Are middle schools and high schools impacted by 2.0?

[Anonymous]

In any case, what PP presumably meant is that the kids who want to go think that the advantages of going outweigh the disadvantages of the commute.

This is a far different statement than saying they enjoy the commute. Its sad that qualified kids are turned away because there are too few slots and a magnet could never be built in any of the affluent areas just because MCPS only care about using the magnets to raise scores in poor performing schools. Lovely school district.

[Anonymous]

Correct, the advantages do out way the commute,

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
In our neighborhood, by mass ave, many students who are accepted want to go. Many do for elementary school, the bus pick up times are OK and you just forfeit most after school activities.
But in MS and HS, they want to go too, but the 5:30am bus pick up time and the 4-5pm bus drop off time are prohibitive. The after school bus route and times are more horrid. Few parents can drop off or pick up, it is too far, no public transport that makes sense, and in too much traffic congestion or far from any office cluster.

So, it's a poorly construed option and they naturally return to their neighborhood school. It does however raise the scores of the host school.

Find out the acceptance rates of those who test in, are accepted and then do not go. MoCo is not providing a viable service to its GT students. Hence the decreasing yields, hence the everlasting churn off the waitlists and hence the low re up/ return rates for distant students.

Why would the yields be decreasing? The magnets haven't gotten any further away, have they? And how do you know that the yields are decreasing?

I don't know about matriculation yields over time, though as the student body has grown, acceptance and matriculation yields may indeed have decreased.
But there is very clear decreasing HGC/magnet matriculation yields from ES to MS to HS. As school start times get earlier and teams/clubs/extracurriculars get going more.

MoCo, which is frankly too large a county and school system, has a lot of A+ player students. Sad that it only seeks to serve a sliver of them. Fairfax can serve more, without the 10-20 mile rush-hour commutes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Why not? The kids who come to Silver spring from these school districts to attend a magnet programs have really long commutes and have a tough time managing extra currics. as a result. The curriculum in the magnet programs is much better than the curriculum you find at Westland or North Bethesda for example. You also have a much larger peer group in the magnet program. In the middle school magnets for example you have 100 kids who are working at your level, whereas in the aforementioned schools you might have a dozen in the entire grade and these children are not grouped together in one class (except for Math - if you take Algebra in 6th grade for example). They are spread out and are frequently lucky to have a couple of kids working at their level in their classes. So their needs are not met in the "W" schools. Remember we are talking about the top 5% of students. Most of these kids love learning - it is what makes them tick, and they really need the stimulation and challenge of an advanced and accelerated curriculum and a robust group of peers.

I don't understand. Are you talking about students in Bethesda/Potomac being able to go to the middle school magnets? They are able to go to the middle school magnets, if they apply and accepted, just like any other students in any other cluster.

Or are you talking about actually locating a middle-school test-in magnet program in a Bethesda/Potomac cluster? There are 38 middle schools in MCPS. 35 of them do not host a middle-school test-in magnet program.

I am aware that they can go to middle school magnets - my child attended one. What I'm saying is that both middle school magnets are in Silver Spring and the commute from Bethesda or Potomac sucks. When dc attended, he was the only child from his home middle school in the magnet program. There are tons of kids from the Silver Spring area who attend these schools but only a smattering of kids from the W schools. As I said in my previous post (see above) the curriculum in the magnet programs is far more advanced than the curriculum in a "W" middle school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I think that you are going to have a hard time persuading the rest of the county about how it's so unfair that Whitman, Wootton, Churchill, and Walter Johnson don't have a test-in middle-school magnet program located in their clusters.

Isn't this reverse social-economic discrimination? I don't know the data on who applies and qualifies for the magnets but assuming those schools have an equal or number of students then why wouldn't you place a magnet or IB program in those schools? Why waste the money busing them across the county? It certainly is counter to health policies to have them go even earlier because of an extra long bus ride.

Montgomery is very fucked up and has suffered from terrible leadership. There should be more integrated housing options but the county council is one of the most idiotic groups in the country when it comes to planning and development. They create so many barriers that Virginia and Howard have stepped in to grab all the growing industries. When a developer does get through the red tape and decides to build something here, Montgomery County ends up being completely shafted on funds for schools or community development because they aren't competent negotiators and don't enforce their own polices that frighten other developers away. . Its really the worst of both ends.

We've ended up with a declining tax revenue base while other areas around us are growing. We have segregation in housing that affects the schools. We try to address this by spending money busing kids around so we don't have enough money to start schools at a legitimate time.

+1 It is really messed up to expect kids to board a bus at 6.20 to make it to a magnet middle school when the first class begins at 7.55 and then do the same thing after school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Why not? The kids who come to Silver spring from these school districts to attend a magnet programs have really long commutes and have a tough time managing extra currics. as a result. The curriculum in the magnet programs is much better than the curriculum you find at Westland or North Bethesda for example. You also have a much larger peer group in the magnet program. In the middle school magnets for example you have 100 kids who are working at your level, whereas in the aforementioned schools you might have a dozen in the entire grade and these children are not grouped together in one class (except for Math - if you take Algebra in 6th grade for example). They are spread out and are frequently lucky to have a couple of kids working at their level in their classes. So their needs are not met in the "W" schools. Remember we are talking about the top 5% of students. Most of these kids love learning - it is what makes them tick, and they really need the stimulation and challenge of an advanced and accelerated curriculum and a robust group of peers.

I don't understand. Are you talking about students in Bethesda/Potomac being able to go to the middle school magnets? They are able to go to the middle school magnets, if they apply and accepted, just like any other students in any other cluster.

Or are you talking about actually locating a middle-school test-in magnet program in a Bethesda/Potomac cluster? There are 38 middle schools in MCPS. 35 of them do not host a middle-school test-in magnet program.

I am aware that they can go to middle school magnets - my child attended one. What I'm saying is that both middle school magnets are in Silver Spring and the commute from Bethesda or Potomac sucks. When dc attended, he was the only child from his home middle school in the magnet program. There are tons of kids from the Silver Spring area who attend these schools but only a smattering of kids from the W schools. As I said in my previous post (see above) the curriculum in the magnet programs is far more advanced than the curriculum in a "W" middle school.

I wouldn't mind the commute up to the Germantown MS magnet - reverse commute. But we are zoned for SS magnet. Any chance you can ask to switch?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Why not? The kids who come to Silver spring from these school districts to attend a magnet programs have really long commutes and have a tough time managing extra currics. as a result. The curriculum in the magnet programs is much better than the curriculum you find at Westland or North Bethesda for example. You also have a much larger peer group in the magnet program. In the middle school magnets for example you have 100 kids who are working at your level, whereas in the aforementioned schools you might have a dozen in the entire grade and these children are not grouped together in one class (except for Math - if you take Algebra in 6th grade for example). They are spread out and are frequently lucky to have a couple of kids working at their level in their classes. So their needs are not met in the "W" schools. Remember we are talking about the top 5% of students. Most of these kids love learning - it is what makes them tick, and they really need the stimulation and challenge of an advanced and accelerated curriculum and a robust group of peers.

I don't understand. Are you talking about students in Bethesda/Potomac being able to go to the middle school magnets? They are able to go to the middle school magnets, if they apply and accepted, just like any other students in any other cluster.

Or are you talking about actually locating a middle-school test-in magnet program in a Bethesda/Potomac cluster? There are 38 middle schools in MCPS. 35 of them do not host a middle-school test-in magnet program.

I am aware that they can go to middle school magnets - my child attended one. What I'm saying is that both middle school magnets are in Silver Spring and the commute from Bethesda or Potomac sucks. When dc attended, he was the only child from his home middle school in the magnet program. There are tons of kids from the Silver Spring area who attend these schools but only a smattering of kids from the W schools. As I said in my previous post (see above) the curriculum in the magnet programs is far more advanced than the curriculum in a "W" middle school.

Agree, no brainer if you lived in Silver Spring or Wheaton. Funny enough, that's a lot of families' buying strategy.
Nightmare if you live NW or west of 16th street/Georgia Avenue.

BTW, my co-worker has alumni interviewed Blair students for years. They are always popping into our offices for that in the Fall. I've asked him where most of the kids' original schools came from and it was not the W catchment areas. He also noticed that there were a lot of NIH-kids and that those parents have worked out a cool car pooling system to mitigate some PITA drop offs/pick ups.
Even his two kids only did the elementary school magnet school, then did Pyle and Whitman.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I don't know about matriculation yields over time, though as the student body has grown, acceptance and matriculation yields may indeed have decreased.
But there is very clear decreasing HGC/magnet matriculation yields from ES to MS to HS. As school start times get earlier and teams/clubs/extracurriculars get going more.

MoCo, which is frankly too large a county and school system, has a lot of A+ player students. Sad that it only seeks to serve a sliver of them. Fairfax can serve more, without the 10-20 mile rush-hour commutes.

There are? Where did you get this information? We're talking about yields, not enrollment, right?

And if Montgomery County has so many A+ player students, doesn't that actually argue against needing separate magnets? If there are so many of them, their needs can be served in the home schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I am aware that they can go to middle school magnets - my child attended one. What I'm saying is that both middle school magnets are in Silver Spring and the commute from Bethesda or Potomac sucks. When dc attended, he was the only child from his home middle school in the magnet program. There are tons of kids from the Silver Spring area who attend these schools but only a smattering of kids from the W schools. As I said in my previous post (see above) the curriculum in the magnet programs is far more advanced than the curriculum in a "W" middle school.

I'm sure that the commute from Bethesda or Potomac to the middle school magnets is lousy. But that is a consequence of choosing to live in Bethesda or Potomac and go to a middle school magnet. If you can afford to live in Bethesda or Potomac, you can almost certainly afford to live closer to the middle school magnets in Silver Spring. In contrast, most of the people who live close to the middle school magnets in Silver Spring cannot afford to live in Bethesda or Potomac. And their alternative to the middle-school magnets is not the Bethesda/Potomac home school, either. Nor do they have the option of choosing a long commute in order to go to a Bethesda/Potomac school.

If you wonder why people in the rest of the county often think of people who live in Bethesda/Potomac as entitled -- well, your post is a good example.

[Anonymous]

Everyone is saying the same thing but for their own personal reasons: MCPS doesn't care to serve its gifted and talented community.
They offer disingenuous offerings, that have limited uptake. By design.

Anyhow, the district's focus, time and resources are not on the high performing schools or students. It is on the achievement gap and the bottom performers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Everyone is saying the same thing but for their own personal reasons: MCPS doesn't care to serve its gifted and talented community.
They offer disingenuous offerings, that have limited uptake. By design.

Anyhow, the district's focus, time and resources are not on the high performing schools or students. It is on the achievement gap and the bottom performers.

In other words: I want mine.

[Anonymous]

All i can say is, I don't live in Potomac or Bethesda but ALL my kids friends live there & go to Blair.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I am aware that they can go to middle school magnets - my child attended one. What I'm saying is that both middle school magnets are in Silver Spring and the commute from Bethesda or Potomac sucks. When dc attended, he was the only child from his home middle school in the magnet program. There are tons of kids from the Silver Spring area who attend these schools but only a smattering of kids from the W schools. As I said in my previous post (see above) the curriculum in the magnet programs is far more advanced than the curriculum in a "W" middle school.

I'm sure that the commute from Bethesda or Potomac to the middle school magnets is lousy. But that is a consequence of choosing to live in Bethesda or Potomac and go to a middle school magnet. If you can afford to live in Bethesda or Potomac, you can almost certainly afford to live closer to the middle school magnets in Silver Spring. In contrast, most of the people who live close to the middle school magnets in Silver Spring cannot afford to live in Bethesda or Potomac. And their alternative to the middle-school magnets is not the Bethesda/Potomac home school, either. Nor do they have the option of choosing a long commute in order to go to a Bethesda/Potomac school.

If you wonder why people in the rest of the county often think of people who live in Bethesda/Potomac as entitled -- well, your post is a good example.

Are you implying that everyone who lives in Bethesda/Potomac is rich? If you stretched your budget to buy a house for $500K or $600K in one of these neighborhoods a few years ago you are not rich by Mont. County standards. Selling that house and paying all the taxes and fees to buy a house in SS would be beyond the means of most of the people I know. Perhaps I should have planned for the eventuality that my child would not be adequately served in his home school and would be accepted into and want to attend a middle school magnet program. I didn't have a crystal ball then. If my child then does not get into a high school magnet like Blair would you suggest I am "rich" enough to then sell my home in SS (pay those taxes, fees and realtor fees again) and move back to Bethesda? Think before you throw words like "entitled" around. There is a lot of reverse snobbery on this forum. I wouldn't care except when it is used to dismiss the concerns I might have for my child's education.

[Anonymous]

It is reverse snobbery. Aka jealousy and envy.
What are you even envious of? That some white collar dual income family worked their butts off in school, grad school, jobs and saved up and bought a house in 20816. You must hate a lot of people then. Because, someone, somewhere, will always have a nicer house, car or savings account than you. Time to grow up!

This thread is an example of people who are so proud that families that live miles from Blair turn it down (regardless if their kid goes there), that they support a dysfunctional expensive public good.

I don't know about you but Teqch to Potential should be the goal. Not politics. Not juicing school test scores. Not offerings that have such collateral damage that they are turned down for logistics reasons.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is reverse snobbery. Aka jealousy and envy.
What are you even envious of? That some white collar dual income family worked their butts off in school, grad school, jobs and saved up and bought a house in 20816. You must hate a lot of people then. Because, someone, somewhere, will always have a nicer house, car or savings account than you. Time to grow up!

This thread is an example of people who are so proud that families that live miles from Blair turn it down (regardless if their kid goes there), that they support a dysfunctional expensive public good.

I don't know about you but Teqch to Potential should be the goal. Not politics. Not juicing school test scores. Not offerings that have such collateral damage that they are turned down for logistics reasons.

+1