Do you know a kid who was screwed in the college process in last few years?

[Anonymous]

A lot people lie about their kid’s test scores to other people. Add a point or two to the ACT- 100 points to the SAT or that they were top of class etc

You really don’t know

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This was an EXTRAORDINARILY tough year for:
CS
Math
Engineering
Business


I think in that order.

People say this every year.

Nope. Different this year - and schools are pivoting away from their admits. Interesting how much higher math has gotten in the pecking order too. Get off of here and onto the anon forums with the AOs. They'll break it down for you.

Where are these forum?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm on a FB college parents group (with some college counselors) and this is the #1 thing parents have been posting about for weeks.

What is the #1 thing? There is no quote?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm on a FB college parents group (with some college counselors) and this is the #1 thing parents have been posting about for weeks.

Figures.

Parents STILL obsessing over the top schools their kid got rejected from/waitlisted at.

Time to move on...

[Anonymous]

No.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:our top kid this year is going to Bocconi. But he applied to Harvard and Yale and Bocconi only .. so this was his own choice. He feels screwed -- but he's that kinda guy.

Weird.

So he's going to one of the best business schools in the world and he was screwed?

[Anonymous]

I think anyone who’s in any kind of environment where selective college admissions is a priority has a story of someone who was “screwed” in college admissions. There were similar stories 30 years ago, but back then, it was the valedictorian who didn’t get into Princeton, but got into some other T-5 or gasp, ended up at Michigan or Northwestern. Now it’s about the the valedictorian who was shut out of the T-25.

[Anonymous]

A lot of kids who think they were screwed are rejected based on intangibles. There are countless international kids (particularly Asian) who either refuse to assimilate or do so really poorly. American colleges do not want to have half their student population be poorly assimilated foreign kids.

I'm not saying this to be a jerk. It's true. Jews were discriminated against and did a better job of assimilating - not perfect, but much better. Many Asians do, but not nearly enough.

Obviously the world would be boring if everyone was the same, but if you are going to go to school in America, best to understand common norms of behavior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think anyone who’s in any kind of environment where selective college admissions is a priority has a story of someone who was “screwed” in college admissions. There were similar stories 30 years ago, but back then, it was the valedictorian who didn’t get into Princeton, but got into some other T-5 or gasp, ended up at Michigan or Northwestern. Now it’s about the the valedictorian who was shut out of the T-25.

This is very true. Especially how the goalposts have moved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:25% of Asian kids score 1400+ on the SAT.

Only 4% of White and 1% of Hispanic and Black kids do.

Asians are underrepresented at elite schools given their high grades and board scores.

But a lot of them get those scores because they go to cram schools. They're not naturally smarter or anything. And the problem with this framing is your premise is these scores are the primary criterion elite schools value -- or should value. They're not. And shouldn't be.

As it is, Asian kids are WOEFULLY overrepresented and we really should cut back on them.

Asians may be overrepresented relative to their overall percentage in the school going population, but underrepresented relative to their credentials and accomplishments. Both can be true.

This. Exactly.

So, they are using their analytical abilities to look beyond the college name and going for - in-demand hard STEM majors where there is a high barrier to entry, saving their education dollars, building wealth and network, as well as having profession adjacent gigs and startup ideas.

You are basically arguing that computer science skills are more worthy than great writers or great dancers or great linguists and so on. You need to find a place at a school that agrees with that. If you are trying to get a place at a school that also values scientific research skills, then you might get beat out by a science researcher. What the student brings to the table needs to align with what the school wants on the table.

No. I am not arguing that at all. What I am saying and seeing is that these Asian superstars are often times studying a STEM major and a Humanities major. So, really, they are all-rounders. Good communicators, able to see the big picture, good debaters etc. Most of them are polygots- knowing multiple languages. In addition to all of this - they are dancers, painters, singers, photographers, and accompalished musicians too. It is the culture of being all-rounders and excelling in everything. So, it becomes immaterial if Ivies don't take them. They are increasing the profile of the regular state colleges. In schools like UMD, it is extremely hard for average kids to get into the high demand classes or even compete with the cohort.

Ok. So they're not screwed. I thought this thread was about students feeling they were screwed over by getting a spot at UMD. Umd is a very fine institution with competitive admissions and offers significant opportunities to its graduates . I am not of the opinion that anyone is screwed over by going there but that was the topic of this thread.

No. I believe that Asian students have changed the rhetoric now. The tippy-top students are being rejected for being Asians (yes, I understand that colleges want diversity and not merit) and they are going to state flagships instead. So, now, because the influx of these academic superstars, state colleges are doing very well and rising in ranking. The only downside I can see is the average student in-state may find it extremely hard to get into these programs because the academic stats and ECs are so high.

Having super hardworking Asians in this country is a boon for this country and for our educational institutions. It is keeping US competitive. And no, intelligence does not have a racial component. Individuals can be geniuses and every child can be educated to reach their best.

You seem to be myopically focused on what you call academic super stardom. That simply is not enough at some of these top schools. Almost all the students at top colleges are overall academic superstars. So many of the students at these places have an additional very developed specific talent.

Every department at the school is fighting to get students in there that they want in their programs. Nobody is fighting for an overall well-rounded high-level academic student. The math department want s. High-level math majors. The arts department s want accomplished people in their discipline. The diving coach wants an Olympic diver. That coach does not care if the diver is Asian or white or black or green. They want the best diver they can get.

If they're admitting a class of a thousand, you are not competing against every kid that's applying to the school. You are competing against the other students with your specific talent for the most part.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I had a friend who was screwed (likely because she is Asian). She ended at becoming a doctor and is now CMO at a health care company. Super successful - no long term damage!

A friend told her daughter that the next time she applies to college, she should be less female and less Asian. They have a healthy sense of humor! Girl went on to beat out a slew of kids from T10 schools in competition for not one but two of the most coveted graduate school scholarships on the planet. She was just better, but not never got bitter. Amazing young woman, now. Very successful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had a friend who was screwed (likely because she is Asian). She ended at becoming a doctor and is now CMO at a health care company. Super successful - no long term damage!

A friend told her daughter that the next time she applies to college, she should be less female and less Asian. They have a healthy sense of humor! Girl went on to beat out a slew of kids from T10 schools in competition for not one but two of the most coveted graduate school scholarships on the planet. She was just better, but not never got bitter. Amazing young woman, now. Very successful.

Lots of Asian students get into t10 schools and lots of Asian students do not gain admittance and so what? They go to another very good school and apparently many achieve great success. So nobody is screwed over.

This country graduates 28 000 students every year from medical school and obviously most of them did not go to t10 colleges undergrad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Immediately after Floyd’s murder many schools increased their diversity efforts. That combined with the sudden test optional/blind practices (mostly due to Covid but also partly because of diversity pushes) created some new obstacles for the unhooked but academically strong. That period contributed to the anti DEI sentiment of today.

With many things, when the pendulum swings too far one way, it often overcorrects in the other.

Admissions were particularly brutal for the HS class of ‘21, since there were fewer slots following many deferred admissions from the year before, due to Covid.

Class of 2021 had it the worst bc it was such a shock. Plenty of top kids missed out on their top choices and ended up at decent, but not super selective schools. Classes of 2022 and 2023 knew it was going to be rough so were mostly able to readjust expectations. By 2024, things seemed to have leveled off and maybe improved for applicants.

For all his faults, Trump is attaching a cost to that sort of bull shit. Now colleges and universities have not of an incentive to focus on merit rather than "representation"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Immediately after Floyd’s murder many schools increased their diversity efforts. That combined with the sudden test optional/blind practices (mostly due to Covid but also partly because of diversity pushes) created some new obstacles for the unhooked but academically strong. That period contributed to the anti DEI sentiment of today.

With many things, when the pendulum swings too far one way, it often overcorrects in the other.

Admissions were particularly brutal for the HS class of ‘21, since there were fewer slots following many deferred admissions from the year before, due to Covid.

Rephrasing: after George Floyd's murder, white people suddenly realized the continuing disadvantages of racism. Some institutions made attempts to make things more fair by removing some of the advantages white students had received for generations.

Rephrasing: after George Floyd's murder, liberal white guilt went through the roof so they tried to assuage their white guilt by discriminating against asian students and in favor of mostly white and hispanic students and a few black students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is all relative. A kid can is screwed if someone with lower stats gets accepted and you don't. But is has be significantly lower stats.

When I hear about such cases, I am always skeptical that the person who got "screwed" actually knows the other kid's stats, and it is impossible that they know all the information about the other kid that caused the admissions committee to accept that kid and reject the other kid.

You didn't get screwed just because the college didn't take all 60,000 applications, rank them in order of GPA and test scores, and then offer admission to the top 10,000 applications without looking at anything else.

Yes but if a 36/1580, valedictorian, class president and varsity capt of championship sports team with maybe something else (national award in major related activity) doesn't get in, but others with demonstrably lower stats (per teachers) are getting in, that kid was screwed.

absolutely.
and yes, its part of life and it happens. but yes, it was being screwed.

That is ridiculous. There are more kids like that than spots every year. I think there are something like 30,000 high school valedictorians alone every single year.

DP
And there's something like 100 of those valedictorians with the 1580+ SAT score and captain of a championship team.