Elissa Silverman and BLM Anti-Semitism Controversy

[Anonymous]

Louis Farrakhan will speak on July 4th at a 2020 edition of the Million Man March.

Look for who attends that. If I see BLM leaders there, I cannot believe that they do not support anti-Semitism.

They need to 100%, unequivocally, disavow him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Louis Farrakhan will speak on July 4th at a 2020 edition of the Million Man March.

Look for who attends that. If I see BLM leaders there, I cannot believe that they do not support anti-Semitism.

They need to 100%, unequivocally, disavow him.

Name a BLM leader.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s a non-issue. Most BLM activists reject the antisemitism. This is the major statement from a leader in the Ferguson protests: https://www.stltoday.com/opinion/mailbag/churches-reject-black-lives-matters-platform-on-israel/article_42a99819-8231-572f-83d1-82d7a753a8f8.html

It’s FAR from a non-issue.

I’ve had black people tell me to my face that Jews played a large role in the slave trade, which is something Louis Farrakhan has long claimed.

Some people repeat Farrakhan stuff, sure. But Bishop Wooton and the Ecumenical Council (did you read the statement?) speak for the majority. For most everyone BLM means just that, BLM. Not on board with people trying to hijack BLM for any other agenda.

I did read the statement. He’s calling out BLM. I haven’t seen anything from BLM itself, unless you can show me proof that Bishop Wootton and the Ecumenical Council’s statement was explicitly endorsed by BLM.

Can you show me that?

The M4BL and other “statements” are written by a small handful of left-wing activists. For 99% of people out there, BLM is about just that. Wooten’s statement reflects that. Most Jewish groups recognize that that, too. The biggest Jewish denomination in America, Reform, just out out a statement affirming BLM. They clearly aren’t supporting antisemitism, and they are pro-Israel too. The whole “antisemitism” thing is a big distraction from the central message of BLM. Jews should stop trying to paint BLM with the far-left/Farrakhan views that most supports don’t share.

You’re just wrong. BLM’s statement on Palestine is proof of that. Most BLM supporters probably aren’t actively anti-Semitic, but they also see Jews as basically white people, which is problematic. I would like to see BLM explicitly disavow Farrakhan, Carmichael, and Baldwin’s reading of Jewish history. Then I’ll believe you.

As an aside, if you think “Reform” is some unified construct, then you’re sadly ignorant. Nothing like that really exists.

This is the statement from URJ, Union Reform Judaism. It’s a good measure of what mainstream liberal Jews think. The people who want to stir this up now baffle me.... https://urj.org/blog/2020/06/12/reform-jewish-leadership-statement-black-lives-matter-jewish-value

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:Baldwin’s quote ignores the fact that the most targeted Jewish community is the VISIBLE Jews — the Hasidim and other orthodox. And by targeted, I mean also targeted by the Black community. We have somehow all forgotten the multiple attacks by the Black Hebrew Israelites across greater NYC over Hanukkah. They attacked ORTHODOX Jews and killed many. Nation of Islam similarly vilifies all Jews but reserves a special hatred for the visible ones (see their conspiracy theory that tfillin are some satanic black cube of Saturn).

Baldwin wrote the article in 1967. Let's condemn him for not correctly predicting 2019 and 2020 events.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Louis Farrakhan will speak on July 4th at a 2020 edition of the Million Man March.

Look for who attends that. If I see BLM leaders there, I cannot believe that they do not support anti-Semitism.

They need to 100%, unequivocally, disavow him.

Name a BLM leader.

https://blacklivesmatter.com/our-co-founders/

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Baldwin’s quote ignores the fact that the most targeted Jewish community is the VISIBLE Jews — the Hasidim and other orthodox. And by targeted, I mean also targeted by the Black community. We have somehow all forgotten the multiple attacks by the Black Hebrew Israelites across greater NYC over Hanukkah. They attacked ORTHODOX Jews and killed many. Nation of Islam similarly vilifies all Jews but reserves a special hatred for the visible ones (see their conspiracy theory that tfillin are some satanic black cube of Saturn).

Baldwin wrote the article in 1967. Let's condemn him for not correctly predicting 2019 and 2020 events.

? Visible Jews were being attacked in the 1960s too. The Nation of Islam existed in the 60s — it’s a large part of the Black Power movement.

Jeff, you need to learn more about the history of Jews in America, and the history of the Nation of Islam, for that matter.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Baldwin’s quote ignores the fact that the most targeted Jewish community is the VISIBLE Jews — the Hasidim and other orthodox. And by targeted, I mean also targeted by the Black community. We have somehow all forgotten the multiple attacks by the Black Hebrew Israelites across greater NYC over Hanukkah. They attacked ORTHODOX Jews and killed many. Nation of Islam similarly vilifies all Jews but reserves a special hatred for the visible ones (see their conspiracy theory that tfillin are some satanic black cube of Saturn).

Baldwin wrote the article in 1967. Let's condemn him for not correctly predicting 2019 and 2020 events.

? Visible Jews were being attacked in the 1960s too. The Nation of Islam existed in the 60s — it’s a large part of the Black Power movement.

Jeff, you need to learn more about the history of Jews in America, and the history of the Nation of Islam, for that matter.

The post to which I was responding mentioned specific recent events, not events from the 1960s. I have been very polite to you while you have taken this thread off topic. There is no need to get rude and tell me what I need or don't need to learn. There are plenty of things that you could learn about yourself.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Baldwin’s quote ignores the fact that the most targeted Jewish community is the VISIBLE Jews — the Hasidim and other orthodox. And by targeted, I mean also targeted by the Black community. We have somehow all forgotten the multiple attacks by the Black Hebrew Israelites across greater NYC over Hanukkah. They attacked ORTHODOX Jews and killed many. Nation of Islam similarly vilifies all Jews but reserves a special hatred for the visible ones (see their conspiracy theory that tfillin are some satanic black cube of Saturn).

Baldwin wrote the article in 1967. Let's condemn him for not correctly predicting 2019 and 2020 events.

? Visible Jews were being attacked in the 1960s too. The Nation of Islam existed in the 60s — it’s a large part of the Black Power movement.

Jeff, you need to learn more about the history of Jews in America, and the history of the Nation of Islam, for that matter.

The post to which I was responding mentioned specific recent events, not events from the 1960s. I have been very polite to you while you have taken this thread off topic. There is no need to get rude and tell me what I need or don't need to learn. There are plenty of things that you could learn about yourself.

This entire thread is about the relationship between BLM and Jews, so it’s really not off-topic.

The PP’s point was about Baldwin ignoring attacks on visible Jews, which has happened for as long as America has existed. That’s a wholly reasonable criticism, despite the PP’s use of recent examples.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Baldwin’s quote ignores the fact that the most targeted Jewish community is the VISIBLE Jews — the Hasidim and other orthodox. And by targeted, I mean also targeted by the Black community. We have somehow all forgotten the multiple attacks by the Black Hebrew Israelites across greater NYC over Hanukkah. They attacked ORTHODOX Jews and killed many. Nation of Islam similarly vilifies all Jews but reserves a special hatred for the visible ones (see their conspiracy theory that tfillin are some satanic black cube of Saturn).

Baldwin wrote the article in 1967. Let's condemn him for not correctly predicting 2019 and 2020 events.

? Visible Jews were being attacked in the 1960s too. The Nation of Islam existed in the 60s — it’s a large part of the Black Power movement.

Jeff, you need to learn more about the history of Jews in America, and the history of the Nation of Islam, for that matter.

The post to which I was responding mentioned specific recent events, not events from the 1960s. I have been very polite to you while you have taken this thread off topic. There is no need to get rude and tell me what I need or don't need to learn. There are plenty of things that you could learn about yourself.

This entire thread is about the relationship between BLM and Jews, so it’s really not off-topic.

The PP’s point was about Baldwin ignoring attacks on visible Jews, which has happened for as long as America has existed. That’s a wholly reasonable criticism, despite the PP’s use of recent examples.

If the poster wanted to discuss attacks in the 1960s, she could have. She obviously chose to discuss more recent attacks. There is no basis for you to suggest that I don't know about earlier attacks and should learn more about it. You should learn to stick to what is written rather than what you would rather discuss. Moreover, this thread -- which I remind you I started -- was not about BLM and Jews. Rather it was about one specific politician who is being criticized (unfairly in my view) by politicians who generally wouldn't give BLM the time of day.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Baldwin’s quote ignores the fact that the most targeted Jewish community is the VISIBLE Jews — the Hasidim and other orthodox. And by targeted, I mean also targeted by the Black community. We have somehow all forgotten the multiple attacks by the Black Hebrew Israelites across greater NYC over Hanukkah. They attacked ORTHODOX Jews and killed many. Nation of Islam similarly vilifies all Jews but reserves a special hatred for the visible ones (see their conspiracy theory that tfillin are some satanic black cube of Saturn).

Baldwin wrote the article in 1967. Let's condemn him for not correctly predicting 2019 and 2020 events.

? Visible Jews were being attacked in the 1960s too. The Nation of Islam existed in the 60s — it’s a large part of the Black Power movement.

Jeff, you need to learn more about the history of Jews in America, and the history of the Nation of Islam, for that matter.

The post to which I was responding mentioned specific recent events, not events from the 1960s. I have been very polite to you while you have taken this thread off topic. There is no need to get rude and tell me what I need or don't need to learn. There are plenty of things that you could learn about yourself.

This entire thread is about the relationship between BLM and Jews, so it’s really not off-topic.

The PP’s point was about Baldwin ignoring attacks on visible Jews, which has happened for as long as America has existed. That’s a wholly reasonable criticism, despite the PP’s use of recent examples.

If the poster wanted to discuss attacks in the 1960s, she could have. She obviously chose to discuss more recent attacks. There is no basis for you to suggest that I don't know about earlier attacks and should learn more about it. You should learn to stick to what is written rather than what you would rather discuss. Moreover, this thread -- which I remind you I started -- was not about BLM and Jews. Rather it was about one specific politician who is being criticized (unfairly in my view) by politicians who generally wouldn't give BLM the time of day.

Yes, but it’s long morphed into something broader than that.

Do you agree with the PP’s point that Baldwin should have taken into account attacks on visible Jews?

[Anonymous]

Attacking her and saying her response was "transactional" only shows how anti semitic many people still are. Why not immediately say, "OF COURSE we stand with you against anti-semitism"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Louis Farrakhan will speak on July 4th at a 2020 edition of the Million Man March.

Look for who attends that. If I see BLM leaders there, I cannot believe that they do not support anti-Semitism.

They need to 100%, unequivocally, disavow him.

Name a BLM leader.

https://blacklivesmatter.com/our-co-founders/

First of all BLM is a decentralized movement. The actual BLM organization/founders have no control over what local chapters do. So in effect, it does not have leadership. Just a large number of local leaders. None of this matters though, b/c honestly many of you guys will be outraged regardless of what they do or say.

Thankfully, There are more than enough Jewish brothers and sisters who understand the nuance behind why blacks, who in many cases do not support or like LF, would attend a conference/march he speaks at and largely agree with what he says relative to black empowerment. At this point, activists are pretty much done being on the defensive re: fake outrage re:LF, antisemitism and “reverse racism”. The time for policing black anger is long over, even though I know many will try.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Louis Farrakhan will speak on July 4th at a 2020 edition of the Million Man March.

Look for who attends that. If I see BLM leaders there, I cannot believe that they do not support anti-Semitism.

They need to 100%, unequivocally, disavow him.

Name a BLM leader.

https://blacklivesmatter.com/our-co-founders/

First of all BLM is a decentralized movement. The actual BLM organization/founders have no control over what local chapters do. So in effect, it does not have leadership. Just a large number of local leaders. None of this matters though, b/c honestly many of you guys will be outraged regardless of what they do or say.

Thankfully, There are more than enough Jewish brothers and sisters who understand the nuance behind why blacks, who in many cases do not support or like LF, would attend a conference/march he speaks at and largely agree with what he says relative to black empowerment. At this point, activists are pretty much done being on the defensive re: fake outrage re:LF, antisemitism and “reverse racism”. The time for policing black anger is long over, even though I know many will try.

I just want to see any BLM chapter disavow Farrakhan. That’s really all I’m asking for.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Attacking her and saying her response was "transactional" only shows how anti semitic many people still are. Why not immediately say, "OF COURSE we stand with you against anti-semitism"?

I know, right??!

So many don’t see this. It’s sad.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:
Yes, but it’s long morphed into something broader than that.

Do you agree with the PP’s point that Baldwin should have taken into account attacks on visible Jews?

LOL, It morphed because I tolerated your hijacking. I do not agree that Baldwin should have taken attacks on visible Jews into account. He was describing his perception of the Jewish community. Who am I to dispute what he perceives?

More importantly, I don't think you have really read the article, or at least not very carefully. If you had, you would realize that the article is not an attack on Jews. Rather, it is a defense of them. He outlines several factors that contribute to anti-Semitism in the Black community and then explains why that factor should not be negatively attributed to Jews. Just look how he concludes the article:

The crisis taking place in the world, and in the minds and hearts of black men everywhere, is not produced by the star of David, but by the old, rugged Roman cross on which Christendom's most celebrated Jew was murdered. And not by Jews.