What happened to this California family?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is tragic, but given what I've read, I think overconfident tech bro and his 'cool girl' partner weren't going to be THOSE parents stuck inside when baby came, and they all paid the price. There is no evidence they were "experienced hikers" in the sense of having enough experience to know when NOT to go.

Jesus, are you the nutter from that other thread who won’t stop harping about “cool girls”? Give it a f-ing rest.

Ha ha. Which other thread? Now I’m curious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is the weirdest thread. Like I love a good mystery/true crime thread but usually there is some evidence to go off of and some decent theories. This thread is just 100% speculation and weird victim-blaming. For 70 pages. Damn.

On the contrary, I’m actually amazed that the victim blaming didn’t start until around page 40. DCUM is usually huge on victim blaming, much more than I am, and IMO these people deserve it. I’m not sure how the police know that they did this whole eight-mile trail, as they stated in one of the updates, but if they did, holy hell they murdered that dog and that poor baby. I was much more sympathetic when I thought they went for a mile or so early in the morning when temperatures were below 80 and then something weird happened.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was Googling to see if there was an update and came across Jonathan’s profile on All Trails. It says he’s completed the Hites Cove trail before.
https://www.alltrails.com/members/jonathan-gerrish/completed

That’s interesting. As I review his profile, I get the impression that he is familiar with that area. He completed the Hites Cove Trail four years ago. So if he’s been hiking this area for quite a while, it might have given him a false sense of security that it was okay to take his family out there.

Hites Cove Trail is described as out and back on the same trail. Looks like he decided to go along the river and come up the switchback.

He had lived in the area before moving to San Francisco and then back. As I recall there was no evidence that he’d previously hiked the Savage-Lundy portion, which makes a loop together with Hites Cove Trail. Along with others, I’m wondering if they started to have issues down at the river and figured Savage-Lundy was the better return option since it was shorter than doubling back. They may well not have known how shade-free and unforgiving it was after the fires.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the weirdest thread. Like I love a good mystery/true crime thread but usually there is some evidence to go off of and some decent theories. This thread is just 100% speculation and weird victim-blaming. For 70 pages. Damn.

On the contrary, I’m actually amazed that the victim blaming didn’t start until around page 40. DCUM is usually huge on victim blaming, much more than I am, and IMO these people deserve it. I’m not sure how the police know that they did this whole eight-mile trail, as they stated in one of the updates, but if they did, holy hell they murdered that dog and that poor baby. I was much more sympathetic when I thought they went for a mile or so early in the morning when temperatures were below 80 and then something weird happened.

No matter the eventual conclusion, we are all learning a few lessons along the way: watch out for overconfidence, research the trail, pay close attention to the weather and lack of shade, have a backup plan when there is no cell service, let someone know when to expect your return, the signs of heatstroke, and that dogs can be more susceptible to the effects of heat than humans.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was Googling to see if there was an update and came across Jonathan’s profile on All Trails. It says he’s completed the Hites Cove trail before.
https://www.alltrails.com/members/jonathan-gerrish/completed

That’s interesting. As I review his profile, I get the impression that he is familiar with that area. He completed the Hites Cove Trail four years ago. So if he’s been hiking this area for quite a while, it might have given him a false sense of security that it was okay to take his family out there.

Hites Cove Trail is described as out and back on the same trail. Looks like he decided to go along the river and come up the switchback.

He had lived in the area before moving to San Francisco and then back. As I recall there was no evidence that he’d previously hiked the Savage-Lundy portion, which makes a loop together with Hites Cove Trail. Along with others, I’m wondering if they started to have issues down at the river and figured Savage-Lundy was the better return option since it was shorter than doubling back. They may well not have known how shade-free and unforgiving it was after the fires.

Is it more likely they would have made it back had they doubled back and done another, what, 5 miles? Or were they past the point of no return either way?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was Googling to see if there was an update and came across Jonathan’s profile on All Trails. It says he’s completed the Hites Cove trail before.
https://www.alltrails.com/members/jonathan-gerrish/completed

That’s interesting. As I review his profile, I get the impression that he is familiar with that area. He completed the Hites Cove Trail four years ago. So if he’s been hiking this area for quite a while, it might have given him a false sense of security that it was okay to take his family out there.

Hites Cove Trail is described as out and back on the same trail. Looks like he decided to go along the river and come up the switchback.

He had lived in the area before moving to San Francisco and then back. As I recall there was no evidence that he’d previously hiked the Savage-Lundy portion, which makes a loop together with Hites Cove Trail. Along with others, I’m wondering if they started to have issues down at the river and figured Savage-Lundy was the better return option since it was shorter than doubling back. They may well not have known how shade-free and unforgiving it was after the fires.

Is it more likely they would have made it back had they doubled back and done another, what, 5 miles? Or were they past the point of no return either way?

It's hard to speculate. But shade can easily be 20-30F cooler. They still had water.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is the weirdest thread. Like I love a good mystery/true crime thread but usually there is some evidence to go off of and some decent theories. This thread is just 100% speculation and weird victim-blaming. For 70 pages. Damn.

I think some tried to blame the nanny or the parents earlier.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was Googling to see if there was an update and came across Jonathan’s profile on All Trails. It says he’s completed the Hites Cove trail before.
https://www.alltrails.com/members/jonathan-gerrish/completed

That’s interesting. As I review his profile, I get the impression that he is familiar with that area. He completed the Hites Cove Trail four years ago. So if he’s been hiking this area for quite a while, it might have given him a false sense of security that it was okay to take his family out there.

Hites Cove Trail is described as out and back on the same trail. Looks like he decided to go along the river and come up the switchback.

He had lived in the area before moving to San Francisco and then back. As I recall there was no evidence that he’d previously hiked the Savage-Lundy portion, which makes a loop together with Hites Cove Trail. Along with others, I’m wondering if they started to have issues down at the river and figured Savage-Lundy was the better return option since it was shorter than doubling back. They may well not have known how shade-free and unforgiving it was after the fires.

Is it more likely they would have made it back had they doubled back and done another, what, 5 miles? Or were they past the point of no return either way?

I don’t think we know enough to say—we don’t even know for sure that they ended up trying doing the 8.5 mile loop instead of down and partway back on Savage-Lundy. But if the dog or baby were in distress, I see wanting to go the shortest route back, plus carrying a big dog 5+ miles would not be easy. Another thing I’ve read elsewhere is that the temperature readings for the day, while they were taken from only a couple miles away in El Portal, likely underestimated the heat they faced. I gather the measurement point in El Portal is shady and at a higher elevation, so cooler. Given how terrible Savage-Lundy was, maybe they would have been better off sitting in the river for a few hours until the temps went down, but they may have been afraid to enter the water due to the algae warnings. They also wouldn’t have had enough water or food for that course, most likely.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This reminds me of the hunt for the Death Valley Germans. Each small wrong choice led them further toward their death.

I think part of what makes it so compelling is how relatable it is. I can remember hiking with a baby in a Kelty. My husband can remember hiking with a dog that was a bit too old for the mileage and then having to carry the dog out. I can recall times when I didn't pack enough diapers or snacks for a trip to the zoo. I've put in the wrong address on Waze and ended up at the address that ended in Road instead of Lane. We've been a little too overconfident before. We've spazzed out and made dumb choices before and ruined an outing because we didn't factor in where we'd eat or if we had enough gas. We've argued and not been the best team in figuring out how to deal with a mini-crisis. Cell phone dead, forgot to download the alltrails map, no cell service, didn't eat enough breakfast first, dog refuses to move, baby looks lethargic...etc etc. I personally can see how, within just a few decisions or situations, heat stroke for a dog, a dad, a baby, and/or a mom could kill all four of them.

What’s a reasonable and empathetic person like you doing on a website like this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the weirdest thread. Like I love a good mystery/true crime thread but usually there is some evidence to go off of and some decent theories. This thread is just 100% speculation and weird victim-blaming. For 70 pages. Damn.

On the contrary, I’m actually amazed that the victim blaming didn’t start until around page 40. DCUM is usually huge on victim blaming, much more than I am, and IMO these people deserve it. I’m not sure how the police know that they did this whole eight-mile trail, as they stated in one of the updates, but if they did, holy hell they murdered that dog and that poor baby. I was much more sympathetic when I thought they went for a mile or so early in the morning when temperatures were below 80 and then something weird happened.

What are you on? The victim blaming literally started on page one and YOU ARE DOING IT TOO!! Like this insane idea that an parent hiking on a hot day with their child must be a murderer is just so damn bizarre.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the weirdest thread. Like I love a good mystery/true crime thread but usually there is some evidence to go off of and some decent theories. This thread is just 100% speculation and weird victim-blaming. For 70 pages. Damn.

On the contrary, I’m actually amazed that the victim blaming didn’t start until around page 40. DCUM is usually huge on victim blaming, much more than I am, and IMO these people deserve it. I’m not sure how the police know that they did this whole eight-mile trail, as they stated in one of the updates, but if they did, holy hell they murdered that dog and that poor baby. I was much more sympathetic when I thought they went for a mile or so early in the morning when temperatures were below 80 and then something weird happened.

What are you on? The victim blaming literally started on page one and YOU ARE DOING IT TOO!! Like this insane idea that an parent hiking on a hot day with their child must be a murderer is just so damn bizarre.

Some people have watched to many Hallmark/Lifetime movies.

[Anonymous]

Sounds like toxic gas. High exposure to hydrogen sulfide gas from the Earth or cyanide somehow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like toxic gas. High exposure to hydrogen sulfide gas from the Earth or cyanide somehow.

Agree. The toxicology report will give everyone the answer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like toxic gas. High exposure to hydrogen sulfide gas from the Earth or cyanide somehow.

If that’s the case, would it affect the surrounding wildlife in the area?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was Googling to see if there was an update and came across Jonathan’s profile on All Trails. It says he’s completed the Hites Cove trail before.
https://www.alltrails.com/members/jonathan-gerrish/completed

That’s interesting. As I review his profile, I get the impression that he is familiar with that area. He completed the Hites Cove Trail four years ago. So if he’s been hiking this area for quite a while, it might have given him a false sense of security that it was okay to take his family out there.

Hites Cove Trail is described as out and back on the same trail. Looks like he decided to go along the river and come up the switchback.

He had lived in the area before moving to San Francisco and then back. As I recall there was no evidence that he’d previously hiked the Savage-Lundy portion, which makes a loop together with Hites Cove Trail. Along with others, I’m wondering if they started to have issues down at the river and figured Savage-Lundy was the better return option since it was shorter than doubling back. They may well not have known how shade-free and unforgiving it was after the fires.

Is it more likely they would have made it back had they doubled back and done another, what, 5 miles? Or were they past the point of no return either way?

It's hard to speculate. But shade can easily be 20-30F cooler. They still had water.

So...they voluntarily hiked themselves to death?

Man, I've heard of health nuts but this takes the cake.