Klonopin is a heck of a drug

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Different psychiatrist here. Agree benzos have their place and can be tremendously helpful, but there are very few cases where daily use is warranted. I have had a much easier time tapering off daily benzos (for inherited patients either from elderly psychiatrists or undertrained, overaggressive nurse practitioners) than tapering off daily THC in any form. When I see a new patient who is smoking weed or using gummies daily, I know from experience there's almost nothing I can do to help them with their problems until they stop using, and even if they want to (which is rare), there just aren't any resources out there to help them stop, and it's so hard. The few who do eventually stop do much better.

Question on the benzos … I lurk on various psychiatry blogs and podcasts, and I hear one psychiatrist say that in very, very rare case that a person actually needs benzos for extreme GAD, that it should be a daily dose and not PRN. What’s your opinion on that? It kind of makes sense to me because in that case the goal is to reduce anxiety on an overall basis, not treat panic attacks. This Dr was pretty clear that this was a very rare case.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Different psychiatrist here. Agree benzos have their place and can be tremendously helpful, but there are very few cases where daily use is warranted. I have had a much easier time tapering off daily benzos (for inherited patients either from elderly psychiatrists or undertrained, overaggressive nurse practitioners) than tapering off daily THC in any form. When I see a new patient who is smoking weed or using gummies daily, I know from experience there's almost nothing I can do to help them with their problems until they stop using, and even if they want to (which is rare), there just aren't any resources out there to help them stop, and it's so hard. The few who do eventually stop do much better.

Interesting. Is that because of psychological addiction to THC?

In before the MJ defenders arrive: Marijuana is not addictive. Even if it is, plenty of CEOs that I know personally use marijuana daily without any issues.

Yes it is addictive. Just because it doesn’t have the same physically addictive properties of a benzo or opiate doesn’t mean it is not addictive. And of course just because some can use in moderation does not mean it is not addictive for others.

https://www.cdc.gov/cannabis/health-effects/cannabis-use-disorder.html

[Anonymous]

When you’re taking Klonopin for anxiety, it doesn’t get you high. It brings you back down to “normal”. Don’t confuse medical usage with recreational drug abuse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When you’re taking Klonopin for anxiety, it doesn’t get you high. It brings you back down to “normal”. Don’t confuse medical usage with recreational drug abuse.

That doesn’t change any of the issues with addiction. It also interferes with therapy for anxiety. It’s a really harmful crutch if used to treat anxiety.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When you’re taking Klonopin for anxiety, it doesn’t get you high. It brings you back down to “normal”. Don’t confuse medical usage with recreational drug abuse.

That doesn’t change any of the issues with addiction. It also interferes with therapy for anxiety. It’s a really harmful crutch if used to treat anxiety.

Repeating this nonsense won't magically make it come true the more you say it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When you’re taking Klonopin for anxiety, it doesn’t get you high. It brings you back down to “normal”. Don’t confuse medical usage with recreational drug abuse.

That doesn’t change any of the issues with addiction. It also interferes with therapy for anxiety. It’s a really harmful crutch if used to treat anxiety.

Have you ever been prescribed Klonopin?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When you’re taking Klonopin for anxiety, it doesn’t get you high. It brings you back down to “normal”. Don’t confuse medical usage with recreational drug abuse.

That doesn’t change any of the issues with addiction. It also interferes with therapy for anxiety. It’s a really harmful crutch if used to treat anxiety.

Repeating this nonsense won't magically make it come true the more you say it.

This isn’t nonsense - it is literally the consensus of the field of psychiatry.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Different psychiatrist here. Agree benzos have their place and can be tremendously helpful, but there are very few cases where daily use is warranted. I have had a much easier time tapering off daily benzos (for inherited patients either from elderly psychiatrists or undertrained, overaggressive nurse practitioners) than tapering off daily THC in any form. When I see a new patient who is smoking weed or using gummies daily, I know from experience there's almost nothing I can do to help them with their problems until they stop using, and even if they want to (which is rare), there just aren't any resources out there to help them stop, and it's so hard. The few who do eventually stop do much better.

Your patients need to you to have this: https://marijuana-anonymous.org/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When you’re taking Klonopin for anxiety, it doesn’t get you high. It brings you back down to “normal”. Don’t confuse medical usage with recreational drug abuse.

That doesn’t change any of the issues with addiction. It also interferes with therapy for anxiety. It’s a really harmful crutch if used to treat anxiety.

Repeating this nonsense won't magically make it come true the more you say it.

This isn’t nonsense - it is literally the consensus of the field of psychiatry.

It most certainly isn't. Stop spreading lies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Different psychiatrist here. Agree benzos have their place and can be tremendously helpful, but there are very few cases where daily use is warranted. I have had a much easier time tapering off daily benzos (for inherited patients either from elderly psychiatrists or undertrained, overaggressive nurse practitioners) than tapering off daily THC in any form. When I see a new patient who is smoking weed or using gummies daily, I know from experience there's almost nothing I can do to help them with their problems until they stop using, and even if they want to (which is rare), there just aren't any resources out there to help them stop, and it's so hard. The few who do eventually stop do much better.

Interesting. Is that because of psychological addiction to THC?

In before the MJ defenders arrive: Marijuana is not addictive. Even if it is, plenty of CEOs that I know personally use marijuana daily without any issues.

You're a poorly-informed idiot. Please educate yourself. Like most psychoactive substances, cannabis IS addictive, and the consequences can be significant.

I'm sure all the CEOs you know personally would tell you the same if they ever, you know, stopped using daily, which is when people tend to find out they're addicted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When you’re taking Klonopin for anxiety, it doesn’t get you high. It brings you back down to “normal”. Don’t confuse medical usage with recreational drug abuse.

That doesn’t change any of the issues with addiction. It also interferes with therapy for anxiety. It’s a really harmful crutch if used to treat anxiety.

Repeating this nonsense won't magically make it come true the more you say it.

This isn’t nonsense - it is literally the consensus of the field of psychiatry.

It most certainly isn't. Stop spreading lies.

What exactly is the lie?

[Anonymous]

I’ve used klonapin (.5) successfully in times of anxiety. I have rx ex for 20 a month and rarely use them all. I have an addictive personality but have never been tempted to misuse them as they make me a bit tired (and less anxious) so as a naturally active person they aren’t even tempting to use “for fun”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Different psychiatrist here. Agree benzos have their place and can be tremendously helpful, but there are very few cases where daily use is warranted. I have had a much easier time tapering off daily benzos (for inherited patients either from elderly psychiatrists or undertrained, overaggressive nurse practitioners) than tapering off daily THC in any form. When I see a new patient who is smoking weed or using gummies daily, I know from experience there's almost nothing I can do to help them with their problems until they stop using, and even if they want to (which is rare), there just aren't any resources out there to help them stop, and it's so hard. The few who do eventually stop do much better.

Question on the benzos … I lurk on various psychiatry blogs and podcasts, and I hear one psychiatrist say that in very, very rare case that a person actually needs benzos for extreme GAD, that it should be a daily dose and not PRN. What’s your opinion on that? It kind of makes sense to me because in that case the goal is to reduce anxiety on an overall basis, not treat panic attacks. This Dr was pretty clear that this was a very rare case.

Yes, I have seen a few cases over the years; not many that I couldn’t address well enough by other means though. Beyond the dependence/withdrawal issues, daily benzos tend to lose efficacy over time and then they are back where they started, so I try to avoid this (note this is a totally different situation than sporadic use, or daily use for a few weeks for an acute crisis). They do work very very well when they’re used appropriately, though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Different psychiatrist here. Agree benzos have their place and can be tremendously helpful, but there are very few cases where daily use is warranted. I have had a much easier time tapering off daily benzos (for inherited patients either from elderly psychiatrists or undertrained, overaggressive nurse practitioners) than tapering off daily THC in any form. When I see a new patient who is smoking weed or using gummies daily, I know from experience there's almost nothing I can do to help them with their problems until they stop using, and even if they want to (which is rare), there just aren't any resources out there to help them stop, and it's so hard. The few who do eventually stop do much better.

Question on the benzos … I lurk on various psychiatry blogs and podcasts, and I hear one psychiatrist say that in very, very rare case that a person actually needs benzos for extreme GAD, that it should be a daily dose and not PRN. What’s your opinion on that? It kind of makes sense to me because in that case the goal is to reduce anxiety on an overall basis, not treat panic attacks. This Dr was pretty clear that this was a very rare case.

My elderly shrink had me on a daily dose of benzos for years and years. I became physically habituated to it. I am tapering off, nearly done. You have to taper after that kind of use. There's a whole thread in Health and Medicine. Or just look here for why daily doses long term are, imo, undesirable. I didn't know.

Benzo withdrawal https://www.uptodate.com/contents/benzodiazepine-withdrawal

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Different psychiatrist here. Agree benzos have their place and can be tremendously helpful, but there are very few cases where daily use is warranted. I have had a much easier time tapering off daily benzos (for inherited patients either from elderly psychiatrists or undertrained, overaggressive nurse practitioners) than tapering off daily THC in any form. When I see a new patient who is smoking weed or using gummies daily, I know from experience there's almost nothing I can do to help them with their problems until they stop using, and even if they want to (which is rare), there just aren't any resources out there to help them stop, and it's so hard. The few who do eventually stop do much better.

Unfortunately, this is not surprising. People who come to see you as daily THC users are seeking dissociation. Psychiatrists—newrly all mental health practitioners, really—are astoundingly bad at identifying dissociation even when it is right in front of them (it is often confused with depression or anhedonia, or with the negative symptoms of psychosis), often do not do the complete trauma histories that would point to it—and when they do recognize it, rarely have the luxury of the time to root out why a person prefers to be dissociated.

It’s good that you recognize your limits.