Should DC submit 1500 score to Duke?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

Yes. And with no hesitation. The schools average is based on self selecting applicants. All of whom are reaching for a top school. Many of whom have been snookered into not submitting great scores.

Nationally (and internationally) a 1500 is a fantastic score. With 1.5m in the proband you know your percentile really means something. No one gets to opt out of being counted nationally.

1500 is a very good score nationally. But it's NOT a good score for Duke. It's a score that is significantly below Duke's average of scores submitted by enrolled students. Back in the old days, that would have been OK, as everyone had to submit a score and 1500 isn't a horribly bad score. But today, Duke doesn't have to take kids with lower than average scores. This kid might still be admitted DESPITE the 1500, but there's no good argument that the score will help her.

We're in the last years of the SAT, that's for certain. And you'll help your child most by being logical in how you play this game. And for here, Duke doesn't want that 1500 in its mix, if it can avoid it.

It’s certain, y’all. We have someone with a crystal ball up in here!

Gonna be fascinating to see the looks on the faces of the “my kid just doesn’t test well” crowd when the UC system reinstates standardized testing and the rest of the country slowly awakens to how relevant testing is to the admissions process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You spend your money to hire a college counselor to get your kid into college and don’t even listen to them?

You do not hire a college counselor to get your kid into college. You hire to help with the process. You take theri advice the same you would any outside expert you hire. Follow unless it does not make sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

Yes. And with no hesitation. The schools average is based on self selecting applicants. All of whom are reaching for a top school. Many of whom have been snookered into not submitting great scores.

Nationally (and internationally) a 1500 is a fantastic score. With 1.5m in the proband you know your percentile really means something. No one gets to opt out of being counted nationally.

1500 is a very good score nationally. But it's NOT a good score for Duke. It's a score that is significantly below Duke's average of scores submitted by enrolled students. Back in the old days, that would have been OK, as everyone had to submit a score and 1500 isn't a horribly bad score. But today, Duke doesn't have to take kids with lower than average scores. This kid might still be admitted DESPITE the 1500, but there's no good argument that the score will help her.

We're in the last years of the SAT, that's for certain. And you'll help your child most by being logical in how you play this game. And for here, Duke doesn't want that 1500 in its mix, if it can avoid it.

It’s certain, y’all. We have someone with a crystal ball up in here!

Gonna be fascinating to see the looks on the faces of the “my kid just doesn’t test well” crowd when the UC system reinstates standardized testing and the rest of the country slowly awakens to how relevant testing is to the admissions process.

You are so out of touch.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:System is getting more and more fukced up

Yes, including rich people buying college counselors.

Not sure what you mean by this. A college counselor is like hiring a lawyer for legal stuff or a doctor for medical stuff. You can't buy one. They do not help you get into college. What they can do is make your bright spots shine and your crap look less crappy. Most kids don't need but it certainly help some.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

Yes. And with no hesitation. The schools average is based on self selecting applicants. All of whom are reaching for a top school. Many of whom have been snookered into not submitting great scores.

Nationally (and internationally) a 1500 is a fantastic score. With 1.5m in the proband you know your percentile really means something. No one gets to opt out of being counted nationally.

1500 is a very good score nationally. But it's NOT a good score for Duke. It's a score that is significantly below Duke's average of scores submitted by enrolled students. Back in the old days, that would have been OK, as everyone had to submit a score and 1500 isn't a horribly bad score. But today, Duke doesn't have to take kids with lower than average scores. This kid might still be admitted DESPITE the 1500, but there's no good argument that the score will help her.

We're in the last years of the SAT, that's for certain. And you'll help your child most by being logical in how you play this game. And for here, Duke doesn't want that 1500 in its mix, if it can avoid it.

It’s certain, y’all. We have someone with a crystal ball up in here!

Gonna be fascinating to see the looks on the faces of the “my kid just doesn’t test well” crowd when the UC system reinstates standardized testing and the rest of the country slowly awakens to how relevant testing is to the admissions process.

You are so out of touch.

PP sounds nuts but requiring tests is oming back for some - never all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

NP: First, even with TO, it's not a mediocre score. Duke knows that a kid with a 1500 will thrive. Not submitting a 1500 could place the student in the not admissible pile if rigor or the GPA is questioned (e.g., grade inflation or lower than the average).

If Duke wanted to admit the OP's child, a 1500 doesn't necessarily bring down the average. You assume that everyone accepted yields. A student with a 1500 may yield because that is their highest rank acceptance, and a person with a 1550 may not yield because they were accepted at HYPSM or couldn't afford tuition.

You also should consider how AO's shape classes. After identifying the admissible students and institutional priorities, AO's can shape the class via statistical modeling and/or advanced algorithms to predict the desired GPA and test score averages, gender, etc. The class averages/demographics can be tweaked, for example, by increasing or decreasing the number of students accepted TO and/or increasing the number of students with scores >1550.

--R1 college professor/chair

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

Yes. And with no hesitation. The schools average is based on self selecting applicants. All of whom are reaching for a top school. Many of whom have been snookered into not submitting great scores.

Nationally (and internationally) a 1500 is a fantastic score. With 1.5m in the proband you know your percentile really means something. No one gets to opt out of being counted nationally.

1500 is a very good score nationally. But it's NOT a good score for Duke. It's a score that is significantly below Duke's average of scores submitted by enrolled students. Back in the old days, that would have been OK, as everyone had to submit a score and 1500 isn't a horribly bad score. But today, Duke doesn't have to take kids with lower than average scores. This kid might still be admitted DESPITE the 1500, but there's no good argument that the score will help her.

We're in the last years of the SAT, that's for certain. And you'll help your child most by being logical in how you play this game. And for here, Duke doesn't want that 1500 in its mix, if it can avoid it.

It’s certain, y’all. We have someone with a crystal ball up in here!

Gonna be fascinating to see the looks on the faces of the “my kid just doesn’t test well” crowd when the UC system reinstates standardized testing and the rest of the country slowly awakens to how relevant testing is to the admissions process.

Not happening.

Standardized testing has become LESS relevant each admissions cycle. Definitely lower stakes.

Don't be naive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

Yes. And with no hesitation. The schools average is based on self selecting applicants. All of whom are reaching for a top school. Many of whom have been snookered into not submitting great scores.

Nationally (and internationally) a 1500 is a fantastic score. With 1.5m in the proband you know your percentile really means something. No one gets to opt out of being counted nationally.

1500 is a very good score nationally. But it's NOT a good score for Duke. It's a score that is significantly below Duke's average of scores submitted by enrolled students. Back in the old days, that would have been OK, as everyone had to submit a score and 1500 isn't a horribly bad score. But today, Duke doesn't have to take kids with lower than average scores. This kid might still be admitted DESPITE the 1500, but there's no good argument that the score will help her.

We're in the last years of the SAT, that's for certain. And you'll help your child most by being logical in how you play this game. And for here, Duke doesn't want that 1500 in its mix, if it can avoid it.

It’s certain, y’all. We have someone with a crystal ball up in here!

Gonna be fascinating to see the looks on the faces of the “my kid just doesn’t test well” crowd when the UC system reinstates standardized testing and the rest of the country slowly awakens to how relevant testing is to the admissions process.

Not happening.

Standardized testing has become LESS relevant each admissions cycle. Definitely lower stakes.

Don't be naive.

It is the HUBRIS for me. Smart people who believe they are smarter than they actually are never get it. It takes an absolute catastrophe to open their eyes. And, in the meantime, they're out here giving "sage advice."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

NP: First, even with TO, it's not a mediocre score. Duke knows that a kid with a 1500 will thrive. Not submitting a 1500 could place the student in the not admissible pile if rigor or the GPA is questioned (e.g., grade inflation or lower than the average).

If Duke wanted to admit the OP's child, a 1500 doesn't necessarily bring down the average. You assume that everyone accepted yields. A student with a 1500 may yield because that is their highest rank acceptance, and a person with a 1550 may not yield because they were accepted at HYPSM or couldn't afford tuition.

You also should consider how AO's shape classes. After identifying the admissible students and institutional priorities, AO's can shape the class via statistical modeling and/or advanced algorithms to predict the desired GPA and test score averages, gender, etc. The class averages/demographics can be tweaked, for example, by increasing or decreasing the number of students accepted TO and/or increasing the number of students with scores >1550.

--R1 college professor/chair

Fascinating. Tell us more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

NP: First, even with TO, it's not a mediocre score. Duke knows that a kid with a 1500 will thrive. Not submitting a 1500 could place the student in the not admissible pile if rigor or the GPA is questioned (e.g., grade inflation or lower than the average).

If Duke wanted to admit the OP's child, a 1500 doesn't necessarily bring down the average. You assume that everyone accepted yields. A student with a 1500 may yield because that is their highest rank acceptance, and a person with a 1550 may not yield because they were accepted at HYPSM or couldn't afford tuition.

You also should consider how AO's shape classes. After identifying the admissible students and institutional priorities, AO's can shape the class via statistical modeling and/or advanced algorithms to predict the desired GPA and test score averages, gender, etc. The class averages/demographics can be tweaked, for example, by increasing or decreasing the number of students accepted TO and/or increasing the number of students with scores >1550.

--R1 college professor/chair

Haha. Stay in your lane, professor.

I'd love to see the algorithm that rewards applicants with test scores that pull down the class average. Would be time to get a new programmer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

Yes. And with no hesitation. The schools average is based on self selecting applicants. All of whom are reaching for a top school. Many of whom have been snookered into not submitting great scores.

Nationally (and internationally) a 1500 is a fantastic score. With 1.5m in the proband you know your percentile really means something. No one gets to opt out of being counted nationally.

1500 is a very good score nationally. But it's NOT a good score for Duke. It's a score that is significantly below Duke's average of scores submitted by enrolled students. Back in the old days, that would have been OK, as everyone had to submit a score and 1500 isn't a horribly bad score. But today, Duke doesn't have to take kids with lower than average scores. This kid might still be admitted DESPITE the 1500, but there's no good argument that the score will help her.

We're in the last years of the SAT, that's for certain. And you'll help your child most by being logical in how you play this game. And for here, Duke doesn't want that 1500 in its mix, if it can avoid it.

It’s certain, y’all. We have someone with a crystal ball up in here!

Gonna be fascinating to see the looks on the faces of the “my kid just doesn’t test well” crowd when the UC system reinstates standardized testing and the rest of the country slowly awakens to how relevant testing is to the admissions process.

You are so out of touch.

PP sounds nuts but requiring tests is oming back for some - never all.

Requiring tests is coming back? Where?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

Yes. And with no hesitation. The schools average is based on self selecting applicants. All of whom are reaching for a top school. Many of whom have been snookered into not submitting great scores.

Nationally (and internationally) a 1500 is a fantastic score. With 1.5m in the proband you know your percentile really means something. No one gets to opt out of being counted nationally.

1500 is a very good score nationally. But it's NOT a good score for Duke. It's a score that is significantly below Duke's average of scores submitted by enrolled students. Back in the old days, that would have been OK, as everyone had to submit a score and 1500 isn't a horribly bad score. But today, Duke doesn't have to take kids with lower than average scores. This kid might still be admitted DESPITE the 1500, but there's no good argument that the score will help her.

We're in the last years of the SAT, that's for certain. And you'll help your child most by being logical in how you play this game. And for here, Duke doesn't want that 1500 in its mix, if it can avoid it.

It’s certain, y’all. We have someone with a crystal ball up in here!

Gonna be fascinating to see the looks on the faces of the “my kid just doesn’t test well” crowd when the UC system reinstates standardized testing and the rest of the country slowly awakens to how relevant testing is to the admissions process.

You are so out of touch.

PP sounds nuts but requiring tests is oming back for some - never all.

Requiring tests is coming back? Where?

DP. Schools requiring tests include MIT and publics in a few states (FL, GA, etc). A recent podcast conversation between Dartmouth and Yale AOs sounded like they'd move toward some sort of test-recommended policy.

[Anonymous]

Kids who "do not test well" turned out to be too dumb to hack it at MIT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

Yes. And with no hesitation. The schools average is based on self selecting applicants. All of whom are reaching for a top school. Many of whom have been snookered into not submitting great scores.

Nationally (and internationally) a 1500 is a fantastic score. With 1.5m in the proband you know your percentile really means something. No one gets to opt out of being counted nationally.

1500 is a very good score nationally. But it's NOT a good score for Duke. It's a score that is significantly below Duke's average of scores submitted by enrolled students. Back in the old days, that would have been OK, as everyone had to submit a score and 1500 isn't a horribly bad score. But today, Duke doesn't have to take kids with lower than average scores. This kid might still be admitted DESPITE the 1500, but there's no good argument that the score will help her.

We're in the last years of the SAT, that's for certain. And you'll help your child most by being logical in how you play this game. And for here, Duke doesn't want that 1500 in its mix, if it can avoid it.

It’s certain, y’all. We have someone with a crystal ball up in here!

Gonna be fascinating to see the looks on the faces of the “my kid just doesn’t test well” crowd when the UC system reinstates standardized testing and the rest of the country slowly awakens to how relevant testing is to the admissions process.

Not happening.

Standardized testing has become LESS relevant each admissions cycle. Definitely lower stakes.

Don't be naive.

It is the HUBRIS for me. Smart people who believe they are smarter than they actually are never get it. It takes an absolute catastrophe to open their eyes. And, in the meantime, they're out here giving "sage advice."

Oh please. If your kid didn’t bomb standardized tests so miserably, you would be out here strutting around and arguing the exact polar opposite of your “forced hand” position now. It’s hilarious. You want to drown out everyone and insist that the practice of placing the entire bet on grade-inflated GPAs is a great idea, and certainly never going to backfire.

Dream on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And the fact that scores are so susceptible to prep makes it more clear you should submit; if the school assumes you prepped and still couldn't get a decent score, that's not a good look.

I don't get you logic. You think it's a better idea to submit a significantly below average score to Duke because you'd worry that, if you don't submit a score, Duke will assume that the student got a significantly below average score. Doesn't make much sense.
And I assume Duke would prefer to not have to put this mediocre score into its average.

Yes. And with no hesitation. The schools average is based on self selecting applicants. All of whom are reaching for a top school. Many of whom have been snookered into not submitting great scores.

Nationally (and internationally) a 1500 is a fantastic score. With 1.5m in the proband you know your percentile really means something. No one gets to opt out of being counted nationally.

1500 is a very good score nationally. But it's NOT a good score for Duke. It's a score that is significantly below Duke's average of scores submitted by enrolled students. Back in the old days, that would have been OK, as everyone had to submit a score and 1500 isn't a horribly bad score. But today, Duke doesn't have to take kids with lower than average scores. This kid might still be admitted DESPITE the 1500, but there's no good argument that the score will help her.

We're in the last years of the SAT, that's for certain. And you'll help your child most by being logical in how you play this game. And for here, Duke doesn't want that 1500 in its mix, if it can avoid it.

It’s certain, y’all. We have someone with a crystal ball up in here!

Gonna be fascinating to see the looks on the faces of the “my kid just doesn’t test well” crowd when the UC system reinstates standardized testing and the rest of the country slowly awakens to how relevant testing is to the admissions process.

You are so out of touch.

PP sounds nuts but requiring tests is oming back for some - never all.

Requiring tests is coming back? Where?

DP. Schools requiring tests include MIT and publics in a few states (FL, GA, etc). A recent podcast conversation between Dartmouth and Yale AOs sounded like they'd move toward some sort of test-recommended policy.

Not really a trend. MIT ended test optional more than a year and a half ago. And the FL system is in the midst of instituting its own "Classic Learning Test" for admissions----basically making sure everyone thinks like Desantis. No thanks.

There is absolutely no way a Yale or Dartmouth ever again requires or recommends tests. The landscape has changed far too much. On top of most CA students no longer taking tests, lots of other kids bagging them, there is the anti-affirmative action decision, which complicates things if a school requires or encourages a test that has been proven to reward tutoring, test prep courses, multiple takes of the test, and other inidicia of wealth. Not happening.