Anybody listening to NPR?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


If students originally belong to other schools, then they should not be sent to your school for no apparent reasons. "Achieving diversity in my school" is a good motivation but not a good reason (for doing so).

A good approach (not necessarily the effect one) would be advocate your school to the surrounding neighborhood and try to attract an in-flow of people from diverse background.

Who says that students "belong" to this school vs. that school?

You seem to agree that segregated neighborhoods are not a good thing. Why do you think that segregated neighborhoods are bad but segregated schools are fine?

If you believe the neighborhood is segregated due to various reasons - solve that.
I do not have a problem with the current school system that schools take students in the surrounding area. Fine-tuning the school zones are fine with me. Taking a significant number of students from clearly outside regions, is not fine.

Schools are not tools for people to solve "segregated neighborhood".

Why not?

And why aren't schools tools for people to solve segregated schools?

Because "segregated schools" are results of other issues.

We correct issues that are wrong (if they really are). We do not correct issues that are not wrong (e.g. students going to their neighborhood schools) just to achieve something else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


If students originally belong to other schools, then they should not be sent to your school for no apparent reasons. "Achieving diversity in my school" is a good motivation but not a good reason (for doing so).

A good approach (not necessarily the effect one) would be advocate your school to the surrounding neighborhood and try to attract an in-flow of people from diverse background.

Who says that students "belong" to this school vs. that school?

You seem to agree that segregated neighborhoods are not a good thing. Why do you think that segregated neighborhoods are bad but segregated schools are fine?

If you believe the neighborhood is segregated due to various reasons - solve that.
I do not have a problem with the current school system that schools take students in the surrounding area. Fine-tuning the school zones are fine with me. Taking a significant number of students from clearly outside regions, is not fine.

Schools are not tools for people to solve "segregated neighborhood".

Why not?

And why aren't schools tools for people to solve segregated schools?

Because "segregated schools" are results of other issues.

We correct issues that are wrong (if they really are). We do not correct issues that are not wrong (e.g. students going to their neighborhood schools) just to achieve something else.

You say this as if it's set in stone. Some schools systems allow for students to go to other schools not in their neighborhood.

Implicit in your responses, I suspect, is that you think there is something negative or aversive about allowing for some students to attend schools in higher performing neighborhoods. So again, why specifically do you oppose minority kids being allowed to attend outside their neighborhoods?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why can’t she change schools? Are majority black schools overcrowded? They won’t take her?

Why shouls she change school? The y should bus mire black students into Whitman to support her and shut off the racists in the school if it was true.

They should shut off the racists in the school if it was true.

But why should they bus more black students to Whitman? Creating diversity just for the purpose of diversity?

My view on this is clear: a school reflects the neighborhood. If the neighborhood itself is not diverse, there is no reason to make the school diverse. That's not the way to do it.
If you want to encourage people of diverse background to move into the neighborhood, that is fine.

Except for the fact many of these neighborhoods aren't diverse because of policies like red-lining and other Jim Crowe shenanigans that are illegal today and failing to address these wrongs of the past only prolongs these issues.

This. Schools should attempt to diversify their student populations, given this history of discriminatory policies. Also, research has pointed out the many positive and practical benefits of diversity, so it's not simply diversity for the sake of diversity.

Do no agree. School takes students, and should not do anything to make the student population more or less diverse. Regular schools should treat all kids in the neighborhood the same. Special schools should be merit based.

If you really want diversity, work on changing the neighborhood, instead of the school that receives students from the neighborhood (of course, unless if the school has discriminating policies).

Diversity is something that should not be achieved by the receiving party.

Just curious, why are you so against public schools taking measures to achieve diversity?

I have no problem with achieving diversity anywhere - not enthusiastic but do not have a problem with others wanting that.

I am against the wrong approach, not the goal. When I hear people proposing something which I think is wrong, but they justify it because the goal is good, I don't like that.

PP again. Do you agree that achieving at least some measure of diversity at schools is a good thing? The girl in the Kojo Nnamdi discussion said that she was one of only two--TWO--minorities in most of her classes. She said people joked on Instagram that they had a Black History Month assembly, but they have no black students at the school. If that percentage of minority students were increased a bit, wouldn't that be a good thing?

Also, why is increasing diversity at schools simply "wrong?" You state it's wrong, but don't explain why.

I think I explained in my other posts. Increasing diversity in a school is a goal. It is not wrong. How you do it can be right or wrong.

Penalizing those with racist behaviors, that is the right approach.

Busing in black students from other schools, that, I consider a wrong approach. You don't break the rules just for achieving diversity.

We are going in circles. You keep repeating that it's wrong. Again, WHY do you consider this to be the wrong approach? If it's allowed in some jurisdictions, there are no rules to break. So again, why is this wrong.

Also, it's noted that you've changed the goal posts. In your prior posts, you said that any efforts to increase diversity should focus on neighborhoods, not schools. Now, you're saying you support increasing diversity in schools, but just not via busing.

Yes, if I were the people trying to achieve school diversity, then I would focus on neighborhood.

But if other people focus on other things, e.g. reducing global warming (which you may consider irrelevant, so do I), as long as the approach itself is not bad, and it does not spend public money, I have no objection - I just wouldn't do it that way myself.

"busing students from outside" is against the current rules, and it is against my principle of schools taking students from its neighborhood. I think I've made that clear enough.

I understand that some people do not have this "schools should take students from the neighborhood" principle. Then we have found our differences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why can’t she change schools? Are majority black schools overcrowded? They won’t take her?

Why shouls she change school? The y should bus mire black students into Whitman to support her and shut off the racists in the school if it was true.

They should shut off the racists in the school if it was true.

But why should they bus more black students to Whitman? Creating diversity just for the purpose of diversity?

My view on this is clear: a school reflects the neighborhood. If the neighborhood itself is not diverse, there is no reason to make the school diverse. That's not the way to do it.
If you want to encourage people of diverse background to move into the neighborhood, that is fine.

Except for the fact many of these neighborhoods aren't diverse because of policies like red-lining and other Jim Crowe shenanigans that are illegal today and failing to address these wrongs of the past only prolongs these issues.

This. Schools should attempt to diversify their student populations, given this history of discriminatory policies. Also, research has pointed out the many positive and practical benefits of diversity, so it's not simply diversity for the sake of diversity.

Do no agree. School takes students, and should not do anything to make the student population more or less diverse. Regular schools should treat all kids in the neighborhood the same. Special schools should be merit based.

If you really want diversity, work on changing the neighborhood, instead of the school that receives students from the neighborhood (of course, unless if the school has discriminating policies).

Diversity is something that should not be achieved by the receiving party.

Just curious, why are you so against public schools taking measures to achieve diversity?

I have no problem with achieving diversity anywhere - not enthusiastic but do not have a problem with others wanting that.

I am against the wrong approach, not the goal. When I hear people proposing something which I think is wrong, but they justify it because the goal is good, I don't like that.

PP again. Do you agree that achieving at least some measure of diversity at schools is a good thing? The girl in the Kojo Nnamdi discussion said that she was one of only two--TWO--minorities in most of her classes. She said people joked on Instagram that they had a Black History Month assembly, but they have no black students at the school. If that percentage of minority students were increased a bit, wouldn't that be a good thing?

Also, why is increasing diversity at schools simply "wrong?" You state it's wrong, but don't explain why.

I think I explained in my other posts. Increasing diversity in a school is a goal. It is not wrong. How you do it can be right or wrong.

Penalizing those with racist behaviors, that is the right approach.

Busing in black students from other schools, that, I consider a wrong approach. You don't break the rules just for achieving diversity.

We are going in circles. You keep repeating that it's wrong. Again, WHY do you consider this to be the wrong approach? If it's allowed in some jurisdictions, there are no rules to break. So again, why is this wrong.

Also, it's noted that you've changed the goal posts. In your prior posts, you said that any efforts to increase diversity should focus on neighborhoods, not schools. Now, you're saying you support increasing diversity in schools, but just not via busing.

Yes, if I were the people trying to achieve school diversity, then I would focus on neighborhood.

But if other people focus on other things, e.g. reducing global warming (which you may consider irrelevant, so do I), as long as the approach itself is not bad, and it does not spend public money, I have no objection - I just wouldn't do it that way myself.

"busing students from outside" is against the current rules, and it is against my principle of schools taking students from its neighborhood. I think I've made that clear enough.

I understand that some people do not have this "schools should take students from the neighborhood" principle. Then we have found our differences.

So basically, you won't state why you feel this is wrong; you just do. And have provided no additional info at all to back up why you feel it's wrong, other than "it's against the rules." Fine, I guess, so long as you understand that this is not a compelling argument.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


If students originally belong to other schools, then they should not be sent to your school for no apparent reasons. "Achieving diversity in my school" is a good motivation but not a good reason (for doing so).

A good approach (not necessarily the effect one) would be advocate your school to the surrounding neighborhood and try to attract an in-flow of people from diverse background.

Who says that students "belong" to this school vs. that school?

You seem to agree that segregated neighborhoods are not a good thing. Why do you think that segregated neighborhoods are bad but segregated schools are fine?

If you believe the neighborhood is segregated due to various reasons - solve that.
I do not have a problem with the current school system that schools take students in the surrounding area. Fine-tuning the school zones are fine with me. Taking a significant number of students from clearly outside regions, is not fine.

Schools are not tools for people to solve "segregated neighborhood".

Why not?

And why aren't schools tools for people to solve segregated schools?

Because "segregated schools" are results of other issues.

We correct issues that are wrong (if they really are). We do not correct issues that are not wrong (e.g. students going to their neighborhood schools) just to achieve something else.

You say this as if it's set in stone. Some schools systems allow for students to go to other schools not in their neighborhood.

Implicit in your responses, I suspect, is that you think there is something negative or aversive about allowing for some students to attend schools in higher performing neighborhoods. So again, why specifically do you oppose minority kids being allowed to attend outside their neighborhoods?

Other than merit based schools, I am against doing that unless there are compelling reasons. I do not consider achieving "diversity in a school" a compelling reason. Maybe you do. So we have a difference of opinion.

I also oppose non-minority kids to attend schools outside of their neighborhood, or for high performing students to attend schools in (outside their own) low performing neighborhoods.

No one here is raising that possibility so I do not see the need to spell that out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why can’t she change schools? Are majority black schools overcrowded? They won’t take her?

Why shouls she change school? The y should bus mire black students into Whitman to support her and shut off the racists in the school if it was true.

They should shut off the racists in the school if it was true.

But why should they bus more black students to Whitman? Creating diversity just for the purpose of diversity?

My view on this is clear: a school reflects the neighborhood. If the neighborhood itself is not diverse, there is no reason to make the school diverse. That's not the way to do it.
If you want to encourage people of diverse background to move into the neighborhood, that is fine.

Except for the fact many of these neighborhoods aren't diverse because of policies like red-lining and other Jim Crowe shenanigans that are illegal today and failing to address these wrongs of the past only prolongs these issues.

This. Schools should attempt to diversify their student populations, given this history of discriminatory policies. Also, research has pointed out the many positive and practical benefits of diversity, so it's not simply diversity for the sake of diversity.

Do no agree. School takes students, and should not do anything to make the student population more or less diverse. Regular schools should treat all kids in the neighborhood the same. Special schools should be merit based.

If you really want diversity, work on changing the neighborhood, instead of the school that receives students from the neighborhood (of course, unless if the school has discriminating policies).

Diversity is something that should not be achieved by the receiving party.

Just curious, why are you so against public schools taking measures to achieve diversity?

I have no problem with achieving diversity anywhere - not enthusiastic but do not have a problem with others wanting that.

I am against the wrong approach, not the goal. When I hear people proposing something which I think is wrong, but they justify it because the goal is good, I don't like that.

PP again. Do you agree that achieving at least some measure of diversity at schools is a good thing? The girl in the Kojo Nnamdi discussion said that she was one of only two--TWO--minorities in most of her classes. She said people joked on Instagram that they had a Black History Month assembly, but they have no black students at the school. If that percentage of minority students were increased a bit, wouldn't that be a good thing?

Also, why is increasing diversity at schools simply "wrong?" You state it's wrong, but don't explain why.

I think I explained in my other posts. Increasing diversity in a school is a goal. It is not wrong. How you do it can be right or wrong.

Penalizing those with racist behaviors, that is the right approach.

Busing in black students from other schools, that, I consider a wrong approach. You don't break the rules just for achieving diversity.

We are going in circles. You keep repeating that it's wrong. Again, WHY do you consider this to be the wrong approach? If it's allowed in some jurisdictions, there are no rules to break. So again, why is this wrong.

Also, it's noted that you've changed the goal posts. In your prior posts, you said that any efforts to increase diversity should focus on neighborhoods, not schools. Now, you're saying you support increasing diversity in schools, but just not via busing.

Yes, if I were the people trying to achieve school diversity, then I would focus on neighborhood.

But if other people focus on other things, e.g. reducing global warming (which you may consider irrelevant, so do I), as long as the approach itself is not bad, and it does not spend public money, I have no objection - I just wouldn't do it that way myself.

"busing students from outside" is against the current rules, and it is against my principle of schools taking students from its neighborhood. I think I've made that clear enough.

I understand that some people do not have this "schools should take students from the neighborhood" principle. Then we have found our differences.

So basically, you won't state why you feel this is wrong; you just do. And have provided no additional info at all to back up why you feel it's wrong, other than "it's against the rules." Fine, I guess, so long as you understand that this is not a compelling argument.

Why is it wrong? Becasue: 1. that is the traditional way - either go to your nearby school, or get tested and go to a merit-based school. 2. busing in students from outside become unfair because it is hard to find a fair process that can determine who and how many to be bused in. 3. I see no reason to deliberately ask students to spend more time on school buses just because someone wants to use them as a way to achieve "diversity" in a school that they originally do not belong to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why can’t she change schools? Are majority black schools overcrowded? They won’t take her?

Why shouls she change school? The y should bus mire black students into Whitman to support her and shut off the racists in the school if it was true.

They should shut off the racists in the school if it was true.

But why should they bus more black students to Whitman? Creating diversity just for the purpose of diversity?

My view on this is clear: a school reflects the neighborhood. If the neighborhood itself is not diverse, there is no reason to make the school diverse. That's not the way to do it.
If you want to encourage people of diverse background to move into the neighborhood, that is fine.

Except for the fact many of these neighborhoods aren't diverse because of policies like red-lining and other Jim Crowe shenanigans that are illegal today and failing to address these wrongs of the past only prolongs these issues.

This. Schools should attempt to diversify their student populations, given this history of discriminatory policies. Also, research has pointed out the many positive and practical benefits of diversity, so it's not simply diversity for the sake of diversity.

Do no agree. School takes students, and should not do anything to make the student population more or less diverse. Regular schools should treat all kids in the neighborhood the same. Special schools should be merit based.

If you really want diversity, work on changing the neighborhood, instead of the school that receives students from the neighborhood (of course, unless if the school has discriminating policies).

Diversity is something that should not be achieved by the receiving party.

Just curious, why are you so against public schools taking measures to achieve diversity?

I have no problem with achieving diversity anywhere - not enthusiastic but do not have a problem with others wanting that.

I am against the wrong approach, not the goal. When I hear people proposing something which I think is wrong, but they justify it because the goal is good, I don't like that.

PP again. Do you agree that achieving at least some measure of diversity at schools is a good thing? The girl in the Kojo Nnamdi discussion said that she was one of only two--TWO--minorities in most of her classes. She said people joked on Instagram that they had a Black History Month assembly, but they have no black students at the school. If that percentage of minority students were increased a bit, wouldn't that be a good thing?

Also, why is increasing diversity at schools simply "wrong?" You state it's wrong, but don't explain why.

I think I explained in my other posts. Increasing diversity in a school is a goal. It is not wrong. How you do it can be right or wrong.

Penalizing those with racist behaviors, that is the right approach.

Busing in black students from other schools, that, I consider a wrong approach. You don't break the rules just for achieving diversity.

We are going in circles. You keep repeating that it's wrong. Again, WHY do you consider this to be the wrong approach? If it's allowed in some jurisdictions, there are no rules to break. So again, why is this wrong.

Also, it's noted that you've changed the goal posts. In your prior posts, you said that any efforts to increase diversity should focus on neighborhoods, not schools. Now, you're saying you support increasing diversity in schools, but just not via busing.

Yes, if I were the people trying to achieve school diversity, then I would focus on neighborhood.

But if other people focus on other things, e.g. reducing global warming (which you may consider irrelevant, so do I), as long as the approach itself is not bad, and it does not spend public money, I have no objection - I just wouldn't do it that way myself.

"busing students from outside" is against the current rules, and it is against my principle of schools taking students from its neighborhood. I think I've made that clear enough.

I understand that some people do not have this "schools should take students from the neighborhood" principle. Then we have found our differences.

So basically, you won't state why you feel this is wrong; you just do. And have provided no additional info at all to back up why you feel it's wrong, other than "it's against the rules." Fine, I guess, so long as you understand that this is not a compelling argument.

Why is it wrong? Becasue: 1. that is the traditional way - either go to your nearby school, or get tested and go to a merit-based school. 2. busing in students from outside become unfair because it is hard to find a fair process that can determine who and how many to be bused in. 3. I see no reason to deliberately ask students to spend more time on school buses just because someone wants to use them as a way to achieve "diversity" in a school that they originally do not belong to.

1. I don't think "this is the way things have always been" has ever been a convincing argument.
2. Unfair to whom? Also, what you're against a process that serves the greater goal of diversity because you're not sure how the logistics would be worked out?
3. Many families will gladly put their kids on a bus for a chance to attend a school with better resources and higher test scores.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Yes, if I were the people trying to achieve school diversity, then I would focus on neighborhood.

But if other people focus on other things, e.g. reducing global warming (which you may consider irrelevant, so do I), as long as the approach itself is not bad, and it does not spend public money, I have no objection - I just wouldn't do it that way myself.

"busing students from outside" is against the current rules, and it is against my principle of schools taking students from its neighborhood. I think I've made that clear enough.

I understand that some people do not have this "schools should take students from the neighborhood" principle. Then we have found our differences.

Rules can be changed.

What is the reason for your principle that schools should take students only from the local neighborhood?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Why is it wrong? Becasue: 1. that is the traditional way - either go to your nearby school, or get tested and go to a merit-based school. 2. busing in students from outside become unfair because it is hard to find a fair process that can determine who and how many to be bused in. 3. I see no reason to deliberately ask students to spend more time on school buses just because someone wants to use them as a way to achieve "diversity" in a school that they originally do not belong to.

1. I don't think "this is the way things have always been" has ever been a convincing argument.
2. Unfair to whom? Also, what you're against a process that serves the greater goal of diversity because you're not sure how the logistics would be worked out?
3. Many families will gladly put their kids on a bus for a chance to attend a school with better resources and higher test scores.

1. it is not by itself. But usually it does take more effort and more reasons to change the norm than to follow the norm. Here I do not see the reasons as strong enough.
2. Unfair to whom? It it benefits no one, then no need to discuss. If you believe it clearly benefits certain kids, then how about people outside of that group? How do you choose that group. For me how to choose "who" get bused in would be the first thing to worry about. Also, logistics are not trivial issues. If you only buses in a few, that is not a problem since there are always "exceptions" to norms. But if you want to bus in a considerable number of kids, and you are telling people it does not matter if the logistics would work out?

3. So now you clearly admit, that these kids being bused in get benefits. Would it be fair to other kids that do not?

Again, if you spend your money on the buses, on the additional costs (maybe not that much, because one can always transfer the money given to the original school which those kids belong to, to the school you want them to be bused into), etc., I don't really have much problem with that. But if you want public money to be spent on this, I do oppose.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Why is it wrong? Becasue: 1. that is the traditional way - either go to your nearby school, or get tested and go to a merit-based school. 2. busing in students from outside become unfair because it is hard to find a fair process that can determine who and how many to be bused in. 3. I see no reason to deliberately ask students to spend more time on school buses just because someone wants to use them as a way to achieve "diversity" in a school that they originally do not belong to.

1. I don't think "this is the way things have always been" has ever been a convincing argument.
2. Unfair to whom? Also, what you're against a process that serves the greater goal of diversity because you're not sure how the logistics would be worked out?
3. Many families will gladly put their kids on a bus for a chance to attend a school with better resources and higher test scores.

1. it is not by itself. But usually it does take more effort and more reasons to change the norm than to follow the norm. Here I do not see the reasons as strong enough.
2. Unfair to whom? It it benefits no one, then no need to discuss. If you believe it clearly benefits certain kids, then how about people outside of that group? How do you choose that group. For me how to choose "who" get bused in would be the first thing to worry about. Also, logistics are not trivial issues. If you only buses in a few, that is not a problem since there are always "exceptions" to norms. But if you want to bus in a considerable number of kids, and you are telling people it does not matter if the logistics would work out?

3. So now you clearly admit, that these kids being bused in get benefits. Would it be fair to other kids that do not?

Again, if you spend your money on the buses, on the additional costs (maybe not that much, because one can always transfer the money given to the original school which those kids belong to, to the school you want them to be bused into), etc., I don't really have much problem with that. But if you want public money to be spent on this, I do oppose.

Do you feel that busing, as a social/educational policy, is detrimental to students at more affluent schools?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Yes, if I were the people trying to achieve school diversity, then I would focus on neighborhood.

But if other people focus on other things, e.g. reducing global warming (which you may consider irrelevant, so do I), as long as the approach itself is not bad, and it does not spend public money, I have no objection - I just wouldn't do it that way myself.

"busing students from outside" is against the current rules, and it is against my principle of schools taking students from its neighborhood. I think I've made that clear enough.

I understand that some people do not have this "schools should take students from the neighborhood" principle. Then we have found our differences.

Rules can be changed.

What is the reason for your principle that schools should take students only from the local neighborhood?

Already stated in the PP. And isn't that obvious? Any other rules that you think would work better than this (other than merit based schools)? Schools with racial quota? Remember, we are talking about rules, that is something that can be followed with very little personal choices from the administrators. Things like "we should make the school diverse" are not rules. They are slogans.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Yes, if I were the people trying to achieve school diversity, then I would focus on neighborhood.

But if other people focus on other things, e.g. reducing global warming (which you may consider irrelevant, so do I), as long as the approach itself is not bad, and it does not spend public money, I have no objection - I just wouldn't do it that way myself.

"busing students from outside" is against the current rules, and it is against my principle of schools taking students from its neighborhood. I think I've made that clear enough.

I understand that some people do not have this "schools should take students from the neighborhood" principle. Then we have found our differences.

Rules can be changed.

What is the reason for your principle that schools should take students only from the local neighborhood?

Already stated in the PP. And isn't that obvious? Any other rules that you think would work better than this (other than merit based schools)? Schools with racial quota? Remember, we are talking about rules, that is something that can be followed with very little personal choices from the administrators. Things like "we should make the school diverse" are not rules. They are slogans.

No, it's not obvious. That's why I'm asking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Do you feel that busing, as a social/educational policy, is detrimental to students at more affluent schools?

You know, my kid has a long bus ride to her zoned school. We don't live in the neighborhood. But those are the rules. I wonder what the "schools should be for kids in the neighborhood" PP thinks about that. Maybe the PP thinks my kid shouldn't be at that school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Why is it wrong? Becasue: 1. that is the traditional way - either go to your nearby school, or get tested and go to a merit-based school. 2. busing in students from outside become unfair because it is hard to find a fair process that can determine who and how many to be bused in. 3. I see no reason to deliberately ask students to spend more time on school buses just because someone wants to use them as a way to achieve "diversity" in a school that they originally do not belong to.

1. I don't think "this is the way things have always been" has ever been a convincing argument.
2. Unfair to whom? Also, what you're against a process that serves the greater goal of diversity because you're not sure how the logistics would be worked out?
3. Many families will gladly put their kids on a bus for a chance to attend a school with better resources and higher test scores.

1. it is not by itself. But usually it does take more effort and more reasons to change the norm than to follow the norm. Here I do not see the reasons as strong enough.
2. Unfair to whom? It it benefits no one, then no need to discuss. If you believe it clearly benefits certain kids, then how about people outside of that group? How do you choose that group. For me how to choose "who" get bused in would be the first thing to worry about. Also, logistics are not trivial issues. If you only buses in a few, that is not a problem since there are always "exceptions" to norms. But if you want to bus in a considerable number of kids, and you are telling people it does not matter if the logistics would work out?

3. So now you clearly admit, that these kids being bused in get benefits. Would it be fair to other kids that do not?

Again, if you spend your money on the buses, on the additional costs (maybe not that much, because one can always transfer the money given to the original school which those kids belong to, to the school you want them to be bused into), etc., I don't really have much problem with that. But if you want public money to be spent on this, I do oppose.

Do you feel that busing, as a social/educational policy, is detrimental to students at more affluent schools?

If the school has the extra capacity (that is a big IF), busing may not be too much detrimental to students already at that school.
However, I see (i) the money spent on the extra buses is a burden to all the taxpayers;
and (ii) it is difficult to implement this policy in a fair manner.

Of course, all of this depends on the scale. If you bus in, say, 20 students, I don't see an issue, but that changes nothing. If you bus in 500, that is a big change.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Already stated in the PP. And isn't that obvious? Any other rules that you think would work better than this (other than merit based schools)? Schools with racial quota? Remember, we are talking about rules, that is something that can be followed with very little personal choices from the administrators. Things like "we should make the school diverse" are not rules. They are slogans.

No, it's not obvious. That's why I'm asking.

So do you have any other obvious rules can be used instead? Again, RULES, not something that different school administrators can easily do differently by just following the "spirit".
If not, it becomes obvious that we should just keep using the current rules.