Oldest kids in class do better, even through college - NPR

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So for those who red-shirt - do you have your kids repeat a year of pre-school? I'm just wondering how this is done logistically. My son is in a Montessori preschool that offers kindergarten and he is on the young side of his class with a June birthday. If I wanted to red-shirt him would I have him repeat a year in his current classroom? Or do kindergarten twice? I can see the advantage of doing it but feel like it would be weird for him if all of his classmates moved up and he didn't.

Do K twice.

My son is in a Montessori and he is going to do K there and again in the "big school" when we switch to our local public school.

[Anonymous]

having a kid repeat k absent a teacher's recommendation is flat out WEIRD.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:having a kid repeat k absent a teacher's recommendation is flat out WEIRD.

It happens a lot. At my kids' preschool, that is pretty much what the kindergarten class does. They do K at the preschool and then K at whatever school they go to for elementary. Kids born as early as April and May (which I think is crazy). Aug and Sept should get some leeway. But the others should go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

+1. Very few people in this country understand the blacklisting public schools have gotten in the name of privatization, when the core problem has always been, and will always be, poverty. No matter how much we test kids, cut recess, or fire teachers, the rich kids will always do better than the poor ones. But it's easier to pretend poverty doesn't exist than work to make an equal society, especially in a society as individualistic as ours.

NP here but I agree that the issue is our country expects public schools to solve all the problems of poverty.

Actually I think the issue is that our country claims to expect public schools to solve all the problems of poverty. If our country actually expected this, our country would provide public schools with a lot more resources, and a wider range of resources. And our country certainly wouldn't allow public school funding to be primarily based on local property taxes from areas that are segregated by income.

Title One schools get more more but it's up to the schools themselves to decide how that money is spent. No amount of money in the world can change the mindset of poverty. I teach in one of these schools and the pressure to be everything for these kids is intense. The only reason I don't burn out is summer vacation. If there was no long break from it, I couldn't do it. I have my own kids and I cannot teach and be the savior of other people's children too. Nobody expects you to do that in UMC schools. You are just expected to teach. I can't be someone's mother, family, counselor, psychologist, college counselor, etc. That's why schools like mine have such high turnover. This kind of work is for young people who don't have other time commitments. I stay because I get paid significantly more and I need the money for tuition for my kids.

Exactly. If we really expected schools to solve all of the problems of poverty, we would provide enough resources to the schools so that they would have enough people for all of those functions, instead of expecting teachers to do everything.

[Anonymous]

My son is older (just missed cutoff). Being older has been extremely helpful in his sports -- he ended up being recruited, and we do have to admit that being almost a full year older was crucial in his success.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most "summer birthday boys"? Summer birthdays range from part of June through part of September. Who would redshirt a June or July kid?

Plenty. I've seen parents redshirt May birthday boys.

My nephew, born in May, was held back. He'd been late to start preschool because he resisted potty training and was generally immature emotionally so it made sense at the time. He's now a HS freshman and doing well.

My DS, born late June, went on time and at the time I had no concerns at all -- he was already reading well, doing math beyond a 1st grade level, extremely social, very confident. But our schools' ridiculous expectations for young children in school still made things very difficult for him. He almost immediately came to hate school and I heard all the time about immaturity, impulse control, etc. Finally, by 4th grade he caught up and classroom behavior was no longer a problem. But he still really dislikes school. I had a number of discussions over the years with the school counselor and second-guessed our decision to send him on but her take was that if we'd held him back he'd still be getting in trouble but out of boredom rather than immaturity and that is harder to deal with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm a late September birthday and was always the youngest in my class. I was also always among the smartest in my class -- I went to a top 10 undergrad, top 5 grad school, and am still quite successful. So there's that.

All that and you still don't understand the difference between anecdote and data.

[Anonymous]

Exactly. If we really expected schools to solve all of the problems of poverty, we would provide enough resources to the schools so that they would have enough people for all of those functions, instead of expecting teachers to do everything.

A different teacher here who spent years with Title I. With all the resources in the world, the school cannot be all the things that the PP listed. Money is not going to solve the problem. It requires a change in priorities.
For example, all this talk about changing school names and transgender issues. Neither of these is going to really help anyone. Yet, we are spending time and resources on them. The FCPS School Board has spent more time on these issues than the budget--or, at least it appears that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Exactly. If we really expected schools to solve all of the problems of poverty, we would provide enough resources to the schools so that they would have enough people for all of those functions, instead of expecting teachers to do everything.

A different teacher here who spent years with Title I. With all the resources in the world, the school cannot be all the things that the PP listed. Money is not going to solve the problem. It requires a change in priorities.
For example, all this talk about changing school names and transgender issues. Neither of these is going to really help anyone. Yet, we are spending time and resources on them. The FCPS School Board has spent more time on these issues than the budget--or, at least it appears that way.

I don't know that I think FC PS should be spending so much time on these issues but I think the transgender issue helps transgender kids and the name issue helps us get rid of institutional racism which has value

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So for those who red-shirt - do you have your kids repeat a year of pre-school? I'm just wondering how this is done logistically. My son is in a Montessori preschool that offers kindergarten and he is on the young side of his class with a June birthday. If I wanted to red-shirt him would I have him repeat a year in his current classroom? Or do kindergarten twice? I can see the advantage of doing it but feel like it would be weird for him if all of his classmates moved up and he didn't.

Do K twice.

My son is in a Montessori and he is going to do K there and again in the "big school" when we switch to our local public school.

My kids were Fall birthdays and started Montessori just before turning 3, so they finished 3 years of Montessori and went to traditional K on time as 5 year olds. Regular K after Montessori is a very good transition.

[Anonymous]

I don't know that I think FC PS should be spending so much time on these issues but I think the transgender issue helps transgender kids and the name issue helps us get rid of institutional racism which has value

Spending millions on changing school names will have little impact on "institutional racism."
The money could be better spent helping the very poor kids in the classroom--no matter what race they are.

The transgender issue should be decided at the school level. All transgender issues are not the same. And, we now have the issue of the "gender fluid". And, sad to say, no matter how many accommodations are made for these kids, they are still not physically the same. It is a very difficult issue for those kids--but bathrooms are not a solution for a quick fix. I think if the kids are accepted as the non-biological gender that they should be allowed to use their identifying bathroom--but, in some places, they could be subject to more bullying. The school is the best place to handle this.

[Anonymous]

I held back my September birthday 5th grade twins and have never regretted it.
In a grade cohort of about 125 kids, they're about the 10th/11th oldest.
They're academic, social and athletic leaders. I can't imagine the same would be true if they were among the 10 youngest kids in the grade.

September birthdays really are tricky. You're dealing with being the very oldest or very youngest. We chose oldest as the lesser or two evils and it's been a good decision.

[Anonymous]

We sent our mid-August 5yo to kindergarten. I was nervous -- her preschool teacher really pushed the "young fives" program, but my gut instinct told me she was ready. I was nervous until the first parent teacher conference, when I found out she was among the top performers. I don't know what I had been so worried about!

I think each child is unique, and statistics are just that.

[Anonymous]

I think each child is unique, and statistics are just that.

This!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a late September birthday and was always the youngest in my class. I was also always among the smartest in my class -- I went to a top 10 undergrad, top 5 grad school, and am still quite successful. So there's that.

Me too, my bday is the first week in October.

I've noticed now that I'm older
-hey wait..maybe I wasn't as mature. Maybe that did make me feel a hint of less confidence going off to college, at 17
-maybe that's why I tend to follow. (I've had leadership opps at work, and I do a good job..I just *prefer* to be a follower)
-maybe that's why I have felt socially different, maybe even over-serious. I had to actually more 'mature' and to me that meant being serious.

But I was reading before K, even being a young starter. So my parents made a good choice. I always did fantastic in school. Maybe I would have felt socially more secure in addition to being a high achiever.

I was always the youngest in my class, by several months. Yes, I wasn't as mature, but I was also reading before kindergarten and excelled academically. Being held back any longer would have made school even more boring and easier than it was. And being the youngest often meant I had to work harder (at other stuff, like sports), so I did get some kinds of challenges. As with all things, there are advantages and disadvantages.