in Silver Spring in 2011?
http://www.wusa9.com/news/article/197734/435/Desaleen-James-Shares-Her-Story-and-Video-from-the-Drunk-Driving-Crash-That-killed-Her-Two-Friends

Or these kids from 2012?
http://patch.com/maryland/bethesda-chevychase/vigil-held-for-young-man-woman-killed-on-jones-bridge-road

Or this kid from 2014?
http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/local/2014/08/30/3-people-injured-in-md-accident/14862269/

Or these kids from 1995?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/local/longterm/library/magazine/drinking060798.htm

Let's talk about alcohol prevention and teen driving.

And about the parents who supply the alcohol.

And who look the other way when kids are drinking in their homes.

Exactly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
It matters tons! Thinking like this is actually dangerous. People must take responsibility and be held accountable for their own actions. No one forced those kids to drink and no one forced them to hitch a ride with a drunk driver. Come on. Own it.

Not so easy to hold him accountable now, eh?

What are you talking about? His actions absolutely still matter. His contributory negligence can reduce or eliminate the finding of negligence of other parties in criminal cases depending on the laws of the state. Oh, were you trying to be cute because you don't like to talk about the actual law or potential legal outcomes?

I am saying: a dead person cannot take responsibility and cannot be held accountable for their own actions.

Meanwhile you are telling the parents of a dead boy that he was complicit in his own death.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/local/potomac/2015/09/21/family-n-potomac-crash-victim-releases-statement/72583840/

I'm not sure how I feel with this statement. I agree with most of it, especially that the host parent should be held criminally responsible. However, their child wasn't doing right either. It feels like they are blaming everyone else, without admitting that their son was drinking underage.

When I know my kid is going to a house with the parents home, I do not expect underage alcohol. Do you?

Not "expect" but at that age, I question what that are doing. Absolutely. Do you have teens?

I have teens. When they go to their friends' houses, I call the friend's parents to ask whether they will be at home. I ask about alcohol (in recent months I bring up the crash discussed here). And if I have a bad feeling or know the parents or kids and don't trust them, then my kid doesn't go to the party.

When my kids' friends come to our house, I am in and out of the basement getting laundry, bringing snacks, keeping an eye on things.

I don't care if my teens are embarrassed. They are alive. And their friends like hanging out at our house, so presumably I have not made my kids pariahs in their social circles.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/local/potomac/2015/09/21/family-n-potomac-crash-victim-releases-statement/72583840/

I'm not sure how I feel with this statement. I agree with most of it, especially that the host parent should be held criminally responsible. However, their child wasn't doing right either. It feels like they are blaming everyone else, without admitting that their son was drinking underage.

I agree that it wasn't acknowledged in their latest statement, but you can see both of them responded to the following blog post and they most definitely recognize that their son made poor choices that night...

http://evvastarr.com/1/post/2015/07/i-make-this-oath.html#comments

Thank you for sharing this, I imagine mostly from the Wootton community.
It gives me hope for tomorrow for the first time in the 73 pages of this thread. Again, my most sincere gratitude from the bottom of my heart, as these problems are getting worse in most of our communities.

Wouldn't it be amazing if every local middle and high school, public and private, had a similar goal? Wouldn't it be amazing if the Wootton community led the way for the rest of us? Wouldn't it be an amazing tribute to the principal who sacrificed his life (I believe) for Wootton?

You could form a 'panel of experts' to speak to kids and parents at other schools. The experts would be the parents and kids with direct experience. You could ask Captain Didone to guide you and be part of your panel. He knows this from every single angle.

You know what would be the ultimate amazing thing?
If 'Mr. Lawyer' himself got off his high horse, and opened his eyes to all the suffering people he's surrounded by. He may find he's just a regular person, but with a law degree and a bunch of money. Wouldn't it be amazing if he put it to good use? This is the time. Today.

Why such a hateful poster because of what I wrote in my above post? Anyone know?

Mr BIG Bully should just say what he doesn't like in my post. That's what a big boy would do, and he can to. Why not?

No answer yet... but it's not too late. Even tomorrow would be perfectly acceptable and appreciated. Thank you.

[Anonymous]

My guess is that nearly 50% of the posts over the last 5 pages are all from the same simple annoying poster. Such a shame because the bullying of other posts and discussions stifle discussion and just drive people away. So no good comes of any of this. Bully for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/local/potomac/2015/09/21/family-n-potomac-crash-victim-releases-statement/72583840/

I'm not sure how I feel with this statement. I agree with most of it, especially that the host parent should be held criminally responsible. However, their child wasn't doing right either. It feels like they are blaming everyone else, without admitting that their son was drinking underage.

When I know my kid is going to a house with the parents home, I do not expect underage alcohol. Do you?

Not "expect" but at that age, I question what that are doing. Absolutely. Do you have teens?

I have teens. When they go to their friends' houses, I call the friend's parents to ask whether they will be at home. I ask about alcohol (in recent months I bring up the crash discussed here). And if I have a bad feeling or know the parents or kids and don't trust them, then my kid doesn't go to the party.

When my kids' friends come to our house, I am in and out of the basement getting laundry, bringing snacks, keeping an eye on things.

I don't care if my teens are embarrassed. They are alive. And their friends like hanging out at our house, so presumably I have not made my kids pariahs in their social circles.

Somebody here needs parent training from you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
It matters tons! Thinking like this is actually dangerous. People must take responsibility and be held accountable for their own actions. No one forced those kids to drink and no one forced them to hitch a ride with a drunk driver. Come on. Own it.

Not so easy to hold him accountable now, eh?

What are you talking about? His actions absolutely still matter. His contributory negligence can reduce or eliminate the finding of negligence of other parties in criminal cases depending on the laws of the state. Oh, were you trying to be cute because you don't like to talk about the actual law or potential legal outcomes?

I am saying: a dead person cannot take responsibility and cannot be held accountable for their own actions.

Meanwhile you are telling the parents of a dead boy that he was complicit in his own death.

Death does not grant the victim immunity. The action of the dead absolutely will be scrutinized. Just as all the facts wil be. The law doesn't have it any other way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
It matters tons! Thinking like this is actually dangerous. People must take responsibility and be held accountable for their own actions. No one forced those kids to drink and no one forced them to hitch a ride with a drunk driver. Come on. Own it.

Not so easy to hold him accountable now, eh?

What are you talking about? His actions absolutely still matter. His contributory negligence can reduce or eliminate the finding of negligence of other parties in criminal cases depending on the laws of the state. Oh, were you trying to be cute because you don't like to talk about the actual law or potential legal outcomes?

I am saying: a dead person cannot take responsibility and cannot be held accountable for their own actions.

Meanwhile you are telling the parents of a dead boy that he was complicit in his own death.

Death does not grant the victim immunity. The action of the dead absolutely will be scrutinized. Just as all the facts wil be. The law doesn't have it any other way.

Have you not one single bit of shame? Or remorse? How do you sleep with yourself?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/local/potomac/2015/09/21/family-n-potomac-crash-victim-releases-statement/72583840/

I'm not sure how I feel with this statement. I agree with most of it, especially that the host parent should be held criminally responsible. However, their child wasn't doing right either. It feels like they are blaming everyone else, without admitting that their son was drinking underage.

When I know my kid is going to a house with the parents home, I do not expect underage alcohol. Do you?

Not "expect" but at that age, I question what that are doing. Absolutely. Do you have teens?

I have teens. When they go to their friends' houses, I call the friend's parents to ask whether they will be at home. I ask about alcohol (in recent months I bring up the crash discussed here). And if I have a bad feeling or know the parents or kids and don't trust them, then my kid doesn't go to the party.

When my kids' friends come to our house, I am in and out of the basement getting laundry, bringing snacks, keeping an eye on things.

I don't care if my teens are embarrassed. They are alive. And their friends like hanging out at our house, so presumably I have not made my kids pariahs in their social circles.

Somebody here needs parent training from you.

PP here. I am not a model parent, but I have strong views on this issue.

It's not hard to do what I do. But you have to be willing to be the parent and not the best friend. And to take a hard line.

I think my kids and their friends like these boundaries. Teens need limits just as toddlers do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
It matters tons! Thinking like this is actually dangerous. People must take responsibility and be held accountable for their own actions. No one forced those kids to drink and no one forced them to hitch a ride with a drunk driver. Come on. Own it.

Not so easy to hold him accountable now, eh?

What are you talking about? His actions absolutely still matter. His contributory negligence can reduce or eliminate the finding of negligence of other parties in criminal cases depending on the laws of the state. Oh, were you trying to be cute because you don't like to talk about the actual law or potential legal outcomes?

I am saying: a dead person cannot take responsibility and cannot be held accountable for their own actions.

Meanwhile you are telling the parents of a dead boy that he was complicit in his own death.

Death does not grant the victim immunity. The action of the dead absolutely will be scrutinized. Just as all the facts wil be. The law doesn't have it any other way.

Have you not one single bit of shame? Or remorse? How do you sleep with yourself?

How can you be so utterly clueless regarding the legal system in the United States?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
It matters tons! Thinking like this is actually dangerous. People must take responsibility and be held accountable for their own actions. No one forced those kids to drink and no one forced them to hitch a ride with a drunk driver. Come on. Own it.

Not so easy to hold him accountable now, eh?

What are you talking about? His actions absolutely still matter. His contributory negligence can reduce or eliminate the finding of negligence of other parties in criminal cases depending on the laws of the state. Oh, were you trying to be cute because you don't like to talk about the actual law or potential legal outcomes?

I am saying: a dead person cannot take responsibility and cannot be held accountable for their own actions.

Meanwhile you are telling the parents of a dead boy that he was complicit in his own death.

Death does not grant the victim immunity. The action of the dead absolutely will be scrutinized. Just as all the facts wil be. The law doesn't have it any other way.

I'm not a lawyer. I assumed that the PP was talking about moral responsibility. I certainly was.

Also, death absolutely does grant a person immunity, in reality, if not in law.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
It matters tons! Thinking like this is actually dangerous. People must take responsibility and be held accountable for their own actions. No one forced those kids to drink and no one forced them to hitch a ride with a drunk driver. Come on. Own it.

Not so easy to hold him accountable now, eh?

What are you talking about? His actions absolutely still matter. His contributory negligence can reduce or eliminate the finding of negligence of other parties in criminal cases depending on the laws of the state. Oh, were you trying to be cute because you don't like to talk about the actual law or potential legal outcomes?

I am saying: a dead person cannot take responsibility and cannot be held accountable for their own actions.

Meanwhile you are telling the parents of a dead boy that he was complicit in his own death.

Death does not grant the victim immunity. The action of the dead absolutely will be scrutinized. Just as all the facts wil be. The law doesn't have it any other way.

Have you not one single bit of shame? Or remorse? How do you sleep with yourself?

How can you be so utterly clueless regarding the legal system in the United States?

You may have the better legal mind, but your wisdom account is bankrupt. Barry Schwartz has an excellent TED talk for you on youtube: "Loss of Wisdom"

[Anonymous]

Look. This whole thing comes down to bad luck.

I am sure there is not ONE poster here who has not A. Driven at our above the legal limit at some point in their lives and/or B. Gotten into a car with a driver who was at our above the legal limit. The sanctimonious attitude on here is laughable. The sooner you admit your own shortcomings, the sooner people can come together and fix what is wrong. Taking a holier-than-thou approach just makes you look like an asshole.

That said, I think Sam should go to jail for a long time as should Saltzman. I don't think the Murks owe it to anyone to talk about the mistakes their son made that night. You don't think that they are angry with their son's decisions that evening? Come on.

The Murks are right, laws need to change and parents need to wake up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Look. This whole thing comes down to bad luck.

I am sure there is not ONE poster here who has not A. Driven at our above the legal limit at some point in their lives and/or B. Gotten into a car with a driver who was at our above the legal limit. The sanctimonious attitude on here is laughable. The sooner you admit your own shortcomings, the sooner people can come together and fix what is wrong. Taking a holier-than-thou approach just makes you look like an asshole.

That said, I think Sam should go to jail for a long time as should Saltzman. I don't think the Murks owe it to anyone to talk about the mistakes their son made that night. You don't think that they are angry with their son's decisions that evening? Come on.

The Murks are right, laws need to change and parents need to wake up.

1. How long do you think Kenny Saltzman should sit in the slammer for what he did to those kids, both those who survived and those who didn't?

2. I have never been driven by a drunk driver.

3. I have never driven a car after consuming alcohol.

So please take your sanctimonious bullshit defense someplace else.