Triplets in House Fire in Bethesda--Install Fire Detectors

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Actually, unless you've been in an emergency you really can't understand how difficult it can be to think clearly. The nanny saw smoke, not fire, and may have felt that it was something minor. She may have - in an instant - calculated where the bedrooms were and where the smoke was and decided enough distance existed between the two. She could have seen smoke at a previous job/house and it turned out to be nothing, influencing how alarmed she was this time. Let me say, I've been in a house fire (with fire alarms going off, which is also disorienting): you have about five seconds to get it right - your judgement, that is - and no second chances. The only way to know for certain what to do - and what you would do in such a situation - is to practice. But a blind fold over your eyes and a towel over your mouth (literally) and practice getting out. And have absolute rules - when you see any smoke, however minor, tell everyone to get out and meet on the sidewalk, for e.g. But these are lessons learned the hard way. How many of you have such a plan?

Absolutely agree -- You have a very short window in which to make decisions in these situations, and you're in a panic, and one wrong move can lead to tragedy (and also leads to a lot of snarky judgmental comments, apparently).

And the relief fund wesite says: We wanted to extend our heartfelt thanks to the brave firefighters who rescued the triplets including Curtis Warfield Jr., John Klavon, and Kimonti Oglesby. Thank you, firefighters!

[Anonymous]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/12/08/AR2008120802445.html?hpid=moreheadlines

One of the 2-year-old triplets rescued from a burning Bethesda house last week has improved enough to be upgraded from critical to serious condition, according to the Children's National Medical Center.

Aiden Petrucelli's brothers, Bryson and Coleson, remained in critical but stable condition, a hospital spokeswoman said this afternoon.

The improvement is the first for any of the Petrucelli triplets since they were rescued from an afternoon blaze that destroyed the family house Wednesday.

Firefighters pulled the children from their cribs even as flames threatened to overtake the rescuers. Two firefighters were treated for burns. The children's father, Michael Petrucelli, was also slightly injured during his attempts to reach the toddlers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually, unless you've been in an emergency you really can't understand how difficult it can be to think clearly. The nanny saw smoke, not fire, and may have felt that it was something minor. She may have - in an instant - calculated where the bedrooms were and where the smoke was and decided enough distance existed between the two. She could have seen smoke at a previous job/house and it turned out to be nothing, influencing how alarmed she was this time. Let me say, I've been in a house fire (with fire alarms going off, which is also disorienting): you have about five seconds to get it right - your judgement, that is - and no second chances. The only way to know for certain what to do - and what you would do in such a situation - is to practice. But a blind fold over your eyes and a towel over your mouth (literally) and practice getting out. And have absolute rules - when you see any smoke, however minor, tell everyone to get out and meet on the sidewalk, for e.g. But these are lessons learned the hard way. How many of you have such a plan?

Absolutely agree -- You have a very short window in which to make decisions in these situations, and you're in a panic, and one wrong move can lead to tragedy (and also leads to a lot of snarky judgmental comments, apparently).

And the relief fund wesite says: We wanted to extend our heartfelt thanks to the brave firefighters who rescued the triplets including Curtis Warfield Jr., John Klavon, and Kimonti Oglesby. Thank you, firefighters!

Seriously??? I'm sorry, but as a mother of two kids under 3, there is absolutely NO WAY my first reaction if I am told my home is on fire is not to get my kids out of the house. I don't need to have been in a fire to know this. Call me snarky all you want, but that doesn't change the fact that (1) 911 was not called for - what? - 15+ minutes after the nanny alerted the father to the fire and (2) that neither of them got the kids out first and foremost.

I'm not saying I don't feel bad for the family - I really do. But I can't believe some of you that think this was just some kind of innocent mistake. It was a HORRIBLE judgment call that almost cost the life of 3 young children and injured some very brave firefighters. Yes, I am being judgmental but it isn't meant to be mean-spirited. It really is meant as part of a discussion of what NOT to do if you are in this situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Seriously??? I'm sorry, but as a mother of two kids under 3, there is absolutely NO WAY my first reaction if I am told my home is on fire is not to get my kids out of the house. I don't need to have been in a fire to know this. Call me snarky all you want, but that doesn't change the fact that (1) 911 was not called for - what? - 15+ minutes after the nanny alerted the father to the fire and (2) that neither of them got the kids out first and foremost.

I'm not saying I don't feel bad for the family - I really do. But I can't believe some of you that think this was just some kind of innocent mistake. It was a HORRIBLE judgment call that almost cost the life of 3 young children and injured some very brave firefighters. Yes, I am being judgmental but it isn't meant to be mean-spirited. It really is meant as part of a discussion of what NOT to do if you are in this situation.

I agree that it's a horrible judgment call, but I also think that it can be particularly difficult to make good judgment calls in crises. That's why the PP's suggestion that people practice evacuating their houses is a good one. I don't want to pass judgment on the family when I'm sure the dad is already feeling terrible - and probably responsible and guilty to boot - and I can't really make any promises about what I would do when faced with a similar situation. I sure don't think that my first instinct would be anything other than getting my children out of the house, but who knows? In some circumstances I'm sure I'd try to put out the fire first, too, depending on the specific circumstances.

The benefit of 20/20 hindsight in this situation is that we're reminded to think about these things -- come up with a plan, make sure smoke detectors are working, etc. A lot of things went wrong here and I just don't see where blame gets any of us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The fire was noticed before a smoke detector would have activated. Dad was inside the house when he was alerted to the fire.

Smoke detectors are pretty damn sensitive. I do not think anyone can say with 100% certainty if it would have gone off. If the kitchen or family room backed up to the porch and there had been detectors they would have gone off.

You are incorrect.

Source?

My source is being blessed with common sense. However, if you insist on something you can watch someone tell you, etc...I encourage you to check out Channel 9's extensive coverage of this event, to include a report on smoke detectors. Dad was in an office across the hall from the nursery when he was alerted to the fire by the nanny. There was so much smoke in the house at this time (not), that he thought she meant that the neighbor's house was on fire. Again, the fire started on the exterior of the house. It took a while for the fire to enter the house...and AGAIN, the fire was noticed before then. Smoke detectors alert people to fires. In this case, Dad was actually alerted before a smoke detector would have alerted him. His mistake was not getting the kids out immediately after he realized his own house was on fire, and trying to fight the fire himself instead of going back in the house immediately. People (not just you) on this thread are concentrating on the wrong thing, the smoke detectors, in their rush to judge and blame. That's unfortunate.

Ummm. Actually smoke detectors do not alert people to fires. Smoke detectors alert people to unusual levels of particulate matter in the air. Our smoke alarm near the bathroom goes off if there is excessive steam in the air outside the bathroom (like after a long steamy shower). Our smoke detector goes off when I use the oven cleaning function (which burns oven matter but doesn't cause either fire or smoke). It also goes off when I burn dinner (but w/o fire). Our fire detector often goes off when none of these things even makes anything more than a peculiar odor, i.e. it goes off when there is no discernable smoke in the air.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The fire was noticed before a smoke detector would have activated. Dad was inside the house when he was alerted to the fire.

Smoke detectors are pretty damn sensitive. I do not think anyone can say with 100% certainty if it would have gone off. If the kitchen or family room backed up to the porch and there had been detectors they would have gone off.

You are incorrect.

Source?

My source is being blessed with common sense. However, if you insist on something you can watch someone tell you, etc...I encourage you to check out Channel 9's extensive coverage of this event, to include a report on smoke detectors. Dad was in an office across the hall from the nursery when he was alerted to the fire by the nanny. There was so much smoke in the house at this time (not), that he thought she meant that the neighbor's house was on fire. Again, the fire started on the exterior of the house. It took a while for the fire to enter the house...and AGAIN, the fire was noticed before then. Smoke detectors alert people to fires. In this case, Dad was actually alerted before a smoke detector would have alerted him. His mistake was not getting the kids out immediately after he realized his own house was on fire, and trying to fight the fire himself instead of going back in the house immediately. People (not just you) on this thread are concentrating on the wrong thing, the smoke detectors, in their rush to judge and blame. That's unfortunate.

Ummm. Actually smoke detectors do not alert people to fires. Smoke detectors alert people to unusual levels of particulate matter in the air. Our smoke alarm near the bathroom goes off if there is excessive steam in the air outside the bathroom (like after a long steamy shower). Our smoke detector goes off when I use the oven cleaning function (which burns oven matter but doesn't cause either fire or smoke). It also goes off when I burn dinner (but w/o fire). Our fire detector often goes off when none of these things even makes anything more than a peculiar odor, i.e. it goes off when there is no discernable smoke in the air.

My response to this is that you should really get an expert to come to your house and install some new smoke detectors. Your are either installed in the wrong places or are not functioning properly.

You certainly don't want to get into a "never cry wolf" situation with your smoke detectors! If you don't trust that they are actually detecting smoke, and are functioning properly, they are really useless to you.

Please, people, monitor, install and check your smoke detectors. Especially outside of the baby's room. It is too important to not trust them or to not have them at all.

[Anonymous]

Some of you people are just plain mean.

Until I fully read the article, I too thought that there were no smoke detectors but the article says there there were detectors but they were being upgraded. Basically, this happened at a bad time, when the old detectors were down and the new ones were not up yet. It's not like these people just didn't have them. It is like when they were all taken down when our interior of our house was painted last year and then reinstalled.

Someone I know knows this family well and because of the bad timing where the new detectors were not up yet they might not be covered by insurance. Hence the fund.

So stop being mean, pray for the kids and recognize the hell that those parents are going through. I hope none of you ever have to go through this type of situation. They don't need your guilt or judgement.

If you want to give to the fund...that would be nice. If you don't agree with it keep your comments to yourself and pray for the family and the firefighters. It is a better use of time and energy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you want to give to the fund...that would be nice. If you don't agree with it keep your comments to yourself and pray for the family and the firefighters. It is a better use of time and energy.

This is a public, online forum. The entire point of this website is to comment on things, including horrible things like this that occur. Please get off your high horse. Not all "judgmental" comments are worthless and even if they are, who cares? Ignore them! But suggesting that we should not comment simply b/c we disagree with you is ridiculous.

[Anonymous]

It seems rather ironic that people are told not to criticize because, after all, the lack of smoke detectors was only temporary but, at the same time, the insureance company is reportedly refusing to pay because they (temporarily) had no smoke detectors. If the insurance company thinks this negates their coverage, can't the rest of world make note of the mistake?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some of you people are just plain mean.

Until I fully read the article, I too thought that there were no smoke detectors but the article says there there were detectors but they were being upgraded. Basically, this happened at a bad time, when the old detectors were down and the new ones were not up yet. It's not like these people just didn't have them. It is like when they were all taken down when our interior of our house was painted last year and then reinstalled.

Someone I know knows this family well and because of the bad timing where the new detectors were not up yet they might not be covered by insurance. Hence the fund.

So stop being mean, pray for the kids and recognize the hell that those parents are going through. I hope none of you ever have to go through this type of situation. They don't need your guilt or judgement.

If you want to give to the fund...that would be nice. If you don't agree with it keep your comments to yourself and pray for the family and the firefighters. It is a better use of time and energy.

Just curious...if they are covered by insurance, which they might be, will they refund people's contributions to the fund? If what you say is true, then that would only make sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It seems rather ironic that people are told not to criticize because, after all, the lack of smoke detectors was only temporary but, at the same time, the insureance company is reportedly refusing to pay because they (temporarily) had no smoke detectors. If the insurance company thinks this negates their coverage, can't the rest of world make note of the mistake?

Absolutely-insurance companies are very fair and all about handing out compensation without much investigation or regret-I'm going to start making all my judgements based on what the insurance company would do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Please don't lose sight of the point of this post:

1. Please react responsibly and always put people before things in a fire situation (get people out, do not fight the fire yourself).

2. Maintain and check fire alarms in your home, especially outside of bedrooms.

3. Make a fire escape plan and think it through or practice.

That is really all that is relevant. Learn from others mistakes or misfortune, but don't waste energy or karma blaming anyone.

I nominate this for best post of this entire thread-succinct, non-judgemental, informative and short-I asked my sister this weekend(who is very level headed, safety oriented and is a wonderful mommy to my nephew) if they had a safety plan or route in case of an emergency and she wasn't even sure what I was talking about. It's the holidays-let's keep our loved ones close, refrain from negativity and above all stop hating!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The fire was noticed before a smoke detector would have activated. Dad was inside the house when he was alerted to the fire.

Smoke detectors are pretty damn sensitive. I do not think anyone can say with 100% certainty if it would have gone off. If the kitchen or family room backed up to the porch and there had been detectors they would have gone off.

You are incorrect.

Source?

My source is being blessed with common sense. However, if you insist on something you can watch someone tell you, etc...I encourage you to check out Channel 9's extensive coverage of this event, to include a report on smoke detectors. Dad was in an office across the hall from the nursery when he was alerted to the fire by the nanny. There was so much smoke in the house at this time (not), that he thought she meant that the neighbor's house was on fire. Again, the fire started on the exterior of the house. It took a while for the fire to enter the house...and AGAIN, the fire was noticed before then. Smoke detectors alert people to fires. In this case, Dad was actually alerted before a smoke detector would have alerted him. His mistake was not getting the kids out immediately after he realized his own house was on fire, and trying to fight the fire himself instead of going back in the house immediately. People (not just you) on this thread are concentrating on the wrong thing, the smoke detectors, in their rush to judge and blame. That's unfortunate.

Ummm. Actually smoke detectors do not alert people to fires. Smoke detectors alert people to unusual levels of particulate matter in the air. Our smoke alarm near the bathroom goes off if there is excessive steam in the air outside the bathroom (like after a long steamy shower). Our smoke detector goes off when I use the oven cleaning function (which burns oven matter but doesn't cause either fire or smoke). It also goes off when I burn dinner (but w/o fire). Our fire detector often goes off when none of these things even makes anything more than a peculiar odor, i.e. it goes off when there is no discernable smoke in the air.

My response to this is that you should really get an expert to come to your house and install some new smoke detectors. Your are either installed in the wrong places or are not functioning properly.

You certainly don't want to get into a "never cry wolf" situation with your smoke detectors! If you don't trust that they are actually detecting smoke, and are functioning properly, they are really useless to you.

Please, people, monitor, install and check your smoke detectors. Especially outside of the baby's room. It is too important to not trust them or to not have them at all.

Uhh, sorry, I am the poster to which you are responding. I did get an expert to check them - -my longtime firefighter brother. His response was that the fire/smoke alarm works great -- it rings because it's keying into particulate in the air, exactly what it should do. They are placed correctly. They should be sensitive and you should check them out EVERY time they go off. An alarm should never be ignored. There is another alarm in the house that doesn't go off as frequently, and he actually suggested that that alarm was the malfunctioning one and that I should vacuum it out as the detectors sometimes get blocked by household particulate.

He explained very carefully to me that every alarm should be taken seriously and that if I ever get an alarm sound to which I can't immediately attach a non-fire oriented explanation, I am to get everyone outside the house and figure it out from there.

He also advised that our entire family and any babysitters discuss, post and practice a fire drill and what to do. It's especially important for non-native English speakers or babysitters from other countries to know how to call 911 and what they will be asked and what will happen and that they will never get in trouble for calling 911 and having it turn out not to be an emergency.

Believe me, my brother would rather be called out for nothing than for an emergency.

[Anonymous]

Thank you PP - we do fire drills in my house too.

Here's the official DC emergency guide for families in case anyone is interested:

http://www.dcema.dc.gov/dcema/lib/dcema/gfp_0817a.pdf

[Anonymous]

Hi, I want to mention that in the fall, many area fire stations have open houses which young kids LOVE!

If you go to an open house look for the mobile home trailer. This is a great experience for little kids. Inside you will get fire prevention tips in the home and in the last room, kids learn how to check a door and experience smoke and learn not to hide from firefighters and practice crawling out of the room.

Of course, this wouldn't have helped the triplets, but practice and explicit discussion is important from about age 3 I would say.