T20 Universities list predictions

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The gleeful posters predicting the demise of Vandy have clearly never spent a few days in deep blue Nashville.

Agree. I don’t understand the Vandy bashing. Have all these posters actually experienced Vanderbilt and/or Nashville, especially in the last decade? There appears to be a contingent who believe that quality education occurs only in the NE. That sounds a tad closed-minded, obnoxious, and parochial.

Vanderbilt provides an excellent education, but if the citizens of Tennessee elect representatives who insist on laws that limit the rights of women, LGBTQ community members, non-whites, etc., it's going to be perceived by many as a less desirable place to get an education and will lose strong applicants because of this.

I'm a PP, I live in the District. I'm certain that a lot of Never South of the Mason-Dixon Line! But abortion! PPs are residents of Arlington, Bethesda, etc.

May I judge YOU because you live in states that elected Republican governors? Why don't you move? Is it OK if we think less of you because you share a state with many organized white supremacists in your western counties? Knowing this is absolutely true, why don't you move so you and your tender offspring can live in a pure, progressive locale like San Francisco?

Of course that's absurd. And so are you.

If Virginia and Maryland were to pass laws that showed little respect for women's ability to make their own difficult decisions, or that limited the rights of minority groups, I expect that their well-respected universities would suffer the same fate as any other state that does so. I'm not at all judging the people of Tennessee, just saying that it will be perceived as a less desirable place to live by many IF they pass such laws.

NP. Yes. PP's post was not an apt comparison.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Based on earlier comments, it sounds like people want to base academic rankings on job placement and salary statistics. Those two don’t necessarily correlate. If you’re comparing an Ivy classics major to a State U CS major, the comparison makes no sense from an academic perspective, but the CS major will have a higher salary. What’s the point of the ROI focus? To make the arts look bad? Don’t people already know which majors pay? ROI is a dumb way to rate academic excellence.

College degree is useless waste of money if you serve at a restaurant or make coffee at Starbucks afterwards.
It's not everything but most important factor

It works the other way too. Anyone who pays too dollar for a degree in a field which pays high salaries regardless of where your degree is from is throwing away their money. When you can do just as well in engineering or CS with a degree from Stat U, why pay 2-3 times as much as much?

That is like saying why go to a Michelin star restaurant when you can go to McDonald's and get a meal at lower price.

Getting a CS degree from GMU is not same as a CS degree from CMU.

True. But getting a CS degree from Georgia Tech ($50K OOS) is comparable to a CS degree from CMU ($80K OOS).

If you need aid, CMU will award it. Not going to get anything from a highly-ranked public as an OOS.

What is considered highly ranked is Georgia Tech highly ranked?

Georgia Tech is ranked #5 in Computer Science. Is being #5 highly ranked in your dictionary?

Yes, but that’s one program. How is it’s classics program? That’s why it’s not a highly ranked overall.

Georgia Tech doesn't even have a Classics Department and offers no classes in Greek or Latin. That doesn't make it a weaker choice, unless that matters to you. Just like Dartmouth not having a major in business doesn't make it a weaker choice for those who don't care about that.

What if your kid goes in for CS and then changes their mind? Lots of kids do that. I went in for Economics and ended up switching to Chemistry. Never imagined I would do that in HS.

So Dartmouth is no good because it doesn't offer the business degree that Georgia Tech does?

Overall, Dartmouth provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech. That doesn’t mean GTech isn’t good for a CS degree and getting a high-paying CS job after college. But for those in the market for prestigious educational credentials, Dartmouth beats GTech.

Honestly, this is the first time I am hearing this i.e "provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech" about Dartmouth. I haven't heard anyone applying to Dartmouth for any major in NoVA region.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT. Just look at the stats of admitted students. And the undergraduate experience at Dartmouth is unparalleled with the possible exception of Princeton.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT in liberal arts. GT is a significant notch above Dartmouth in Engineering.

Dartmouth is many notches above GT, period.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Based on earlier comments, it sounds like people want to base academic rankings on job placement and salary statistics. Those two don’t necessarily correlate. If you’re comparing an Ivy classics major to a State U CS major, the comparison makes no sense from an academic perspective, but the CS major will have a higher salary. What’s the point of the ROI focus? To make the arts look bad? Don’t people already know which majors pay? ROI is a dumb way to rate academic excellence.

College degree is useless waste of money if you serve at a restaurant or make coffee at Starbucks afterwards.
It's not everything but most important factor

It works the other way too. Anyone who pays too dollar for a degree in a field which pays high salaries regardless of where your degree is from is throwing away their money. When you can do just as well in engineering or CS with a degree from Stat U, why pay 2-3 times as much as much?

That is like saying why go to a Michelin star restaurant when you can go to McDonald's and get a meal at lower price.

Getting a CS degree from GMU is not same as a CS degree from CMU.

True. But getting a CS degree from Georgia Tech ($50K OOS) is comparable to a CS degree from CMU ($80K OOS).

If you need aid, CMU will award it. Not going to get anything from a highly-ranked public as an OOS.

What is considered highly ranked is Georgia Tech highly ranked?

Georgia Tech is ranked #5 in Computer Science. Is being #5 highly ranked in your dictionary?

Yes, but that’s one program. How is it’s classics program? That’s why it’s not a highly ranked overall.

Georgia Tech doesn't even have a Classics Department and offers no classes in Greek or Latin. That doesn't make it a weaker choice, unless that matters to you. Just like Dartmouth not having a major in business doesn't make it a weaker choice for those who don't care about that.

What if your kid goes in for CS and then changes their mind? Lots of kids do that. I went in for Economics and ended up switching to Chemistry. Never imagined I would do that in HS.

So Dartmouth is no good because it doesn't offer the business degree that Georgia Tech does?

Overall, Dartmouth provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech. That doesn’t mean GTech isn’t good for a CS degree and getting a high-paying CS job after college. But for those in the market for prestigious educational credentials, Dartmouth beats GTech.

Honestly, this is the first time I am hearing this i.e "provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech" about Dartmouth. I haven't heard anyone applying to Dartmouth for any major in NoVA region.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT. Just look at the stats of admitted students. And the undergraduate experience at Dartmouth is unparalleled with the possible exception of Princeton.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT in liberal arts. GT is a significant notch above Dartmouth in Engineering.

Dartmouth is many notches above GT, period.

Lol total idiot

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Based on earlier comments, it sounds like people want to base academic rankings on job placement and salary statistics. Those two don’t necessarily correlate. If you’re comparing an Ivy classics major to a State U CS major, the comparison makes no sense from an academic perspective, but the CS major will have a higher salary. What’s the point of the ROI focus? To make the arts look bad? Don’t people already know which majors pay? ROI is a dumb way to rate academic excellence.

College degree is useless waste of money if you serve at a restaurant or make coffee at Starbucks afterwards.
It's not everything but most important factor

It works the other way too. Anyone who pays too dollar for a degree in a field which pays high salaries regardless of where your degree is from is throwing away their money. When you can do just as well in engineering or CS with a degree from Stat U, why pay 2-3 times as much as much?

That is like saying why go to a Michelin star restaurant when you can go to McDonald's and get a meal at lower price.

Getting a CS degree from GMU is not same as a CS degree from CMU.

True. But getting a CS degree from Georgia Tech ($50K OOS) is comparable to a CS degree from CMU ($80K OOS).

If you need aid, CMU will award it. Not going to get anything from a highly-ranked public as an OOS.

What is considered highly ranked is Georgia Tech highly ranked?

Georgia Tech is ranked #5 in Computer Science. Is being #5 highly ranked in your dictionary?

Yes, but that’s one program. How is it’s classics program? That’s why it’s not a highly ranked overall.

Georgia Tech doesn't even have a Classics Department and offers no classes in Greek or Latin. That doesn't make it a weaker choice, unless that matters to you. Just like Dartmouth not having a major in business doesn't make it a weaker choice for those who don't care about that.

What if your kid goes in for CS and then changes their mind? Lots of kids do that. I went in for Economics and ended up switching to Chemistry. Never imagined I would do that in HS.

So Dartmouth is no good because it doesn't offer the business degree that Georgia Tech does?

Overall, Dartmouth provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech. That doesn’t mean GTech isn’t good for a CS degree and getting a high-paying CS job after college. But for those in the market for prestigious educational credentials, Dartmouth beats GTech.

Honestly, this is the first time I am hearing this i.e "provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech" about Dartmouth. I haven't heard anyone applying to Dartmouth for any major in NoVA region.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT. Just look at the stats of admitted students. And the undergraduate experience at Dartmouth is unparalleled with the possible exception of Princeton.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT in liberal arts. GT is a significant notch above Dartmouth in Engineering.

Dartmouth is many notches above GT, period.

Ooooh, a period was added. Guess that settles it.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Based on earlier comments, it sounds like people want to base academic rankings on job placement and salary statistics. Those two don’t necessarily correlate. If you’re comparing an Ivy classics major to a State U CS major, the comparison makes no sense from an academic perspective, but the CS major will have a higher salary. What’s the point of the ROI focus? To make the arts look bad? Don’t people already know which majors pay? ROI is a dumb way to rate academic excellence.

College degree is useless waste of money if you serve at a restaurant or make coffee at Starbucks afterwards.
It's not everything but most important factor

It works the other way too. Anyone who pays too dollar for a degree in a field which pays high salaries regardless of where your degree is from is throwing away their money. When you can do just as well in engineering or CS with a degree from Stat U, why pay 2-3 times as much as much?

That is like saying why go to a Michelin star restaurant when you can go to McDonald's and get a meal at lower price.

Getting a CS degree from GMU is not same as a CS degree from CMU.

True. But getting a CS degree from Georgia Tech ($50K OOS) is comparable to a CS degree from CMU ($80K OOS).

If you need aid, CMU will award it. Not going to get anything from a highly-ranked public as an OOS.

What is considered highly ranked is Georgia Tech highly ranked?

Georgia Tech is ranked #5 in Computer Science. Is being #5 highly ranked in your dictionary?

Yes, but that’s one program. How is it’s classics program? That’s why it’s not a highly ranked overall.

Georgia Tech doesn't even have a Classics Department and offers no classes in Greek or Latin. That doesn't make it a weaker choice, unless that matters to you. Just like Dartmouth not having a major in business doesn't make it a weaker choice for those who don't care about that.

What if your kid goes in for CS and then changes their mind? Lots of kids do that. I went in for Economics and ended up switching to Chemistry. Never imagined I would do that in HS.

So Dartmouth is no good because it doesn't offer the business degree that Georgia Tech does?

Overall, Dartmouth provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech. That doesn’t mean GTech isn’t good for a CS degree and getting a high-paying CS job after college. But for those in the market for prestigious educational credentials, Dartmouth beats GTech.

Honestly, this is the first time I am hearing this i.e "provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech" about Dartmouth. I haven't heard anyone applying to Dartmouth for any major in NoVA region.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT. Just look at the stats of admitted students. And the undergraduate experience at Dartmouth is unparalleled with the possible exception of Princeton.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT in liberal arts. GT is a significant notch above Dartmouth in Engineering.

Dartmouth is many notches above GT, period.

Georgia Tech is no. 1, 2, 3 or 4 in the entire nation for aerospace engineering depending upon ranking service. Dartmouth is - not even in the running!

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Based on earlier comments, it sounds like people want to base academic rankings on job placement and salary statistics. Those two don’t necessarily correlate. If you’re comparing an Ivy classics major to a State U CS major, the comparison makes no sense from an academic perspective, but the CS major will have a higher salary. What’s the point of the ROI focus? To make the arts look bad? Don’t people already know which majors pay? ROI is a dumb way to rate academic excellence.

College degree is useless waste of money if you serve at a restaurant or make coffee at Starbucks afterwards.
It's not everything but most important factor

It works the other way too. Anyone who pays too dollar for a degree in a field which pays high salaries regardless of where your degree is from is throwing away their money. When you can do just as well in engineering or CS with a degree from Stat U, why pay 2-3 times as much as much?

That is like saying why go to a Michelin star restaurant when you can go to McDonald's and get a meal at lower price.

Getting a CS degree from GMU is not same as a CS degree from CMU.

True. But getting a CS degree from Georgia Tech ($50K OOS) is comparable to a CS degree from CMU ($80K OOS).

If you need aid, CMU will award it. Not going to get anything from a highly-ranked public as an OOS.

What is considered highly ranked is Georgia Tech highly ranked?

Georgia Tech is ranked #5 in Computer Science. Is being #5 highly ranked in your dictionary?

Yes, but that’s one program. How is it’s classics program? That’s why it’s not a highly ranked overall.

Georgia Tech doesn't even have a Classics Department and offers no classes in Greek or Latin. That doesn't make it a weaker choice, unless that matters to you. Just like Dartmouth not having a major in business doesn't make it a weaker choice for those who don't care about that.

What if your kid goes in for CS and then changes their mind? Lots of kids do that. I went in for Economics and ended up switching to Chemistry. Never imagined I would do that in HS.

So Dartmouth is no good because it doesn't offer the business degree that Georgia Tech does?

Overall, Dartmouth provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech. That doesn’t mean GTech isn’t good for a CS degree and getting a high-paying CS job after college. But for those in the market for prestigious educational credentials, Dartmouth beats GTech.

Honestly, this is the first time I am hearing this i.e "provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech" about Dartmouth. I haven't heard anyone applying to Dartmouth for any major in NoVA region.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT. Just look at the stats of admitted students. And the undergraduate experience at Dartmouth is unparalleled with the possible exception of Princeton.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT in liberal arts. GT is a significant notch above Dartmouth in Engineering.

Dartmouth is many notches above GT, period.

Georgia Tech is no. 1, 2, 3 or 4 in the entire nation for aerospace engineering depending upon ranking service. Dartmouth is - not even in the running!

Aerospace engineering is a low profit margin business

Dartmouth grads become treasury secretaries

Do you know any gen x or boomers who were in aero?

Before space x and blue origin, the 80s and 90s and even 2000s were brutal for aero.

You are at the whim of shareholders who pressure ceos to cut costs.

I like GT as a school btw but you are making GT look bad by trying to shoehorn it into a weight class it doesn’t belong in

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:There have been several mentions of Notre Dame in this thread, so I want to point to a statistical reality for Notre Dame. For a college of their stature and name recognition, they don’t receive a lot of interest, as reflected by the number of applications.

In their region of the country, private colleges of similar size and stature receive more applications. Not only do Chicago and Northwestern receive more applications, but so do Case Western Reserve, Washington University/St. Louis and Vanderbilt. So do Tulane and Rice, also in the middle of the country.

Among Catholic colleges, interest is exceeded by Boston College, Georgetown, and Fordham. Notre Dame received 26,000 applications this year while BC received more than 40,000. And colleges like Villanova and Loyola Marymount are coming up close behind with rapidly rising numbers of applications.

What Notre Dame has going for it is that students who apply there really want to go there. The result is that their yield is exceptionally high - over 60% last year for this current freshman class. They accomplish this by catering to alumni and admitting high numbers of legacies. It’s a good strategy and it works for them. However, it also means that they don’t have a large margin for error. Yield for Notre Dame doesn’t have to drop all that much for their acceptance rate to rise quickly. The SCOTUS appointment of Amy Comey Barrett has solidified their reputation as a place for conservative Catholics unlike many of their .Catholic college competitors which have broadened their appeal. Catholic colleges already have a more limited pool of applicants, but a college which limits their appeal to only a smaller segment of that niche has the potential for future declining interest.

Did Yale and Harvard only appeal to conservatives because conservative Justice went to their law school?

I think the same schools will be in the magazines top 20, but people are dumb to choose a school based on a magazine.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Based on earlier comments, it sounds like people want to base academic rankings on job placement and salary statistics. Those two don’t necessarily correlate. If you’re comparing an Ivy classics major to a State U CS major, the comparison makes no sense from an academic perspective, but the CS major will have a higher salary. What’s the point of the ROI focus? To make the arts look bad? Don’t people already know which majors pay? ROI is a dumb way to rate academic excellence.

College degree is useless waste of money if you serve at a restaurant or make coffee at Starbucks afterwards.
It's not everything but most important factor

It works the other way too. Anyone who pays too dollar for a degree in a field which pays high salaries regardless of where your degree is from is throwing away their money. When you can do just as well in engineering or CS with a degree from Stat U, why pay 2-3 times as much as much?

That is like saying why go to a Michelin star restaurant when you can go to McDonald's and get a meal at lower price.

Getting a CS degree from GMU is not same as a CS degree from CMU.

True. But getting a CS degree from Georgia Tech ($50K OOS) is comparable to a CS degree from CMU ($80K OOS).

If you need aid, CMU will award it. Not going to get anything from a highly-ranked public as an OOS.

What is considered highly ranked is Georgia Tech highly ranked?

Georgia Tech is ranked #5 in Computer Science. Is being #5 highly ranked in your dictionary?

Yes, but that’s one program. How is it’s classics program? That’s why it’s not a highly ranked overall.

Georgia Tech doesn't even have a Classics Department and offers no classes in Greek or Latin. That doesn't make it a weaker choice, unless that matters to you. Just like Dartmouth not having a major in business doesn't make it a weaker choice for those who don't care about that.

What if your kid goes in for CS and then changes their mind? Lots of kids do that. I went in for Economics and ended up switching to Chemistry. Never imagined I would do that in HS.

So Dartmouth is no good because it doesn't offer the business degree that Georgia Tech does?

Overall, Dartmouth provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech. That doesn’t mean GTech isn’t good for a CS degree and getting a high-paying CS job after college. But for those in the market for prestigious educational credentials, Dartmouth beats GTech.

Honestly, this is the first time I am hearing this i.e "provides a much better education and admits higher quality students than GTech" about Dartmouth. I haven't heard anyone applying to Dartmouth for any major in NoVA region.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT. Just look at the stats of admitted students. And the undergraduate experience at Dartmouth is unparalleled with the possible exception of Princeton.

Dartmouth is a significant notch above GT in liberal arts. GT is a significant notch above Dartmouth in Engineering.

Dartmouth is many notches above GT, period.

Georgia Tech is no. 1, 2, 3 or 4 in the entire nation for aerospace engineering depending upon ranking service. Dartmouth is - not even in the running!

Aerospace engineering is a low profit margin business

Dartmouth grads become treasury secretaries

Do you know any gen x or boomers who were in aero?

Before space x and blue origin, the 80s and 90s and even 2000s were brutal for aero.

You are at the whim of shareholders who pressure ceos to cut costs.

I like GT as a school btw but you are making GT look bad by trying to shoehorn it into a weight class it doesn’t belong in

Well, maybe it’s time to start considering that the short-term view of finance types from Dartmouth and Harvard are tanking our industries for the profits these “leaders” make on sales of corporations. They are cutting out long-term global economic clout and sustainability with their myopic short term goals and lining their own pockets. Yeah, you want your kids to be titans of industry rather than some pitiful engineer with low earning power. The lack of corporate and finance vision these days is our doom. I’m not anti-capitalist, either.

[Anonymous]

University of Florida will be top 20 by 2030.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't give a hoot about any of the rankings, but it will be interesting to see how the reversal of Roe v. Wade affects the ability of colleges in red states to attract strong students, especially women. Rice, Wash U, Tulane and Vanderbilt could be in trouble.

Your daughter factors in the ability to get an abortion in her evaluation of colleges? Interesting.

That's a pretty narrow-minded response. One doesn't have to care about one's own personal situation to factor something into a decision, and many kids (mine included) care about going to school in a geographic area that values the ability of a woman to decide for herself (within the limitations of reasonable restrictions) whether she is jeopardizing her relationship with God in order to not bring an unwanted child into the world. Just like they don't want to be somewhere that their LGBTQ friends don't have the same rights as they do. Or their friends of color are not treated nicely by the locals. Etc.

The laws and policies in some states just continue to encourage the brain drain that's been going on for decades and that contributes heavily to the polarization of our country. The more educated you are, the less likely you are to feel comfortable in a place that values some citizens less than others. That's a problem for universities in those states.

Funny that you said that. Have you heard that companies are relocating from California to Texas in droves recently? Maybe you can apply your logic and explain why.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:University of Florida will be top 20 by 2030.

Go Gators! Amazing school.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:University of Florida will be top 20 by 2030.

Go Gators! Amazing school.

Yawn...no way Top 20.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't give a hoot about any of the rankings, but it will be interesting to see how the reversal of Roe v. Wade affects the ability of colleges in red states to attract strong students, especially women. Rice, Wash U, Tulane and Vanderbilt could be in trouble.

Your daughter factors in the ability to get an abortion in her evaluation of colleges? Interesting.

That's a pretty narrow-minded response. One doesn't have to care about one's own personal situation to factor something into a decision, and many kids (mine included) care about going to school in a geographic area that values the ability of a woman to decide for herself (within the limitations of reasonable restrictions) whether she is jeopardizing her relationship with God in order to not bring an unwanted child into the world. Just like they don't want to be somewhere that their LGBTQ friends don't have the same rights as they do. Or their friends of color are not treated nicely by the locals. Etc.

The laws and policies in some states just continue to encourage the brain drain that's been going on for decades and that contributes heavily to the polarization of our country. The more educated you are, the less likely you are to feel comfortable in a place that values some citizens less than others. That's a problem for universities in those states.

Funny that you said that. Have you heard that companies are relocating from California to Texas in droves recently? Maybe you can apply your logic and explain why.

Petulant CEOs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:I don't give a hoot about any of the rankings, but it will be interesting to see how the reversal of Roe v. Wade affects the ability of colleges in red states to attract strong students, especially women. Rice, Wash U, Tulane and Vanderbilt could be in trouble.

Your daughter factors in the ability to get an abortion in her evaluation of colleges? Interesting.

That's a pretty narrow-minded response. One doesn't have to care about one's own personal situation to factor something into a decision, and many kids (mine included) care about going to school in a geographic area that values the ability of a woman to decide for herself (within the limitations of reasonable restrictions) whether she is jeopardizing her relationship with God in order to not bring an unwanted child into the world. Just like they don't want to be somewhere that their LGBTQ friends don't have the same rights as they do. Or their friends of color are not treated nicely by the locals. Etc.

The laws and policies in some states just continue to encourage the brain drain that's been going on for decades and that contributes heavily to the polarization of our country. The more educated you are, the less likely you are to feel comfortable in a place that values some citizens less than others. That's a problem for universities in those states.

Funny that you said that. Have you heard that companies are relocating from California to Texas in droves recently? Maybe you can apply your logic and explain why.

They're moving their DESPITE the backward social legislation Texas is passing, so the logic is still sound. And I'll bet that movement significantly changes if things keep going in the direction they are, despite Texans' willingness to do without many of the phenomenal services that Californians enjoy. If the currently excellent University of Texas can't get as many smart students as it enjoys today, companies that need smart grads will not be as eager to locate there. I'm not saying they'll stay in California, which has its own issues, but.....

[Anonymous]

Do people seriously not believe that criminalizing abortion in certain states--and potentially criminalizing travel outside the state to get an abortion--won't affect college decisions? No, I hope that my daughter never needs one, but I also can't imagine sending her to college in a state that would allow her to die in the event of an ectopic pregnancy.

Agree that schools in the NE will continue to rise.