NYU Prof fired because his class was too hard

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The inmates are running the asylum.

This. We’re in a race to the bottom. Shame on the administration.

+1 where is due process? Why not give the Professor a warning or probation period?

How do you know he didn’t get some kind of warning? These complaints had been going on for years, he knew why students were unhappy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Orgo has ALWAYS been a weed out class--from medical school and from chemistry as a major. When I took it, the average was a C.
I don't know the specifics of this guy but it's hardly new for many people to fail organic chemistry.

A “C” is, by definition, average.

would you go to just an "average" doctor?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The inmates are running the asylum.

This. We’re in a race to the bottom. Shame on the administration.

+1 where is due process? Why not give the Professor a warning or probation period?

My guess is that bc he wasn't tenured, NYU wasn't bound by due process and administrative law procedures. I admit I didn't read the full article, though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This isn't surprising at all to me as a STEM HS teacher. We always have students who lack the prereq skills, don't do what they're supposed to do, take classes that are simply too hard for them and then make demands along the lines of "what extra credit do you offer because I need to get my grade to at least a ____". The blank is usually an A or a B, and the student is usually scoring two grades below that.

Or they'll come to you and say "I don't understand what you're teaching/you're going too fast/if you taught it differently I would understand so can you change what you're doing/no one else understands what you're teaching" because they've talked to two similarly situated friends who are failing and have no idea that the class average is a C.

On top of which, our district has open enrollment and there's always a fraction of students who were told to take a lower-level class who disregard teacher recs and select classes they can't handle, and then gripe about them.

There was a thread on DCUM recently in the private school forum where people were saying public schools were than private better bc there was no "gatekeeping" or prerequisites for AP classes,

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This isn't surprising at all to me as a STEM HS teacher. We always have students who lack the prereq skills, don't do what they're supposed to do, take classes that are simply too hard for them and then make demands along the lines of "what extra credit do you offer because I need to get my grade to at least a ____". The blank is usually an A or a B, and the student is usually scoring two grades below that.

Or they'll come to you and say "I don't understand what you're teaching/you're going too fast/if you taught it differently I would understand so can you change what you're doing/no one else understands what you're teaching" because they've talked to two similarly situated friends who are failing and have no idea that the class average is a C.

On top of which, our district has open enrollment and there's always a fraction of students who were told to take a lower-level class who disregard teacher recs and select classes they can't handle, and then gripe about them.

There was a thread on DCUM recently in the private school forum where people were saying public schools were than private better bc there was no "gatekeeping" or prerequisites for AP classes,

Our private school requires test scores and grades to get into Honors courses first year. After that it's teacher rec and for AP classes--a writing sample if it's English--if it's science prior teacher approval, etc. It is a rigorous school.

My kid has received 5s on all his AP exams so far. It keeps the class levels rigorous without being weighted down by kids that do not belong in the class (a problem we saw in public where things were 'dumbed' down). During Covid our public would not even teach new material for fear some kids would be left behind. They sacrificed some kids for the others.

I don't think gate-keeping is a bad thing. A C average student likely doesn't belong in the most advanced course level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Orgo has ALWAYS been a weed out class--from medical school and from chemistry as a major. When I took it, the average was a C.
I don't know the specifics of this guy but it's hardly new for many people to fail organic chemistry.

A “C” is, by definition, average.

Yep. As a Bio major, organic chem was feared by all. We just crossed our fingers and relied on the Bell curve.

[Anonymous]

It's one course. Everyone gets the 'hard' teacher once in awhile. Deal. IF you don't like it, there is a drop period first quarter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reminds me of one of my classes. None of the questions in the tests matched what was covered in the lectures or textbook. It was the most interesting class but grade wise it was the worst. To this day I remember her lectures, she was brilliant. And a terrible test writer.

It's definitely possible that this is what's happening, just like it's possible that the kids are complaining about tests that are appropriately difficult. It's really hard to say without having taken the class and taken the exams, so it becomes this Rorschach test that reveals whatever you already think about what's happening in colleges, but nothing else.

+1
I had a class like that. The professor was very engaging and the material interesting, but the exam questions were AWFUL. Confusingly worded, ambiguous, subjective. It's possible that the students are unprepared or unwilling to study enough. It's possible he's a terrible teacher. It's possible that the tests are badly written. It's really impossible to know if you don't know the subject and the details of the class and the tests. All these comments are just projection about "kids these days."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The inmates are running the asylum.

This. We’re in a race to the bottom. Shame on the administration.

This is why we need to overturn the affirmative action.

How is this related???

How is it not?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The inmates are running the asylum.

This. We’re in a race to the bottom. Shame on the administration.

This is why we need to overturn the affirmative action.

How is this related???

In PP's convoluted mind, its only minorities who would be unable to keep up with a tough class. In reality, the most entitled students I ever saw in my classes in college were the white. They thought nothing of calling out professors in they got something wrong on an exam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As someone with a PhD who has taught at major universities, I thought this story had something in it for everyone's grievances - whiny entitled Gen Z kids, snowplow parents, learning loss during Covid, college admissions with TO, universities designed for 'customer service' instead of learning, contingent faculty (he was on contract, e.g., adjunct.)

But for my money the fact that he's 84yo says it all. Even geniuses need to retire. Btw the end of mandatory retirement for professors is destroying academia. No one with tenure ever leaves. 50 years ago, 80% of faculty were tenure or tenure track. Today only 25% are. That means 3/4 of professors in the US have zero job security and really lousy pay and minimal or no benefits at all. And meanwhile tuition is stratospheric. Broken system.

If tuitions are stratospheric and most professors get lousy pay and minimal or no benefits at all, where did the money go?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As someone with a PhD who has taught at major universities, I thought this story had something in it for everyone's grievances - whiny entitled Gen Z kids, snowplow parents, learning loss during Covid, college admissions with TO, universities designed for 'customer service' instead of learning, contingent faculty (he was on contract, e.g., adjunct.)

But for my money the fact that he's 84yo says it all. Even geniuses need to retire. Btw the end of mandatory retirement for professors is destroying academia. No one with tenure ever leaves. 50 years ago, 80% of faculty were tenure or tenure track. Today only 25% are. That means 3/4 of professors in the US have zero job security and really lousy pay and minimal or no benefits at all. And meanwhile tuition is stratospheric. Broken system.

If tuitions are stratospheric and most professors get lousy pay and minimal or no benefits at all, where did the money go?

Great question. Many of us who have taught at universities wonder the same thing.

I can assure you that the tuition money IS NOT going to faculty. Adjunct are now the majority of faculty members at most universities. And if not adjunct, then titles like “clinical professor” or “term professor” who have high loads, no tenure, and salaries lower than many public school teachers. Many students don’t know these facts and assume their professor is well-compensated. They are not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Orgo has ALWAYS been a weed out class--from medical school and from chemistry as a major. When I took it, the average was a C.
I don't know the specifics of this guy but it's hardly new for many people to fail organic chemistry.

A “C” is, by definition, average.

would you go to just an "average" doctor?

You have no clue if your dr was at the bottom or top of their class. All you know is that they "passed" and a C is passing. So yeah, most of us have gone to "average" doctors I'm certain.
My only preference is that they did not go to med school in the Caribbean---as it's well known that people head there when they can't get into USA medical schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The inmates are running the asylum.

This. We’re in a race to the bottom. Shame on the administration.

+1 where is due process? Why not give the Professor a warning or probation period?

My guess is that bc he wasn't tenured, NYU wasn't bound by due process and administrative law procedures. I admit I didn't read the full article, though.

He was on a yearly contract, not tenured. He wasn't fired. His contract just wasn't renewed. It's a shame but I wouldn't want to bend to the administration of NYU after a long storied career either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Orgo has ALWAYS been a weed out class--from medical school and from chemistry as a major. When I took it, the average was a C.
I don't know the specifics of this guy but it's hardly new for many people to fail organic chemistry.

A “C” is, by definition, average.

would you go to just an "average" doctor?

Most of them are. That’s the thing about average.