Make 350k-400k, feel middle class

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:$400K is not a lot of money AFTER YOU'VE SPENT IT ALL.

Think of all you've consumed before being left with "nothing" each month: expensive educations, excellent child care and health care, outstanding public schools, housing in one of the most desirable markets in the country, etc, etc. Nevermind your food, clothing, cars, retirement and college savings, etc. Most people can't fathom having even a few of these things, let alone all of them.

So stop whining. You've purchased a premium lifestyle with your spending power.

This x1000.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$400K is not a lot of money AFTER YOU'VE SPENT IT ALL.

Think of all you've consumed before being left with "nothing" each month: expensive educations, excellent child care and health care, outstanding public schools, housing in one of the most desirable markets in the country, etc, etc. Nevermind your food, clothing, cars, retirement and college savings, etc. Most people can't fathom having even a few of these things, let alone all of them.

So stop whining. You've purchased a premium lifestyle with your spending power.

This x1000.

+2

Seriously, this thread is the most pathetic thing ever.

[Anonymous]

What degree gets you $4k/month in student loans?

DH has loans from an Ivy league masters degree and that's $300/month - he had a scholarship and worked part time, covering about 1/3 of the total cost, but even if he had had loans for 100% of the costs for both years, we still wouldn't be facing $1k/month in student loan debt.

I can't imagine $4k - where is that coming from? You both went to med school fully funded with debt and even lived off debt to pay your rent + undergrad loans?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What degree gets you $4k/month in student loans?

DH has loans from an Ivy league masters degree and that's $300/month - he had a scholarship and worked part time, covering about 1/3 of the total cost, but even if he had had loans for 100% of the costs for both years, we still wouldn't be facing $1k/month in student loan debt.

I can't imagine $4k - where is that coming from? You both went to med school fully funded with debt and even lived off debt to pay your rent + undergrad loans?

Yeah - I agree this is crazy. I paid for both my undergrad (partial scholarship) and an IL law school and still have a $1500/m payment (which I think is insane, but recognize that I voluntarily took on the debt). 4000/m reeks of bad choices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What degree gets you $4k/month in student loans?

DH has loans from an Ivy league masters degree and that's $300/month - he had a scholarship and worked part time, covering about 1/3 of the total cost, but even if he had had loans for 100% of the costs for both years, we still wouldn't be facing $1k/month in student loan debt.

I can't imagine $4k - where is that coming from? You both went to med school fully funded with debt and even lived off debt to pay your rent + undergrad loans?

Yeah $4K seems high. Two recent law grads with some undergrad debt would get you pretty close to $400K, which, at a blended rate of say 8% is still only $3,087 per month.

Alternatively, they might be on a self imposed 10 year repayment plan which would make their payments $4,853 a month.

[Anonymous]

Try living in a smaller house (it'll cost less.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$400K is not a lot of money AFTER YOU'VE SPENT IT ALL.

Think of all you've consumed before being left with "nothing" each month: expensive educations, excellent child care and health care, outstanding public schools, housing in one of the most desirable markets in the country, etc, etc. Nevermind your food, clothing, cars, retirement and college savings, etc. Most people can't fathom having even a few of these things, let alone all of them.

So stop whining. You've purchased a premium lifestyle with your spending power.

Great post. Spot on.

[Anonymous]

We earn about 350k a year, and I feel completely middle class at this stage of life with 2 young kids in daycare, student loans, retirement college savings, and mortgage. Although our lifestyle is middle class, our savings are not. Between pretax and posttax savings, we probably sock away 90k a year.

[Anonymous]

The Washington metropolitan area is becoming more like the New York City or San Francisco metropolitan areas. Would you purposely choose to live in those cities? Probably not, because we recognize that the ordinary cost of living in those cities is prohibitively expensive, and that our income of $350-400 K would not go very far in supporting an upper-middle class lifestyle.

If you believe that NYC or SF or DC are the only places that you can live because they are so cosmopolitan, and intellectual, and international, and cultural, then so be it. You are purposely making the tradeoff to live more modestly, and constantly worrying about money, precisely so that you can live in an area that is more cosmopolitan, and intellectual, and international, and culturally significant.

But what if, like the original settlers, or our founding fathers, or the pioneers, you believed that you can bring "civilization", and "intellectualism", and "culture" with you and raise your children with those interests and values wherever you may settle. Then an affordable world of options all over this country (or the world) open up to you -- outside of the very most desirable metropolitan areas.

Choose any place in the country -- Billings, MT, or Oak Park, IL, or Bloomington, IN, or Santa Fe, NM. I will choose the random (for me) area of Vestavia Hills, AL. As you can see $539K will buy you a perfectly nice, if not dream home. More importantly the public schools all have 10 ratings, so your children will be well-educated in an area where all your neighbors and friends also send their children to the public schools.

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/5105-Club-Ridge-Dr-W-Vestavia-AL-35242/974256_zpid/

Tuition in-state at the University of Alabama is $4,800/semester for a full-time undergraduate student. And since your kids plan to go there they can somewhat enjoy their high school years, without constantly worrying about the grades and extracurriculars needed for the Ivy League -- like everyone's children around here stress over.

Yes, there are federal jobs to be had in that part of Alabama, and private sector ones also. If you continue to earn between $350-400K there, you will not only feel rich -- you will be rich as well. But as the cost of living is so much lower in every respect (including state income taxes), you can afford to have a stay-at-home parent, or to take new jobs that only pay you between $250-300K.

That is one option for everyone feeling bad about their income in this area, the other is to realize that you live here because you love all that the region has to offer, and that you are willing to pay for the high-quality of cultural, intellectual, international, and cosmopolitan life. It is a trade off for sure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think the real difference is retirement/college savings.

You $400k people feel poor AFTER you put all the money in savings. But you have fully funded retirement and college funds.

We $150k people just have to admit we won't be able to pay for college or retirement. It is what it is.

YES yes yes. Just admit you can't save the full amount even for in state tuition and a decent retirement with an HHI of 80K.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm 52.

I probably averaged 200 k my entire working life .

Live in an 800k house . Have 3 million net worth.

Totally satisfied financially but I'm kind of a minimalist. I never skimp on eating out or sporting events. Pretty much always vacation at the local beaches.

+1 Its all in retirement accounts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What degree gets you $4k/month in student loans?

DH has loans from an Ivy league masters degree and that's $300/month - he had a scholarship and worked part time, covering about 1/3 of the total cost, but even if he had had loans for 100% of the costs for both years, we still wouldn't be facing $1k/month in student loan debt.

I can't imagine $4k - where is that coming from? You both went to med school fully funded with debt and even lived off debt to pay your rent + undergrad loans?

Many med school grads have more than this a month for a single tuition.


Welcome to the new normal in student loans.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We earn about 350k a year, and I feel completely middle class at this stage of life with 2 young kids in daycare, student loans, retirement college savings, and mortgage. Although our lifestyle is middle class, our savings are not. Between pretax and posttax savings, we probably sock away 90k a year.

+1


Add in Obama stealing our deductions and you have a massive problem with building wealth on your hands.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We earn about 350k a year, and I feel completely middle class at this stage of life with 2 young kids in daycare, student loans, retirement college savings, and mortgage. Although our lifestyle is middle class, our savings are not. Between pretax and posttax savings, we probably sock away 90k a year.

You have $90k in savings a year AFTER two daycares / mortgage / retirement savings / college savings and feel "completely middle class"? I just can't even wrap my head around this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No sympathy. Family of 4 living on $150k. Live below your means until the loans are paid off. You are better off than most people. Stop complaining.

People are not complaining just stating the facts. That it feels like complaint to you is your problem, not theirs.

PP here.

People are stating that they feel middle class even though they can save for college AND retirement, especially if they max out on both. Middle class people cannot max out on both. You all need to check yourselves and what "middle class" means. You are comparing yourselves to people in DMV and you probably live in a wealthy part of town. That is why you feel "middle class". The *fact* is your lives in the wealthy areas are privileged. You spend money on an expensive house, probably have good healthcare, good child care, probably send kids to go schools, go on nice vacations. And then you state you feel middle class because you feel that with such high HHI you should live an even more privileged life. This is complaining.